Pre-planning a funeral

[Pom]

This is morbid, but due to some spend down-to benefits rules for potential VA Aid & Attendance and Medicaid stuff we might need for FIL down the line, Mr. P and I are going to handle arrangements for FIL on Monday.  We are also 27 hours away (even 12 travel hours total if we come by plane), so dealing with it beforehand seems like a solid plan.

Has anyone been part of something like this before?  I was there to plan my dad's funeral when he passed but that was over 25 years ago and I was 17.  Pre-planning is probably different and if you have any advice, I would appreciate it.  I would hope the funeral directors are very honest, etc...but I am a buyer beware type person.

[shortstax]

I have no personal experience, but this has a lot of good questions to ask (that I might not have thought about on my own):

www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0305-planning-your-own-funeral

[Deleted]

We did this with my grandma and it wasn't a big deal. It was a good way to spend down, but if I remember right there is a limit on how much can be spent. Doing this over the phone shouldn't be a problem at all.

My best friend is a funeral director and I'd be happy to ask him anything you'd like and he'd probably be willing to talk to you as well if that would help. Just PM me.

[Pom]

Nov 26, 2014 11:02:29 GMT -5 @ruralrabbit1 said:

We did this with my grandma and it wasn't a big deal. It was a good way to spend down, but if I remember right there is a limit on how much can be spent. Doing this over the phone shouldn't be a problem at all.

My best friend is a funeral director and I'd be happy to ask him anything you'd like and he'd probably be willing to talk to you as well if that would help. Just PM me.

Thanks.  Good to know about the limit on how much can be spent. I doubt it will be anything crazy, but I will have to find out what the rules are if they don't know at the funeral home we are meeting with...they handled Mr. Pom's mom's service I guess, so we will be using them. Small town, one option kind of deal. I just want to get it done, especially after some recent scares with FIL and the fact that Mr. Pom is headed out of the country soon for work.

[livinitup]

It was rather simple with my grandmother. There is a federal program/law that allows you to set aside funeral expenses before you Spend down all assets. We did this with my grandmother. We secured a contract with a local funeral home and set aside the maximum allowed for funeral expenses. About 8 years later, she passed away and we used that funeral home and stayed in the budget for the room, casket, Mass cards, etc. We also made arrangements with a church, priest, etc. She had a lovely wake and funeral and the family had little out of pocket expenses

It's a good program in that it makes sense to set aside funds for funeral expenses before all assets are gone. But there are significant flaws in the program - like, it's a poor way to manage a chunk of money, funeral homes close and/or mismanage funds. And you can't pre-pay travel expenses for the family, church donations, catering. And some people think the max is too low.

[Deleted]

My parents pre-planned and pre-paid their own funerals. They just wanted to take that off our plates when the inevitable does someday happen. I think it's a great thing to do if you're not local.

[livinitup]

Nov 26, 2014 11:48:20 GMT -5 @rennido said:

However, this makes me worried because of what my grandma said. What if the catering business goes under? What if the funeral home goes under?
Idk, there are a lot of things to think of, so my vote would be putting money aside in an account with BOTH names on it, and when it happens go from there. Definitely sit down and talk about what they want, have the notes, but don't pre-pay.

There are rules against dispersing funds to family members before you qualify for Medicaid benefits. Medicaid does a 5 year "look back" and if they see you sold your 80k house for $1 to your son or transferred 10k into a joint savings account, grandma/pa won't qualify. The rules for pre-paying for funeral services allow you to spend several thousand dollars, without penalty. It's a program with very specific rules. And flaws.

[moolarkey]

My dad was ill from the time I was 12, he bought a funeral policy that grew large enough that it not only paid for his complete funeral but also my moms. The only thing Mom paid for was the headstone for them.

We all knew the end was near for Dad and he wanted us to go make the arrangements so my mom, my brother and I went to the funeral home about 2 weeks before he died. We were there about 2 hours.

First we discussed what we thought he wanted, gave the funeral director all his information (birth date/location, marriage date/ etc). This was for the little cards handed out during calling (viewing) hours and at the service. Mom had me write the obit for the paper.

We picked out the order of the service, music for calling hours, prior to the service and a couple pieces during the service. We picked flowers, they florist the funeral home used was the one my mom always used so that was cool and they had pictures that we picked from.

