Please tell me about using Uber

[cheezer]

Mar 12, 2015 7:11:41 GMT -5 v said:

Mar 11, 2015 20:56:56 GMT -5 cheezer said:

I've never used an estimate to say whether it matches.  I generally know how much a fare is around the city as a base.  But if it gives a normal estimate, the surge is just a multiplier to the fare.

I always use estimates. They incorporate the surge multiplier if there is one. And then the fare almost always ends up being way more than the estimate.

Also, basically any time I'd want to use Uber there is surge pricing. There seems to be surge pricing pretty much all night every Friday and Saturday in NY.

I took an Uber home at 10 pm during the week last week and there was surge pricing.  We are on a permasurge in our city.  Our public transit sucks so people take it like they take the bus.

[ESF]

Depends on your definition of safe.

Uber does not consider its drivers employees. They are driving vehicles they own. Uber does not insure them, so most drivers are just using their regular insurance, which does not typically cover them if they are using the car for a commercial purpose. Uber's background checks are notoriously lackluster. When you register with Uber, you agree not to hold Uber accountable for any injuries you sustain while using their service because Uber claims the "service" it offers is matching riders with drivers, not actually providing transportation.

So if you are buried by one of their drivers, you are shit out of luck. Use at your own risk.

I used to think Uber was great. The more I read, the more I believe it is an elaborate sham that exploits low wage workers and compromises publIc safety. I want to see them shut down.

[anna7602]

My car-riding usage has gone up about 50% since I installed the Uber app on my phone. It is just too darned easy. No more calling car companies when it's late and I don't see a cab in sight and no more standing in the street hoping the jerk ass who just stepped off the curb doesn't take the approaching cab before I can flag it down for myself. 

I lurve Uber. My bank account could probably do with me taking it a tad less, but such is life. 

[anna7602]

Mar 12, 2015 19:54:17 GMT -5 ESF said:

Depends on your definition of safe.

Uber does not consider its drivers employees. They are driving vehicles they own. Uber does not insure them, so most drivers are just using their regular insurance, which does not typically cover them if they are using the car for a commercial purpose. Uber's background checks are notoriously lackluster. When you register with Uber, you agree not to hold Uber accountable for any injuries you sustain while using their service because Uber claims the "service" it offers is matching riders with drivers, not actually providing transportation.

So if you are buried by one of their drivers, you are shit out of luck. Use at your own risk.

I used to think Uber was great. The more I read, the more I believe it is an elaborate sham that exploits low wage workers and compromises publIc safety. I want to see them shut down.

Honest question that I do not know the answer to- how does this differ from most black car cab services? 

[ESF]

Mar 13, 2015 7:52:00 GMT -5 anna7602 said:

Mar 12, 2015 19:54:17 GMT -5 ESF said:

Depends on your definition of safe.

Uber does not consider its drivers employees. They are driving vehicles they own. Uber does not insure them, so most drivers are just using their regular insurance, which does not typically cover them if they are using the car for a commercial purpose. Uber's background checks are notoriously lackluster. When you register with Uber, you agree not to hold Uber accountable for any injuries you sustain while using their service because Uber claims the "service" it offers is matching riders with drivers, not actually providing transportation.

So if you are buried by one of their drivers, you are shit out of luck. Use at your own risk.

I used to think Uber was great. The more I read, the more I believe it is an elaborate sham that exploits low wage workers and compromises publIc safety. I want to see them shut down.

Honest question that I do not know the answer to- how does this differ from most black car cab services? 

I have never read any articles that suggest that this is how black car cab services operate, so I'm not sure why you think they are the same?

Generally, there are not news articles that say, "a company is complying with the law"; rather, the news articles talk about the ways the companies do not comply with the law.  So I'm assuming that the black car cab services do not violate wage and hour laws, shuttle passengers around without insurance, and make false representations about the quality of their background checks.  If those articles exist, I will put those companies on my shit list.

