Stupid question re citizenship, do I have duel citizenship?

[liveintheville]

Oh and I have emailed the consulate. Thanks guys!

[toesie]

That's a crazy story!
I guess your birth certificate is in English? If so, it's legal. My DH was adopted, he also has a US birth certificate when he's adopted and an original birth certificate.

[liveintheville]

Oct 1, 2014 12:27:36 GMT -5 toesie said:

That's a crazy story!
I guess your birth certificate is in English? If so, it's legal. My DH was adopted, he also has a US birth certificate when he's adopted and an original birth certificate.

Yeah. I wish I had an original.

[heygrey]

this is a totally nosy question and you absolutely don't have to answer...

were the babies/children that were evacuated orphans? or were they just rounding up kids in the street without verifying if they had family still? i'm baffled by this idea that the US just walked in and took children.

[liveintheville]

Oct 1, 2014 12:33:47 GMT -5 heygrey said:

this is a totally nosy question and you absolutely don't have to answer...

were the babies/children that were evacuated orphans? or were they just rounding up kids in the street without verifying if they had family still? i'm baffled by this idea that the US just walked in and took children.

Oh I don't mind answering any questions at all. Ask away. But I don't know a ton. 
They took orphans and kids whose families gave them up to get them out of the country. Supposedly they gave up parental rights to do this. But there were many cases where the family eventually made it to the states and then tried to get their child back who had already been placed with an adoptive family. Like I said complete cluster.

[mrsfarmer]

We just finalized our second adoption here in the US and they do amend the birth certificate to remove birth parents and put our names on.

[heygrey]

Oct 1, 2014 12:38:32 GMT -5 liveintheville said:

Oct 1, 2014 12:33:47 GMT -5 heygrey said:

this is a totally nosy question and you absolutely don't have to answer...

were the babies/children that were evacuated orphans? or were they just rounding up kids in the street without verifying if they had family still? i'm baffled by this idea that the US just walked in and took children.

Oh I don't mind answering any questions at all. Ask away. But I don't know a ton. 
They took orphans and kids whose families gave them up to get them out of the country. Supposedly they gave up parental rights to do this. But there were many cases where the family eventually made it to the states and then tried to get their child back who had already been placed with an adoptive family. Like I said complete cluster.

that is insane. i can't imagine the heartache those parents felt. to think that sending your children away was the best option for their futures... but to still have the hope that maybe you could be reunited again. 

[liveintheville]

Oct 1, 2014 12:43:44 GMT -5 heygrey said:

Oct 1, 2014 12:38:32 GMT -5 liveintheville said:

Oh I don't mind answering any questions at all. Ask away. But I don't know a ton. 
They took orphans and kids whose families gave them up to get them out of the country. Supposedly they gave up parental rights to do this. But there were many cases where the family eventually made it to the states and then tried to get their child back who had already been placed with an adoptive family. Like I said complete cluster.

that is insane. i can't imagine the heartache those parents felt. to think that sending your children away was the best option for their futures... but to still have the hope that maybe you could be reunited again. 

My birth mother gave me up. She released me to Holt Adoption Agency, though. And Holt was one of the agencies who evacuated everyone they had there.

[glynn]

Can the Adoption Agency help you with your records??
We adopted DD2 from Canada and her current birth certificate has our names on it. I have tons of stuff I kept for her. I have seen a copy of her orginal birth certiifcate and may have kept a copy of it but items had been blacked out. I do have DD2's Passport from Canada which I am thankful I got to keep when we got DD2 a US Passport. i have looks of records from Canada with stuff marked threw. We have contact with her Grandparents and I hope to get more stuff as she questions things. They fostered her until we took her and I have stuff from Canada that they did not get access to. In my thoughts all information is good even the bad for my adult DD2. DD2 is 7 now.

[rubytue]

Oct 1, 2014 11:14:23 GMT -5 liveintheville said:

Hmm. Seems like I could possibly get a passport if I had a valid birth certificate. But my birth certificate is the sketchiest document ever. It was issued in 1977 and I was born in 1975. Plus it lists my adoptive parents as my parents. Which just doesn't seem legal. 

