At work, so unfortunately not watching except the brief clips of Trump arriving in the row, then later W greeting everyone (and giving Michelle another candy, awwww).
Boy, does Trump seem way out of place in that pew.
Hillary refusing to even turn to look at 45 was amazing.
yeah. I'm at home all by myself but when I saw that whole (non)exchange I said, out loud, "Ooh. Remind me to never piss her off!."
I also noticed neither he nor Melania said the Apostle's Creed. Looks like it was printed in the program, so they could have just opened it and stared down to at least fake it, but they both just stood there looking petulant.
I don’t expect non religious people to say the Apostle’s Creed. In fact, I consider it disrespectful to say prayers if you don’t believe them. I stay respectfully quiet during prayers or the “under God” line in the Constitution.
I am a Christian and have attended evangelical churches (and Catholic funerals) and never heard the Apostle's Creed before. Maybe it's strictly an Episcopalian thing?
ETA: regardless, I know we're talking about Trump and he probably can't read anyway, but I think it's appropriate for each person to choose whether or not to participate in something like that.
I am a Christian and have attended evangelical churches (and Catholic funerals) and never heard the Apostle's Creed before. Maybe it's strictly an Episcopalian thing?
He claims to be a Presbyterian. It's definitely a thing in the Presbyterian church.
I am a Christian and have attended evangelical churches (and Catholic funerals) and never heard the Apostle's Creed before. Maybe it's strictly an Episcopalian thing?
ETA: regardless, I know we're talking about Trump and he probably can't read anyway, but I think it's appropriate for each person to choose whether or not to participate in something like that.
To my knowledge Catholics, Methodists, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Church of England all say it as well. It's common in all the old(er) school Christian religions. I grew up Lutheran and the Apostle's Creed was said during every service.
I am a Christian and have attended evangelical churches (and Catholic funerals) and never heard the Apostle's Creed before. Maybe it's strictly an Episcopalian thing?
ETA: regardless, I know we're talking about Trump and he probably can't read anyway, but I think it's appropriate for each person to choose whether or not to participate in something like that.
To my knowledge Catholics, Methodists, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Church of England all say it as well. It's common in all the old(er) school Christian religions. I grew up Lutheran and the Apostle's Creed was said during every service.
While being Catholic, most of the churches I've attended have used the Apostle's Creed. It wasn't said during every service, but I can account for it being said during Methodist and Catholic services, and other Protestant services. The only place I don't remember hearing it was during Baptist services, but I could be wrong.
To my knowledge Catholics, Methodists, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Church of England all say it as well. It's common in all the old(er) school Christian religions. I grew up Lutheran and the Apostle's Creed was said during every service.
While being Catholic, most of the churches I've attended have used the Apostle's Creed. It wasn't said during every service, but I can account for it being said during Methodist and Catholic services, and other Protestant services. The only place I don't remember hearing it was during Baptist services, but I could be wrong.
It's recited at every mass. I've never been to a service where it is not present in some form. It's typically part of the Liturgy of the Word, but it may be moved as part of particular events, such as a baptism, or Easter Sunday, etc. where it is less a personal profession of faith, but the priest calling on the congregation to witness in a Q/A way.
Catholics use both the Nicene Creed and the Apostles Creed. The apostles creed is typically used for Rites of Initiation.
I also noticed neither he nor Melania said the Apostle's Creed. Looks like it was printed in the program, so they could have just opened it and stared down to at least fake it, but they both just stood there looking petulant.
I don’t expect non religious people to say the Apostle’s Creed. In fact, I consider it disrespectful to say prayers if you don’t believe them. I stay respectfully quiet during prayers or the “under God” line in the Constitution.
This is interesting to me (your perspective re: respect). I am not religious but when I have been at church -- for example for a baptism or a wedding -- where there is a prayer or something everyone is supposed to say I have said it as well because I worried I would be considered disrespectful by *not* participating. Now I wonder if I offended them by participating. Gah.
I don’t expect non religious people to say the Apostle’s Creed. In fact, I consider it disrespectful to say prayers if you don’t believe them. I stay respectfully quiet during prayers or the “under God” line in the Constitution.
This is interesting to me (your perspective re: respect). I am not religious but when I have been at church -- for example for a baptism or a wedding -- where there is a prayer or something everyone is supposed to say I have said it as well because I worried I would be considered disrespectful by *not* participating. Now I wonder if I offended them by participating. Gah.
I don’t think people would be offended in either scenario. But I don’t feel right saying prayers without the intent behind them (meaning that they’re my belief system). Most of those prayers are professing belief in a higher power in some way, which is something I’ve never believed in, and I don’t feel right saying empty words.
I don’t expect non religious people to say the Apostle’s Creed. In fact, I consider it disrespectful to say prayers if you don’t believe them. I stay respectfully quiet during prayers or the “under God” line in the Constitution.
