Discussion: sleepovers yes or no

[cookiemdough]

www.challies.com/articles/why-my-family-doesnt-do-sleepovers

Why My Family Doesn't Do Sleepovers


James Dobson believes that children should not participate in sleepovers. The world has changed, he says, and has become too dangerous to allow your children out of your sight for so long. In his book Bringing Up Girls, he says:

Sadly, the world has changed in the last few decades, and it is no longer a safe place for children. Pedophiles and child molesters are more pervasive than ever. That is why parents must be diligent to protect their kids every hour of the day and night. …

Until you have dealt with little victims as I have and seen the pain in their eyes, you might not fully appreciate the devastation inflicted by molestation. It casts a long shadow on everything that follows, including future marital relationships. Therefore, parents have to think the unthinkable in every situation. The threat can come from anywhere—including neighbors, uncles, stepfathers, grandfathers, Sunday school teachers, coaches, music instructors, Scout leaders, and babysitters. Even public bathrooms can be dangerous today…

He believes the threat is so pervasive that parents should not allow their children to participate in sleepovers. I find myself both agreeing and disagreeing.

HCSB


I agree with the nature of his concerns. Before my children were even old enough to ask, Aileen and I talked it through and decided we would not allow our kids to do sleepovers. Now let’s be clear: there is no biblical command that forbids them, so this was not a matter of clear right and wrong, but a matter of attempting to act with wisdom. We determined we would make it a family rule: Our children would not be allowed to spend the night at their friends’ homes. We believed they would face a particular kind of vulnerability if they found themselves alone and in bed outside our care, and we wanted to protect them from it. So they have stayed at their grandparents’ and have stayed with my sisters when we’ve visited the South, but they have not stayed at friend’s homes. (Note: My son is fourteen and we have now relaxed the rule with him, though permission is still dependent on circumstances.)

The reason we drew the rule so firmly was that it removes exceptions and explanations. We know ourselves well and realized that if we drew up a list of exceptions we would inevitably broaden that list over time. Not only that, but we did not want to have to explain to a family why we allowed our children to stay with others but not with them. So sleepovers were just taken right off the table without exceptions or individual explanations.

In this way I agree with Dobson that there is wisdom in avoiding sleepovers. But here’s where I disagree: that the risk is that much higher today than it was decades ago.

Aileen and I made our decision based largely on experience and observation of what happened around us when we were young. We made this decision because even in our youth—decades ago—we saw plenty of evidence of the dangers inherent in sleepovers.

When I was young I had some bad experiences with sleepovers. Nothing devastating happened to me, but I did learn that sleepovers bring a certain vulnerability and that children often behave foolishly in these circumstances. Before long my family came to know the local chief of police and he told us that if he had learned anything in his many years of law enforcement it was this: Don’t let your kids sleep over. As I got older I learned of several people I knew who had been taken advantage of during sleepovers, and it wasn’t a perverse father in most cases, but a predatory older brother or sister or cousin. Sometimes it was even the friend himself. The world was plenty dangerous back then and children were just as vulnerable, but somehow these things weren’t talked about as they are today.

As Aileen and I considered all of this and weighed it in our minds, we decided that the benefits of sleepovers did not outweigh the risks.

Denny Burk writes, “Parents must be as wise as serpents and innocent as doves when figuring out the best way to protect children from both. Moreover, parents will often have to pursue principles that might seem strange to the rest of the world but which are the only rational responses to very real and potential threats to children.” Burk believes we need to challenge the assumption of sleepover-as-norm, and I quite agree. Do not allow yourself to feel pressured into sleepovers simply because it is what parents have always done. Instead, consider the issues and come to a conclusion that is right for your family and your context.

I would be interested to know: Do you allow sleepovers? Why or why not?

[craftyone]

I allow sleepovers for my son (7), but I am very close with the 2 different mom's where my son (and their son at our house) has spent the night. Yikes what happened just to the kids sneaking out or getting into crap they shouldn't such as alcohol. I don't know that I'm really worried about what the article is pointing out.

[heyjude]

"In his book Bringing Up Girls, he says:"

Sorry. I got lost here.

[Deleted]

Are there more pedophiles?
He says they are more prevalent than ever. True? I don't think so

[downtoearth]

It's James Dobson... not my parental guru and never will be. Plus, I swear we've talked about this recently.

ETA: We did talk about this...

pandce.proboards.com/thread/345052/james-dobson-sleepovers-child-molesters

 

[darnkatz]

I saw James Dobson and immediately stopped reading.

[Kattey]

Fuck this guy.

[heyjude]

I'm going to write a James Dobson fanfiction from the perspective of his mom called "Bringing up James Dobson."

[ECB]

Its THIS attitude (that child molesters are EVERYWHERE) that is part of the reason why people are SO protective of their kids, but I don't think it's any more prevalent than it was 20, 30, 40 years ago. Granted, I haven't done any research into this, but I don't know that James Dobson has done much research either to the opposite...

[mominatrix]

Oh for CRYING OUT LOUD.

[lyssbobiss, Command, B613]

Mar 4, 2015 18:43:17 GMT -5 @hannymaren said:

Are there more pedophiles?
He says they are more prevalent than ever. True? I don't think so

Nah. I think crazy old white republican men with religious obsessions are more prevalent, though.

[NewOrleans]

James Dobson advocates hitting kids until they cry while simultaneously not allowing them to cry after the hitting, so I'm not inclined to take parenting advice from him.

