August Book Club discussion thread

[christy082]

It's the 25th so time for the Oryx and Crake discussion. I'm not done yet so I will join in once I finish.

[aurora]

I forgot that yesterday was the 25th! I love this book and hope at least a few people want to discuss it.

I think Atwood is very good in general at laying out plausible paths to dystopic futures, and O&C is no exception. I mean, yeah, we're not yet to the point where we're genetically engineering new human-like species, but you can follow the path of events from Jimmy's flashbacks and it follows a natural progression.

The human-like pigs are pretty freaky.

I actually liked this book best of the three, which is odd since Jimmy isn't my favorite of the lead characters.

[aurora]

Oh, and also it's strange that I feel like the book does a great job standing alone even though it ends with a cliffhanger...it's like those other humans are a whole different story entirely.

[charlatti]

I thought it was fascinating how dated some of the things seemed, despite the book not being very old. Having everything on cd-rom was one that stuck out -- really emphasizes how fast technology is changing.

The pigoons were very creepy, probably because they don't seem all that implausible. And the chicken stubs! That seems disturbingly not far-fetched.

[meredithj]

I'm still not sure how I feel about this book. I really liked the plot line, I also found it very plausible, especially with how huge the medical industry is in the US, and with no sign of slowing in growth or profitability. However, I didn't like the characters very much. I found them to be fairly one-dimensional and just not relate-able.

[christy082]

I'm also not sure how I feel. It was SO depressing to read. I never found myself wanting to get back to it to keep reading. I do also find the plot plausible. It took me 3/4 of the book to really be interested in what was happening.

For the majority of the book, I kept thinking.. this is the first time I've read the first book in a trilogy and have no desire to read the rest. But now that i finished, I might consider reading the rest of them. The cliffhanger has me intrigued.

Poor little Killer (the rakunk), lol.

[aprilsails]

I read this and then raced through the rest of the series through to Maddaddam so I'm having a hard time separating them our in my mind. I also read it 2 months ago so it's not quite fresh.

I liked the writing style and storyline in the 2nd book best. I found this book a bit disorienting at the beginning as I couldn't quite figure out what had happened to land them in this situation.

I don't generally like dystopian novels, but I found this one compelling as it seemed plausible given certain advances in medical science and certain lapses in morality. Considering events that are happening even now, I consider Margaret Atwood to be visionary to have written this in 2003.

I did not much like Jimmy or his character. I didn't identify well with him and I felt like I spent the entire book waiting for him to die. This seemed odd.

[aurora]

Aug 27, 2014 11:26:32 GMT -5 meredithj said:

I'm still not sure how I feel about this book. I really liked the plot line, I also found it very plausible, especially with how huge the medical industry is in the US, and with no sign of slowing in growth or profitability. However, I didn't like the characters very much. I found them to be fairly one-dimensional and just not relate-able.

I know what you mean here.  It's interesting that I liked this book so much because I've said before that I have a really hard time loving books with unsympathetic main characters.  Knowing that it was written by Margaret Atwood may have colored my impression (feeling more inclined to like it from the get-go because I love her books in general).  But, I didn't really like Jimmy. 

I think it helped to think what I would be acting like if I found myself as the only human left alive (or at least thought I was).

[aurora]

Aug 27, 2014 11:31:53 GMT -5 christy082 said:

I'm also not sure how I feel. It was SO depressing to read. I never found myself wanting to get back to it to keep reading. I do also find the plot plausible. It took me 3/4 of the book to really be interested in what was happening.

For the majority of the book, I kept thinking.. this is the first time I've read the first book in a trilogy and have no desire to read the rest. But now that i finished, I might consider reading the rest of them. The cliffhanger has me intrigued.

Poor little Killer (the rakunk), lol.

I actually don't think the others are as depressing.  This first book sets up the demise of humanity (through the flashbacks).  At the end, you realize there are other humans left alive.  There are still some depressing flashbacks in the others, but also more of moving into the new future.

That said, they are definitely in the same overall vein, so I can see how if someone doesn't really like Oryx and Crake it might make sense to stop there.  And maybe read the Wikipedia entry to find out what happens with respect to the cliffhanger.

[aurora]

Aug 27, 2014 14:13:29 GMT -5 aprilsails said:

I read this and then raced through the rest of the series through to Maddaddam so I'm having a hard time separating them our in my mind. I also read it 2 months ago so it's not quite fresh.

I liked the writing style and storyline in the 2nd book best. I found this book a bit disorienting at the beginning as I couldn't quite figure out what had happened to land them in this situation.

