F/U and a question about the incident at my apartment

[Deleted]

The original post and several updates are here: pandce.proboards.com/thread/373996/september-officially-worst-month-me

(Summary- our dog sitter, B, had a "get together" at our apartment while we were out of town, even though we specifically told her not to have people over, and says she was date raped while this was going on. People went through our belongings in our bedroom and we believe they took some medication. There was vomit left in several places. There is an ongoing police investigation about the rape.)

I was so mad about everything last night that I couldn't sleep, and today I arranged a time to talk to B's mom. Maybe it wasn't the best time but my H and I felt like we needed to have some answers to things. The police couldn't give us any details. B lives with her mom still and the mom was there for the police questioning, so we felt like this might be more appropriate than talking to B herself.

According to the mom, B doesn't remember most of the night. She apparently doesn't know what time people got there or when they left. She remembers vomiting but she doesn't know where she vomited or if the vomit we found everywhere could have been someone else's. She says she didn't go through our medication but vaguely remembers someone trying to give her medication. B was supposed to walk our dogs at 5pm on Sunday because we weren't getting home until Sunday at 9pm.... she says she doesn't remember what time SHE left on Sunday, although admitted that she didn't know if the dogs got walked at all that day (even though she texted me at 5:15pm on Sunday and said she just gave them their last walk). So she basically lied. And the dogs had peed in our apartment. Two different police officers told us the B's story is questionable and insinuated they don't believe she was raped so I don't even know what to think anymore.

I asked her not to cash the check we gave her for dog sitting, and the mom said she would not.

Some questions... I would like to send her an itemized list of things we would like for her to reimburse us for because of all of this. Do you think this is a bad idea? How long do you think is an appropriate enough time to wait to do this given the situation? I don't want to seem insensitive to everything that has happened but I am pissed. 

What do you think about also asking her to pay for these things?
- everything the police took as evidence, which includes the sheets, comforter set and mattress pad (which will be $250+ to replace).
- professional cleaning of anything that had vomit on it: living room carpet and guest bathroom
- carpet cleaning in the guest bedroom where the incident happened
- carpet cleaning under our dining room table, which has drink stains

[hamster]

I don't think you'd be out of line at all for asking for reimbursement of those expenses.

What was her moms reaction to not cashing the check? Did she seem to understand how you were feeling, or think you're a monster for not focusing on her daughter?

[thinkofthesoldiers]

I understand being angry that this went on, but you don't know for a fact that she wasn't raped. Using a nonprofessional for a job like this has certain risks, and shit like this is one of them. I wouldn't go beyond asking her not to cash the check. If she was raped, it is like rubbing salt in the wound. If she wasn't, then you took the high road, and you probably wouldn't be paid back for any of this anyway.

[Deleted]

Oct 1, 2014 20:15:31 GMT -5 hamster said:

I don't think you'd be out of line at all for asking for reimbursement of those expenses.

What was her moms reaction to not cashing the check? Did she seem to understand how you were feeling, or think you're a monster for not focusing on her daughter?

Well, I started off the conversation by asking how her daughter was doing and talking about how awful I felt for her. I told her the only reason I was calling was because we had gotten no answers to what exactly went on at our apartment, and the police wouldn't tell us anything.

She said she completely understood how upset I was. She said she wouldn't want her daughter to cash the check and didn't think she would anyway, but that she would ask her just to make sure.

I should mention with the check (and the mom knew this)- we were supposed to be out of town for 2 nights but at the last minute on Saturday decided to come back a day early. We pay her $50/night so the check was for $100. I told her to keep the extra $50 because of the late notice... and she accepted it, knowing she was going to have a party there. 

[dexteroni]

omfg. I am so livid on your behalf. If she didn't walk the dogs at all, her awful behavior started long before any party or assault happened.

I would keep compiling the list for another week or so because you may encounter more damaged or missing stuff. I would not hesitate to tell her that I expect reimbursement for everything that was damaged, stolen, or confiscated by the police. I'm very sorry for whatever happened to her, but none of it should have taken place in your home. It would be totally different if, say, someone broke in and assaulted her, and stuff was damaged in the process. But she invited strangers into your home and they caused the damage, so it's on her.