Then we moved to the room with all the coffins- it is a huge room with a LOT of coffins. Very weird. We picked a deep wood tone, kind of a mahogany finish. We could select corner pieces, different options. My dad belonged to the Masonic fraternity and we chose the Masonic emblem. Not necessary but my mom liked them. We could choose a special liner for the lid, we chose a guy fishing in a stream. When he was healthy my dad loved to fish, hunt, just be outdoors.

We picked the color of the liner for the coffin too. You'll have several options.

Dad's coffin is in a vault so I'm sure we had some discussion on the vault but the choices are limited so I don't recall that being any issue.

When we left we had brochures showing the liner, the coffin, flowers, etc. and the 3 of us told him what we picked. He liked it all.

I know this sounds bizarre to many people but it brought him a sense of peace.

His coffin also had a drawer in the lower half of the lid, the front half has to be open to access it, and you can put momentos in there, most of the family did. I did not. Before they closed the coffin my mom covered him with his favorite afghan that she'd made for him. He had circulation problems in his legs and was just always cold.

2 weeks later my mom called me, she'd just come from the funeral home. She'd picked out their monument and "ordered" her funeral. Weird phone call but my mom was so practical and it was a funny (ha ha) phone call. The only thing she didn't pick was flowers for on her casket. SHe told me we could buy her some damn flowers or buy her some flowers damn it. something like that. My mom loved red roses so we had a huge spray of red roses, I chose her favorite red suit and had them do her nails in her favorite red nail polish.

Oh and ladies - if you color your hair yourself - be sure you have a box of hair color stashed away. My mom was suddenly ill, couldn't color her hair and it looked awful. Luckily I found a box stashed under her bathroom sink and sent it and her favorite fingernail polish to the funeral home. The directors knew my mom so they knew how to do her hair etc.

Cemetery plots. My parents had bought their plots many years before. The funeral home was aware of this and as part of the funeral plans had the plot opened and ready for the graveside services.

[megstoo]

We had pre planning and pre-payment done with my grandparents and for my mom her crypt was already paid for (we just had to do the casket). It made a world of difference. Doing it while you're in a clear mind makes things a lot easier. You're not rushing trying to remember what they might want or like. For my MIL nothing was done and honestly we spent ALL DAY planning her funeral.

[Deleted]

Nov 26, 2014 11:48:20 GMT -5 @rennido said:

I've been working with my grandma, and my mother-in-law also has made arrangements.
My grandmother chose what she wanted. She sat me down and told me there was an account(with my name on it) that should cover all of the costs of a funeral. She decided not to go thru a funeral home because she would be worried if the business went under. She just wants to be cremated and have her ashes buried at our family homestead.

My mother-in-law has paid for everything, at one point she sat there and told us how it was SO expensive, and how she already hired the catering company and that was one of the reasons, she wanted good food. However, this makes me worried because of what my grandma said. What if the catering business goes under? What if the funeral home goes under?
Idk, there are a lot of things to think of, so my vote would be putting money aside in an account with BOTH names on it, and when it happens go from there. Definitely sit down and talk about what they want, have the notes, but don't pre-pay.

I asked my friend the funeral director what happened if the funeral home closed.  He said the pre-pay contracts would be bought out by another funeral home, probably from a nearby town.

[nomad100]

Keep copies of your paperwork because not doing so ended badly for MIL. GMIL pre-paid, pre-planned her funeral at the funeral home in the tiny town she grew up in shortly after her 2nd husband died. Funeral home was sold between the pre-paying and GMIL's death. When GMIL died, MIL couldn't find the paperwork anywhere in GMIL's papers. New funeral home didn't have a copy (since it had been something like 10 years so maybe it got misfiled, lost, destroyed on their end?) so MIL had to pay for everything again. All that money went to waste because no one could find the paperwork.

[Pom]

Nov 26, 2014 14:11:56 GMT -5 nomad100 said:

Keep copies of your paperwork because not doing so ended badly for MIL. GMIL pre-paid, pre-planned her funeral at the funeral home in the tiny town she grew up in shortly after her 2nd husband died. Funeral home was sold between the pre-paying and GMIL's death. When GMIL died, MIL couldn't find the paperwork anywhere in GMIL's papers. New funeral home didn't have a copy (since it had been something like 10 years so maybe it got misfiled, lost, destroyed on their end?) so MIL had to pay for everything again. All that money went to waste because no one could find the paperwork.

