Your Kids Are Ruining Your Retirement - Article

[LoveTrains]

My 28 year old brother lives at home with my parents. My biggest fear is that he is sucking them dry.

[rubytue]

This is a concept I just can't understand. Moving in with your parents for a year or so to get back on your feet? Sure. Never moving out, never trying to make it on your own, and parents that don't want to help their children become productive members of society on their own? Just don't get it.

And they said Gen-X was a bunch of slackers. At least we piled 6 ppl into a group house.

[irene adler]

One of my biggest fears is what happens of something happens to my mil--she supports SIL and her two kids. Because SIL fancies herself the "family mom" and "practically disabled". She refuses to work more than part time. I don't want us to be the next ones in line to support them.

It makes me especially angry that MIL and FIL were planning on retiring and living pat time at the coast in an RV the size of a tour bus, but never got that time alone together because SIL got pregnant to avoid moving out and mil had to continue working to support them.

[af1212]

Mar 6, 2015 9:40:00 GMT -5 @songforyou said:

Mar 6, 2015 9:31:58 GMT -5 LoveTrains said:

My 28 year old brother lives at home with my parents. My biggest fear is that he is sucking them dry.

Hopefully, him having a free place to live is helping him not need anything else from them?  Just looking for a silver lining.

The worst thing is parents who help their child(ren) to their detriment and then need help from their other child(ren).  My friend's husband is in this spot.

This is my worry. My husband's 38 year old sister lives with his parents and is very dependent on them. Not just for money but they prepare her meals, do her laundry, etc. I so nervous about what will happen when they are no longer able to do this.

We are not in a place to be able to help. With 3 kids of my own I do not have the time, interest or money to help out a capable adult. Not to mention that as an only child of divorced parents I will have enough elderly people to keep track of!

[audette]

Dang...

I mean, I'm a SCRU, but the examples in this article sound pretty extreme... I can't imagine getting help from my folks if they were in a rough financial situation.

[af1212]

Mar 6, 2015 9:52:24 GMT -5 @songforyou said:

Mar 6, 2015 9:49:01 GMT -5 af1212 said:

This is my worry. My husband's 38 year old sister lives with his parents and is very dependent on them. Not just for money but they prepare her meals, do her laundry, etc. I so nervous about what will happen when they are no longer able to do this.

We are not in a place to be able to help. With 3 kids of my own I do not have the time, interest or money to help out a capable adult. Not to mention that as an only child of divorced parents I will have enough elderly people to keep track of!

That is a scary situation...but since you said she a capable adult, I would stay out of it, now and forever.  Definitely more concerned with you being the only child of divorced parents.  I hope that they will not need much help or at the very least, not the same type of help at the same time.

I very lucky that both of my parents are financially prepared for their later years. However I know how much time it takes just to help them manage their affairs, get medical care, etc. I'm concerned about bring their only source of that type of support, as well as providing that support for my inlaws since my SIL doesn't seem to be able to manage those tasks for herself so I doubt she will do so for her parents.

[ddi741]

I lived at home until I was 33. While I was in college, I didn't have to pay rent, but I was working full time to pay for my education. When I graduated, I started paying rent. My parents bought groceries but anything special "just for me" was my responsibility. We kept a running tally on the refrigerator of what they bought and how much and I added it to my rent at the end of the month. They never would have let me just live at home and not contribute.

[rubytue]

Mar 6, 2015 9:55:39 GMT -5 @peggyolson said:

I'm not touching the parts about entitled adult-kids, but I'm surprised they didn't mention the chicken vs. egg concept as it relates to this problem.

Boomers didn't adequately plan for retirement. (for a variety of reasons)
Boomers don't retire.
Their jobs aren't available for Gen X.
Gen X jobs aren't available for Millenials.
Millenials have crippling student loan debt.
Millenials can't afford to live on their own. (Not talking about the entitled shits in this article, talking in general)
Millenials move back in with Boomer parents.
Boomer parents subsidize Millenial lifestyles.
Boomer's can't retire.