[doobeedoo]

I am a new uber-er. I used it in Europe recently on a business trip and it was great not to have to deal with currency or credit cards and the cars that I was in were super luxury cars--I rode in several Mercedes, a BMW and a Tesla. All sparkling clean, and they all gave me a bottle of water as well. It was sweet.

Back in the US, I was in Boston and tried it. Car that came was a dirty hoopty (no Uber Black available) and the guy needed money for the tolls! I don't usually carry cash which is what makes Uber so appealing to me. I scrounged up the change necessary and gave him one star rating. Uber's customer service reached out to me right away, gave me a credit for a future ride and also refunded the toll money. So, a bad experience that had a good ending. I tried to use it another day on the same trip but the surge pricing was ridiculous and so I just hopped in a cab that thankfully took credit cards--the ride on Uber would have been 5x the price of a readily available cab. No thank you.

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2015 19:54:17 GMT -5 ESF said:

Depends on your definition of safe.

Uber does not consider its drivers employees. They are driving vehicles they own. Uber does not insure them, so most drivers are just using their regular insurance, which does not typically cover them if they are using the car for a commercial purpose. Uber's background checks are notoriously lackluster. When you register with Uber, you agree not to hold Uber accountable for any injuries you sustain while using their service because Uber claims the "service" it offers is matching riders with drivers, not actually providing transportation.

So if you are buried by one of their drivers, you are shit out of luck. Use at your own risk.

I used to think Uber was great. The more I read, the more I believe it is an elaborate sham that exploits low wage workers and compromises publIc safety. I want to see them shut down.

Is that true for UberBlack? My (limited) understanding was that UberBlack had the same safety and insurance requirements as other limo and private taxis? Is that false advertising on their part?

[karinothing]

Mar 12, 2015 19:54:17 GMT -5 ESF said:

Depends on your definition of safe.

Uber does not consider its drivers employees. They are driving vehicles they own. Uber does not insure them, so most drivers are just using their regular insurance, which does not typically cover them if they are using the car for a commercial purpose. Uber's background checks are notoriously lackluster. When you register with Uber, you agree not to hold Uber accountable for any injuries you sustain while using their service because Uber claims the "service" it offers is matching riders with drivers, not actually providing transportation.

So if you are buried by one of their drivers, you are shit out of luck. Use at your own risk.

I used to think Uber was great. The more I read, the more I believe it is an elaborate sham that exploits low wage workers and compromises publIc safety. I want to see them shut down.

Interesting, I didn't know this part. If regular taxi companies would actually come when I call them, I could give up on Uber

[v]

Mar 14, 2015 12:29:39 GMT -5 @wandering said:

Mar 12, 2015 19:54:17 GMT -5 ESF said:

Depends on your definition of safe.

Uber does not consider its drivers employees. They are driving vehicles they own. Uber does not insure them, so most drivers are just using their regular insurance, which does not typically cover them if they are using the car for a commercial purpose. Uber's background checks are notoriously lackluster. When you register with Uber, you agree not to hold Uber accountable for any injuries you sustain while using their service because Uber claims the "service" it offers is matching riders with drivers, not actually providing transportation.

So if you are buried by one of their drivers, you are shit out of luck. Use at your own risk.

I used to think Uber was great. The more I read, the more I believe it is an elaborate sham that exploits low wage workers and compromises publIc safety. I want to see them shut down.

Is that true for UberBlack? My (limited) understanding was that UberBlack had the same safety and insurance requirements as other limo and private taxis? Is that false advertising on their part?

It looks like there's some commercial insurance for UberX, but not as much as for UberBlack.

blog.uber.com/ridesharinginsurance

The UberX limits are actually higher than the required limits for NY taxis: www.nyc.gov/html/tlc/downloads/pdf/veh_insurance_req.pdf

That said, I don't know what happens if the insurance limits are blown on UberX versus UberBlack -- meaning, how easy it is to try to get money from Uber (deep, deep pockets) versus the driver if you're in a really, really bad UberX accident.  

