Post by luv2rn4fun on Mar 13, 2015 10:27:38 GMT -5
When and how did you transition to the crib, especially if you had/have a reflux/colicky baby?
C is 12 wks on Sunday. Right now he does the majority of his sleep in the RNP, although he has napped 3 times in his crib (only for a maximum of 20 minutes...although not sure if this was from the crib or just his normal sucky napping behavior). He naps in his nursery during the day and sleeps in the guest room with me at night. We just setup the video monitor and just need the last two blackout curtains for his room and then I can transition him to his room full time. I'm contemplating whether or not to start with naps in the crib or just go ahead and try nighttime sleep in the crib. Likely won't start for another week or so but would like to have a game plan in place.
Right now getting him to sleep, naps or nighttime, is a huge nightmare. For naps, he'll go down after around 20 min but only sleep for 20-40 min. Four out of the last 5 nights have taken 2+ hours to get to sleep (last night was 3 hrs and then he was up in an hour, down for 4 1/2 after that first wakeup)...not sure if it's due to the time change or what (I try bedtime at 6:30 because he seems ready, especially after not napping well all day.
For naps I feel like some of the problem is he relies on his pacifier to fall asleep (he also nurses to sleep at night) but then it falls out...but I can't seem to get him to sleep without it unless we walk in the baby carrier. Other info is he's swaddled, room is dark, and white noise.
Post by melsamoony on Mar 13, 2015 11:33:21 GMT -5
We did the RNP to crib transition at 4 months when DS started having some trouble sleeping. At that point he was a little more mobile and seemed to be sliding down in the RNP so I decided to try the crib/bassinet.
Started w bassinet in our room w a rolled up towel. Kept the RNP beside the bassinet and moved him there if he woke and couldn't get back to sleep. He kept sliding down in the bassinet w the elevation so he was sleeping flat. We removed the towels and he did well sleeping flat.
We moved him to his crib shortly after getting him to successfully sleep flat although I think both could be done at one time. It only took about a week. DS sleeps better in the crib than the bassinet probably because it is more comfortable.
Have you tried putting him down later? Maybe he fights because he isn't quite ready? Mine get their last bottle at 7/715 depending on if they have bath. By 8 they are in bed and that works for them - but I know each baby is different.
Have you tried a Wubbanub? We got that for DS. He doesn't like a paci anymore but it helped keep it in place. And when he naps he likes to hold it even though he doesn't suck on it. We also swaddle but I know you do that already.
We just transitioned last weekend from RNP. I packed them away as I always heard once you move to crib don't go back. It went better then I thought. I do have to rock them to sleep for naps. At night they go down easy, not sure why. We inclined the mattress with a couple towels but last night I took those out and they had no issues. Mine don't have reflux but would spit up which I think they outgrew. Also, we rolled towels up and put them along side their body. I know some people use a pool noodle. I think that is what really helped them transition. They kind of rest their head on it - I'm sure not crib approved but they are swaddled, don't roll yet, and I check on them all the time thru monitor so know they are breathing.
Started w bassinet in our room w a rolled up towel. Kept the RNP beside the bassinet and moved him there if he woke and couldn't get back to sleep. He kept sliding down in the bassinet w the elevation so he was sleeping flat. We removed the towels and he did well sleeping flat.
DD Kept sliding down and I thought it was our incline even though it wasn't super steep. Last night I took the towels out so they laid flat and when I woke up she was still down in the corner! I think she's just a wiggler
We folded a towel to elevate one end of the mattress, ever so slightly, when we transitioned DD (who was colicky and had reflux) to the crib. I breastfed her or rocked her to sleep back in those days and she slept with a pacifier (still does, but if it falls out, she has recently been finding it herself or sleeping without it). It guess I was still in survival mode back then. For us, naps were a crapshoot until a lot later...like 9 months (sorry to say!).
I'm going to go out on a limb and say the sleep issues are due to putting him down too late. If he's yawning, you've missed the magic window.
I'd try a wubbanub-DS relied on it because the weight kept the paci right there (for the most part) so it wasn't an issue about falling out and waking him up completely.
DS slept in his crib from day 1 and napped in the swing until about 4 months. He napped fine at DC with a flat crib. We had to do nap training at 5m because he was too big/wiggly for the swing and he was a horrible drowsy but awake sleeper (which was because we were putting him down too late).
