Why are you quoting The Federalist? My nephew's been posting shit from them on FB about the whole PP thing and I've had to block him again because of it.
Or is this a "know thy enemy" thing? Cause, seriously, these people are Right of... of... Rush Limbaugh and Rand Paul's love child.
Yet it is still perfectly acceptable to be a racist towards white people. Indeed, you can get profiled in New York Magazine while you’re doing it. This is not racial progress; it is a crude and loathsome regression.
Seems like this white dude needs a "racism 101" lesson.
Why are you quoting The Federalist? My nephew's been posting shit from them on FB about the whole PP thing and I've had to block him again because of it.
Or is this a "know thy enemy" thing? Cause, seriously, these people are Right of... of... Rush Limbaugh and Rand Paul's love child.
LOL!
I was trying to think of an appropriate person without going all Godwin's Law and blanked. LOL
But these are the sorts of folks who will talk seriously about needing military-grade weaponry in the hands of the public as "anti-government guns" (which is the last time I blocked my nephew when he started spouting that shit after Sandy Hook).
Clearly The Federalist has its own issues. But, I think if a white author did say he/she has low expectations of black people I would roll my eyes and write him/her off forever. Now, I'm not going to write Coates off and I hope (more than hope) that the majority in this country starts reading him more regularly, but, I can also see why people are asking why it's okay for Coates to say he has low expectations for white people without being called out on it. EDIT to clarify-I don't agree with people asking this, but I am sure many people stopped reading after the third paragraph.
Yet, sadly, at the outset of this piece, we are shown that Coates, for all the adulation he receives, is actually a remarkably narrow-minded and unpleasant person, as we find at the end of the article’s third paragraph: “When people who are not black are interested in what I do, frankly, I’m always surprised,” Coates said. “I don’t know if it’s my low expectations for white people or what.”
We’ve tricked ourselves into thinking such rhetoric is anything other than repulsive prejudice.
It is entirely fashionable, of course, for progressives to speak sneeringly and dismissively of “white people.” Coates is not the first person to evince such casual racism, and he will surely not be the last. Common as this low and ugly form of bigotry is, however, it’s still a wonder people put up with it to the degree that we do.
Imagine, for a minute, if a white writer—for the sake of argument, say, a guy named Daniel Payne, at, say, a fictional publication called the Federalist—expressed surprise that “people who are not white” ever read his work: “I don’t know if it’s my low expectations for black people or what,” he would remark. Would you be impressed at the jaded profundity of such a statement? Or would you think, “Gee, Daniel Payne sounds like a racist jerk?”
Clearly The Federalist has its own issues. But, I don't necessarily disagree with what he's trying to get at below. I think if a white author did say he/she has low expectations of black people I would roll my eyes and write him/her off forever. Now, I'm not going to write Coates off and I hope (more than hope) that the majority in this country starts reading him more regulalry, but, I can also see why people are asking why it's okay for Coates to say he has low expectations for white people without being called out on it.
Yet, sadly, at the outset of this piece, we are shown that Coates, for all the adulation he receives, is actually a remarkably narrow-minded and unpleasant person, as we find at the end of the article’s third paragraph: “When people who are not black are interested in what I do, frankly, I’m always surprised,” Coates said. “I don’t know if it’s my low expectations for white people or what.”
We’ve tricked ourselves into thinking such rhetoric is anything other than repulsive prejudice.
It is entirely fashionable, of course, for progressives to speak sneeringly and dismissively of “white people.” Coates is not the first person to evince such casual racism, and he will surely not be the last. Common as this low and ugly form of bigotry is, however, it’s still a wonder people put up with it to the degree that we do.
Imagine, for a minute, if a white writer—for the sake of argument, say, a guy named Daniel Payne, at, say, a fictional publication called the Federalist—expressed surprise that “people who are not white” ever read his work: “I don’t know if it’s my low expectations for black people or what,” he would remark. Would you be impressed at the jaded profundity of such a statement? Or would you think, “Gee, Daniel Payne sounds like a racist jerk?”
We have been here together talking about these issues too long for you to say this right here.