[v]

Oct 1, 2014 20:26:45 GMT -5 swizz said:

Oct 1, 2014 20:18:18 GMT -5 thinkofthesoldiers said:

I understand being angry that this went on, but you don't know for a fact that she wasn't raped. Using a nonprofessional for a job like this has certain risks, and shit like this is one of them. I wouldn't go beyond asking her not to cash the check. If she was raped, it is like rubbing salt in the wound. If she wasn't, then you took the high road, and you probably wouldn't be paid back for any of this anyway.

I have to agree with this. 

I also hate confrontation and I don't think I'd be able to go back to her and ask for reimbursements. 

Yup.

I'd also see what your insurance carrier will take care of.  

[hamster]

Keep in mind this money would likely be coming from the mom, not the daughter, if that matters any to you. I dont get the sense she is responsible enough to have that kind of money (NOT a victim shame if anybody's mind tries to wander there)

[Deleted]

Oct 1, 2014 20:26:45 GMT -5 swizz said:

Oct 1, 2014 20:18:18 GMT -5 thinkofthesoldiers said:

I understand being angry that this went on, but you don't know for a fact that she wasn't raped. Using a nonprofessional for a job like this has certain risks, and shit like this is one of them. I wouldn't go beyond asking her not to cash the check. If she was raped, it is like rubbing salt in the wound. If she wasn't, then you took the high road, and you probably wouldn't be paid back for any of this anyway.

I think I agree with this. 

I also hate confrontation and I don't think I'd be able to go back to her and ask for reimbursements. 

Okay, thank you for the other perspective.

I originally talked to the mom when the police were searching our apartment. She knew the crime scene unit was coming and that they were going to take anything that could be evidence. She told me before they even got there that she would replace whatever they took. Then I talked to her again the next day and she brought it up again. So I guess I never saw replacing that as rubbing salt in the wound... BUT I would never want to do that, so maybe I should reconsider.

[tacom]

I agree with TOTS. I also would just want to wash my hands of this. My stomach keeps turning just reading the posts about it.

[Deleted]

I think it's fair to ask for the cleaning services to be reimbursed. I'd be hesitant to ask her to replace the sheets she was potentially raped on. To me, it's like saying, it's your fault you were raped because you invited these people into my house so now it's your responsibility to pay for them. I would tread lightly. And many rape victims aren't taken seriously; it really wasn't appropriate for the police to insinuate anything to you during the investigation.

Does she even have the money to cover all those expenses? I guess her parents would help her ...

ETA: I just saw the update about the mom offering to pay. In that case, I would provide the mom and daughter with the full list. I might still leave the sheets off ... Maybe? ... I don't know. I'm sorry you're dealing with this.

[Deleted]

Oct 1, 2014 20:27:43 GMT -5 v said:

Oct 1, 2014 20:26:45 GMT -5 swizz said:

I have to agree with this. 

I also hate confrontation and I don't think I'd be able to go back to her and ask for reimbursements. 

Yup.

I'd also see what your insurance carrier will take care of.  

I will have to check with them. We are not named on the police report, so I wonder if that will make a difference. They wouldn't let us file our own report. 

[awkwardpenguin]

I would ask for reimbursement for the cleaning of the vomit and the drink stains. I would not ask for reimbursement for what was taken as evidence, because she didn't have control over what the police did in the course of their investigation. Basically hold her responsible for having a party but not for things related to the alleged rape.

[dexteroni]

Oct 1, 2014 20:31:27 GMT -5 @linzercookie said:

I'd be hesitant to ask her to replace the sheets she was potentially raped on. To me, it's like saying, it's your fault you were raped because you invited these people into my house so now it's your responsibility to pay for them.

That I definitely get. If you want to remove anything having to do with the rape from the list, that would be fine. But stuff like carpet cleaning and other party-related damage, I mean, you would ask her to reimburse that if there hadn't been an assault, right?

A lot of my anger would be stemming from the fact that she doesn't know if she walked the dogs at all that whole day. If the part wasn't until that night, there's no excuse for that. Unless the party was both nights, in which case...rage.

