Post by notsocreepylurker on Nov 23, 2016 21:20:53 GMT -5
I am one of the millions of people who only get their news from 1 or 2 sources (you guys & Facebook). Most of the awful stuff Trump said or did I saw on FB or here. But even then, the fact that he openly mocked a reporter living with a disability and his numbers went up showed that most people just don't care if it isn't affecting them.
Some of us were anti-Obama because of his positions, not his color. I may be firmly in the "not fucking Republican" camp now, but for some of us, we were worried about government overreach, healthcare costs, economic policy, foreign relations, etc. I'm still a huge fan of Mitt Romney. I campaigned for him in Nevada. I would've voted for him if he'd been the candidate this year, unless he acted a fool.
I realize that most of you know this, but if you really want to change hearts and minds, you can't lump everyone in the same category or you will just push everyone further to their "side." We're seeing this with President Trump. There are people that voted for him because he was the R nominee, straight up. We can wax on about allllllll the things they overlooked to do so, but the polarization is real, and broad brush assessments are just driving everyone further to their side.
To be clear, I'm not discounting the racism at play. Not at all. It's a huge factor, especially in this election. But unless there is a hard look at more than that, the voters aren't gonna come back. And looking around at the results of this election, and all the R Governors in the country, waiting for a population shift to turn the tide could be a long, painful road.
Even if you are the smartest person in the room, telling that to everyone else standing in there isn't going to get you anywhere. We have to stop talking about how it should be, and figure out how to actually get there.
I'm done with my rambling. This new 40 year old is going to go have another drink and listen to Sia's "Chandelier" until I'm 40 and a day.
Some of us were anti-Obama because of his positions, not his color. I may be firmly in the "not fucking Republican" camp now, but for some of us, we were worried about government overreach, healthcare costs, economic policy, foreign relations, etc. I'm still a huge fan of Mitt Romney. I campaigned for him in Nevada. I would've voted for him if he'd been the candidate this year, unless he acted a fool.
I realize that most of you know this, but if you really want to change hearts and minds, you can't lump everyone in the same category or you will just push everyone further to their "side." We're seeing this with President Trump. There are people that voted for him because he was the R nominee, straight up. We can wax on about allllllll the things they overlooked to do so, but the polarization is real, and broad brush assessments are just driving everyone further to their side.
To be clear, I'm not discounting the racism at play. Not at all. It's a huge factor, especially in this election. But unless there is a hard look at more than that, the voters aren't gonna come back. And looking around at the results of this election, and all the R Governors in the country, waiting for a population shift to turn the tide could be a long, painful road.
Even if you are the smartest person in the room, telling that to everyone else standing in there isn't going to get you anywhere. We have to stop talking about how it should be, and figure out how to actually get there.
I'm done with my rambling. This new 40 year old is going to go have another drink and listen to Sia's "Chandelier" until I'm 40 and a day.
13 yrs ago or so Glenn Beck was that rational voice on talk radio, at least compared to Rush, Hannity and Savage. And then he went in TV and went completely nuts.
Sure, some people were concerned about Obama's policies. And Obama hasn't been perfect.
But the people buying ammo at record rates and driving up the cost of it because they were worried he was going to take everyone's guns didn't have fears based in reality.
Sure, some people were concerned about Obama's policies. And Obama hasn't been perfect.
But the people buying ammo at record rates and driving up the cost of it because they were worried he was going to take everyone's guns didn't have fears based in reality.
Ammo was hard to get. Now, I think that was the gun lobby, taking advantage of the "guns and religion" comment to strengthen their position and market, and certainly pushing the idea that President Obama was going to take away gun rights, but the result was still "ammo shortage." Which just gave the NRA and their ilk the perfect cards to keep playing.