[tacosforlife]

Mar 14, 2015 16:23:43 GMT -5 karinothing said:

Mar 12, 2015 19:54:17 GMT -5 ESF said:

Depends on your definition of safe.

Uber does not consider its drivers employees. They are driving vehicles they own. Uber does not insure them, so most drivers are just using their regular insurance, which does not typically cover them if they are using the car for a commercial purpose. Uber's background checks are notoriously lackluster. When you register with Uber, you agree not to hold Uber accountable for any injuries you sustain while using their service because Uber claims the "service" it offers is matching riders with drivers, not actually providing transportation.

So if you are buried by one of their drivers, you are shit out of luck. Use at your own risk.

I used to think Uber was great. The more I read, the more I believe it is an elaborate sham that exploits low wage workers and compromises publIc safety. I want to see them shut down.

Interesting, I didn't know this part. If regular taxi companies would actually come when I call them, I could give up on Uber

Yeah. I get the concerns about Uber. But DC cabs just fucking SUCK. And I know they've increased the number of licenses since I moved, but when I was in Milwaukee, the city council had capped taxi permits at fewer than 400. For a city of 600,000.

The last time I tried to take a cab, three cabs in a row told me their credit card reader was "broken." Cabs don't follow the law, and nobody enforces it. So I can't really get it up for the gray areas of Uber's legalities.

[karinothing]

Mar 14, 2015 18:49:51 GMT -5 tacosforlife said:

Mar 14, 2015 16:23:43 GMT -5 karinothing said:

Interesting, I didn't know this part. If regular taxi companies would actually come when I call them, I could give up on Uber

Yeah. I get the concerns about Uber. But DC cabs just fucking SUCK. And I know they've increased the number of licenses since I moved, but when I was in Milwaukee, the city council had capped taxi permits at fewer than 400. For a city of 600,000.

The last time I tried to take a cab, three cabs in a row told me their credit card reader was "broken." Cabs don't follow the law, and nobody enforces it. So I can't really get it up for the gray areas of Uber's legalities.

Not to mention cabs won't take you to VA! And it isn't like I live super far away, I border DC!

[ESF]

Mar 14, 2015 16:37:53 GMT -5 v said:

Mar 14, 2015 12:29:39 GMT -5 @wandering said:

Is that true for UberBlack? My (limited) understanding was that UberBlack had the same safety and insurance requirements as other limo and private taxis? Is that false advertising on their part?

It looks like there's some commercial insurance for UberX, but not as much as for UberBlack.

blog.uber.com/ridesharinginsurance

The UberX limits are actually higher than the required limits for NY taxis: www.nyc.gov/html/tlc/downloads/pdf/veh_insurance_req.pdf

That said, I don't know what happens if the insurance limits are blown on UberX versus UberBlack -- meaning, how easy it is to try to get money from Uber (deep, deep pockets) versus the driver if you're in a really, really bad UberX accident.  

Yeah, the insurance is flimsy and they aren't compensating people. Plus there's an arbitration clause, so good luck.


More info here. It's California specific, but probably similar issues in other states.

www.buzzfeed.com/kenbensinger/ubers-yawning-insurance-gap#.vwQKpLqm6

[Deleted]

Mar 14, 2015 21:22:55 GMT -5 ESF said:

Mar 14, 2015 16:37:53 GMT -5 v said:

It looks like there's some commercial insurance for UberX, but not as much as for UberBlack.

blog.uber.com/ridesharinginsurance

The UberX limits are actually higher than the required limits for NY taxis: www.nyc.gov/html/tlc/downloads/pdf/veh_insurance_req.pdf

That said, I don't know what happens if the insurance limits are blown on UberX versus UberBlack -- meaning, how easy it is to try to get money from Uber (deep, deep pockets) versus the driver if you're in a really, really bad UberX accident.  

Yeah, the insurance is flimsy and they aren't compensating people. Plus there's an arbitration clause, so good luck.