I'd KOKO at this point and get a merlin sleep suit. That really helped with DD putting herself to sleep. We transitioned to the crib at 4 months and it was easier at that point than earlier.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say the sleep issues are due to putting him down too late. If he's yawning, you've missed the magic window.
I'd try a wubbanub-DS relied on it because the weight kept the paci right there (for the most part) so it wasn't an issue about falling out and waking him up completely.
DS slept in his crib from day 1 and napped in the swing until about 4 months. He napped fine at DC with a flat crib. We had to do nap training at 5m because he was too big/wiggly for the swing and he was a horrible drowsy but awake sleeper (which was because we were putting him down too late).
I agree about missing the window...but like this morning he woke up already overtired. Typically I start his first nap within 1 hr of waking up and it's still hard to get him to settle. He's been a horrible napper from day one and has only recently been a better night sleeper.
linz- I've tried everything...earlier, later...seems like 6:30-7 used to work so maybe the time change is messing him up? It's still light out so I'm sure that's not helping (his room will be darker than the guest room once we get the two additional curtains). I am going to try 7-7:30 tonight if he doesn't kill us with his fussiness before then (that's typically why we start earlier...before the fussiness gets too bad...and he'll fall asleep but wake up as soon as I put him in the RNP).
zarapipe- Thank you for that recommendation. A friend had also said to get that and I had forgotten. Just looked it up and sent a link to DH reminding him that we need it and explaining that this is how we will break the swaddle habit (he was wondering about that last night since C will only sleep in his fleece swaddle, which isn't realistic soon since it's so hot here). Would it be ok to use the merlin sleepsuit while in the RNP before transitioning him to the crib or should I break both habits at once (RNP/inclined sleep/swaddle)?
luv2rn4fun I asked the same question and people responded and said it was ok to put them in the rnp but I didn't- it just seemed so big and fluffy to put her in the rnp so we did straight to the crib with an elevated mattress. I would do an ISO post on the swap page. That's where I got and sold mine. They are pretty expensive .
Post by sillygoosegirl on Mar 13, 2015 14:29:27 GMT -5
I was advised by a "baby sleep consultant" to not even try until after the 4 months sleep regression. She said that your baby will "forget everything you taught them about sleep" during the 4 month sleep regression. This has seemed to be the case for us. Anyway, she went from sleeping a 5-6 hours once per night, to waking every 60-90 minutes, and forgot how to fall asleep in a carrier, or basically any way other than side-lying nursing to sleep or in the swing (and the swing normally only works for DH--if I'm there, she wants to nurse).
Currently, I have the crib in a modified toddler bed configuration, with 3 sides and the mattress on the floor, so I can get in with her and nurse her to sleep. But she still wakes up almost immediately. Though I haven't tried a lot of times. She's right at 4 months and until her sleep stretches out again (which it seems to be starting to do, thank goodness), I know I can't handle having her anywhere other than in my bed anyway.
We tried around 4 months to transition to the crib and it was an epic disaster that resulted in a lack of weight gain and a borderline FTT diagnosis. I tried for a month, I should have given up sooner. We went back to the RnP (in her room, we just set the monitor camera up to look at that) until 6 months. At that point, her reflux was much, much better and she was able to actually sleep flat in her crib without pain.
ETA: DD was a swaddle junkie. We swaddled in the RnP (modified so that I could snap her in when we went back to it) and switched to the Sleep Suit when we put her in the crib and sleep trained.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say the sleep issues are due to putting him down too late. If he's yawning, you've missed the magic window.
I'd try a wubbanub-DS relied on it because the weight kept the paci right there (for the most part) so it wasn't an issue about falling out and waking him up completely.
DS slept in his crib from day 1 and napped in the swing until about 4 months. He napped fine at DC with a flat crib. We had to do nap training at 5m because he was too big/wiggly for the swing and he was a horrible drowsy but awake sleeper (which was because we were putting him down too late).
I agree about missing the window...but like this morning he woke up already overtired. Typically I start his first nap within 1 hr of waking up and it's still hard to get him to settle. He's been a horrible napper from day one and has only recently been a better night sleeper.
If it helps, DD was an atrocious sleeper for her first year. It got much, much better around 7/8 months when I got her to take decent naps. Sleep training helped us a lot because she had problems falling asleep (she was perpetually tired and a sleep fighter, she didn't have a magic window) and she had problems staying asleep during sleep cycle transitions, especially during naps. For naps, I took the advice of a friend and would be waiting at transition time when dd would start to wake and run in and quietly rock her back to sleep. I started getting another hour (!!!) out of her, quite the change from a 27 minute nap! and pretty soon she started sleeping through the transitions on her own.
