"While initially the reports and information were not conclusively documented, further detailed research by several prolife groups has provided direct proof of a connection between aborted fetal tissue and most vaccines.
My head hurts. What does that sentence even mean? Grammatically, not even substantively. Substantively is a whoooooooole other basket of crazy.
And Susie I also wonder if the comments you're getting are because of the fact that you're a woman and have to walk the assertive but not aggressive line.
And Susie I also wonder if the comments you're getting are because of the fact that you're a woman and have to walk the assertive but not aggressive line.
I admit I've wondered that too. I'm in a really male-dominated area of law, and I'm the only female partner here. My gender is definitely a bigger issue than I wish it was.
I have a kid-free, pet-free life right now. I'm responsible for doing like 2 things and if I flake on them a little, nothing really happens! #livingthedream
I hate to say it, but this sounds very much like, "women who speak out are bitchy, women who aren't assertive are pushovers." You can't win. I'm sorry.
My "baking business" is not ever going to make me money, because I'm expensive, it's just something to do. But honestly, I love the attention I get. Engineering, even on a good day, the most I got was a grudging acknowledgement that I didn't suck. With the cookies and cakes people act like I've turned water into wine and I like it.
The lack of acknowledgement seems to be common. DH and I are both in the software industry and although I'm lucky and seem to have some coworkers that appreciate me (verbally and in front of others no less!), DH gets almost no recognition for pulling off extremely difficult engineering work on a regular basis. Because of this, I try to be very appreciative of others at work and acknowledge their hard work. I think part of it must be the way some work is perceived, even though it's incorrect to do so. For example, I tend to attend a lot of meetings and do a lot of little maintenance tasks to keep things running smoothly. I've been thanked for showing up to meetings regularly (which is trivial for me to do). So my work is often very visible but not all that hard to do. On the other hand, DH will spend a couple of months implementing functionality that no one has ever implemented before, and all he gets is crap about it not being done yet - and all the while he's getting interrupted with other little tasks that also get no appreciation because he still hasn't finished the big project yet. I think it's often the most valuable people who spend weeks or months on extremely difficult tasks, yet because the timeline is so long they get no appreciation until maybe the very end when they might also get yelled at for taking so long.
milsaroo, I am so angry on your behalf. Even hearing that kind of BS from random guys makes me flip out for a day or two; I can't imagine a coworker. And WTF to people thinking it's "nice" to be "complimented." They can all eat a bag of dicks.
This is probably flamefuls.... I don't mind men making comments / compliments about me. I use that opportunity to develop a "connection" of sorts to then benefit me in some way. Their opinions don't matter one way or another and more often than not it's an insight into their views and I don't allow it to discredit myself.
For all the complaints about men, its women who invalidate other women with shit like this (it doesn't bother me so it shouldn't bother you, it must be nice to get that kind of attention I wish I did, I bet you liked it and it wasn't really rape) that really undercut our ability to make progress. We aren't just trying to get men to understand, we are having to fight other women, who the men use as rationale for why we are crazy, too.
Oh I don't encourage it but I'm not going to fret or one person's comments.
I've let those comments overwhelm and distress me before.
I'm sorry you're dealing with this. It definitely isn't fair and I think many men are in positions of power simply because they are men. And I definitely think in your line of work, it is much, much worse.
I am sorry you're dealing with all of this.
For me, it's easier to accept the comments, move on, and surround myself with powerful women instead. I recognize that I have the option of saying "fuck you" to someone who overtly offends me. Or the option of not working for (or with) a sexist pig.
But believe me, I've been sexually harassed and dealt with a lot of bullshit. So I get it. It's frustrating.
I've learned to deal with it, in a way that works for me. And that way is to smile and nod.
Have you ever been sexually harassed at a job? It's not a networking opportunity. It makes you feel small and dehumanized and threatened.
ETA: We posted at the same time. It's worse that you've experienced it and still hold that opinion.
I worked at Hooters. Of course, I've been sexually harassed. And that place wasn't the worst of it.
But I've also learned that holding on to those feelings isn't going to change some douche bag.
I've also spoken up in every instance and made sure to let them (the offender) know that isn't acceptable and if it continues they will lose their jobs. And believe me, people have lost jobs.
I recognize that what offends others doesn't easily offend me. "You're easy on the eyes" is like a 1 on my scale. "Don't be emotional"* is like an 8 on my scale. "Come sit on my dick and spin" is a 10 on scale. Anything above a 6 is reported and often leads to him losing his job.
Did I mention that a majority of the offenders were my boss? No job is worth me feeling abused and unsafe in my workplace.
*I don't consider that sexual harassment but I'd consider it something against my gender.
For me, it's easier to accept the comments, move on, and surround myself with powerful women instead.
I've learned to deal with it, in a way that works for me. And that way is to smile and nod.
But you said you use their comment as a chance to make a connection.
It is dangerous to not address something that is inappropriate.
A compliment can be completely benign, and if that's the case, cool. But the way your post was worded, it felt like you were referencing a more sexually charged comment from a man.
As someone who spends a lot of time advocating on behalf of female mentees and direct reports, it's the subtle sexism that is just as dangerous.
"She just doesn't have the gravitas needed.". " She is a perfectionist." "She's bossy.". This is shit that is never said about the men we evaluate for promos. And if I am not in the room pointing out all of those fucking bullshit comments, they just happen and are accepted, and the wage gap sustains and more men named " John" lead companies than ALL the women combined (its true and sickens me.)
I encourage you to do better. Don't let them make you feel like "you're not cool" because "you can't take a joke.". Fuck that. Woman up and don't take that shit.