This board has, but all I mean is that I can see that other people would have this same reaction. When I read the article yesterday (or maybe Tuesday), as soon as I read that line I thought to myself that people are not going to read him just b/c he said that. But maybe those same people wouldn't have read him anyway.
Clearly The Federalist has its own issues. But, I think if a white author did say he/she has low expectations of black people I would roll my eyes and write him/her off forever. Now, I'm not going to write Coates off and I hope (more than hope) that the majority in this country starts reading him more regularly, but, I can also see why people are asking why it's okay for Coates to say he has low expectations for white people without being called out on it. EDIT to clarify-I don't agree with people asking this, but I am sure many people stopped reading after the third paragraph.
Yet, sadly, at the outset of this piece, we are shown that Coates, for all the adulation he receives, is actually a remarkably narrow-minded and unpleasant person, as we find at the end of the article’s third paragraph: “When people who are not black are interested in what I do, frankly, I’m always surprised,” Coates said. “I don’t know if it’s my low expectations for white people or what.”
We’ve tricked ourselves into thinking such rhetoric is anything other than repulsive prejudice.
It is entirely fashionable, of course, for progressives to speak sneeringly and dismissively of “white people.” Coates is not the first person to evince such casual racism, and he will surely not be the last. Common as this low and ugly form of bigotry is, however, it’s still a wonder people put up with it to the degree that we do.
Imagine, for a minute, if a white writer—for the sake of argument, say, a guy named Daniel Payne, at, say, a fictional publication called the Federalist—expressed surprise that “people who are not white” ever read his work: “I don’t know if it’s my low expectations for black people or what,” he would remark. Would you be impressed at the jaded profundity of such a statement? Or would you think, “Gee, Daniel Payne sounds like a racist jerk?”
You do realize why he said this correct? He speaks about the struggle of Black people and addresses issues with the gloves off. So yeah, I could see being surprised when white people are interested. I will let the rest of these folks address the rest of your fuckery.
Why should he have high expectations of white people with regards to race? Leaving aside the history of race in this country and simply looking at the news for the past year and seeing crap like #alllivesmatter and the way people react to any criticism or even the idea that systemic racism exists shows us that for the most part white people value peace and sticking their heads in the sand over recognizing reality and accepting their role in the problems.
Everything I've read of his focuses on race in America. Considering a vast majority of white people think we are post racial and we are all color blind, I'm not surprised he is surprised when he hears that white people read what he writes.
I don't understand why anyone should have anything but low expectations of white people when we are addressing or discussing race in America, honestly.
But Coates wasn't saying "I have low expectations of white people (because I expect them to all be thugs/on welfare/whatever current racism is in vogue)." Coates was saying "I have low expectations of white people (to take an interest in other people/try and see beyond their immediate experiences)." The author of the piece is deliberately misconstruing an important point: that we should expect everyone to be invested in undoing racism and it's pretty tragic that we don't.
Clearly The Federalist has its own issues. But, I think if a white author did say he/she has low expectations of black people I would roll my eyes and write him/her off forever. Now, I'm not going to write Coates off and I hope (more than hope) that the majority in this country starts reading him more regularly, but, I can also see why people are asking why it's okay for Coates to say he has low expectations for white people without being called out on it. EDIT to clarify-I don't agree with people asking this, but I am sure many people stopped reading after the third paragraph.
Yet, sadly, at the outset of this piece, we are shown that Coates, for all the adulation he receives, is actually a remarkably narrow-minded and unpleasant person, as we find at the end of the article’s third paragraph: “When people who are not black are interested in what I do, frankly, I’m always surprised,” Coates said. “I don’t know if it’s my low expectations for white people or what.”
We’ve tricked ourselves into thinking such rhetoric is anything other than repulsive prejudice.
It is entirely fashionable, of course, for progressives to speak sneeringly and dismissively of “white people.” Coates is not the first person to evince such casual racism, and he will surely not be the last. Common as this low and ugly form of bigotry is, however, it’s still a wonder people put up with it to the degree that we do.