More info here. It's California specific, but probably similar issues in other states.

www.buzzfeed.com/kenbensinger/ubers-yawning-insurance-gap#.vwQKpLqm6

Thanks for sharing.
But if I'm reading that correctly, it says the Ubers policy does cover passengers for $1million, right? The problem is that the drivers personal coverage wouldn't count when they're in between passengers and got in to an accident. So as far as having to pay out of pocket, it's the drivers themselves who need to be more careful with their policy, not the passenger?

And it says UberBlack covers the drivers at all times.

Or am I not reading correctly? Do you know if Ubers insurance limits for UberBlack are different than taxi or limo services?

[ESF]

Mar 14, 2015 18:49:51 GMT -5 tacosforlife said:

Mar 14, 2015 16:23:43 GMT -5 karinothing said:

Interesting, I didn't know this part. If regular taxi companies would actually come when I call them, I could give up on Uber

Yeah. I get the concerns about Uber. But DC cabs just fucking SUCK. And I know they've increased the number of licenses since I moved, but when I was in Milwaukee, the city council had capped taxi permits at fewer than 400. For a city of 600,000.

The last time I tried to take a cab, three cabs in a row told me their credit card reader was "broken." Cabs don't follow the law, and nobody enforces it. So I can't really get it up for the gray areas of Uber's legalities.

DC cabs are the worst. I lived there during the zoning years where there was no transparency in pricing so they could rob you blind.. If DC cabbies are still doing that bullshit where they carry multiple riders, then safety considerations would probably be a wash for me. I was in a cab once where a driver picked up a drunk belligerent man who was probably would have assaulted me had the cab driver not intentionally gone off route and driven to a crowded street known for having cop cars everywhere.

But as an objective measurement in response to the OP's question, it is absolutely not safe. And it is a shitty, shitty company.

[tacosforlife]

Mar 14, 2015 21:37:41 GMT -5 ESF said:

Mar 14, 2015 18:49:51 GMT -5 tacosforlife said:

Yeah. I get the concerns about Uber. But DC cabs just fucking SUCK. And I know they've increased the number of licenses since I moved, but when I was in Milwaukee, the city council had capped taxi permits at fewer than 400. For a city of 600,000.

The last time I tried to take a cab, three cabs in a row told me their credit card reader was "broken." Cabs don't follow the law, and nobody enforces it. So I can't really get it up for the gray areas of Uber's legalities.

DC cabs are the worst. I lived there during the zoning years where there was no transparency in pricing so they could rob you blind.. If DC cabbies are still doing that bullshit where they carry multiple riders, then safety considerations would probably be a wash for me. I was in a cab once where a driver picked up a drunk belligerent man who was probably would have assaulted me had the cab driver not intentionally gone off route and driven to a crowded street known for having cop cars everywhere.

But as an objective measurement in response to the OP's question, it is absolutely not safe. And it is a shitty, shitty company.

I don't think they still do the zoning thing. I know the few times I've taken a cab here, they haven't. But like I said, the last time I tried to take a cab, I couldn't. I got sick rather suddenly and could barely walk. I had no cash. Every cab said the CC reader was broken even though a workig CC reader is mandated by law. And in Milwaukee, until very recently, the supply of cabs was so artificially limited by ordinance as to be laughable.

If cabs are plentiful and well regulated, then I might agree on Uber. But my experience has been that they are terrible. So I keep taking Uber. 

[ESF]

Mar 14, 2015 21:35:11 GMT -5 @wandering said:

Mar 14, 2015 21:22:55 GMT -5 ESF said:

Yeah, the insurance is flimsy and they aren't compensating people. Plus there's an arbitration clause, so good luck.


More info here. It's California specific, but probably similar issues in other states.

www.buzzfeed.com/kenbensinger/ubers-yawning-insurance-gap#.vwQKpLqm6

Thanks for sharing.
But if I'm reading that correctly, it says the Ubers policy does cover passengers for $1million, right? The problem is that the drivers personal coverage wouldn't count when they're in between passengers and got in to an accident. So as far as having to pay out of pocket, it's the drivers themselves who need to be more careful with their policy, not the passenger?

