SOS - and a request for advice

[akafred]

My H calls me every morning, and like far too many mornings he complained about DD not getting ready for school easily. Mornings are all on him; I am almost always gone before she gets up. When I WFH, I build in some time to help get her ready, but that is rare. I don't agree with his methods of getting her ready. He lets her "warm up" by sitting on the couch with an iPad and not really eat her breakfast, then yells at her to eat over and over. (I admit this is a pattern I engage in at times also that needs to stop; I think we've been so sonditioned to the idea that DD's issues get worse when she has low blood sugar/not enough protein that we are afraid to let the natural consequence kick in sometimes, but he probably does this more than I do). Meanwhile in an effort to "save time", he goes upstairs and brings down clothes for her. He usually has to make several trip. Occasionally he has to tear her room apart because of one elusive item. Today he ended up giving in to her wearing the shorts she wore playing hockey on Saturday which I'm sure were sweat soaked and nasty, but it won't kill her. I try to stay out of it. I have made suggestions, which he mostly ignores and seems to get angry about. I have tried problem solving with DD. I have tried having her pick out clothes the night before, or even sleep in her clothes, but she always changes her mind in the morning and the pattern re-emerges. And then he is bitter and sullen when he calls me, and I don't know what I'm supposed to do. I've asked how I can help. I've empathized until I can empathize no more. I've offered suggestions, which he argues with. I tried having a family meeting about it but they both were pissy about it. So I try to stay out of it. But it drives me crazy that saying, "Wow, that's rough, I'm sorry that happened" isn't remotely helpful.

That was the SOS. Now for the advice. DH brought up a good point that most of the summer camps have bus pickups requiring him to get out the door earlier. For the most part clothes won't be an issue, since at least half the camps have the kids go to camp in swimsuits and change later, and I can just pack the backpack for her, and she has fewer swimsuits so choosing will be easier. But what about breakfast? The best possible solution IMO is NO iPad, breakfast in the car. Which she'll have no choice but to do the week I am taking her to camp across town, but that is not every week. I need ideas for healthy-ish, highish protein foods that don't require cooking that day and are easily eaten in a car. I'm thinking like higher protein muffins, squeeze pouches of yogurt, some kind of protein bar? What else?

[mustardseed2007]

How about those P3 packs? Or even a lunchable. I know it's not a breakfast food but it has protein in it. Who says you have to eat breakfast foods for breakfast?

Also, a box or single-sized small bottle of milk.


ETA: Premade protein smoothie?

[phdmomma]

Trail mix (if she's not allergic to nuts), string cheese, hardboiled eggs that you boiled the day before (I make several days worth at a time for DD), nut butter of some sort as a sandwich (obviously my kids have a thing for nuts),.... I wouldn't worry about it being a "breakfast food", as long as they eat food, I don't worry too much.

[CrazyLucky]

For the mornings, I have few suggestions because I've dealt with some of the same issues. I have the luxury of having breakfast served at school though, so if mine don't eat, too bad, they can eat whatever is at school. How old is she? We had the same issue of DD changing her mind when she had chosen clothes the night before. What we let her do is choose two outfits the night before and she has to pick one of them. That way she still feels like she has a choice in the morning. It also allows us to get the frantic search for the teal ponytail holder out of the way the night before. No screen time until they are completely ready for school. None. DD can take 30+ minutes to eat a bowl of cereal. Set a timer. When the timer goes off, breakfast is over. I know these may seem harsh, but we were getting to the point where I was late to work because DD was making us late for the bus, and then I had to drop them at school.

For breakfast - bagels with PB, granola bars, easily transportable fruit, like blueberries. Yogurt parfait.

[akafred]

CrazyLucky, she is about to turn 9 in a few weeks.

I agree with you completely about your methods. My problem is that i can't make DH do it. When I suggest it, he acts pissy. Today he turned the internet off to get her off the iPad. Not sure why he didn't just take it away, but good for him. He threatened to take her to school in her pajamas. I think that is great. I wish he would follow through. I know he doesn't want to rock the boat, and I do that too especially when DD's anxiety is high and *everything* causes a meltdown, but at least when she is regulated, the natural consequences route could be really effective and helpful.

mustardseed2007, what are P3 packs?

[callmekd]

my DD eats breakfast in the car several times a week (if I'm doing her drop off). she eats while I bring her siblings to daycare. we do a lot of PBJs or PBJ on english muffins. yogurt, cheese, etc.

we also pick out her clothes the night before.

can your H use the iPad as a reward or incentive for getting dressed and eating breakfast first? (i.e. she to have all of her morning things done by a certain time and then she has X amount of minutes to use the iPad before they leave).

[akafred]

I'm not saying al of you guys' ideas on how to get her ready in the mornings iaren't great ideas, but I already know he won't really listen. I'm better off getting advice on how I can deal with him vs how he can deal with her. Won't happen.

