Is your priority not to get Trump out of office, whatever it takes? If so, why *wouldn't* you listen to the people who previously voted for him who are now looking for an alternative? I said this in another thread, but it isn't just about the four years of the next term. I don't think Ginsburg will survive another administration, and we certainly don't need to lose yet another Supreme Court seat to the GOP.
And then we are stuck with someone who will likely not actual get the votes from these people, and who will also not inspire confidence or excitement from people on the D side. So...we lose again.
Like.....the current frontrunner that almost everyone here loves but is DEFINITELY not going to get those votes and probably can't generate the turnout needed either?
And then we are stuck with someone who will likely not actual get the votes from these people, and who will also not inspire confidence or excitement from people on the D side. So...we lose again.
Like.....the current frontrunner that almost everyone here loves but is DEFINITELY not going to get those votes and probably can't generate the turnout needed either?
Okay. So, in your wisdom who do we vote for in the primary? Who of the candidates appeals to 1. The base, such that there will be super high D turnout, and 2. A critical number of conservative folks who plainly don't understand how government actually works and are racist, either overtly or not, and thus voted for 45?
Post by miniroller on Oct 18, 2019 19:26:26 GMT -5
Just to make it clear: I’m FULL ON Kamala. My only reason for bringing up Trump voters is that 2 of the six said acquaintances have led me to very much believe they’ve almost definitely turned (KH).
I didn’t at all mean to turn a thread about the horrible disproportionate lessening of her face/ voice in MSM into turning 45-voters. Gah- that that’s what has happened. My apologies.
Like.....the current frontrunner that almost everyone here loves but is DEFINITELY not going to get those votes and probably can't generate the turnout needed either?
Okay. So, in your wisdom who do we vote for in the primary? Who of the candidates appeals to 1. The base, such that there will be super high D turnout, and 2. A critical number of conservative folks who plainly don't understand how government actually works and are racist, either overtly or not, and thus voted for 45?
Biden. He's the only one of the candidates that has good numbers for the white men who voted for Trump in the rust belt states, and a sizeable amount of the African American vote.
I don't want him, no one here wants him, but this has been shown repeatedly since before he even entered the race. None of our candidates are going to excite the base to turn out in numbers like they did for Obama, we'll have a repeat of 2016 where tons of people just stayed home. He's better than Trump.
Look, I'm sure a ton of former Trump voters are just looking for another excuse to vote for him. They might say they're open to Biden or whoever at this point, but when it comes down to it, a fair number will decide that the Iraq war vote disqualifies Biden or some other random reason ("don't want to put liberals on the court, so guess I'll pull the lever for Trump again!").
It's crazy to let these so called swing voters choose the Dem nominee. The ones who really see Trump as a train wreck will vote for any Dem, and the ones who secretly want to vote Trump will find any excuse.
Okay. So, in your wisdom who do we vote for in the primary? Who of the candidates appeals to 1. The base, such that there will be super high D turnout, and 2. A critical number of conservative folks who plainly don't understand how government actually works and are racist, either overtly or not, and thus voted for 45?
Biden. He's the only one of the candidates that has good numbers for the white men who voted for Trump in the rust belt states, and a sizeable amount of the African American vote.
I don't want him, no one here wants him, but this has been shown repeatedly since before he even entered the race. None of our candidates are going to excite the base to turn out in numbers like they did for Obama, we'll have a repeat of 2016 where tons of people just stayed home. He's better than Trump.
You think Biden excites the base? Enough to surpass 2016 voting levels? Really?
Look, I'm sure a ton of former Trump voters are just looking for another excuse to vote for him. They might say they're open to Biden or whoever at this point, but when it comes down to it, a fair number will decide that the Iraq war vote disqualifies Biden or some other random reason ("don't want to put liberals on the court, so guess I'll pull the lever for Trump again!").
It's crazy to let these so called swing voters choose the Dem nominee. The ones who really see Trump as a train wreck will vote for any Dem, and the ones who secretly want to vote Trump will find any excuse.
And what about the Democratic African American contingency? They'll turn out to vote for Biden in a general, but if he's not the nominee, most/a large number of them won't vote at all. It isn't just about swing voters.
Biden. He's the only one of the candidates that has good numbers for the white men who voted for Trump in the rust belt states, and a sizeable amount of the African American vote.
I don't want him, no one here wants him, but this has been shown repeatedly since before he even entered the race. None of our candidates are going to excite the base to turn out in numbers like they did for Obama, we'll have a repeat of 2016 where tons of people just stayed home. He's better than Trump.
You think Biden excites the base? Enough to surpass 2016 voting levels? Really?
I'm sorry, but I find it quite laughable for anyone to argue that there is a significant number of "former" Trump voters who will instead vote for a strong, black woman.
A handful, sure. But, there is no way that the number would be be anything more than a blip.
Look, I'm sure a ton of former Trump voters are just looking for another excuse to vote for him. They might say they're open to Biden or whoever at this point, but when it comes down to it, a fair number will decide that the Iraq war vote disqualifies Biden or some other random reason ("don't want to put liberals on the court, so guess I'll pull the lever for Trump again!").