I hate to say it, but eventually they're going to die off and their jobs will open up.

you spelled out so well my biggest issue with boomers being "unable to retire" bc "their kids can't find good jobs." As a Gen-X stuck unable to move up bc of the boomers still around, and then getting passed over bc I stayed in my mid-level job too long (ie, I should have advanced faster if I had that potential) - ugh!!!

Eta- I do realize some of my issues relate to being government and a small agency with limited higher positions. I think I could have advanced faster in the private sector.

[anna7602]

At this point, I am more worried about my parents ruining my retirement with what it will cost me to care for them as they age.

[elcjet]

My sister is in this situation -- 30 and living with my parents. She found out rather quickly that a vet tech making $12 an hour couldn't live on their own in Denver.....and so she went back to school to be a nurse, but her student loans are so ridiculous that she still can't swing rent on her own on first year nurse's pay (and it drained her savings before she moved cross country just to get a job). Fortunately she pays her way so she isn't totally mooching off my parents, but I see how the above situation can happen these days.

[af1212]

Mar 6, 2015 10:38:41 GMT -5 @lcap said:

Mar 6, 2015 9:49:01 GMT -5 af1212 said:

This is my worry. My husband's 38 year old sister lives with his parents and is very dependent on them. Not just for money but they prepare her meals, do her laundry, etc. I so nervous about what will happen when they are no longer able to do this.

We are not in a place to be able to help. With 3 kids of my own I do not have the time, interest or money to help out a capable adult. Not to mention that as an only child of divorced parents I will have enough elderly people to keep track of!

I have a friend in this situation too. She's 34, single, and lives rent free with her parents who clean the house, make her meals, do her laundry, etc. Periodically she moves out and lives on her own but she always ends up back there. Occasionally it comes up how different our lives are (as in, I do all of the above stuff for my own children who are 6 and under, lol) and it's slightly awkward. I love her dearly but I just don't get why you wouldn't want independence in your thirties. I feel guilty asking my mom for stuff when she offers because she's at the grocery store! Lol

I truly think she doesn't want to live on her own because it's hard to be a grown up. When you've gone 38 years and never had to manage life it probably seems pretty overwhelming.

She works full time in a lower paying job and although she could definitely afford to live on her own it would mean making some sacrifices. Right now she goes out with friends for dinner, drink and the movies 2 - 3 times a week, has annual passes to 3 different amusements parks, gets regular spa treatments , etc. If she lived on her own she would have to give some of that up for sure.

But it sure does worry me for the future!!

[Deleted]

peggy nailed it.

I moved back in with my parents after graduate school. But I was also working in my professional job and a part time job to pay off student loans, a car loan and a credit card bill. It was intended to be a one-year gift of free rent (I was barely ever at home) in exchange for shoveling the driveway and generally helping out.

[Deleted]

Mar 6, 2015 9:55:39 GMT -5 @peggyolson said:

I'm not touching the parts about entitled adult-kids, but I'm surprised they didn't mention the chicken vs. egg concept as it relates to this problem.

Boomers didn't adequately plan for retirement. (for a variety of reasons)
Boomers don't retire.
Their jobs aren't available for Gen X.
Gen X jobs aren't available for Millenials.
Millenials have crippling student loan debt.
Millenials can't afford to live on their own. (Not talking about the entitled shits in this article, talking in general)
Millenials move back in with Boomer parents.
Boomer parents subsidize Millenial lifestyles.
Boomer's can't retire.

I hate to say it, but eventually they're going to die off and their jobs will open up.

I think this is less the norm (no jobs to be had), at least from what I've seen, than the entitled adult kids. I know several people who have no intention of getting a "real job" because its so much easier to do nothing or work at a local restaurant 15 hours a week so they have time to hang out.

My parents situation really worries me because my asshole brother is slowly bleeding them dry. He's 38, has worked maybe a total of 300 hours in the last 2 years. He's about to lose his house and my parents are talking about renting him an apt because they don't want him moving back in with them. Plus, they pay for child support, clothes, etc for my nephew so his ass doesn't get thrown in jail. He uses any money he has to pay for internet and new computer/TV equipment.
My dad says "well what would you have me do?" I've told them that I will not support them when they run out of money so they better hope my brother suddenly has a major attitude adjustment and suddenly decides to act like an adult.