Oh god, that's terrible. It will go in our lock box.

[frlcb]

You would be buying a policy through the funeral home but it would be backed (generally, I am sure there are exceptions) by a company - some big ones are Assurant Preneed, Forethought, United Heritage, Homesteaders. It is essentially an insurance policy.

So, if they buy a policy through a funeral home that is, for example, owned by dignity memorial, and then that particular funeral home closes, the policy would go to a nearby home also owned by dignity memorial.

I worked for a preneed company for several years, it is all very much on the up and up and a great way to spend down money before medicaid kicks in.

[lys]

My parents did a prepaid funeral plan with a local funeral business. They chose caskets, paid for enbalment, and other funeral services - transportation to and from church and to the cemetary etc -- and also bought a burial plot at the cemetary and had a headstone make with only the death date needing to be added. It made things sooooo much easier when the time came to deal with their passing.

We all die. IMO having these things in order is a gift to those who love you.

[moolarkey]

I made one phone call. I called the funeral director and let him know she was gone. He took care of everything else. He came to the house to pick up her suit, nail polish and hair color, I told him we wanted roses for the casket spray. I didn't do another thing except show up at the funeral home for calling hours and for the funeral.

That evening, after the funeral, he called me at my mom's house. He apologized for calling but asked if we would mind if his stone carver added my mom's death date to my parent's marker the next day since he was in town. If I didn't want him to do that, if it was too soon, it would be ok, they'd wait a month or so. My mom was very practical. I laughed and told him to do it, my mom would be so in favor of it.

[heyney]

I have just gone through this, PM me and I'll give you deets

[AAM2012]

I didn't read all the responses, but I like the idea in theory. My only concern is that if the funeral home goes out of business you're screwed. However, given FIL's age it may not be that big of a risk.

[moolarkey]

Nov 26, 2014 21:38:56 GMT -5 AAM2012 said:

I didn't read all the responses, but I like the idea in theory. My only concern is that if the funeral home goes out of business you're screwed. However, given FIL's age it may not be that big of a risk.

I think you can buy through a funeral home but you can also buy directly through companies that provide this type of insurance. My dad's was not through a specific funeral home but I don't know who it actually was through. He died in 2000 and my mom in 2002 and I don't think I still have any of that paperwork left.  When my dad purchased it I was 12, he wasn't expected to live long. He far exceeded their expectations and the money continued to grow. By the time he died it not only paid for all of the expenses associated with his funeral but it also paid for my mother's expenses when she died.

[10nille]

One interesting thing we came across and not sure if all states have this regulations was regarding cremation. Florida had this rule that all the children had to sign off they agreed to the procedure. This was in the case where my FIL was mentally unable to make his own decisions and had not specified prior his wishes. We happen to be making cremation arrangements for his Mom and decided to take care of his Dad's in the event of his death. Once a person is dead a POA does not cover making decisions for them. Fortunately, my DH has only one sibling and it was easy to get her to sign the form.

[Deleted]

When you sign a contract with a funeral home and set aside funds, it's generally insured by a larger company or put into a trust. Funeral homes going out of business is a non-issue. That's not how the mortuary business works (for those who seem to be worried about that.)

These are very common though, and most funeral homes will walk you through it and discuss all options. And although morbid, having all this pre-planned will make things so much easier. When FIL passed in August he had no plans whatsoever, and sitting down to work out the details hours after he passed was not at all good for DH.

[CakeLover]

Nov 26, 2014 23:19:09 GMT -5 papiercherri said:

When you sign a contract with a funeral home and set aside funds, it's generally insured by a larger company or put into a trust. Funeral homes going out of business is a non-issue. That's not how the mortuary business works (for those who seem to be worried about that.)

These are very common though, and most funeral homes will walk you through it and discuss all options. And although morbid, having all this pre-planned will make things so much easier. When FIL passed in August he had no plans whatsoever, and sitting down to work out the details hours after he passed was not at all good for DH.

Yes, all very true. My mom works for one of the larger companies that does this. She used to work at a funeral home doing pre-planning and then was hired by the insurance company that underwrites these policies. 

[whitemerlot]

My grandmother preplanned everything. She was cremated and prepaid that. She also had her whole church service planned and a note for the program written. She even wrote her own obit.