NPCER: Not feeling appreciated in marriage

[josieposy]

I'm sorry you are unhappy, AE. Have you actually told him any of this?

[pceae]

Nov 30, 2015 5:56:53 GMT -5 josieposy said:

I'm sorry you are unhappy, AE. Have you actually told him any of this?

I have not yet. We haven't had time to sit down and talk since I recognized this.  

[katietornado]

PDQ

I'm not going to go into a ton of detail, but I was in your position a few years ago. Felt unfulfilled in my marriage, and was interested in someone else. Thought I wanted out.

Blah blah blah... a bit of counseling and a lot of time together, and I couldn't be happier in my marriage. Things had gotten routine and platonic, for sure. But some commitment from both of us to spend one on one time together, to talk and listen without screens (laptop, TV, etc), to have a lot of sex ... our marriage did a 180. I think the key was speaking in counseling and being more honest about what we each wanted from the other.

I am not going to tell you to stay in an unhappy marriage. But. I would just caution that what seems fun and flirty and exciting and whatever with this other guy ... that shit wears off really quickly when you're waking up next to his morning breath, and he's leaving his dirty dishes in the sink for the billionth time, or he's farting next to you in his sleep. The excitement you feel from this other guy is not how marriage "should" be. It's how all new relationships are.

I would advise discussing this in counseling. Be as honest as you feel you can be. What you're missing from your H, TELL HIM about it. Lose daycare guy's number. He has no part in your marriage.

[josieposy]

I keep typing up a response and deleting it because the posts inevitably become about me and my own recent experiences. I don't want to do that. Just know that at least one of us dealt with somewhat similar issues fairly recently. You can feel free to PM me if you feel the need to hear more.

Right now I will just say that you aren't crazy, but you will obviously have to have the awkward conversation at some point. I realize this is a total "no shit, jp" response. I also wouldn't blame you if you waited until after the holidays, because it's bound to be a long and painful process regardless of outcome.

I wish you luck and send lots of hugs. I hope things get better, whatever the case may be.

[erbear]

The above posters are wise. Marriages change over time, and someone new seems exciting. If you want out of your marriage because you're not in love anymore, that's ok. But I always feel like you owe it to your spouse, your child and yourself to make sure you're not in love anymore before you uproot everything. Ditto counseling. Find the right person and see if you have something worth fighting for. Good luck.

[pceae]

I will say that "daycare guy" is not someone I should be with. Friends, sure. This isn't about him.

I do need to figure out how to have this conversation with my husband, but don't know where to start. I just hope he can understand the difference between happy and not unhappy.

[penguingrrl]

Sending you hugs first! That's a really difficult realization to have. I would ditto PP who suggested counseling before anything else. Have you and H had many opportunities to go out without your child? Are you stuck in a go to work, come home, spend time with your child, go to bed rut? We were stuck in that rut for a while and that was taking a toll on our marriage as well. We found ways to break out of it and that truly did fix that discontent feeling for us.

I'm also going to point out that kids will be happier and have a better view of marriage with parents who are divorced but each happy than parents in an unhappy marriage. It doesn't have to be abusive to be unhappy.

[NewOrleans]

In preparation for the conversation that NEEDS to happen, maybe you could list out what you need to feel appreciated as a wife and woman. And when you talk about it state it as things you need rather than things he doesn't do for you. It gives him a roadmap at least.

The other person is a danger to an already vulnerable situation and a distraction to clearing your headspace. The fact that you included him as part of the equation in this post shows how deeply he's been inserted here. I think you should make him go away, friend or whatever.

Maybe you ultimately do need a divorce. Maybe you don't. But you do need to express yourself. You and your H both deserve that.

Good luck, AE. Big hugs and good wishes.

[wambam]

I think you know that the first step is to talk to your husband so I won't harp on that.

I do think you should consider whether or not it's wise to continue your friendship with the other guy. He might become a source of confusion and conflict while you're trying to figure things out in your current marriage.

I'm sorry that you're unhappy.

[aurora]

I'm never going to tell anybody to stay in an unhappy marriage, but I agree with the others that it sound like you may be in a rut that is possible to get out of. I would recommend counseling, honesty with your H, and an attempt to get things back on track. At leastif you divorce you'll know you tried (feel better about it) and have some insight about what you're looking for next time.

[YeahSure]

Do you have any friends at all who are mainly your friend? Can you ask them? The reason I suggest this is that when I left my first husband (of over twenty years), I was certain that my friends would be upset with me. When I told them, every single one said, "It's about time!" Of course I'm not saying that this would happen to you, but in my case, my friends recognized issues in the marriage, that I had not. In your case, your friends might recognize good things. Armed with a new or different perspective could help you to figure the direction you want to head when you go to the counselling that others here have suggested. 
I also agree with those who have suggested you lose the number of daycare guy. Even if he's just a friend, he's making that line feel muddled, and that's not good no matter which direction you go.