At 2.5, I would say she's a great sleeper. She typically sleeps 9p-8a and then takes a 2.5 hour nap during the day. Naps have shortened a bit over time but she's been like this since about 15 months. Prior to that, she was taking 2 good naps with a similar nighttime schedule, just with 1-2 wake ups at night.
There is hope! He may turn out to be a decent sleeper once the colic and reflux are gone
Post by luv2rn4fun on Mar 13, 2015 15:45:25 GMT -5
Thanks ladies! Naps are by far the worst. I'm lucky that once he's down at night he's typically a much better sleeper. We are averaging 2 wakeups a night and get a 5 hr stretch (sometimes longer) most nights.
redheadk- I might have to do the sneaking in for naps. C definitely wakes up during sleep cycle transitions...I know he would sleep longer if he could just get past that hurdle. I think that's why he naps so well in the baby carrier and not in the RNP.
DS2 (5 mos) has reflux and he is still sleeping in the RNP. He has started sleeping for some naps in his crib but it's short lived. I know I need to make the transition but in your shoes I would just KOKO with the RNP at night. DS1 was a nightmare for naps until around 6 months. It was such an ordeal to get him down. You could spend 40 min trying to get him down and it would be a 20 min nap if I was lucky.
DS2 (5 mos) has reflux and he is still sleeping in the RNP. He has started sleeping for some naps in his crib but it's short lived. I know I need to make the transition but in your shoes I would just KOKO with the RNP at night. DS1 was a nightmare for naps until around 6 months. It was such an ordeal to get him down. You could spend 40 min trying to get him down and it would be a 20 min nap if I was lucky.
This describes C (and my life) pretty well. Today is a "good" day in that his first nap was 40 minutes and his next two were 30 minutes. The first took 30 minutes to get him down, the second took 40 minutes, and this last one was lucky with only 15 minutes. I feel like it's not even worth it most of the time but then he's even more fussy or needy when he doesn't nap. Surprisingly he wakes up pretty happy even though he's clearly overtired (rubbing eyes, etc).
Post by luv2rn4fun on Mar 13, 2015 16:11:51 GMT -5
redheadk- when did you sneak in to rock? I think C's sleep cycle is somewhere around the 30-40 min range...not sure when I should sneak in and try to get him through to the next cycle. Also, how long did you have to do that before your DD learned on her own? Did you do it for every nap or just randomly?
DS2 (5 mos) has reflux and he is still sleeping in the RNP. He has started sleeping for some naps in his crib but it's short lived. I know I need to make the transition but in your shoes I would just KOKO with the RNP at night. DS1 was a nightmare for naps until around 6 months. It was such an ordeal to get him down. You could spend 40 min trying to get him down and it would be a 20 min nap if I was lucky.
This describes C (and my life) pretty well. Today is a "good" day in that his first nap was 40 minutes and his next two were 30 minutes. The first took 30 minutes to get him down, the second took 40 minutes, and this last one was lucky with only 15 minutes. I feel like it's not even worth it most of the time but then he's even more fussy or needy when he doesn't nap. Surprisingly he wakes up pretty happy even though he's clearly overtired (rubbing eyes, etc).
I felt the exact same way. I spent ALL of my time cleaning up vomit and trying to get her to sleep, then she hardly slept at all. It sucked.
redheadk- when did you sneak in to rock? I think C's sleep cycle is somewhere around the 30-40 min range...not sure when I should sneak in and try to get him through to the next cycle. Also, how long did you have to do that before your DD learned on her own? Did you do it for every nap or just randomly?
I watched her on the monitor and just went in as soon as I heard her. It wasn't too long, maybe a few weeks. I did it for every nap. It would take about 10-15 minutes but then she'd sleep for another hour, which was glorious.
redheadk- when did you sneak in to rock? I think C's sleep cycle is somewhere around the 30-40 min range...not sure when I should sneak in and try to get him through to the next cycle. Also, how long did you have to do that before your DD learned on her own? Did you do it for every nap or just randomly?
I watched her on the monitor and just went in as soon as I heard her. It wasn't too long, maybe a few weeks. I did it for every nap. It would take about 10-15 minutes but then she'd sleep for another hour, which was glorious.