[tine]

H and I were talking about this the other day. We have both supported ourselves with little or no help for 10+ years and are now supporting a child. It's weird to see friends (H has 2) that live with their parents, do not pay their own bills and do not work full time. Honestly, no judgement, it's just not how I would choose to live.

[Deleted]

Mar 6, 2015 11:16:05 GMT -5 @peggyolson said:

Mar 6, 2015 11:12:17 GMT -5 @fox123 said:

I think this is less the norm (no jobs to be had), at least from what I've seen, than the entitled adult kids. I know several people who have no intention of getting a "real job" because its so much easier to do nothing or work at a local restaurant 15 hours a week so they have time to hang out.

I work in-house talent acquisition/recruiting so this is one of my soapbox issues\. For entry level jobs I get 500+ applicants. Of those, at least 50% are truly entry-level candidates. Another 40% are "over-qualified" individuals who are seriously underpaid or don't have room to move up at their companies. 

What industry do you recruit for? And what part of the country?
We've had 2 openings at our company for 3 months and can't find anyone to fill them-entry level or experienced.

[mrshandy]

My parents downsized big time and moved to FL when my sister and I left for college. Living with them sucked big time (2 bedroom/2 bath apartment). I would share a room with my sister whenever we visited. Because of this, I would have never considered moving home. We were broke as a joke when we moved to DC for grad school living in a shitty apartment but it was better than living with my parents.

I'm not sure what the solution is, but no kids of mine will be getting a free ride.

[msmerymac]

SIL1 lived at home from age 30-36. It was originally going to be like 2 years, but then she was able to save a lot of money. She worked full time and made decent $, though. Hell, she was able to pay off a lot of her student loans and also paid for 1/2 of her wedding on her own (MIL offered to pay the other half), and definitely still has more in savings. If you don't feel awkward living at home as an adult and your parents are cool with it, and you're not mooching, whatever. My parents definitely made it clear that if I moved home, I'd be contributing financially somehow.

[LoveTrains]

Mar 6, 2015 9:49:01 GMT -5 af1212 said:

Mar 6, 2015 9:40:00 GMT -5 @songforyou said:

Hopefully, him having a free place to live is helping him not need anything else from them?  Just looking for a silver lining.

The worst thing is parents who help their child(ren) to their detriment and then need help from their other child(ren).  My friend's husband is in this spot.

This is my worry. My husband's 38 year old sister lives with his parents and is very dependent on them. Not just for money but they prepare her meals, do her laundry, etc. I so nervous about what will happen when they are no longer able to do this.

We are not in a place to be able to help. With 3 kids of my own I do not have the time, interest or money to help out a capable adult. Not to mention that as an only child of divorced parents I will have enough elderly people to keep track of!

Yes, exactly. my brother does not have a job. he is going to "school' which he has been doing since he was 18. He received a BA and now goes to community college for an AA or something in medical coding and billing. He is incapable of making food for himself and depends on my parents for everything. Now with my brother, he does have mental health issues, but he will not accept professional help. 

As an example, when I was home over the holidays, my brother would wake up and walk into the kitchen and plaintively ask for food. "Who is going to make me lunch?" he would ask. Then my mother would make him a sandwich while my father rolled his eyes. 

[Deleted]

I can't really comment on this, as I have definitely regressed since DD was born.
My mom begged me not to send DD to daycare, and instead is sacrificing 40% of her pay to watch DD 2 days/week. I went back PT because things at my job had slowed down significantly.
My dad collects SS and has a small IRA. My mom doesn't yet collect her pension (retired from primary job 11.5 years ago), 401k or SS. But she and my dad live on my dad's SS and her regular paycheck, the latter of which has taken a hit. She won't take money directly, but we have a cc for her incidentals and gas, stock up on food she likes, and pay for her tolls. On top of watching my kid, she cleans and does my laundry.
This article makes me feel like shit for being a mooch for allowing her to do such things, even if I am not the exact target of the article in terms of living beyond my means, or living in my parents' house rent-free, etc.