Sending hugs. 

[penguingrrl]

Nov 30, 2015 8:53:30 GMT -5 ttt said:

Nov 30, 2015 7:20:01 GMT -5 penguingrrl said:

Sending you hugs first! That's a really difficult realization to have. I would ditto PP who suggested counseling before anything else. Have you and H had many opportunities to go out without your child? Are you stuck in a go to work, come home, spend time with your child, go to bed rut? We were stuck in that rut for a while and that was taking a toll on our marriage as well. We found ways to break out of it and that truly did fix that discontent feeling for us.

I'm also going to point out that kids will be happier and have a better view of marriage with parents who are divorced but each happy than parents in an unhappy marriage. It doesn't have to be abusive to be unhappy.

I don't want to be Debbie Downer here but I don't think this second part is necessarily true. Kids aren't always happy when their parents are happy and they aren't always unhappy when their parents are unhappy. Kids are selfish creatures and to be honest, they don't generally care that much about their parents emotional fulfillment until a much older age, if at all. (And I admit I have a lot of personal bias coloring my opinion here, as my parents divorced for the reasons of "not being happy" and it was terribly traumatic and hard on me and my brother and left a lot of long lasting issues. My father being happier and more emotionally satisfied did not even slightly begin to make up for what we went through. And my mother ended up not being at all happier.) It's nice to think that if I make myself happy, that's what's best for my children but unfortunately it's not really true.

All that said, I'm sorry, OP, and I think counseling, if that's possible, could be very useful and helpful, even if you only go on your own.

I can understand that and I do think that it depends a lot on the full situation. My life got tremendously better once my parents divorced and my mother was finally happy. But my father was an abusive alcoholic, so it's comparing apples to oranges. It's good to hear varying experiences on this. I'm sorry it was hard on you!

[hocus2]

I think a lot of folks on starting over read too good to leave, too bad to stay (or something like that).

Right now your marriage sounds salvageable, but it is hard to say without knowing exactly how your husband feels and what he is capable of. The fact that you have a crush on someone else doesn't mean that your marriage is over or really in deep trouble. People do have crushes throughout their adult lives I think. I have a few dad friends from school and daycare and it is nice to hang out with them. We don't know everything about each other and we don't spend most of our time together so in a way it is easier to talk to them. It doesn't mean my marriage is bad. It just means my husband and I know each other in a profound way. We've had all those conversations already and we share the experiences that I talk about with others.

[earlgreyhot]

Haven't read all the posters and don't know the specifics but I think leaving your husband would be a huge mistake that you will come to regret.

[omgzombies]

Nov 30, 2015 8:41:18 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

In preparation for the conversation that NEEDS to happen, maybe you could list out what you need to feel appreciated as a wife and woman. And when you talk about it state it as things you need rather than things he doesn't do for you. It gives him a roadmap at least.

The other person is a danger to an already vulnerable situation and a distraction to clearing your headspace. The fact that you included him as part of the equation in this post shows how deeply he's been inserted here. I think you should make him go away, friend or whatever.

Maybe you ultimately do need a divorce. Maybe you don't. But you do need to express yourself. You and your H both deserve that.

Good luck, AE. Big hugs and good wishes.

This is what I was going to write almost word for word.  

Sit down and think about what you actually need here.  Is it H planning a romantic date now and then, telling you how beautiful you look more often, telling you how much he appreciates you doing x thing around the house?  Then talk about it together.  If you feel safer talking about it in therapy that's ok too.  As long as you tell him what's going on.  It's ok to say that you're unhappy right now, and that you need more.  

And ditch other guy.  Avoid him, don't talk to him, call him etc.  He's not a part of this conversation.  He's a distraction and a fantasy, you need to concentrate on your reality.  

I hope you can figure out what you need to be happy, regardless of whether it's with your H or without.  Big hugs.  I'm sure this is a tough time for you.  

[earlgreyhot]

Nov 30, 2015 7:09:14 GMT -5 pceae said:

I will say that "daycare guy" is not someone I should be with. Friends, sure. This isn't about him.

I do need to figure out how to have this conversation with my husband, but don't know where to start. I just hope he can understand the difference between happy and not unhappy.

See. It just sounds like you are in a rut. And having the conversation is hard. But, that's life. That's marriage.

If you were miserable, sure. But what is attractive about the daycare guy is the ease. You are in the trenches with your DH...parenting, keeping a house going, etc...the emotional stuff gets pushed to the back burner. You just need to bring it to the front. Make the time.

You also need to be open to your husbands love language. It took me a long time to really see how DH shows his love vs my expectations. I had to let go of my expectation that he will just know. And it's been hard having to ask him for what I need.

[KateAggie]

Nov 30, 2015 10:16:37 GMT -5 earlgreyhot said:

Haven't read all the posters and don't know the specifics but I think leaving your husband would be a huge mistake that you will come to regret.