Imagine, for a minute, if a white writer—for the sake of argument, say, a guy named Daniel Payne, at, say, a fictional publication called the Federalist—expressed surprise that “people who are not white” ever read his work: “I don’t know if it’s my low expectations for black people or what,” he would remark. Would you be impressed at the jaded profundity of such a statement? Or would you think, “Gee, Daniel Payne sounds like a racist jerk?”
You do realize why he said this correct? He speaks about the struggle of Black people and addresses issues with the gloves off. So yeah, I could see being surprised when white people are interested. I will let the rest of these folks address the rest of your fuckery.
I don't agree with the article or the author's POV. I tried to clarify that I can see how MANY people are going to agree with his POV and write Coates off altogether.
Why should he have high expectations of white people with regards to race? Leaving aside the history of race in this country and simply looking at the news for the past year and seeing crap like #alllivesmatter and the way people react to any criticism or even the idea that systemic racism exists shows us that for the most part white people value peace and sticking their heads in the sand over recognizing reality and accepting their role in the problems.
Everything I've read of his focuses on race in America. Considering a vast majority of white people think we are post racial and we are all color blind, I'm not surprised he is surprised when he hears that white people read what he writes.
I don't understand why anyone should have anything but low expectations of white people when we are addressing or discussing race in America, honestly.
go read the Serena thread for Velvetshady's reaction to being told that what she was saying was problematic. And then look at my reaction where I delivery her ass on a silver platter and drop the mic She had no interest in engaging about why we were caung her on it. She just flounced out.
Then come back and tell me that Coates quote is off base.
*sigh* Saying you "have low expectations of black people" brings up a whole history of oppression and stereotypes. It's DANGEROUS. It's a continuation of racism to do that. Saying you have low expectations for white people does nothing to actually harm white people or anyone else's perception of white people. Sure, as a white person I don't feel GREAT when someone says that, but Ta-Nehisi Coates is not here to give me head pats. It's okay, and probably beneficial, for white people to feel uncomfortable sometimes.
go read the Serena thread for Velvetshady's reaction to being told that what she was saying was problematic. She had no interest in engaging about why we were caung her on it. She just flounced out.
Then come back and tell me that Coates quote is off base.
I don't think Coates is off base, swear on my life. And I agree wholeheartedly with what Eclaires said. But, there is going to be a huge amount of people who read the NYT piece and get to the third paragraph and write him off for exactly the same reason the author of the federalist article said. Posters on this board won't, but I think a lot of white people will (which of course is the point Coates was making originally). I guess I wonder if those people will ever engage in any sort of conversation.
go read the Serena thread for Velvetshady's reaction to being told that what she was saying was problematic. She had no interest in engaging about why we were caung her on it. She just flounced out.
Then come back and tell me that Coates quote is off base.
I'm not proud of how long it took me to catch on to what the issue was in that thread. But if you read that thread and still believe that *I* was the one not interested in engaging in a conversation, then I can't help you. I "flounced" out of the thread when it became apparent that what I actually said or meant didn't matter to some posters, some posters were far more interested in slamming me or serving me my ass on a platter than in engaging anything productive, some posters weren't going to believe anything I said, and overall the direction was causing more anger/hurt/whatever for everyone than anyone needs over an Internet post.
If your goal in that thread was to make me feel unwelcome and unwanted in any that or any future discussions, you achieved it. And this post and the FTFY below it, re-enforce that impression. I have had many positive conservations about race and learned a lot about recognizing my white privilege on this board, including being corrected on how a comment could be interpreted, in the past. I'll get what positive lessons out of future threads that I can by lurking.
I have what is really in the larger scheme a nitpicky issue - since when is "white people" a racial slur? It's not like he said, "well, what do you expect from all those honkies?"
go read the Serena thread for Velvetshady's reaction to being told that what she was saying was problematic. She had no interest in engaging about why we were caung her on it. She just flounced out.
Then come back and tell me that Coates quote is off base.
