Yeah, my original response was based on the thought that his dogs were on your properly unnecessarily. I was kind of picturing my old house where there was a section of fence facing the street that was not facing my neighbors' property.
If the dogs were in their own yard on his property and your dog stuck its head out onto theirs, you should pay the whole thing. If they were on your property I think half is more fair, but paying it all wouldn't be out of line either
While I agree a dog should not be unattended in the yard, I think part of the point of having a yard is that you can let the dog out to do it's stuff without having to be with it 100% or the time. I would have never in a million years let my dogs out while I was not home, but I usually just hung out in the rooms within earshot when I'd let them out. If I heard barking I'd go get them but if they wanted to enjoy the space for a bit there was no reason to watch them the whole time. I guess I am unclear here if someone was home to go outside right after this happened?
Were your dogs aggressive? Because that makes a difference. My previous dog was large and territorial - I would never leave her outside unattended. Not just because I believe it is irresponsible to leave your pet unattended in a place they could possibility escape, but because if something like this happened, I would have no real idea of the circumstances.
Also if the fence is on the property line, and the dog stuck it’s head through to bite, it’s OP’s dog that was on the other property, no? I feel like I’m taking crazy pills.
But it doesn’t sound like the other dog was just sitting quietly minding his own business. It ran up to the fence and they were both being aggressive. That’s where *me* as a dog owner should do something, and has some responsibility. Especially since it seems to be a frequent occurrence between her dog and his to rile each other up. I am looking at this from how I would handle my dogs in a similar situation.
It seemed like he did react but slowly because he was elderly.
Also if the fence is on the property line, and the dog stuck it’s head through to bite, it’s OP’s dog that was on the other property, no? I feel like I’m taking crazy pills.
The other dogs could have stuck their heads through to bite OP’s dogs paw and then OPs dog bit back. I don’t think anyone actually saw what dog did what. Nor does she truly know where the property line is.
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Also if the fence is on the property line, and the dog stuck it’s head through to bite, it’s OP’s dog that was on the other property, no? I feel like I’m taking crazy pills.
I feel like this is just begging to open a classic ML favorite topic, but if the fence is ON the property line, it could also be his responsibility to fix the fence since it's shared.
It seemed like he did react but slowly because he was elderly.
I am sympathetic to that but you still have to be able to control your dogs, in general, not just this situation. I think there is responsibility on both sides and I’d offer half.
I certainly don’t disagree with you, but the bottom line is that this would not have happened if her fence was in a state of good repair. Would have actually have been impossible. Both dogs would have still been on their respective properties. But because of the fence, her dogs head was able to get out of her property and bite the other dog. If this little dog had run over and gotten under the fence and then her dog attacked it, that’d be an entirely different thing and definitely an issue of the neighbor keeping his dog leashed/controlled.
Also if the fence is on the property line, and the dog stuck it’s head through to bite, it’s OP’s dog that was on the other property, no? I feel like I’m taking crazy pills.
I feel like this is just begging to open a classic ML favorite topic, but if the fence is ON the property line, it could also be his responsibility to fix the fence since it's shared.
I love this place. This is how it always happens too. “My dog bit someone else’s dog. What do I do?” “Well, we’re going to need a measurement of the fence hole, the weight of the dogs, the age of everyone involved, the exact deed property description, and your social security number to decide.”
But it doesn’t sound like the other dog was just sitting quietly minding his own business. It ran up to the fence and they were both being aggressive. That’s where *me* as a dog owner should do something, and has some responsibility. Especially since it seems to be a frequent occurrence between her dog and his to rile each other up. I am looking at this from how I would handle my dogs in a similar situation.
It seemed like he did react but slowly because he was elderly.
Right. So if you are elderly and have slow reaction time, WTF are you walking three dogs at once? Again, knowing that at least one (and it actually sounds like it's at least two) is reactive? It's not as though all of his dogs have been established to be quiet, passive and nonreactive and this is the first time they ever barked or reacted to the OPs dog. I think both parties are responsible for this.
I feel like this is just begging to open a classic ML favorite topic, but if the fence is ON the property line, it could also be his responsibility to fix the fence since it's shared.
I love this place. This is how it always happens too. “My dog bit someone else’s dog. What do I do?” “Well, we’re going to need a measurement of the fence hole, the weight of the dogs, the age of everyone involved, the exact deed property description, and your social security number to decide.”
