So FIL has a rental and it needs major bathroom repairs. The renters have been begging us to sell it to them. We struck an as is deal for a land contract, since they can't qualify for a loan. Ugh. We don't want to sell to them nor do a LC, but we don't want to sink the money in to fixing it while we are paying out the ass to fix other rental house and main residence which we hope to sell this summer. We will need this money eventually for FIL's care.
None the less, Mr. P originally bought this property when he graduated HS and got his first job. It's a small lake lot with an old mobile home on it. When he went away to out of state college, he signed the deed over to his dad/FIL.
The issue is there is no title for this mobile home. We've found titles to other vehicles and deeds, but there "could be" a title for the trailer, but sources---the secretary of state, title company, etc... tell us that on these older mobile homes, often no title was issued before a certain date. For the sale to go through, REA is asking us for the title. SOS searched under both FIL and Mr. Pom's and property address and came up with nothing. We are trying to find a VIN and look for it that way. A title search will cost $150 and very possibly, there is no title.
We've called the SOS and title company that handled the loan when Mr. P bought it originally and everyone keeps telling us to get a surety bond. REA doesn't seem to want us to go this route, but we haven't figured anything else out. I called FIL's insurance agency and he was less than helpful telling me that people always find a way to get around this issue, but when I pressed him, he offered no suggestions. He did say the policy/surety bond (to clarify) is probably $600 and was anxious to get off the telephone.
You are all wise. Can anyone give me any thoughts on this? Can we file for lost title? Of course, as you might know, we are 27 hours away from this property, so yeah, that's helpful. REA wants the commission, but doesn't seem to offer much in the way of assistance.
UPDATE: Thanks to everyone who helped us. We got the VIN and still no title. I tracked down old loan papers when Mr. P bought it, no title with the docs. We talked to the Secretary of State and all of the sub departments that deal with mobile homes, no title and they also checked purged files with the VIN. The SOS told us to find the deed and see if the trailer is included on the deed work...I called everyone in the county and it is noted on the deed and therefore part of the taxed property. You'd think this would help. Title company called and said too bad, so sad, the local Secretary of State branch says Mr. Pom must appear IN PERSON, (no ifs, ands or buts) with his POA, completed forms, VIN, etc...and we STILL need to buy a surety bond. :::head desk:::
Check the closet in the bedroom or near the water heater for the vin #. (I speak from experience as we have been trying to get title for our rental which is also a mobile home so we can have it converted to real property). What about DMV? There should be a way to request duplicate title (That is what we are having to do)
Check the closet in the bedroom or near the water heater for the vin #. (I speak from experience as we have been trying to get title for our rental which is also a mobile home so we can have it converted to real property). What about DMV? There should be a way to request duplicate title (That is what we are having to do)
We did get one of the REAs to go over and look for the VIN. I hope he finds it. If/when he finds the #, we will call the DMV/SOS again.
The VIN number could also be on the inside of the electrical panel or underneath the house on the tongue or axle.
Do you have the title insurance policy from when it was bought by Mr. P? It may have the VIN on it. Also, was there a mortgage/Deed of Trust on it at any time? The VIN might be added into the legal description.
What state is this in? You can PM me if you want. I have some mobile home resources I could tap into to see what I can find out. Without going into it too much, I know a whole team of people that deal with mobile homes and mobile home title conversions in all 50 states.
The VIN number could also be on the inside of the electrical panel or underneath the house on the tongue or axle.
Do you have the title insurance policy from when it was bought by Mr. P? It may have the VIN on it. Also, was there a mortgage/Deed of Trust on it at any time? The VIN might be added into the legal description.
What state is this in? You can PM me if you want. I have some mobile home resources I could tap into to see what I can find out. Without going into it too much, I know a whole team of people that deal with mobile homes and mobile home title conversions in all 50 states.
Michigan.
There would have been a mortgage when my H bought it from the previous owner. No paperwork has been spotted and no idea where it is other than we do know the Title Company. They really didn't seem interested in helping my H when he called today. My H then signed a quit claim deed (I think) over to his dad when he went away to school/university out of state.
I don't think pre-1976 has HUD tags. If you have checked the inside of the breaker box, maybe the inside of the kitchen cabinets, on the siding on the outside?
I am on my phone right now. I know our state has a way to reapply for a title I believe, but sometimes on a pre-1976 mobile home the only way to sell it is cash or through a local bank who doesn't care if it has the tags.
So far, only VIN has been discussed. Oh shit, there's more? LOL
I hit post too soon. See the other stuff I typed. :-). If you are just doing a land contract now, they may only need the Vin. If they are ever going to get a loan, I would be kind of surprised if anyone will lend on a mobile home that old unless the land has significant value.
So far, only VIN has been discussed. Oh shit, there's more? LOL
I hit post too soon. See the other stuff I typed. :-). If you are just doing a land contract now, they may only need the Vin. If they are ever going to get a loan, I would be kind of surprised if anyone will lend on a mobile home that old unless the land has significant value.
See this is my head scratching question. Since it is a land contract, they cannot qualify for a loan, etc...how critical is the title to an old trailer? Can we proceed without it? H had it, then FIL, since 1993...believe it or not, other than the bathroom it's in okay shape, but anyway. I am not sure if there's even ever been a title.
Ugh. I'm so sorry. At least you have a path forward?
Yeah, I guess. We haven't spoken with the realtor yet. "Unofficial legal" advice we got was to say that we have started the process to replace the lost title, and try to put something in the land contract to that end. Since we are 27 hours from the Secretary of State office, if that's not sufficient, they will have to wait to close until we get up there in the spring...May/June. I am so tired of all of this shit being so very hard.
This probably isn't any help as I'm assuming someone would have mentioned this but I was talking to someone today who had issues when they transferred ownership of her mother's mobile home. Turns out in the past mobile homes were considered vehicles and you weren't issued a deed but a title instead. So that's what they had to track down in order to transfer ownership. Good luck!
Post by imojoebunny on Jan 29, 2015 21:00:54 GMT -5
What is the value of the trailer? I doubt it is worth more than a few thousand to tell you the truth. You are selling it as part of a land deal, and even if you were not, the cost is basically the cost of the land anyway, correct?
so I went and looked at this, and they don't even have a value for a mobile home as old as yours... It is essentially worthless, so I would just tell the potential buyer, your buying the land. There is a mobile home on I that has been there since 1993, or whenever Mr? P bought it, but you cannot provide any further documentation and this deal is for land, not the home.
I know that Mr. Pom has POA for his dad but is there any way that he can somehow give someone (the realtor or one of the attorneys you talked to) a limited POA to handle this particular transaction for you and get them copies of all the paperwork? It just sounds too fucked up that you have to appear in person.
If not, I agree with imojoebunny. Land contract is just for the land. The mobile home is a bonus.
Pom - first of all, goat rodeo is an excellent way to describe that update. What the everloving heck is the logic behind needing him there in person!?!!?
Second of all, perhaps this can cheer you up a little? It runs through my brain when I hear "goat rodeo".... www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IuRzJRrRpQ