[Deleted]

Oct 1, 2014 20:37:48 GMT -5 dexteroni said:

Oct 1, 2014 20:31:27 GMT -5 @linzercookie said:

I'd be hesitant to ask her to replace the sheets she was potentially raped on. To me, it's like saying, it's your fault you were raped because you invited these people into my house so now it's your responsibility to pay for them.

That I definitely get. If you want to remove anything having to do with the rape from the list, that would be fine. But stuff like carpet cleaning and other party-related damage, I mean, you would ask her to reimburse that if there hadn't been an assault, right?

A lot of my anger would be stemming from the fact that she doesn't know if she walked the dogs at all that whole day. If the part wasn't until that night, there's no excuse for that. Unless the party was both nights, in which case...rage.

TOTS is right in that that's a risk you take when hiring a non-professional, but I don't think that means you shouldn't ask. I would.

Sunday was the day after the party. 

So basically we asked her to walk the dogs around 5pm because we were going to be home at 9pm. She texted us at 5:15pm and said she just walked them and was leaving for the day.

Her mom said she was borderline unconscious the whole day on Sunday, and almost couldn't drive home. She told her mom she 'had no idea' what time she left our apartment. This means my dogs probably hadn't gone out since the night before. 

[v]

Oct 1, 2014 20:37:48 GMT -5 dexteroni said:

A lot of my anger would be stemming from the fact that she doesn't know if she walked the dogs at all that whole day. If the part wasn't until that night, there's no excuse for that. Unless the party was both nights, in which case...rage.

The party was Saturday night and she doesn't remember whether the dog was walked on Sunday, right?  If I was drugged and raped on Saturday night, I might forget details about the day after too. 

[sjh722]

I'm really sorry you are dealing with this on top of everything else. It's a shitty situation all around.

I keep typing and deleting replies. On the one hand, I would rather take the high road and not rub salt in the wound, as pp put it. On the other hand, that is a lot of damage to deal with, and the mom offered twice. I got the impression from your post that the mom was offering to reimburse, not the daughter.

I'd probably start with the insurance company to see what, if anything, they cover and go from there.

[Deleted]

Oct 1, 2014 20:42:03 GMT -5 sjh722 said:

I'm really sorry you are dealing with this on top of everything else. It's a shitty situation all around.

I keep typing and deleting replies. On the one hand, I would rather take the high road and not rub salt in the wound, as pp put it. On the other hand, that is a lot of damage to deal with, and the mom offered twice. I got the impression from your post that the mom was offering to reimburse, not the daughter.

I'd probably start with the insurance company to see what, if anything, they cover and go from there.

We are also replacing the mattress in that room, which was $700. I know this was not her fault but replacing the mattress and bedding alone is going to be close to $1,000. You're right- I should contact insurance. We have renter's insurance.

[dexteroni]

Oct 1, 2014 20:42:01 GMT -5 v said:

Oct 1, 2014 20:37:48 GMT -5 dexteroni said:

A lot of my anger would be stemming from the fact that she doesn't know if she walked the dogs at all that whole day. If the part wasn't until that night, there's no excuse for that. Unless the party was both nights, in which case...rage.

The party was Saturday night and she doesn't remember whether the dog was walked on Sunday, right?  If I was drugged and raped on Saturday night, I might forget details about the day after too. 

Oh, I misread that; I thought it was the day of the party. Yeah I wouldn't expect them to have been walked the day after the party either, knowing what went on.

[mcsangel2]

Doesn't explain the text she sent at 5:15 saying they were walked and she was leaving, though. That part is odd, if she was really that out of it.

However, I do concur with staying away from anything that looks like victim shaming/skepticism.

[flygirl22]

I could not bring myself to ask for anything. She was raped, if this were me basically everything else would feel less important. I get that you are hurt, I don't think her not remembering when she let the dogs out out of line with being drugged the night before. Maybe she did let the dogs out at 5:30, and sent you the text and she just doesn't remember?

Do you think she is doing all of this because she threw a rager and didn't want to get caught? Why wouldn't she just clean it if this were the case?