I'm mostly kidding, OP seems to acknowledge that it's her fence.
I’m team half or $1000. We were recently at a park and a young girl was walking a big lab-she could not control this dog what so ever...she had his leash wrapped around a tree trying to hold him back from another dog as a man was walking by with it. I don’t know what the man was thinking but he literally walked right by the girl with the lab and their dogs got into a fight. The bottom line is both of them should have had their dogs under control. If you aren’t strong enough to hold onto three dogs, you shouldn’t be walking them all at the same time. And if you have a fence which your dog can get thru, you should repair it knowing that your dog is aggressive when other dogs walk by-especially when you know someone HAS TO GO BY
I love this place. This is how it always happens too. “My dog bit someone else’s dog. What do I do?” “Well, we’re going to need a measurement of the fence hole, the weight of the dogs, the age of everyone involved, the exact deed property description, and your social security number to decide.”
And a picture of the dog with the large body and small head.
This is something I actually really want to see. My aunt and uncle have the opposite. They have a dog with the body of a corgi and the head of a pit bull. It’s hilarious. That dog kind of sucks but it looks hilarious.
I love this place. This is how it always happens too. “My dog bit someone else’s dog. What do I do?” “Well, we’re going to need a measurement of the fence hole, the weight of the dogs, the age of everyone involved, the exact deed property description, and your social security number to decide.”
I'm mostly kidding, OP seems to acknowledge that it's her fence.
Oh no I know you were! I liked your anticipation of the next ridiculous 4 page argument.
My response was influenced by the fact that the OP asked how to be a good neighbor rather than what her bare minimum or legal responsibility is. For me being a good neighbor means not quibbling about property lines when I know I’m at least partially responsible. And leaving a dog who’s known to be aggressive unattended and not completely secured amounts to a big portion of responsibility IMO.
I see the thread is largely still on topic... I'd be mortified my dog injured another dog so badly and would pay half. I'd also see about finding a behaviorist and work on the fence aggression issues in my dog.
It seemed like he did react but slowly because he was elderly.
Right. So if you are elderly and have slow reaction time, WTF are you walking three dogs at once?
Because at a time when he was likely younger and more able-bodied, he ended up with three dogs. We have no idea if that’s because he wanted three or if he took one of the dogs from his children because it was territorial or...there are a million reasons. And now his mobility/balance is failing him, but the dogs still need exercise. Taking each one out individually likely cannot happen because it’s three times as much walking, and not taking them out brings another host of issues. Going the other way may feel like no big deal to able-bodied people, but with limited mobility, sometimes literally every step is valued. Getting old really sucks.
If I could cover the bill comfortably, I would pay the entire amount. If not, I’d work with my neighbor to figure something out.
I would pay half. I think it keeps things neighborly, but even more so, it sounds like neither dog owner knows exactly what happened, so sharing the "blame" so to speak 50/50 seems reasonable. Fix the fence ASAP, even if you have to do a temporary fix for now until it's truly fixed.
To me, outside of who pays what in this situation, it would matter what happened first as to who is truly "to blame." If the other dog got away from its owner for a minute while he regained control and came at your dog under your fence, then I feel the other owner is responsible. If your dog first put its head under the fence and bit at the other dog on their property, I feel you are 100% responsible. But it sounds like no one truly saw what happened first, hence my suggestion of just splitting the cost.
Your fence, your dog, you pay half that bill. Or 3/4 because you were neglectful in letting a hole in your fence knowing your dog and his don't get along.
And no, he should not have to walk all the way around his house to walk his dogs. Lol. It is his driveway. Keep your fence repaired.
It seemed like he did react but slowly because he was elderly.
I am sympathetic to that but you still have to be able to control your dogs, in general, not just this situation. I think there is responsibility on both sides and I’d offer half.
I agree but I’m still not clear if his dogs did anything. She seemed to guess that they went after her dog but didn’t see it and her dog wasn’t injured at all. They could have just been walking in their own yard and then were attacked through the fence.
It seemed like he did react but slowly because he was elderly.