I don't generally like dystopian novels, but I found this one compelling as it seemed plausible given certain advances in medical science and certain lapses in morality. Considering events that are happening even now, I consider Margaret Atwood to be visionary to have written this in 2003.

I did not much like Jimmy or his character. I didn't identify well with him and I felt like I spent the entire book waiting for him to die. This seemed odd.

That's interesting, because I found The Year of the Flood the hardest to get through (though I still liked it).  But, I do think it had overall more likeable characters.

[aurora]

What did people think of the Extinctathon game as the meeting place for Crake and his buddies planning to kill people off?

[charlatti]

Aug 28, 2014 9:58:15 GMT -5 aurora said:

What did people think of the Extinctathon game as the meeting place for Crake and his buddies planning to kill people off?

It made sense to me. I can't remember the details of the game (were they given?) but it seems like a game where you're obsessing over creatures we've wiped off the planet is likely to make you think humanity isn't worth much. 

[aurora]

Aug 28, 2014 11:49:31 GMT -5 charlatti said:

Aug 28, 2014 9:58:15 GMT -5 aurora said:

What did people think of the Extinctathon game as the meeting place for Crake and his buddies planning to kill people off?

It made sense to me. I can't remember the details of the game (were they given?) but it seems like a game where you're obsessing over creatures we've wiped off the planet is likely to make you think humanity isn't worth much.

Good point.   In my mind I was more focused on the layers of subterfuge - as in, here's a cool game, but it's really just a cover for Crake's grand plan to recruit co-conspirators.  But I don't know if that's really how he set it up.

[charlatti]

But Crake didn't invent the game, did he? I've only read the first in the trilogy so far -- I was assuming we'd find out who MaddAddam is in that book. In this one, it gives the impression that the game existed on its own when Crake and Jimmy were just kids.

[aurora]

Aug 28, 2014 20:07:32 GMT -5 charlatti said:

But Crake didn't invent the game, did he? I've only read the first in the trilogy so far -- I was assuming we'd find out who MaddAddam is in that book. In this one, it gives the impression that the game existed on its own when Crake and Jimmy were just kids.

Hmmm...you may be right, and I may have forgotten this detail (I didn't end up re-reading O&C for this discussion since I've read it a couple of times).  I don't remember from MaddAddam, either, obviously - it's not that I'm giving it away, I swear!

I guess I was just thinking of Crake as the Grandmaster behind humanity's extinction and giving him extra credit that he doesn't deserve.

[charlatti]

Aug 28, 2014 20:32:39 GMT -5 aurora said:

I guess I was just thinking of Crake as the Grandmaster behind humanity's extinction and giving him extra credit that he doesn't deserve.

Either way, he was behind it all. He used his entry into the Extinctathon elite to recruit likeminded others to help make it all happen. 

Related question: Atwood clearly implies that Crake tested the drug out on his father and stepmother, and he kills himself and Oryx. Does he believe he's saving them? Did he really love Oryx?

[meredithj]

I think Crake was a sociopath and didn't have real feelings at all. I think he formed an attachment to Jimmy only because he always sensed that Jimmy was enough of a follower/loser that he would do what Crake wanted in the end. I'm not sure that Crake meant to die, after all, it was Jimmy who killed him after Oryx was killed.

[charlatti]

Aug 29, 2014 12:18:52 GMT -5 meredithj said:

I think Crake was a sociopath and didn't have real feelings at all. I think he formed an attachment to Jimmy only because he always sensed that Jimmy was enough of a follower/loser that he would do what Crake wanted in the end. I'm not sure that Crake meant to die, after all, it was Jimmy who killed him after Oryx was killed.

That's right, he didn't kill himself! I remembered that wrong. I find myself wanting to sympathize with him for some reason, despite his character being rather unsympathetic.

[aurora]

Aug 29, 2014 12:18:52 GMT -5 meredithj said:

I think Crake was a sociopath and didn't have real feelings at all. I think he formed an attachment to Jimmy only because he always sensed that Jimmy was enough of a follower/loser that he would do what Crake wanted in the end. I'm not sure that Crake meant to die, after all, it was Jimmy who killed him after Oryx was killed.

I think Crake did want to die but didn't want to do it himself.  I think that's why he waited until Jimmy was watching to kill Oryx - he knew Jimmy would kill him in his rage.  I don't have my book copy with me at work, but according to the internet right after Crake killed Oryx he looked at Jimmy and said “I’m counting on you.”

I do agree that he seemed like a sociopath, and to charlatti's question I don't think he really thought about saving others (Oryx or his parents) because he couldn't really think of other people as humans.