[k3am]

akafred depending on how picky she is, you can make anything into muffin form. DD's favorites (that she won't eat anymore) that I loved were quinoa bites - quinoa, diced veggies, egg, and cheese. Pop into a muffin pan, bake, and then freeze. Those would meet your high protein criteria, be easy enough to eat in the car and you can prep a big batch in advance. If she doesn't like quinoa, just do the eggs.

We can't do TV/kindle in the morning. It just causes issues. Since it's something we almost always avoid in the mornings, she knows that if she's 100% ready to go before DH is ready to leave the house, she can watch a show or play on it until he's ready to go. Some days this is really motivating for her, sometimes not.

I would stop answering the phone when he calls you. You know it's not an emergency. (Unless you're calling him repeatedly when you're on duty to vent and expecting him to answer... then you should expect to get the same behavior.)

[mommyatty]

Jimmy Dean makes individual microwave frittatas. They are awesome on an English muffin with a slice of ham and/or cheese. Or you can make your own frittatas on the weekend and heat in the microwave. The Jimmy Dean ones heat in 90 seconds.

Hard boiled eggs are a hit with my kids, as is precooked turkey bacon.

As for DH, man that’s rough. Have you considered just asking when he calls “Do you need something or are you just calling to complain about how your methods aren’t working in the morning?” I have zero sympathy for folks who just want to complain. I’ve had to resort to this twice with DH on parenting matters twice. It seems like your DH is treating this as though DD is your kid that he’s graciously helping with and he wants you to know what an imposition it is for him. She’s his daughter too and he bears equal responsibility for figuring this stuff out. You can encourage him to change things up until he finds a good formula that works for them, but beyond that, I think all you can do is quit being his dumping ground.

I will also say that once I shrugged and quit listening, DH found some strategies I never would have thought of that are genius. One is that DS won’t get out of bed in the mornings. DH uses a stuffed animal, who challenges DS to race to the potty. That kid is out of bed and to the toilet in under 10 seconds. Another is he threatens to play the Clean Up Robot song. The kids hate that song, so they start madly cleaning up their toys as soon as he threatens it. So your DH can totally do this if he puts on his big boy underwear.

[covergirl82]

There is a company called Birch Benders that makes pancake mixes, one of which is a protein mix. I buy that and the regular organic mix and use a 1:1 ratio for making pancakes. (I also add about a little milled flax for even more protein.) You/your H could make those ahead and then your H could warm them up in the microwave right before he and DD leave.

Also:
-drinkable yogurt (you could add protein powder)
-muffin-pan omelets
-protein milk (I think the brand I buy is TruMoo, but I've recently seen a plant-based vegan one at my grocery store)

[186momx]

P3 are DD new favorite. It is a meat, cheese, almond or pretzel lunchable basically.

I made these egg muffins ahead of time. Freeze individually pop in the microwave for less than a minute and then wrap into a tortilla for instant breakfast burrito. DD loved them until DH served it to her ice cold now she won't touch them.

When he calls tell him you don't want to listen to him whine about the morning since he won't try any of your suggestions or change the routine you can't keep listening to him whine about it. Now giving you updates on she ate 3 eggs and a peanut butter toast is different.

FYI we constantly tell DD to eat. She is super slow and loves to talk and eat but not all meal times can last an hour or more.

[mellym]

Most of the time DD1 eats a granola bar or toast for breakfast on the way out the door.

We don't allow any screen time before school, house rules. *If* DD1 is ready early with time to spare, she can play with her toys. It has only happened a handful of times this school year. Make it a rule that she doesn't get the iPad in the morning (assuming your DH will follow through?

[mustardseed2007]

akafred, Oscar Mayer makes them. They have cheese, nuts and cubes of meat.

www.amazon.com/P3-Portable-Protein-Pack-2OZ/dp/B00KO9IL26

[xctsclrx]

I agree with mommyatty , stop taking the phone calls, or say something like "I'm sorry that sucks, but you aren't interested in my help" Definition of insanity and all that.

No advice on the breakfast. We do a peanut butter (eggo) waffle in the morning with DS for a quick breakfast

[akafred]

Oh I guess I worded that wrong about the phone call. We have a standing phone call when he drops her off. It started just as one of those things you do to make sure she didn't get left in the car or something like that. That sounds awful; I don't want to make it sound like he would leave her in the car. But it was one of those precautions like putting your purse in the back seat or putting a teddy bear in the passenger seat. A mental check, if you will. And it totally worked in reverse on those rare occasions that o took her to daycare, because *that* is when tragedy strikes, when someone does something out of their routine. Anyway, the purpose of the call evolved into just a call to touch base. We work different shifts and rarely see each other at night or I am tired if we do, and I only just wake him up in the mornings. The call allows us to talk about our to do lists and sync up on some things. But when he has had a really bad morning, he vents and he vents hard. At that point I can't politely hang up on his shenanigans, so I am stuck.