Right. So if you are elderly and have slow reaction time, WTF are you walking three dogs at once? Again, knowing that at least one (and it actually sounds like it's at least two) is reactive? It's not as though all of his dogs have been established to be quiet, passive and nonreactive and this is the first time they ever barked or reacted to the OPs dog. I think both parties are responsible for this.
They are in his own yard. Dogs bark. I don’t think that automatically leads to someone’s dog reaching through the fence into their own yard and attacking them.
I assume he was walking them because he had to. Perhaps he got them when he was younger and more mobile. They still need exercise. If the fence was in good repair, this wouldn’t have happened.
Right. So if you are elderly and have slow reaction time, WTF are you walking three dogs at once?
Because at a time when he was likely younger and more able-bodied, he ended up with three dogs. We have no idea if that’s because he wanted three or if he took one of the dogs from his children because it was territorial or...there are a million reasons. And now his mobility/balance is failing him, but the dogs still need exercise. Taking each one out individually likely cannot happen because it’s three times as much walking, and not taking them out brings another host of issues. Going the other way may feel like no big deal to able-bodied people, but with limited mobility, sometimes literally every step is valued. Getting old really sucks.
If I could cover the bill comfortably, I would pay the entire amount. If not, I’d work with my neighbor to figure something out.
Again, I said I am sympathetic to this guy's issues, but to a point. How he ended up with three dogs has nothing to do with this. Age and mobility are not an excuse to go out with dogs you cannot control, that's not fair to everyone else in the neighborhood. If this guy can't get the dogs up the driveway safely, what happens when he is on the actual walk and his dog darts toward another dog or a squirrel and he can't stop it? I know that getting old sucks. But there are dog walkers and doggy daycare to help. I didn't say F-the old guy, he should pay the whole bill and extra to fix the fence plus pain and suffering to OP. I said he's partially to blame and I think splitting the bill is fair.
Right. So if you are elderly and have slow reaction time, WTF are you walking three dogs at once?
Because at a time when he was likely younger and more able-bodied, he ended up with three dogs. We have no idea if that’s because he wanted three or if he took one of the dogs from his children because it was territorial or...there are a million reasons. And now his mobility/balance is failing him, but the dogs still need exercise. Taking each one out individually likely cannot happen because it’s three times as much walking, and not taking them out brings another host of issues. Going the other way may feel like no big deal to able-bodied people, but with limited mobility, sometimes literally every step is valued. Getting old really sucks.
If I could cover the bill comfortably, I would pay the entire amount. If not, I’d work with my neighbor to figure something out.
Exactly. I’m sure he’s not doing this for funsies.
For the "is it trespassing" issue, trespassing is weirdly not clear. Not that I think it applies here at all, I just thought this next part was interesting and wanted to share - We are dealing with this at work now, and a friend just dealt with an issue at her home. We have been told that in order for something to count as trespassing, the person in question must first have been told that they are not allowed on the property, which is why you often see No Trespassing signs. Without that, you can't charge something with trespassing. Some states require the specific statute to be printed on the signs.
For instance - "To be protected by law, most states require a landowner or tenant to post notice that entry onto the land is not allowed.
Often there is no specific language that needs to be conveyed, so a sign with a simple and direct message of “no trespassing allowed” or “private property no trespassing” will be enough to satisfy the law and properly notify any person attempting to enter the property."
Right. So if you are elderly and have slow reaction time, WTF are you walking three dogs at once? Again, knowing that at least one (and it actually sounds like it's at least two) is reactive? It's not as though all of his dogs have been established to be quiet, passive and nonreactive and this is the first time they ever barked or reacted to the OPs dog. I think both parties are responsible for this.
They are in his own yard. Dogs bark. I don’t think that automatically leads to someone’s dog reaching through the fence into their own yard and attacking them.
I assume he was walking them because he had to. If the fence was in good repair, this wouldn’t have happened.
Obviously we don't have an accurate picture of what really happened, but what I'm picturing is the OP's dog barking and pawing under the fence gap (on the ground). Giving a visual of his/her paws under the fence line. If I see a dog pawing or peering under a fence, I do not let my dog go directly to that fence. It's common sense and if you have control of your dog, you can pull them back. It sounds as though he didn't pull the dog back and his dog went directly to the paws of OPs dog. I'm just assuming here, but she said it looks like her dog's paw got bit first, so I'm guessing her dog has a bite or injury also.