This is kind of harsh, but I agree. Your marriage (in your words) has a base that many are missing--teamwork, partnership, respect, caring. Passion/affection can be improved with care and effort--the other things can be harder to come by.

[NewOrleans]

Dang, you ladies are wise up in here. This is some good stuff. I'm not the AE, but I'm actually getting a lot out of your posts for my own life!

This board is good people.

[downtoearth]

I think it would be good to confide in a counselor for just you first, but yes for both of you later if you can't talk directly to him without feeling like you're not being heard. I lean toward that b/c it seems that you have some realization/resentment from a comment your DH made in premarital counseling (I presume for church) ages ago. By not dealing with that comment and how it affected you then, I think you are now seeing a lot of his behaviors with that coloring and relabeling them. I'm not saying if he really believes that marrying is a step and he doesn't care who/arranged is fine, but I think you and he need to get to the bottom of that b/c it's affecting your relationship and how you see his actions now years later. And if he said it in jest and/or meant something else, you're not giving him a chance to explain and learn how that made you feel.

[ESF]

Google Ester Perel. I highly recommend listening to her TED talks and reading some of the stuff on her blog. She specializes in writing about problems in happy marriages that sound a lot like yours. Some of her stuff is heavy on infidelity and she also works with people in open relationships, so on the surface, some of the content may not seem to apply to you, but there are some takeaways that are universal.

[Deleted]

Hugs.

I've been here. I'm (maybe) coming out on the other side now. It CAN get better but it's work. Are you seeing a therapist? Individual and couples therapy has been really helpful in sorting out my/our issues. The most important thing I've learned is that relationship issues stem from issues within ourselves and it takes a lot of work on yourself to be able to be in a happy relationship.

[pceae]

Thanks everyone. I'm pretty sure you're right. While it's never been amazing, we really are in a rut. No, we don't have date nights (no babysitter) and the thought of making the effort myself turns me off more. It's always me. He kind of wanted to go to the silent auction & dance fundraiser for the school and I said sure, if he found a babysitter. He didn't even try.

I'll see what our EAP has available as a start, at least for me, but I think it will need to be joint to get through to him.

[ttt]

As far as daycare guy, I think that is totally and completely normal, and I'd venture to say that most anyone who has been married for a significant amount of time and has regular contact with the outside world has had a similar experience - someone new and exciting who pays special attention to you, who makes you remember what it was like to be single and have a new interest, someone who maybe gives you flutters, someone who sees you in a different (more interesting, maybe sexier) way than your spouse does, the fantasy of a different life or a new start. But if you recognize it for what it is - a fantasy, a diversion - avoid situations where it could turn into something more than a fantasy, and use those feelings to improve your "real life," I think it can actually be a good thing.

[tacosforlife]

Nov 30, 2015 11:30:45 GMT -5 pceae said:

Thanks everyone. I'm pretty sure you're right. While it's never been amazing, we really are in a rut. No, we don't have date nights (no babysitter) and the thought of making the effort myself turns me off more. It's always me. He kind of wanted to go to the silent auction & dance fundraiser for the school and I said sure, if he found a babysitter. He didn't even try.

I'll see what our EAP has available as a start, at least for me, but I think it will need to be joint to get through to him.

IANAP, but I think this is a common problem in marriages with kids. Heck, it's an issue in my childless marriage. If I didn't plan outings, we'd probably do nothing but watch Netflix every night for the rest of our lives. I've expressed my frustration with this before, and frankly I probably need to do it again. He considers sitting on the couch with me to be quality time. My definition is a little different.

I'm currently reading a book about women and psychology. I'm only in the beginning, but one of the big issues that the authors are exploring is that in our culture, women have essentially done the heavy psychological lifting. I think this can be an issue in all marriages - women do so much of the mental and emotional work of keeping things running. But in a lot of ways, I see this in my friends with kids even more, with things like the burden of securing childcare falling to mom.

This is something that will take work, but I definitely think it can be improved with communication and possibly counseling. Your husband needs to understand that you need to feel WANTED, not just NEEDED. (Heck, he may feel the same way.) Part of that is taking initiative to get out of ruts. Our relationships fall into routine, and frankly that's necessary - it's not practical to have a long, drawn out discussion of who is going to make breakfast each morning. Someone has to just fucking DO IT. But we also need to shake things up from time to time, and the changing up of the routine needs to be a team effort.

I agree with KateAggie that it sounds like you have a very solid foundation, so I think this is fixable. And I'm very interested to look into the suggestions ESF offered.

[Deleted]

tacosforlife I'd love the name of that book if you would like to share.