If this was a child that I was close to I just can't imagine focusing on getting reimbursement. Or maybe I'm just a push-over..

[thinkofthesoldiers]

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that the mom isn't expecting to pay for carpet cleaning and replacement mattresses. She is probably thinking trinkets, copays for medications, and maybe sheets if it came to that. It just seems like a big leap to assume she is going to willingly pay for all of this.

[aurora]

I think I would wait a week or two before asking for reimbursement. It seems like more of the story of what really happened might come out in the meantime.

I would feel very guilty asking a rape victim to pay to replace the bedding she was raped on, even if she shouldn't have had the party in your house and neglected your dogs. The rest of it isn't quite as emotionally sensitive.

[Deleted]

Oct 1, 2014 20:52:25 GMT -5 thinkofthesoldiers said:

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that the mom isn't expecting to pay for carpet cleaning and replacement mattresses. She is probably thinking trinkets, copays for medications, and maybe sheets if it came to that. It just seems like a big leap to assume she is going to willingly pay for all of this.

I'm definitely not asking for her to pay for a mattress. I was just saying that it's an additional expense we are dealing with. I would not ask her to pay for that.

[Deleted]

Oct 1, 2014 20:51:00 GMT -5 flygirl22 said:

I could not bring myself to ask for anything. She was raped, if this were me basically everything else would feel less important. I get that you are hurt, I don't think her not remembering when she let the dogs out out of line with being drugged the night before. Maybe she did let the dogs out at 5:30, and sent you the text and she just doesn't remember?

Do you think she is doing all of this because she threw a rager and didn't want to get caught? Why wouldn't she just clean it if this were the case?

If this was a child that I was close to I just can't imagine focusing on getting reimbursement. Or maybe I'm just a push-over..

I understand what you are saying. I'm really not trying to be insensitive to what's going on here.

[pacificrules]

It makes sense to me to create an itemized list for party-related clean up expenses. It was her fault that she invited people over and made a mess of your place. I would leave off the list anything related to the assault/rape since that was out of her control.

I'm sorry you're dealing with this. What an awful situation!

[msmerymac]

Oct 1, 2014 20:27:43 GMT -5 v said:

Oct 1, 2014 20:26:45 GMT -5 swizz said:

I have to agree with this. 

I also hate confrontation and I don't think I'd be able to go back to her and ask for reimbursements. 

Yup.

I'd also see what your insurance carrier will take care of.  

Eh, my insurance deductible is $1000, which is actually kind of low for homeowners. If her's is similar, I would imagine all of these damages would not even equal that amount. 

That said, I have a small carpet steamer, and I'd try to clean the drink stains off the dining room carpet myself first, unless there was some kind of 3 room discount with the professional cleaners. You can also rent carpet cleaners from Home Depot pretty cheaply. 

[msmerymac]

Okay, I'm leaning towards TOTS's opinion right now, but what would the total costs be to the mom? $250 for bedding? How much for carpet cleaning? I'd keep that as cheap as possible (coupon or DIY) and not hit her with more than like $400 worth of stuff. AND I wouldn't bring it up for at least a week or two.

[imojoebunny]

Yeah. I would not ask for anything and hire a professional pet sitter the next time. I have two friends who are professional pet sitters. I have gone with them on their rounds to care for pets. I am never allowed in the pet owners house. I just walk with them with the dogs (at night). I would just be greatful that she is not suing you for being raped in your house. She may or may not have been raped, but the truth is, she has claimed she was injured on your property. You have assets. She doesn't. She was either injured on your property or she is an excellent liar. I would be done with her as fast as possible.

[Deleted]

Oct 1, 2014 21:16:49 GMT -5 imojoebunny said:

Yeah. I would not ask for anything and hire a professional pet sitter the next time. I have two friends who are professional pet sitters. I have gone with them on their rounds to care for pets. I am never allowed in the pet owners house. I just walk with them with the dogs (at night).

This is funny because we specifically chose her over a professional pet sitter because we trusted her. I now realize the backwards logic in trusting a 20 y/o more than a professional company. Again, I feel like an idiot.

[vanillacourage]

Itemize a list and give it to your renters insurance. Leave the rape victim alone.