When you smile and nod, you're tacitly condoning. And what you said in your reply was not what you said in your original post. You said it doesn't bother you. Big difference.
I need to get better about asserting myself for sure. Yesterday I should have said, "I'm not sure why you're saying that [title]." It's hard for sure. That man is southern, entrenched in a patriarchal old boys club of a profession and he holds my future in his hands. But I have to own that people are going to think I'm difficult or an uppity bitch(I swear to God I've had a white male in my job call me that behind my back but in my hearing). We all have to fight. WE ALL NEED FEMINISM.
Personally, I'm okay with someone calling my an uppity bitch. Certainly won't be the last time.
I've also been told I'm a ball buster.
It does bother me.... But I don't let it consume me and I should have made that clear.
"Develop a connection" encourages those shitbags to continue to make comments to others who may not have the same appreciation as you do for what they can get out of being viewed as a piece of meat.
For me, it's easier to accept the comments, move on, and surround myself with powerful women instead.
I've learned to deal with it, in a way that works for me. And that way is to smile and nod.
But you said you use their comment as a chance to make a connection.
It is dangerous to not address something that is inappropriate.
A compliment can be completely benign, and if that's the case, cool. But the way your post was worded, it felt like you were referencing a more sexually charged comment from a man.
As someone who spends a lot of time advocating on behalf of female mentees and direct reports, it's the subtle sexism that is just as dangerous.
"She just doesn't have the gravitas needed.". " She is a perfectionist." "She's bossy.". This is shit that is never said about the men we evaluate for promos. And if I am not in the room pointing out all of those fucking bullshit comments, they just happen and are accepted, and the wage gap sustains and more men named " John" lead companies than ALL the women combined (its true and sickens me.)
I encourage you to do better. Don't let them make you feel like "you're not cool" because "you can't take a joke.". Fuck that. Woman up and don't take that shit.
I should have clarified that I only make a connection after I've asserted myself and said that those comments aren't appropriate and we won't work together if they continue.
Sorry. I'm not very good at explaining myself here. I forget that my assertiveness and no bullshit personality doesn't come across here. I should have been more clear.
"Develop a connection" encourages those shitbags to continue to make comments to others who may not have the same appreciation as you do for what they can get out of being viewed as a piece of meat.
To further clarify... I said compliment or comments. Which for me, are taken at genuine until otherwise proven thirsty.
A one time comment isn't going to deter me from working with someone. Continuous comments get a cookie-like smack down.
Sexist Pig: "Heyyyy, blissy baby..you are looking HOT today!" Bliss: "Those comments are not appropriate and we will not work together if they continue." .... Bliss: "Can I have your business card so we can network and stay in touch?"
"Develop a connection" encourages those shitbags to continue to make comments to others who may not have the same appreciation as you do for what they can get out of being viewed as a piece of meat.
To further clarify... I said compliment or comments. Which for me, are taken at genuine until otherwise proven thirsty.
A one time comment isn't going to deter me from working with someone. Continuous comments get a cookie-like smack down.
Comments about appearance/sexuality are not appropriate in work settings. Genuine or not. It doesn't have to be obscene for it to be offensive and wrong (and illegal).
Sexist Pig: "Heyyyy, blissy baby..you are looking HOT today!" Bliss: "Those comments are not appropriate and we will not work together if they continue." .... Bliss: "Can I have your business card so we can network and stay in touch?"
Lol. Is this guy single or married? Because.... That changes things!
Seriously though. It's all about context. I had to tell a gent the other day that his comments weren't well received. And we run in the same biz circles..... And we're still "pals".
Idk. I'm off to a meeting. Hopefully someone will harass me and I'll land a new client. /sarcasm
And this a flamefuls thread!! I'm trying to stir the pot. :o
This is probably flamefuls.... I don't mind men making comments / compliments about me. I use that opportunity to develop a "connection" of sorts to then benefit me in some way. Their opinions don't matter one way or another and more often than not it's an insight into their views and I don't allow it to discredit myself.
Oh fuck. Fine. Great for you. I don't even want to say great in your profession because I imagine carrotsmakemefat and others in PR would disagree. Fucking horrifying in my profession. In most professions. Encouraging this behavior is bad for women. I imagine you wanted to start a fight with this shit, so let's go. My life has been ruined by people in my profession thinking I'm less than my male counterparts. I'm sitting on making a sexual assault official open record because I have to wait until by virtue of my title I'm more believable. Because my leadership puts men above me because they're men. Fuck that attitude.
Believe me, if you "build a connection" with a man through harassing comments, that connection isn't going to get you far. The kind of man who thinks he can get away with treating you like a piece of meat isn't going to take you seriously, isn't going to advocate for your advancement, isn't going to send you meaningful business -- particularly if he thinks that you're okay with him treating you that way.
Sexist Pig: "Heyyyy, blissy baby..you are looking HOT today!" Bliss: "Those comments are not appropriate and we will not work together if they continue." .... Bliss: "Can I have your business card so we can network and stay in touch?"
Lol. Is this guy single or married? Because.... That changes things!
Seriously though. It's all about context. I had to tell a gent the other day that his comments weren't well received. And we run in the same biz circles..... And we're still "pals".
Idk. I'm off to a meeting. Hopefully someone will harass me and I'll land a new client. /sarcasm
And this a flamefuls thread!! I'm trying to stir the pot. :o
I know you're "kidding" but it isn't funny. It's a serious subject that women have been dealing with forever and that has really had an impact on some of the women on this board.