And it says UberBlack covers the drivers at all times.

Or am I not reading correctly? Do you know if Ubers insurance limits for UberBlack are different than taxi or limo services?

I'm on airplane wifi and opening articles is slow. My understanding from what I've read is that the Uber policies claim to offer some insurance to riders but the plan is full of holes, they've not been voluntarily paying those claims, and data on what they are paying out is not publicly known, thanks to the mandatory arbitration provision, which allows Uber to force all lawsuits into a secret tribunal to be adjudicated by a de facto employee of the company. Countless studies have shown that consumers lose in arbitration hearings more than 80% of the time. So they have no reason to pay you if the cost of your damages is more than the cost of arbitration.

Robert Reich writes about this issue a lot. You may be able t find some info reading his Facebook page,

[Deleted]

Mar 14, 2015 21:46:43 GMT -5 ESF said:

Mar 14, 2015 21:35:11 GMT -5 @wandering said:

Thanks for sharing.
But if I'm reading that correctly, it says the Ubers policy does cover passengers for $1million, right? The problem is that the drivers personal coverage wouldn't count when they're in between passengers and got in to an accident. So as far as having to pay out of pocket, it's the drivers themselves who need to be more careful with their policy, not the passenger?

And it says UberBlack covers the drivers at all times.

Or am I not reading correctly? Do you know if Ubers insurance limits for UberBlack are different than taxi or limo services?

I'm on airplane wifi and opening articles is slow. My understanding from what I've read is that the Uber policies claim to offer some insurance to riders but the plan is full of holes, they've not been voluntarily paying those claims, and data on what they are paying out is not publicly known, thanks to the mandatory arbitration provision, which allows Uber to force all lawsuits into a secret tribunal to be adjudicated by a de facto employee of the company. Countless studies have shown that consumers lose in arbitration hearings more than 80% of the time. So they have no reason to pay you if the cost of your damages is more than the cost of arbitration.

Robert Reich writes about this issue a lot. You may be able t find some info reading his Facebook page,

Ahh ok got it. The article you linked doesn't discuss that (if I'm reading correctly). It discusses how drivers get personal insurance but that technically doesn't cover them when they're trolling and waiting for passengers since they're on the job. But Uber's policy does cover passengers up to $1 million (unless they're lying about that).

I'll have to read what Robert Reich writes about though.

I know hack cabs/ride sharing has been a thing in major cities for as far back as I can remember, but clearly with technology it has been taken to a whole different level. 

[niq]

I've taken uberX about fifteen times, usually at night. Maybe three times during the day. You definitely get a different sort of driver during the day vs on a weekend night -- of the three daytime drivers I've gotten, two were definitely part-time. I've gotten one driver who was kind of a douche, and maybe two who didn't quite know their way around town very well. Seattle has some funky intersections where no satnav can prepare you in advance. So, if your route takes you in a funky spot, you have to help your driver a little more.

I've only been hit by surge pricing once. Our company holiday party was the same night as Microsoft's, so that's probably why it happened.

I have mixed feelings about Uber as a company. They're obviously bending a lot of noses. On the other hand, as PPs point out they're filling a consumer gap that's not served well by taxis in many cities (given a choice between Uber & calling a cab then waiting half an hour for them to maybe pick me up, I'll take door #1 thank you), and it's not like the taxicab industry is a workers' paradise FFS.

[moolarkey]

I think their driver's come from a lot of backgrounds. One in Cincinnati is a star on the University of Cincinnati basketball team. He likes it because he can fit it in around classes and basketball.

In Columbus one of the best is a dad from Upper Arlington, drives Uber black. He has 5 daughters. 3 in college, 2 in private school. He puts his Uber money in to his retirement. He says otherwise he doesn't have any extra money to build his retirement.

Another top driver in Columbus is a mom of small kids. She drives evenings and weekends. It gives her a break from the kids, she is extremely out-going so she gets to talk to people and earn money. If something comes up, she doesn't work but she is VERY popular with riders.