[Poppy]

I don't know, if everyone involved is happy with the arrangement (and the parents are not being bled dry by their kids), I don't judge. Actually, I find it heartwarming in a "that's what family is for" way. @mrsspunky, it sounds like you're probably in this category. I hope to be able to help my kids out, too (though obviously it's the goal for them to be self-sufficient, I'd still like to make their lives easier). Of course there are a lot of parents helping their children out where that isn't the case.

I think @songforyou's point about the helping one sibling to the parents' detriment is a good one and it's probably happening to my MIL. We'll see how that plays out...

I also don't fault the boomers for not retiring. I think that in general, it's better for society when people are adding productivity. I don't think we can afford to have everyone retire at 55 and only earn income for 50% of their lives. If the youngins were more capable, they'd have jobs (warped systems like gov't and union seniority situations are a bit different obviously).


Side note: I vote that @songforyou should do all article posting. This is one of the most readable posts I've seen!

[my3bears]

Ugh. PDQ. I'm afraid of having to support my almost 40-yr-old sister someday. She has always struggled to keep a job and has had periods of long unemployment where she gets the bare minimum of support from my parents, which included living at home for nearly 2 unbearable years. There are likely some mental health issues but she has always refused treatment. As of now I think my parents changed the will to leave everything to me, and it will be up to me how I want to allocate half of it to support to her. We actually have a good relationship given our history, but I'm not looking forward to being her "keeper" given how she has taken advantage of my parents financially and psychologically. I don't want to spend my retirement worrying about her but it might play out that way.

DH and I are SCRUs but our families had pretty strict definitions and boundaries about what they would and would not support. I was always told I would be on my own after college, and so was DH. We were lucky to have our educations covered and are mostly responsible people today. Except for DH and his luxury car fantasy that I keep crushing

[mskitkat]

I have a couple coworkers who are like this. Their kids either can't or won't (in one case, I know the adult child is flat out refusing anything but the "right" job) help themselves. My coworkers bitch to me all the time about having to support their kids, but I just point out that if the help wasn't there, the kids would figure it out. I did, and some of these kids are older than me.

I'm in the camp where my parents will probably ruin my retirement. I think my dad will be okay, but I have serious doubts about my mom. She has made many comments about wanting to be a live in nanny. I love her dearly, but no. We'd kill each other if we had to live together.

My dad paid my cell phone bill for a couple years out of college, but that's all the help I was given since I graduated. My middle sister also gets no help. My baby sister gets a ton of help, but she's at least trying. I don't begrudge her too much, since middle sister and I both were able to move in with our boyfriends for help. Baby sister hasn't found a guy worth marrying yet, so she's trying to make it in HCOL on her own.

[Deleted]

Everyone involved needs to read "The Millionaire Next Door." For situations where the parents don't have enough for retirement, what happens after they can't work? Pray govt assistance is enough?

Does not seem like a smart strategy.

Threadjack....

The thing that does drive me bananas (on behalf of my H) is the boomer generations inability to retire (generalization warning). He works in engineering and for years all the industry has been fretting over the "brain drain" when the boomers retire. Well, at his work, the average employee is aged over *57* with no signs of retirement in his direct business unit. Given their rigorous career planning, H can't truly move up unless these boomers go packing. Now, he is not dying to move up (more laid back than his wife) but for fucks sake it is annoying.

[tacosforlife]

Mar 6, 2015 15:43:08 GMT -5 Poppy said:

I also don't fault the boomers for not retiring. I think that in general, it's better for society when people are adding productivity. I don't think we can afford to have everyone retire at 55 and only earn income for 50% of their lives. If the youngins were more capable, they'd have jobs (warped systems like gov't and union seniority situations are a bit different obviously).

Many of the Boomers are nearing 70. The "official" generation covers 18 years, but 55 is on the low end of it. 

As for young people finding jobs if they were more capable? Are you kidding me with this? Do these jobs just get created by the magical job fairy? Sure, plenty of Millennials in the article and anecdotes are lazy shits. But plenty aren't. I have lots of friends who have struggled to find jobs despite being very capable. And many of those have had to do more with less and have gotten fewer raises than Boomers ever did. 