I have no info on the Vietnamese citizenship part, but this in and of itself is pretty typical of adoptions in the 70s. I'm surprised you can't get a passport.

At least if I followed this right... I may have missed something key.

I was born in 1974, my birth certificate is from 1975 with the names of my adoptive parents as my parents, and a made up birthplace. I've never seen any birth certificate with my birth parents names. But we do differ bc I know one exists, it's just sealed and needs a judge to open.

[Deleted]

Oct 1, 2014 13:31:59 GMT -5 rubytue said:

Oct 1, 2014 11:14:23 GMT -5 liveintheville said:

Hmm. Seems like I could possibly get a passport if I had a valid birth certificate. But my birth certificate is the sketchiest document ever. It was issued in 1977 and I was born in 1975. Plus it lists my adoptive parents as my parents. Which just doesn't seem legal. 

I have no info on the Vietnamese citizenship part, but this in and of itself is pretty typical of adoptions in the 70s. I'm surprised you can't get a passport.

At least if I followed this right... I may have missed something key.

I was born in 1974, my birth certificate is from 1975 with the names of my adoptive parents as my parents, and a made up birthplace. I've never seen any birth certificate with my birth parents names. But we do differ bc I know one exists, it's just sealed and needs a judge to open.

Mine is the same way. My birth certificate was issued in 1991 and has my mom and adoptive father as my birth parents. (My mom remarried and her husband adopted me. I was born in 1986.)

[auntie]

Oct 1, 2014 11:16:02 GMT -5 heygrey said:

it varies so much from country to country. it's worth looking into though because if you are a vietnamese citizen that may be something you want to pass on to your boys. i'm not sure if there are any strong perks to holding a vietnamese passport (unlike, say, holding a passport in the European Union), but i don't think there would be a downside?



++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

My niece had dual citizenship based on being born to American parents overseas. Her country of birth required her to select one on her majority. She enrolled at the USAFA, the oath she took there was sufficient to drop the other country.

I have friends whose children would be eligible for dual citizenship with states that have a mandatory military service (Israel and Turkey); they both opted out to avoid this. I would consider conscription a downside.

[msmerymac]

Oct 1, 2014 11:05:44 GMT -5 audette said:

Oct 1, 2014 11:01:24 GMT -5 v said:

Depends on the laws in Vietnam.

Call the consulate to see what they say?

vietnamembassy-usa.org/consular

This.

Not every country has birth-right citizenship. Some countries do not allow dual citizenship. Some countries consider the wording of the US Oath of Naturalization to be a revocation of their citizenship.  Some countries require certain actions by non-resident citizens to maintain citizenship.

No way to know without looking into the Vietnamese laws.  The US won't consider you a dual citizen, but they seem to have a general policy of ignoring it when a naturalized citizen maintains their prior citizenship. 

ETA: Just read a few more posts - I didn't know your whole backstory, but it definitely does not fall into the norm of an adult immigrating to the US. I have no clue what the US would consider regarding dual citizenship in that case, so the US might actually consider you a dual citizen.    Best to contact the Consulate and see what they say. Looks like they have previously had a program for handling those wanting to reclaim their citizenship, and while that program may now be done, it may have brought in a lot more inquiries. They should be able to help you figure it out.

Pretty much everyone I know who is a dual citizen is such because they were born somewhere other than the US to a US citizen (like my SIL, who was born when my in-laws were living in Toronto). One friend who was born in Canada to American and Japanese parents did, for some reason, have to renounce her Canadian citizenship when she was 18, but I think that's rare. The US won't acknowledge your status as anything other than a US citizen, and none of the people with dual citizenship I know have anything but a US passport, but it still "exists."

I would imagine there are many citizenship questions for Vietnamese nationals who left the country as children, though. Actually, a good friend did that, but he was born a US citizen (American father, Vietnamese mother), so I should ask what his citizenship status is...