It's crazy to let these so called swing voters choose the Dem nominee. The ones who really see Trump as a train wreck will vote for any Dem, and the ones who secretly want to vote Trump will find any excuse.
And what about the Democratic African American contingency? They'll turn out to vote for Biden in a general, but if he's not the nominee, most/a large number of them won't vote at all. It isn't just about swing voters.
What? Since when did we have a hard time getting AA's to get out and vote?
I'm sorry, but I find it quite laughable for anyone to argue that there is a significant number of "former" Trump voters who will instead vote for a strong, black woman.
A handful, sure. But, there is no way that the number would be be anything more than a blip.
Agreed. I know- it seems unbelievable. Five of the six to which I referred are elem/ middle school teachers, which certainly plays a part. (Gun rights/ safety/ school shootings)
Look, I'm sure a ton of former Trump voters are just looking for another excuse to vote for him. They might say they're open to Biden or whoever at this point, but when it comes down to it, a fair number will decide that the Iraq war vote disqualifies Biden or some other random reason ("don't want to put liberals on the court, so guess I'll pull the lever for Trump again!").
It's crazy to let these so called swing voters choose the Dem nominee. The ones who really see Trump as a train wreck will vote for any Dem, and the ones who secretly want to vote Trump will find any excuse.
And what about the Democratic African American contingency? They'll turn out to vote for Biden in a general, but if he's not the nominee, most/a large number of them won't vote at all. It isn't just about swing voters.
At this point in the 2008 Dem nomination, you could make a similar argument about Hillary Clinton, who had an overwhelming percentage of black voters compared to Obama.
Do you really think black voters will come out for Biden more than Harris?
And what about the Democratic African American contingency? They'll turn out to vote for Biden in a general, but if he's not the nominee, most/a large number of them won't vote at all. It isn't just about swing voters.
At this point in the 2008 Dem nomination, you could make a similar argument about Hillary Clinton, who had an overwhelming percentage of black voters compared to Obama.
Do you really think black voters will come out for Biden more than Harris?
I don't think there's a remote chance Harris will get the nomination.
Biden. He's the only one of the candidates that has good numbers for the white men who voted for Trump in the rust belt states, and a sizeable amount of the African American vote.
I don't want him, no one here wants him, but this has been shown repeatedly since before he even entered the race. None of our candidates are going to excite the base to turn out in numbers like they did for Obama, we'll have a repeat of 2016 where tons of people just stayed home. He's better than Trump.
You think Biden excites the base? Enough to surpass 2016 voting levels? Really?
I don't hate the guy. But come ON.
People have a short memory Anita Hill people Biden is problematic at best
Post by One Girl In All The World on Oct 18, 2019 22:35:35 GMT -5
Jesus are we arguing about Biden and the electability myth again? It's a primary. Vote for whoever you want. Don't vote according to what might bring voters out later.
Post by secretlyevil on Oct 19, 2019 6:43:56 GMT -5
I just did an entire presentation on influencing and a strong tactic that seems to particularly play out in the political arena and this article acknowledges it is agenda setting. We have got to wake up and stop letting the media dictate the election. Money is a big element of agenda setting for politics. Gross but true. I shared this article on FB after reading it the first. I also donated to KH. The later is passive, my mom appreciates the article’s message and it gave her pause. Do I think many more actually read the letter? Probably not. Donating is something I can do to actively tell those trying to set the agenda that I am not here for it. I can also share KH’a policy stances, etc with anyone who will listen IRL.
Quit talking about Biden in a thread specific about the erasure of KH. (Or what heyjude said).
Good article! I think if I had to vote today, I would vote for Kamala Harris. I don’t think there is some magical candidate that will attract Trump defectors. I just hope those Republicans sick of his personality will stay home.
I think we have a large “Anybody-but-Trump” base that we didn’t have last time, because the base was cocky and never viewed him as a true threat. I truly believe people will come out for any candidate opposing Trump. What we don’t need is an “anyone-but” candidate opposing Trump, like Hillary Clinton was, that forces those who don’t really support Trump, but will never vote off party to go vote. I think Warren, Biden and Sanders are those candidates.
( I am mentioning other candidates, to say how they fare poorly to Kamala Harris. Not to bring the discussion back to them)
WTF are we talking about Biden in an article about the erasure of Kamala?!
As I said in the other thread on this topic, the ONLY reason people think Biden is more “electable” than Harris is because he’s an old white guy. With Warren, people talk about how she’s too far left, but with Harris no one talks about all the work she’s done as AG in California (don’t conservatives love tough-on-crime prosecutors?!?), it’s just — white men are turned off by her. And ... why? Because she’s a black woman.
So our strategy for 2020 is ... to pander to sexists and racists. Umm, I think Trump already has that corner of the market covered. And add me to the list of the people who think when push comes to shove, sexists and racists will quietly push the button for Trump anyway.
Post by mrsukyankee on Oct 19, 2019 11:10:29 GMT -5
I just had a white female friend on FB who stated that she won't vote for Kamala in the primary because she reminds her of Californians who think anyone who lives/grew up outside the state is a barbarian (I take this with a grain of salt as her experience in CA was not good). She stated that she thinks Kamala would not be a uniting force (where have I heard that before) and while she understands her role as an AG, it leaves her with a bad taste in her mouth.