This is interesting to me (your perspective re: respect). I am not religious but when I have been at church -- for example for a baptism or a wedding -- where there is a prayer or something everyone is supposed to say I have said it as well because I worried I would be considered disrespectful by *not* participating. Now I wonder if I offended them by participating. Gah.
The Apostles Creed is a declaration of faith, specifically saying “I believe...” Reciting it isn’t the same as offering a prayer.
I am a Christian and have attended evangelical churches (and Catholic funerals) and never heard the Apostle's Creed before. Maybe it's strictly an Episcopalian thing?
He claims to be a Presbyterian. It's definitely a thing in the Presbyterian church.
I definitely had to memorize the Apostle's creed before I was confirmed in the Presbyterian church at age 14. It's a summary of the core beliefs of mainstream Christianity. They recite in practically every Presbyterian service I've ever been to.
It's kind of weird that Cheeto sat it out. I imagine this would be a big deal for some of his super-Christian supporters-- he doesn't know or refuses to profess belief in the core tenants of Christianity?
He claims to be a Presbyterian. It's definitely a thing in the Presbyterian church.
I definitely had to memorize the Apostle's creed before I was confirmed in the Presbyterian church at age 14. It's a summary of the core beliefs of mainstream Christianity. They recite in practically every Presbyterian service I've ever been to.
It's kind of weird that Cheeto sat it out. I imagine this would be a big deal for some of his super-Christian supporters-- he doesn't know or refuses to profess belief in the core tenants of Christianity?
I definitely had to memorize the Apostle's creed before I was confirmed in the Presbyterian church at age 14. It's a summary of the core beliefs of mainstream Christianity. They recite in practically every Presbyterian service I've ever been to.
It's kind of weird that Cheeto sat it out. I imagine this would be a big deal for some of his super-Christian supporters-- he doesn't know or refuses to profess belief in the core tenants of Christianity?
They don't care. Even a little bit.
Sigh, yes. If pussy-grabbing doesn't matter, then why should it matter that he doesn't understand the basics of the religion he claims to belong to? All that matters is abortion, gay marriage, abortion, gay marriage [NONE OF THESE ARE EVEN MENTIONED IN THE APOSTLE'S CREED]
All that matters is abortion, gay marriage, abortion, gay marriage [NONE OF THESE ARE EVEN MENTIONED IN THE APOSTLE'S CREED]
This is the crux (honest to God no pun intended) of why I've been struggling to leave the church for years ... Decades, really. Because I absolutely believe every tenet in the Creed. It's all that other stuff that isn't mentioned anywhere that people purport to be the measure of a good Catholic that I reject out of hand, and that makes me feel unwelcome, or worse.
He claims to be a Presbyterian. It's definitely a thing in the Presbyterian church.
I definitely had to memorize the Apostle's creed before I was confirmed in the Presbyterian church at age 14. It's a summary of the core beliefs of mainstream Christianity. They recite in practically every Presbyterian service I've ever been to.
It's kind of weird that Cheeto sat it out. I imagine this would be a big deal for some of his super-Christian supporters-- he doesn't know or refuses to profess belief in the core tenants of Christianity?
Hell, he has pretty much thumbed his nose at just about all of the 10 commandments. What's one more thing?
I am a Christian and have attended evangelical churches (and Catholic funerals) and never heard the Apostle's Creed before. Maybe it's strictly an Episcopalian thing?
ETA: regardless, I know we're talking about Trump and he probably can't read anyway, but I think it's appropriate for each person to choose whether or not to participate in something like that.
I grew up Lutheran and can still recite it in my sleep. I don't think I've actually said it since I was about 20.
I think “I thought Bob Dole was dead” is the latest example of the Mandela Effect. I’m seeing it every where today!
I truly thought he was dead also - found out in August he wasn't. Elizabeth and my aunt both threw out the first pitch at a MLB game so I googled while watching.
I am a Christian and have attended evangelical churches (and Catholic funerals) and never heard the Apostle's Creed before. Maybe it's strictly an Episcopalian thing?
I grew up Catholic, and while it's a slightly altered version of it, we did it every mass.
I don’t expect non religious people to say the Apostle’s Creed. In fact, I consider it disrespectful to say prayers if you don’t believe them. I stay respectfully quiet during prayers or the “under God” line in the Constitution.
He claims to be a Christian man of great faith.
Yeah, there was the huge to do about him being a born-again, baby Christian.
I have no objection to people remaining quiet during prayers they don't want to say.
I do have a problem with Trump's hypocrisy and lying, pretending to be Christian when he thinks it will benefit him only.
Jeb didn’t say it either. I don’t think 45’s made any secret about the fact that he’s not religious, so I’m glad he didn’t profess a faith that he doesn’t really believe in. When I have been in similar situations, I don’t say it either because it’s not something I believe and I feel it’s disrespectful to pretend I do believe it.