In general I think he's going through a rough time right now. There could be some depression going on. He seems sullen and hates the world. It's frustrating because I have my own mental health issues (anxiety) and even when he has rough mornings, I still get the brunt of DD's mental health issues (anxiety, ADHD, possibly OCD). Right now she is better than she has ever been and I want to just enjoy that, but meanwhile I have Oscar the Grouch calling me to complain about stuff he's not making an effort to fix.

[akafred]

mommyatty, I don't think he treats the situationike DD is my kid and he is doing me favors necessarily. Or, I don't think he thinks of it that way even if he kind of does. IDK. We are in this place where I do all the research, I ask him for input, he provides none, I make a decision, and he acts like it was a bad decision or like it results in a huge imposition to him. I literally make all the decisions and then they both treat it like I never make the right decision. Which makes me angry and resentful. Which I know is at least partially if not mostly my own anxiety and depression talking. Which I am really working on this year.

I guess it is accurate that he treats her like my kid. But he doesn't act like he's doing me a favor. He just acts mad when "my" decisions don't always work perfectly.

[2chatter]

I flat out tell DH that if he doesn’t take my suggestions he doesn’t get to complain. When I travel for work he will call me freaking out about things like where are DS’ shoes and this is how it sounds “did you put his shoes where they go last night, if you didn’t make him do it before he went to bed? I can’t help you if you won’t do things that help you. So what’s the dinner plan for Thursday night?”

DH and I also do better if we don’t constantly talk through the minutiae, so maybe consider cutting the call back to every other day. He travels FT and isn’t even in the same state, but I don’t need to get drowned in details daily - some weeks we don’t talk more than once before he’s home again. It means we talk when we need to, or when we want to, but we don’t have their weighty obligatory talk that inevitably revolves into a laundry list of stressors. You might consider if the call helps or hurts things. I prefer text and email.

[akafred]

When it started I enjoyed talking to him. Now? Not so much. I really want to get to a better place with him but I don't know how and I can't do it alone even if I did. And he is against therapy. But I am good with cutting the call back; probably a good idea. We already handle a lot of stuff by text.

[2chatter]

I find DH way less annoying when I don’t have to deal with him being annoying as much. So the calls are one example, another is yard work. He wants to do it and I don’t, but the issue was he wouldn’t stop until it was dark. So now we text on Fridays and he picks his projects and we determine the parameters, like he’s on his own in the yard until noon, then we all eat lunch. Agreeing in advance of hot buttons has way way helped. It’s that expectation thing - unmet expectations really are killer. Are there any things like that you can do? He doesn’t even have to buy in - you just have to work with him.

[akafred]

I typed out a whole long reply that really solidified for me that this is his issue (depression), not mine. And just like I am trying to step away from DD's issues because it is her journey, I need to step away from this. It's not my responsibility to make either of them happy. I just wish they didn't think it was their obligation to make me sad lol.

[xctsclrx]

akafred, have you had an honest conversation about how you are feeling with him? Your DD is a different situation, but your DH should be a partner, not someone who tears you down.

It sounds like (without really knowing) is that he is taking out all of his stress on you, and then you are internalizing it as it is your fault? Maybe he is just venting to you not looking for you to fix it? I am not sure. Either way when you have hit your limit disengage from him. Be honest and tell him what you are feeling in the moment.

If your DD didn't have the anxiety issues that she has I might have advice, but I really don't know how to parent a kid with anxiety like she does along with the brattiness that goes with being a kid.

My kid: When he is getting nasty I tell him I don't want to hang out with people who are mean, go to your room until you can be nice. I just don't think that would work with your DD without doing more damage there.

[campermom]

As for breakfasts Inhave a slew of options that I keep handy for days the kids eat at daycare. I have a mix of carbs, dairy, fruit.

Breakfast bars, breakfast biscuits, packs of muffins, fruit cups, fruit pouches, fresh fruit, danimals, yogurts pouches or yogurt tubes, and oatmealbthat I microwave at daycare.
When we have more time at home, they like cereal, frozen waffles or leftover pankcakes that we put in the feeezer and microwave.

I’m down with all of your suggestions about things your H can do to make mornings more smooth but stuck at the phone call. You said it yourself, he won’t listen to you. But he gets to vent to you. So what is he getting out of that interaction and what reinforces him to keep doing it? Sometimes when I frame things like that it helps me find how to break the cycle or sway it in a different direction. What would happen if you could no longer take the calls? Or respond to a text right away?

[2chatter]

Oh and breakfast! I meant to say this earlier but got hungry thinking about it...so went and made popcorn.