That, and he embodies all the absolute most disgusting positions of the Christian Right: homophobia, misogyny, Christians are persecuted and need to take over the country, anti-intellectual/real education, outright lies.

[Deleted]

Mar 4, 2015 18:54:07 GMT -5 ECB said:

Its THIS attitude (that child molesters are EVERYWHERE) that is part of the reason why people are SO protective of their kids, but I don't think it's any more prevalent than it was 20, 30, 40 years ago. Granted, I haven't done any research into this, but I don't know that James Dobson has done much research either to the opposite...

That free range lady says there are less abductions and etc compared to when we were kids. But now there is 24 hour news

[omgzombies]

[badgergrl]

Mar 4, 2015 18:43:17 GMT -5 @hannymaren said:

Are there more pedophiles?
He says they are more prevalent than ever. True? I don't think so

I am here. What is his source for that assertion?

[chedifuen]

This guy is a maniac. I fucking love sleepovers!

[AJL]

Mar 4, 2015 19:03:31 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

James Dobson advocates hitting kids until they cry while simultaneously not allowing them to cry after the hitting, so I'm not inclined to take parenting advice from him.

That, and he embodies all the absolute most disgusting positions of the Christian Right: homophobia, misogyny, Christians are persecuted and need to take over the country, anti-intellectual/real education, outright lies.

What the fuck?!  Ugh.

[terpsfan]

So wait, they say no sleepovers and then say they allow their 14 yo son with permission. So which is it??? Just not your daughters?? Double standard.

[erbear]

I would allow DD1 (6) to sleep over at a friend's house. Certainly, there are limitations (it's limited to a few friends whose parents I know well), but I don't think it is inherently dangerous to sleep over at people's houses. When she's older, I might think differently, but for now, I'm ok with it.

[sushi]

In his book bringing up boys he advocates for dads to shower naked with boys so they don't become gay. Yeah I'm going to listen to that guy.

[Deleted]

Mar 4, 2015 20:11:10 GMT -5 sushi said:

In his book bringing up boys he advocates for dads to shower naked with boys so they don't become gay. Yeah I'm going to listen to that guy.

But but thats how you get gay. You see the man penis and its all over. 

[penguingrrl]

Mar 4, 2015 20:00:13 GMT -5 terpsfan said:

So wait, they say no sleepovers and then say they allow their 14 yo son with permission. So which is it??? Just not your daughters?? Double standard.

Clearly it's only girls who can be molested, so his sons are totes safe.

[andrealynn]

If the Dobsons are against it, then I am all for sleepovers. #logic

[lyssbobiss, Command, B613]

I feel like between his advice about whether or not little boys should shower with their dads and why and now this nonsense, he seems to spend a lot of time thinking about kids and genitals.

[NewOrleans]

Mar 4, 2015 19:45:54 GMT -5 AJL said:

Mar 4, 2015 19:03:31 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

James Dobson advocates hitting kids until they cry while simultaneously not allowing them to cry after the hitting, so I'm not inclined to take parenting advice from him.

That, and he embodies all the absolute most disgusting positions of the Christian Right: homophobia, misogyny, Christians are persecuted and need to take over the country, anti-intellectual/real education, outright lies.

What the fuck?!  Ugh.

1. From his book on discipline: "When a youngster tries this kind of stiff-necked rebellion, you had better take it out of him, and pain is a marvelous purifier. ...It is not necessary to beat the child into submission; a little bit of pain goes a long way for a young child. However, the spanking should be of sufficient magnitude to cause the child to cry genuinely." 


2. From his book on strong-willed children: "Some strong-willed children absolutely demand to be spanked, and their wishes should be granted."

3. From his website on spanking: "I recommend a neutral object of some type.... The reason I suggest a switch or paddle is because the hand should be seen as an object of love--to hold, hug, pat, and caress. However, if you're used to suddenly disciplining with the hand, your child may not know when she's about to be swatted and can develop a pattern of flinching when you make an unexpected move. This is not a problem if you take the time to use a neutral object."

4. from the book on discipline: "Real crying usually lasts two minutes or less, but may continue for five. After that point, the child is merely complaining... I would require him to stop the protest crying, usually by offering him a little more of whatever caused the original tears."

[Deleted]

Mar 4, 2015 18:43:17 GMT -5 @hannymaren said:

Are there more pedophiles?
He says they are more prevalent than ever. True? I don't think so

I would expect less so and certainly more likely to be discovered.

[andrealynn]

Mar 4, 2015 20:11:10 GMT -5 sushi said:

In his book bringing up boys he advocates for dads to shower naked with boys so they don't become gay. Yeah I'm going to listen to that guy.

Wait, what? People buy this shit?

[zoegirltx]

dobson is a douche-nozzle.

I think parents are just more aware of abuse & pedophilia than previously, which is a good thing.

With this great "social conscious" (due to news or social media), I do think parents have a little higher bar to be conscious of the dangers & monitor their children in a reasonable manner but not still give them freedom to grow & be independent in a safe environment.

[ESF]

Sleepovers are how my friends with kids can come out and drink with me.

The real reason he is against it is because kids raised by people who listen to Dobson and who have too much exposure to other families who don't listen to Dobson might start questioning why theirs sucks so much.

[summer]

We have three 7-year old girls sleeping over next week. I have to admit, at least one mom is really freaking out about it. To the point that I told her it was fine if her daughter didn't come. I don't care either way but she is stressing me out.