[MrsAxilla]

Nov 30, 2015 11:30:45 GMT -5 pceae said:

Thanks everyone. I'm pretty sure you're right. While it's never been amazing, we really are in a rut. No, we don't have date nights (no babysitter) and the thought of making the effort myself turns me off more. It's always me. He kind of wanted to go to the silent auction & dance fundraiser for the school and I said sure, if he found a babysitter. He didn't even try.

I'll see what our EAP has available as a start, at least for me, but I think it will need to be joint to get through to him.

Well, you dodged a bullet with the silent auction!  That is definitely not a fun date.  I totally get the babysitter issue.  Sure, you can find someone easily, but it's expensive and pretty much doubles the cost of your date.  DH and I almost never go out, but we have dates at home all the time, and not just movie nights.  We turn board or card games into drinkng games, stream concerts (live or from YouTube) on our big TV (this is our favorite, actually), build a fire out in our fire pit, play wii or guitar hero....honestly, we can make anything fun with some alcohol - lol.  

[tacosforlife]

Nov 30, 2015 11:43:02 GMT -5 @notquiteblushing said:

tacosforlife I'd love the name of that book if you would like to share.

The Healing Connection. I've only read one chapter so far, so maybe it gets terrible! But a friend of mine, who reads a lot about psychology, gave it to me as a gift because she thought it was so good.

Warning: the first chapter talks about how traditional psychology uses men's experiences as a baseline and pathologizes women's experiences. So it just gave me another thing to include in my breakfast table ranting about the patriarchy!

[pceae]

Nov 30, 2015 11:19:46 GMT -5 ESF said:

Google Ester Perel. I highly recommend listening to her TED talks and reading some of the stuff on her blog. She specializes in writing about problems in happy marriages that sound a lot like yours. Some of her stuff is heavy on infidelity and she also works with people in open relationships, so on the surface, some of the content may not seem to apply to you, but there are some takeaways that are universal.

Thank you very much for this. 

[katietornado]

Nov 30, 2015 11:39:43 GMT -5 tacosforlife said:

Nov 30, 2015 11:30:45 GMT -5 pceae said:

Thanks everyone. I'm pretty sure you're right. While it's never been amazing, we really are in a rut. No, we don't have date nights (no babysitter) and the thought of making the effort myself turns me off more. It's always me. He kind of wanted to go to the silent auction & dance fundraiser for the school and I said sure, if he found a babysitter. He didn't even try.

I'll see what our EAP has available as a start, at least for me, but I think it will need to be joint to get through to him.

IANAP, but I think this is a common problem in marriages with kids. Heck, it's an issue in my childless marriage. If I didn't plan outings, we'd probably do nothing but watch Netflix every night for the rest of our lives. I've expressed my frustration with this before, and frankly I probably need to do it again. He considers sitting on the couch with me to be quality time. My definition is a little different.

I'm currently reading a book about women and psychology. I'm only in the beginning, but one of the big issues that the authors are exploring is that in our culture, women have essentially done the heavy psychological lifting. I think this can be an issue in all marriages - women do so much of the mental and emotional work of keeping things running. But in a lot of ways, I see this in my friends with kids even more, with things like the burden of securing childcare falling to mom.

This is something that will take work, but I definitely think it can be improved with communication and possibly counseling. Your husband needs to understand that you need to feel WANTED, not just NEEDED. (Heck, he may feel the same way.) Part of that is taking initiative to get out of ruts. Our relationships fall into routine, and frankly that's necessary - it's not practical to have a long, drawn out discussion of who is going to make breakfast each morning. Someone has to just fucking DO IT. But we also need to shake things up from time to time, and the changing up of the routine needs to be a team effort.

I agree with KateAggie that it sounds like you have a very solid foundation, so I think this is fixable. And I'm very interested to look into the suggestions ESF offered.

My mom has been saying this for years.  I hate that it's so very true.

[hocus2]

Nov 30, 2015 11:30:45 GMT -5 pceae said:

Thanks everyone. I'm pretty sure you're right. While it's never been amazing, we really are in a rut. No, we don't have date nights (no babysitter) and the thought of making the effort myself turns me off more. It's always me. He kind of wanted to go to the silent auction & dance fundraiser for the school and I said sure, if he found a babysitter. He didn't even try.

I'll see what our EAP has available as a start, at least for me, but I think it will need to be joint to get through to him.

Back 8 years ago we hit a rut and did a few sessions with someone and one of the suggestions was that we take turns planning date nights. My DH took it pretty seriously and did plan his share of the dates. They were NOT what I would have planned but I really enjoyed having the break from owning that function. I don't think people always realize that one nice aspect of "dating" is not having to plan it all the time.

For the most part I plan 95% of our lives and I'm far less bothered by it than I was a few years back. I make all the babysitting arrangements regardless of why there is a need for them. I even work with my husbands parents directly since they do 50% of the sitting since it is far easier than going through him . DH did plan most of our long weekend away and it was lovely and a much needed break for me.