COVID week of June 22nd

[winecat]

I remember blood types being discussed as a possible reason why some people get more severe symptoms than others.  The general consensus from medical types here was that it wasn't anything conclusive, I believe.  (Someone correct me if I'm wrong.)  

This article was published the end of last week: www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2020283?  

There's a whole lot of science going on that I don't understand.  But it seems like they might have found new info that buoys the blood type being a risk factor?  I'm hoping that people here can read and interpret it for those of us who need it.   

[rubytue]

Fascinating! I wish I understood more than I do, but once they go from clinical trial protocols and statistics to biologist basis if theories, I’m out. Kinda want to ask my hematologist buddy.

[meganew]

I follow an infectious disease researcher on Instagram (her handle is kinggutterbaby- don’t let the name throw you, lol) and she broke down this research and said it does show the chance that type A might be more susceptible to catching Covid, but that it doesn’t show a correlation between blood type and severity of symptoms.

[winecat]

meganew- Recently? Her most recent post was about a week ago.

rubytue- I thought so too.

[klee23]

My Pittsburgh adjacent county was never a hot spot and the county reopened June 5th. There was a lot of mY RiGhTs commentary just prior, including local police stating they won't enforce nonessential businesses opening early and a township commissioner saying "go big or go home"🙄 at a meeting (to set the scene).

Early June my area had 4 cases/100,000. This past 7 day average is now 20/100,000. The majority of these cases are servers in the area. 3 restaurants have posted that multiple servers have tested positive and will be closed in the interim. A 4th restaurant closed when they found out some of their staff was out drinking with the known + cases (they cleaned and mandated that all employees be tested if they want to return to work). All of this played out if the restaurants FB pages... a bit messy

[frlcb]

Jun 22, 2020 18:16:34 GMT -5 winecat said:

meganew - Recently? Her most recent post was about a week ago.

rubytue - I thought so too.

She does instagram stories often during the week. She is awesome and breaks down tons of info.

[cville]

My baby cousin (she's 23) posted an insta story of her at some beach bar on the dancefloor on Saturday night.

OH MY GOD WILL PEOPLE JUST STOP BEING IDIOTS?

I sent her "where is your mask?" No reply.

[underwaterrhymes]

Jun 22, 2020 18:39:13 GMT -5 cville said:

My baby cousin (she's 23) posted an insta story of her at some beach bar on the dancefloor on Saturday night.

OH MY GOD WILL PEOPLE JUST STOP BEING IDIOTS?

I sent her "where is your mask?" No reply.

I’m liking out of solidarity.

I feel like I’m on a different planet than some people I see posting on social media. I’m just gobsmacked.

[cville]

Jun 22, 2020 19:02:02 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

Jun 22, 2020 18:39:13 GMT -5 cville said:

My baby cousin (she's 23) posted an insta story of her at some beach bar on the dancefloor on Saturday night.

OH MY GOD WILL PEOPLE JUST STOP BEING IDIOTS?

I sent her "where is your mask?" No reply.

I’m liking out of solidarity.

I feel like I’m on a different planet than some people I see posting on social media. I’m just gobsmacked.

Yes. She's young and invincible. Apparently.

Also, doing that insta perspective from way high to get her best angles. Less about showing your cleavage to its best advantage, more about AVOIDING A FUCKING PANDEMIC.

[litebright]

Jun 22, 2020 17:41:04 GMT -5 winecat said:

I remember blood types being discussed as a possible reason why some people get more severe symptoms than others.  The general consensus from medical types here was that it wasn't anything conclusive, I believe.  (Someone correct me if I'm wrong.)  

This article was published the end of last week: www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2020283?  

There's a whole lot of science going on that I don't understand.  But it seems like they might have found new info that buoys the blood type being a risk factor?  I'm hoping that people here can read and interpret it for those of us who need it.   

So I thought this part was relevant: "In the meta-analysis corrected for age and sex, we found a higher risk among persons with blood group A than among patients with other blood groups ... and a protective effect for blood group O as compared with the other blood groups."