Thanks! Yes, I feel like my life revolves around 2 hr cycles (30 minutes feed, 30 minutes awake, and then nap time). I wish his cycles were closer to 3 hrs...that would feel much more manageable. I wonder if I would have to pat C's stomach, rock, and shush (or some combo)...he's definitely not just a rock to sleep type baby. I'll try different things and see how it works. Also, not sure if waiting til he's actually eyes open will work...might just have to go in after 20-25 minutes and see how he's doing and react accordingly.
Thanks ladies! Naps are by far the worst. I'm lucky that once he's down at night he's typically a much better sleeper. We are averaging 2 wakeups a night and get a 5 hr stretch (sometimes longer) most nights.
redheadk- I might have to do the sneaking in for naps. C definitely wakes up during sleep cycle transitions...I know he would sleep longer if he could just get past that hurdle. I think that's why he naps so well in the baby carrier and not in the RNP.
DD does this too. I try to catch her and run in and grab her before she wakes her brother. It sucks when you don't always get a break during the day but he'll be so much happier if he naps. And I will day around 4-4 1/2 mos it got better. Hopefully you are at the worst and it will get better from here!
Also DD doesn't like being rocked but if I pat her butt and shush her she falls right asleep. Idk what it is about patting her butt that works.
Thanks! Looks like I'm going to have to try and break his waking up pattern. What did you do to get her to nap longer (assuming you couldn't pat her but in the RNP)?
C is the same way, except he likes to be bounced and walked around, patting, and either singing or shushing. He's very high maintenance I really hope you're right and we start seeing an improvement in the next few weeks. This is getting old pretty fast. And once he naps longer, his cycles will be longer which won't feel so restrictive!
We transitioned A out of her RnP and into the crib using the Merlin's Magic Sleep Suit close to 4 months. She hated to be swaddled so this was the only thing that worked. At first I also built a little nest under her sheets using towels so it was kind of like the RnP. She has reflux and also was congested all the time so her mattress was lifted. On really bad nights she was back in the RnP. Now, she can't sleep in the crib at all w/o the suit, so I'll be looking for a way to transition out of that sometime soon!
She still naps in the RnP - that is what daycare uses and at home I just can't get her undressed and into the sleep suit for the crib. We use to spend 40 minutes getting her to sleep for a 15-20 nap and it was hell. We couldn't get her to nap any longer.
She just recently started doing 1.5 hr naps and sometimes up to 3 hours but to put her down we have to let her fuss it out on her own first - which takes less than 5 minutes and is usually her babbling to herself. She won't be rocked to sleep now - it seems like doing that actually keeps her up.
Sometimes she wakes earlier than usual and I just have to pop her pacifier in and give a little rock if she is in the RnP and she'll settle back down.
Post by luv2rn4fun on Mar 14, 2015 10:24:36 GMT -5
redheadk and linz- I tried the sleep transition thing for the last nap yesterday and it didn't work. I didn't remove him from the RNP, just put the paci back in, pat, shush, and a little rocking. So today I tried taking him out and doing our normal nap time bouncing, singing, paci, etc and he fell back to sleep! I guess I'm going to have to do that because he's definitely overtired and not sleeping well, even at night (he woke up at 5:00 this morning and wouldn't go back to sleep so I finally gave up at 6:00. Thanks for all your help ladies!
zarapipe- how long did you have to use the Merlin suit (or how long do you anticipate using it, if you're still transitioning)?
When they were in RNP I would try first to not pick them up and if they screamed I would hold them. You won't create a bad habit by doing that at this age. I'm glad he fell back asleep!
We used it for about a month. I decided to try to sleep sack when we did cio.
How did CIO go? Any chance you want to sell your Merlin sleep suit? No worries if not, just thought I'd ask...we're looking to buy one in the next couple days...C is definitely ready to have his hands free (he wakes up in the MOTN sucking and trying to break out of the swaddle).
When they were in RNP I would try first to not pick them up and if they screamed I would hold them. You won't create a bad habit by doing that at this age. I'm glad he fell back asleep!
Thanks, me too! But Nap 2 was a bust. This kid HATES sleep and is so tired, constantly rubbing his eyes the past two days. I wish he would just sleep! I'm exhausted trying to do naps and getting nowhere and then there's the nightly battle with bedtime. I just keep reminding myself that it does get better, this too shall pass.