[msmerymac]

Oct 1, 2014 13:39:43 GMT -5 auntie said:

Oct 1, 2014 11:16:02 GMT -5 heygrey said:

it varies so much from country to country. it's worth looking into though because if you are a vietnamese citizen that may be something you want to pass on to your boys. i'm not sure if there are any strong perks to holding a vietnamese passport (unlike, say, holding a passport in the European Union), but i don't think there would be a downside?



++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

My niece had dual citizenship based on being born to American parents overseas. Her country of birth required her to select one on her majority. She enrolled at the USAFA, the oath she took there was sufficient to drop the other country.

I have friends whose children would be eligible for dual citizenship with states that have a mandatory military service (Israel and Turkey); they both opted out to avoid this. I would consider conscription a downside.

As a 39 year old woman, I imagine this wouldn't be a concern in this case. 

liveintheville do you know your actual birth date if you didn't have any documentation?

[liveintheville]

Oct 1, 2014 13:52:10 GMT -5 msmerymac said:

Oct 1, 2014 13:39:43 GMT -5 auntie said:

As a 39 year old woman, I imagine this wouldn't be a concern in this case. 

liveintheville do you know your actual birth date if you didn't have any documentation?

We're pretty sure it's feb 26. But I swear there's a document saying the 25th somewhere. We go with the 26th.

[craftyone]

I don't think it would hurt to check if you can obtain dual. My husband and one of my sons have dual with Finland. It happened because my MIL who was born in Finland lost her Finnish citizenship when she became a US citizen. Years later Finland had an open enrollment period that allowed former citizens and their children (and in turn my husband's children) to declare citizenship. My husband never had to do the required military service since we live here.

We have never used it, but my husband has it in his "back pocket" if he every decides to move back there..

[wise_rita]

Oct 1, 2014 11:55:48 GMT -5 liveintheville said:

Oct 1, 2014 11:52:19 GMT -5 v said:

Call the consulate anyway.  There may be exceptions/extensions/etc.   If you're *really* interested in pursuing this, an immigration lawyer may be able to help (or tell you if it is hopeless).

I just feel like I have so little to pass down to my kids about their ethnicity. I have a cool story about how I entered the country and that's it.

Even if you're granted Vietnamese citizenship it doesn't mean your kids will.

[toesie]

Oct 1, 2014 23:33:18 GMT -5 wise_rita said:

Oct 1, 2014 11:55:48 GMT -5 liveintheville said:

I just feel like I have so little to pass down to my kids about their ethnicity. I have a cool story about how I entered the country and that's it.

Even if you're granted Vietnamese citizenship it doesn't mean your kids will.

Yes, you can register your kids.

[drloretta]

Oct 1, 2014 11:14:23 GMT -5 liveintheville said:

Hmm. Seems like I could possibly get a passport if I had a valid birth certificate. But my birth certificate is the sketchiest document ever. It was issued in 1977 and I was born in 1975. Plus it lists my adoptive parents as my parents. Which just doesn't seem legal. 

Legal. DD's birthmom has her original BC, but after finalization we got a new one with us listed as her parents. Having 2 would be a paperwork nightmare without an adoption decree as well, so this is what the powers that be came up with. With the cluster you explained, who knows how that worked

[Deleted]

Depends. I was born in Saudi Arabia but don't have citizenship, birth is not considered a route to citizenship there.

[wise_rita]

Oct 2, 2014 8:07:15 GMT -5 toesie said:

Oct 1, 2014 23:33:18 GMT -5 wise_rita said:

Even if you're granted Vietnamese citizenship it doesn't mean your kids will.

Yes, you can register your kids.

"Register"?

Not all countries automatically pass down citizenship from citizen parent to child-born-elsewhere. Particularly if the parent has virtually no residency in that country their entire life.

I know nothing about Vietnamese citizenship, but citizenship on the whole is a complicated, tangled web that changes the rules often.