[jillboston]

As I posted in the CEP thread, this is my biggest challenge in counseling homeowners facing foreclosure. They have "children" they infantalize. These kids are in their late 20's early 30's in some cases and when I ask if they work I get a blank stare or "they are in school" - really? at 30?? Then I point out that I worked during college and full time in summers. It is really frustrating as I see these "kids" pulling these people into foreclosure.

[Deleted]

This is my in-laws. BIL is 40 and he's lived with them for all but a few years. Expect he now has 3 kids and a wife who is equally lazy. MIL will never kick him out and they all live off her social security check and welfare. BIL works occasionally and uses his money for fun stuff.

Things weren't so bad when FIL was alive and they were both working. But over the years as they got older and had to quit working, things just got worse because they couldn't afford it. So instead of kicking out BIL, they let the let their home deteriorate, gave up cable, have no running car, etc. and then FIL passed and we learned she also let their life insurance lapse.

And it all trickles downhill to us, the people who get the phone call when she has $10 to her name and no way to pay for FIL's funeral, or she just spent her entire social security check on bills and has no groceries. And we're forced to put aside our savings goals or make some very hard decisions and tell them all to figure it out on their own.

And it enrages me and and depresses my husband and neither of us have no idea how to fix it.

[winnied]

I have a few friends who are still supported by their parents and it slays me.

One went to our private undergrad with me and her parents paid for all of it with their retirement funds. She didn't pay a dime. Then, she went to an Ivy for grad school and I have no idea how it was paid for. Now, she lives at home with them and her mom lost her job. Now, none of them have much of anything. It makes me sad more than anything for them all because I'm not sure how they'll climb out of their situation. My friend gets side jobs here and there but not much.

Other friends in DC are pushing 30 and still receive either a monthly stipend from their parents or parents still pay for their vacations/car insurance/car payment/etc. I can confidently say these particular individuals live more luxurious lifestyles than I do, and their parents KNOW that their kids go to nice restaurants, take European vacations, etc. and they still pay it. It's ludicrous.

[gibbinator]

I just found out that my 64yr old dad and step mom are paying rent for my 29yr old step sister who can't be bothered to work because she's following her dream of becoming an Indy rock icon.... Yeah.
Dad said he hates to cut her off because she's got some untreated depression stuff going on, but they can't support her forever. Pretty sure dad's retirement plan is Canada pension, which is not a lot.

[Poppy]

Mar 7, 2015 7:51:53 GMT -5 tacosforlife said:

Mar 6, 2015 15:43:08 GMT -5 Poppy said:

I also don't fault the boomers for not retiring. I think that in general, it's better for society when people are adding productivity. I don't think we can afford to have everyone retire at 55 and only earn income for 50% of their lives. If the youngins were more capable, they'd have jobs (warped systems like gov't and union seniority situations are a bit different obviously).

Many of the Boomers are nearing 70. The "official" generation covers 18 years, but 55 is on the low end of it. 

Right but theory presented is that they are creating problems by staying past 55 (or thereabouts).

Mar 7, 2015 7:51:53 GMT -5 tacosforlife said:

As for young people finding jobs if they were more capable? Are you kidding me with this? Do these jobs just get created by the magical job fairy? Sure, plenty of Millennials in the article and anecdotes are lazy shits. But plenty aren't. I have lots of friends who have struggled to find jobs despite being very capable. And many of those have had to do more with less and have gotten fewer raises than Boomers ever did. 

To be fair, there ARE other factors at play including increasing wealth inequality. But my point is that we live in a free economy. Aside from sectors warped by seniority systems, the most qualified person will get a job. It's super common for older workers to be discriminated against or have a harder time finding a job because many employers prefer young workers for a myriad of reasons.

I know there is a lot of unemployment among the younger generation and I did not say it's because they're lazy. I think the bigger issue is that so many people go out and spend 4 years and a crapton of money pursuing educations that are largely irrelevant or oversaturated and do not add economic value. And then they are stuck because they have to pay off this debt and need a job of a certain caliber but don't have the skills/experience needed to do it.

[tacosforlife]

The most qualified person will get a job?

LOL.

Pack it up, folks. There is no racism or sexism or heteronormativity or cronyism or nepotism in the private sector.