I missed the Jeb camera shot, and wouldn't want someone to say something they don't believe in, but I thought I distinctly remembered him talking about how he's religious during the election....and we all know the evangelicals fall all over themselves for him.
I honestly don't care if he truly believes Christian tenets, but I swear I remember him talking about his "great faith" in the past. I don't know, it just struck me as one more thing about him that is fake.
It feels a bit gross to me judge the behavior of a man who is grieving and at his father’s funeral. I was zoned out at my Dad’s and probably didn’t recite half of the prayers that were said. I don’t think that is a sign my faith is fake. We can judge politicians for many things, but their behavior at a loved one’s funeral should be off limits, IMO.
So clearly DJT doesn’t know the creed. But what’s Melania’s excuse? You mean when she dressed up as a 1950’s era pre-Vatican II devout Catholic to meet the Pope, it was really just a costume? Who would have guessed?
So clearly DJT doesn’t know the creed. But what’s Melania’s excuse? You mean when she dressed up as a 1950’s era pre-Vatican II devout Catholic to meet the Pope, it was really just a costume? Who would have guessed?
I’m all for Melania bashing but this is standard uniform for female heads of state and spouses when having an audience with the Pope. Especially Catholics and I think she was at least raised Catholic.
I missed the Jeb camera shot, and wouldn't want someone to say something they don't believe in, but I thought I distinctly remembered him talking about how he's religious during the election....and we all know the evangelicals fall all over themselves for him.
I honestly don't care if he truly believes Christian tenets, but I swear I remember him talking about his "great faith" in the past. I don't know, it just struck me as one more thing about him that is fake.
It feels a bit gross to me judge the behavior of a man who is grieving and at his father’s funeral. I was zoned out at my Dad’s and probably didn’t recite half of the prayers that were said. I don’t think that is a sign my faith is fake. We can judge politicians for many things, but their behavior at a loved one’s funeral should be off limits, IMO.
I wasn’t judging him, simply stating a fact. I’m sure that there were a lot of people at the National Cathedral yesterday who chose not to recite it for a variety of reasons. I myself don’t say the Apostle’s Creed (as I said in my post), so why would I judge someone else for not saying it?
So clearly DJT doesn’t know the creed. But what’s Melania’s excuse? You mean when she dressed up as a 1950’s era pre-Vatican II devout Catholic to meet the Pope, it was really just a costume? Who would have guessed?
I’m all for Melania bashing but this is standard uniform for female heads of state and spouses when having an audience with the Pope. Especially Catholics and I think she was at least raised Catholic.
I respectfully disagree. Many other dignitaries and spouses have dressed appropriately and covered their heads while managing to not look like a caricature of a devout catholic grandma. Melania was a bit over the top in her effort to prove she’s the best catholic ever. It seemed insincere at the time and even more so, now.
eta: when I was searching for the photo above, I came across one of Michelle Obama meeting the Pope. She wore a simple black headscarf. She met all the dress protocols without looking like she was dressing in a costume.
I missed the Jeb camera shot, and wouldn't want someone to say something they don't believe in, but I thought I distinctly remembered him talking about how he's religious during the election....and we all know the evangelicals fall all over themselves for him.
I honestly don't care if he truly believes Christian tenets, but I swear I remember him talking about his "great faith" in the past. I don't know, it just struck me as one more thing about him that is fake.
It feels a bit gross to me judge the behavior of a man who is grieving and at his father’s funeral. I was zoned out at my Dad’s and probably didn’t recite half of the prayers that were said. I don’t think that is a sign my faith is fake. We can judge politicians for many things, but their behavior at a loved one’s funeral should be off limits, IMO.
My comment wasn’t clear, and I apologize for that. I don’t care what the Bushes, or any loved ones in mourning did at the funeral. Grief, and faith, are highly personal. Stand and say nothing, do the YMCA in the aisle with ribbon wands, whatever.
I was more taking issue with the behavior of our president, who loves to talk about how he is a man of “great faith,” and has used his apparent faith to justify hateful policy, but then seemed strikingly non-participatory and petulant during the religious memorial service for a man for whom faith was truly a grounding principal of his life.
Again, I don’t care if trump is *actually* Christian (or any religion, for that matter), nor do I think people should say/do things in worship they don’t believe in. It was more the hypocrisy of his words (especially when he panders to the evangelicals), in stark contrast with his behavior and body language for the duration of the service.
His non-participation may actually be the most honest piece of his personality we’ve seen from him, if he truly doesn’t believe in Christianity, and/or isn’t a person of faith. But instead of just owning it (which would be completely fine for a non-religious person to hold that office), he lies, and runs his mouth about it to get votes and hurt people, etc.