I keep biscuits and country ham on hand for mobile breakfasts. Red eye gravy as a treat. My kids maddeningly only eat the ham, but will not eat it if I offer them ham only. “Want ham biscuits” gets a yes and they leave the biscuits in the car. It’s the protein I want them to eat so...

For frozen Tennessee Pride chicken and biscuits get the same treatment.

[waverly]

akafred , My DH can on occasion sound similar. He has a history of depression and anger from external things in his life not going the way he wanted or he was screwed over like that one job that fired him. They fired almost everyone, so it wasn't just him.

He has had depression for two years and was very against therapy. I used to help him sort through his feelings, but now I am alone while he travels doing everything (I feel like- might not be accurate) while he is gone. I have to take care of two small children and one with special needs that requires that I take time off from work for all of the doctor appointments. I just can't be in charge of his fragile mental health also.

I had a series of conversations with him, but one of them was definitely the come to Jesus talk where I basically said if he wouldn't get help and therapy and medication were the two most common help for depression then I guess he wants to be and is choosing to be depressed. The other conversation I had for several months was just that I wasn't going to be his therapist and setting those boundaries.

He was against therapy for like 20 years, and he finally went. I was amazed. He does have some anger that I pushed him but its like the depression fueled anger or talking about the depression. So we decided we won't talk about his recovery for now. Other things came up too where he quit and then re-started therapy, but he worked through it. He is really trying and seems happier.

At a minimum, I think decreasing the calls or the amount of time that you can listen to his complaining.

For breakfast, I have nothing because I don't seem as food savy as many of the other posters. Just protein bars or yogurt shakes/ protein shakes is all I can really think of.

[akafred]

May 8, 2018 16:21:16 GMT -5 campermom said:

I’m down with all of your suggestions about things your H can do to make mornings more smooth but stuck at the phone call. You said it yourself, he won’t listen to you. But he gets to vent to you. So what is he getting out of that interaction and what reinforces him to keep doing it? Sometimes when I frame things like that it helps me find how to break the cycle or sway it in a different direction. What would happen if you could no longer take the calls? Or respond to a text right away?

That is a very intriguing question. I honestly don't know what he is getting out of it. I'm obv not solving his problems. I offer some empathy and understanding, but honestly not a ton because it just gets frustrating for me because it just seems to fester. Sometimes he gets anger or resentment back from me if he pushes the right buttons or if I am just done. Nothing particularly positive.

[sdlaura]

My only practical advice is to have her sleep in her clothes - then again, my kids are younger so their clothes may be more comfortable. That takes the selecting clothes and actually getting them on out of the equation. If you are going to allow morning screen time, I wouldn’t let her have it until after she’s dressed and eaten something. Then she gets it if she does those things.

My morning bottleneck is sunscreen. Can’t really do it the night before and I can’t get dressed until it’s done. No way of getting around it daily though with three very fair-skinned kids in San Diego, though.

[akafred]

Well, she picked out her clothes last night and I laid out a breakfast she can eat in the car if necessary. If it's anything like the past, she will change her mind about the clothes as he will let her, and she'll fester on the couch with the breakfast sitting in front of her but not being eaten. Meanwhile I will get resentful that not only am I cooking dinner and making her lunches, I now have to prepare and curate breakfast.

[phdmomma]

akafred, I would feel resentful too......although I also echo the folks who say that maybe skipping the morning venting call would be a good thing.

[waverly]

You can't do everything for everyone. If he isn't willing to change and keeps complaining... I don't know its super hard, but I might be inclined to let them fail and stop listening to the complaints.

I might throw an extra protein bar in her lunch box for a morning snack and call it a day. I don't see why you have to curate breakfast. Buy more protein breakfast stuff for sure, but if there are protein bars in the cupboard how hard is it for him to get them out for her or for her to get them out herself. She can eat them at home, in the car, on the bus or at camp.


DD is not hungry in the morning, so every morning it is a struggle to get her to eat anything. But we don't allow TV in the morning. They don't know my iPad password so iPad isn't an issue. I did away with TV in the morning about 1.5 years ago, and it has been worth it.

[k3am]

May 9, 2018 6:04:56 GMT -5 akafred said:

Well, she picked out her clothes last night and I laid out a breakfast she can eat in the car if necessary. If it's anything like the past, she will change her mind about the clothes as he will let her, and she'll fester on the couch with the breakfast sitting in front of her but not being eaten. Meanwhile I will get resentful that not only am I cooking dinner and making her lunches, I now have to prepare and curate breakfast.

Then stop. There's no reason for you to make breakfast. YH is a grown man, if mornings are his gig, he can make breakfast. He can help her pick out clothes. You don't have to do it for him. 

I struggle with this also and STILL feel guilty when I leave early and don't help the kids finish getting ready and into the car. But then I remind myself... mornings are HIS gig. I get the tantrums and attitude at night.