I'm not proud of how long it took me to catch on to what the issue was in that thread. But if you read that thread and still believe that *I* was the one not interested in engaging in a conversation, then I can't help you. I "flounced" out of the thread when it became apparent that what I actually said or meant didn't matter to some posters, some posters were far more interested in slamming me or serving me my ass on a platter than in engaging anything productive, some posters weren't going to believe anything I said, and overall the direction was causing more anger/hurt/whatever for everyone than anyone needs over an Internet post.
If your goal in that thread was to make me feel unwelcome and unwanted in any that or any future discussions, you achieved it. And this post and the FTFY below it, re-enforce that impression. I have had many positive conservations about race and learned a lot about recognizing my white privilege on this board, including being corrected on how a comment could be interpreted, in the past. I'll get what positive lessons out of future threads that I can by lurking.
Honestly, this is exactly why I said Shuck and Jive. What I read was three posters trying to nicely realize that what you were saying was raising hackles. Instead, you kept doubling down on how Serena needed to be happy and you like happy players.
Meanwhile everyone was like ...
There isn't a nice way to explain you're all the way in Happy Negro stereotype land. Especially, if you're missing the clues.
And TNC is right - what he's saying isn't for average white folks. It takes a brave soul to basically say - well SHIT. The whole system was set up on the backs of black folks. Everything was designed to keep us separate. AND IT KEEPS HAPPENING! Move out of a neighborhood when it shifts to 8% black. Move out of schools when you hear Title 1. Run in an elevator when one damn black man gets on it.
I don't know you what you want us *meaning black folks on GBCN* to do. Do you want an apology, because that's not likely. All we want is for folks to stop getting all butthurt when we point out things that ain't right. That's all. It's not like we thought you were flying the Confederate Flag and had your Klanswear in the cleaners.
You don't need to sulk and lurk. It's totally unnecessary.
The crazy thing to me about this is that the writer never examines why Coates said what he said. It's a good thing I am not a writer. No one wants to hear how low my expectations of white people are lol. Forget the fact that he meets and speaks to large audiences and personally sees who is and who isn't interested in what he has to say. Let's just start at the basics. If we picked 100 random white Americans Family Feud style, how many do you guys think would actually be interested in discussing, hearing about or reading about race relations? How many of that number would be interested in hearing about it solely from a black POV? Now of that number, how many make a conscious effort to seek out black writers and their thoughts on race relations? But okay, let's make it about Coates engaging in reverse racism.
Awww, I miss @misoangry. I don't have time to keep up with ML. ::waves::
This thread was a good read. I don't have anything to contribute except to say thanks for posting and discussing this stuff because I always learn something new.
I love when we call @misoangry over here. (yes I just gave you an unnecessary tag. I know how much you love that ) Her response always starts the same..."I don't know what's going on here, but..."
Bwahahaha.
I started to read the thread. I really did.
But y'all are so serious.
I can only muster up enough seriousness for work, and even that's a struggle.
I can only muster up enough seriousness for work, and even that's a struggle.
Now you KNOW you are just as feisty. You don't have to react cause there are plenty of worked up ladies here. Otherwise, you would be in someone's shit!
The crazy thing to me about this is that the writer never examines why Coates said what he said. It's a good thing I am not a writer. No one wants to hear how low my expectations of white people are lol. Forget the fact that he meets and speaks to large audiences and personally sees who is and who isn't interested in what he has to say. Let's just start at the basics. If we picked 100 random white Americans Family Feud style, how many do you guys think would actually be interested in discussing, hearing about or reading about race relations? How many of that number would be interested in hearing about it solely from a black POV? Now of that number, how many make a conscious effort to seek out black writers and their thoughts on race relations? But okay, let's make it about Coates engaging in reverse racism.
Yeah when I started reading I thought maybe this article was going to actually look a little deeper but instead it was the same old tired bullshit.
By the way, I would legit be surprised if more than 40 people on my Facebook feed even know who Coates is. I've posted some of his articles and they've gotten some likes and shares but I would be speechless if any of them even knew him by name or what he typically writes about.
I fully admit if I didn't hang out here for the better part of the past 8 years I probably wouldn't have a clue either.