My point is that fears are often viewed as silly or inconceivable to those who don't have them. And yes, sometimes they are silly or inconceivable, but we're also talking about a society where vaccines are poison, 9/11 was an inside job, chemtrails, big brother tracking all of us, etc. is not far fetched to a decent percentage of Americans. And both parties have those people to some degree (although the chemtrail and 9/11 peeps are a whole 'nother level of crazycakes). And there are plenty of oportunistic people and groups that fan these flames. We could argue back and forth about what is a real threat and what is an overreaction, but it's hard to quell fear. I think if we're truly going to make progress, we have to stop being dismissive. The Steve Bannon's of the world are smart, charismatic, calculating people, who see these opportunities and capitalize on them. We can't let people like him get a stronger foothold. Who are people going to listen to? Someone who tells them that their fears have merit? Or someone who patronizes them?
Some of us were anti-Obama because of his positions, not his color. I may be firmly in the "not fucking Republican" camp now, but for some of us, we were worried about government overreach, healthcare costs, economic policy, foreign relations, etc. I'm still a huge fan of Mitt Romney. I campaigned for him in Nevada. I would've voted for him if he'd been the candidate this year, unless he acted a fool.
I realize that most of you know this, but if you really want to change hearts and minds, you can't lump everyone in the same category or you will just push everyone further to their "side." We're seeing this with President Trump. There are people that voted for him because he was the R nominee, straight up. We can wax on about allllllll the things they overlooked to do so, but the polarization is real, and broad brush assessments are just driving everyone further to their side.
To be clear, I'm not discounting the racism at play. Not at all. It's a huge factor, especially in this election. But unless there is a hard look at more than that, the voters aren't gonna come back. And looking around at the results of this election, and all the R Governors in the country, waiting for a population shift to turn the tide could be a long, painful road.
Even if you are the smartest person in the room, telling that to everyone else standing in there isn't going to get you anywhere. We have to stop talking about how it should be, and figure out how to actually get there.
I'm done with my rambling. This new 40 year old is going to go have another drink and listen to Sia's "Chandelier" until I'm 40 and a day.
I'd like to add that polarization/the blind party loyalty happens on the D side, too. Nobody complains about it when it benefits them.
When I was out canvassing, we started out by asking if people planned to support HRC and if yes, then we asked about senate, congress and then local races (the state-level reps had their own, separate canvassing apart from the D office I worked with). I can't tell you how many times people looked at me like I had two heads when I *didn't* just assume that they would vote straight-ticket. Usually instead of actually recognizing the candidate's name I was asking about, they'd say something like, "Oh, I'm a Democrat!" with the tone of, duh, that means all the way down the ballot!
Some (too many) people are going to be so intent on making the other side agree with their side. It feels like people want the other side to admit they are wrong more than they want things to change. I feel like there have been so many posts here of liberals trying to get conservatives to admit that they are wrong. Like the post about what is the biggest concern to you politically. Any con response was criticized. Being right is not the most important thing.
I have to say the talk show host I was listening to sounded really reasonable. He wasn't inflammatory like a Hannity or oreilly. So if people are tuning into those calmer individuals I can see how those who voted for trump don't feel like it was a vote for hate. Also the surprise of a trump win helps bolster their views that the left-leaning media is biased and unwilling to do well-rounded coverage. I don't agree, however it is not far-fetched in comparison to some of the arguments we traditionally hear.
do you ever listen to WBAL? (I am remembering that you're in PG, yes?)
MH does, so I end up hearing it often. Not that those guys are all typical talk radio.
I used to daily when I drove to work, but not anymore. It has been years. I remember sending @iamalcolmx messages about some mess Hannity was saying back then. That is when Rush seemed to have a cooler head.
Some (too many) people arie going to be so intent on making the other side agree with their side. It feels like people want the other side to admit they are wrong more than they want things to change. I feel like there have been so many posts here of liberals trying to get conservatives to admit that they are wrong. Like the post about what is the biggest concern to you politically. Any con response was criticized. Being right is not the most important thing.
I used to say - you can be right or you can find a solution because it did feel like people cared more about being right than actually fixing something. I don't say it much anymore because it became clear that elected Rs weren't going to bend on shit so it wasn't worth a debate with others about meeting in the middle. But it also applies to elected Rs. They continuously dig their heels in and say - no only this. Which is fucking ridiculous.