Here's a US News story on the report: "Now a team of European researchers have found that people with blood type A had a 45% higher risk of catching coronavirus and developing "COVID-19 with respiratory failure," compared to people with other blood types. On the other hand, people with type O blood had a 35% lower risk for this more serious form of COVID-19."

www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2020-06-18/blood-type-genetics-could-impact-odds-for-severe-covid-19-study

I think the NYT story that I posted a few weeks ago was about the same study (they talked to one of the guys listed as a co-author on that NEJM link) but at the time, the paper was still going through peer review before being published. 

www.nytimes.com/2020/06/03/health/coronavirus-blood-type-genetics.html

[basilosaurus]

Jun 22, 2020 17:41:04 GMT -5 winecat said:

I remember blood types being discussed as a possible reason why some people get more severe symptoms than others.  The general consensus from medical types here was that it wasn't anything conclusive, I believe.  (Someone correct me if I'm wrong.)  

This article was published the end of last week: www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2020283?  

There's a whole lot of science going on that I don't understand.  But it seems like they might have found new info that buoys the blood type being a risk factor?  I'm hoping that people here can read and interpret it for those of us who need it.   

I read the discussion. There are 2 things they did. One was just flat out genetic comparisons when they found statistically significant differences in one section of a chromosome that has various genes likely to have some sort of impact on susceptibility, immune response particularly with cytokines. But they also mentioned sars cov2, so I'd have to read and reread to parse for more specifics as it seemed like they were reporting results from both viruses. Basically I read it as, oh, this is interesting. It might be clinically significant but we're not drawing conclusions at this time. It's really reading as a way to narrow down future areas of focus.

For ABO I don't think they hypothesized a mechanism of action. On my first read through it seems like they set up potential for bias that weighs toward o type being more likely to be blood donors? I got a bit confused there.

Given ther novelty and how much data they had to analyze it's pretty cool. But the results seem so preliminary and not anywhere near clinically applicable. That doesn't make for a good click bait headline, though.

Im way out of practice with reading these things, but I did at least understand nearly all the sciency and medical words and methodology

Does that make it clear as mud?

[basilosaurus]

litebright, yes. They found a different proportion of various blood types in severe cases from what would be expected based on control groups.

BUT, and it's a big but, what does it mean? Why? And can it lead to any clinical application? Those are all unanswered. IRS not like I'd say, well, you're 64, and she's 66, and we see a difference in the >65 and <65 groups, so 64, go get your party on and 66 stay home in a plastic bubble. I'm a+, partner is o+. We're doing the exact same things. Until there's clinical significance, there's not much wr can do with this data right now other than targeting future research.

[meganew]

Jun 22, 2020 18:16:34 GMT -5 winecat said:

meganew- Recently? Her most recent post was about a week ago.

rubytue- I thought so too.

It was in her stories- I don’t know if they all get saved

[winecat]

Jun 22, 2020 18:35:21 GMT -5 frlcb said:

Jun 22, 2020 18:16:34 GMT -5 winecat said:

meganew - Recently? Her most recent post was about a week ago.

rubytue - I thought so too.

She does instagram stories often during the week. She is awesome and breaks down tons of info.

ah.  I was afraid of that.  Stories disappear, right?  

[winecat]

Jun 22, 2020 19:18:02 GMT -5 litebright said:

Jun 22, 2020 17:41:04 GMT -5 winecat said:

I remember blood types being discussed as a possible reason why some people get more severe symptoms than others.  The general consensus from medical types here was that it wasn't anything conclusive, I believe.  (Someone correct me if I'm wrong.)  

This article was published the end of last week: www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2020283?  

There's a whole lot of science going on that I don't understand.  But it seems like they might have found new info that buoys the blood type being a risk factor?  I'm hoping that people here can read and interpret it for those of us who need it.   

So I thought this part was relevant: "In the meta-analysis corrected for age and sex, we found a higher risk among persons with blood group A than among patients with other blood groups ... and a protective effect for blood group O as compared with the other blood groups."

Here's a US News story on the report: "Now a team of European researchers have found that people with blood type A had a 45% higher risk of catching coronavirus and developing "COVID-19 with respiratory failure," compared to people with other blood types. On the other hand, people with type O blood had a 35% lower risk for this more serious form of COVID-19."

www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2020-06-18/blood-type-genetics-could-impact-odds-for-severe-covid-19-study

I think the NYT story that I posted a few weeks ago was about the same study (they talked to one of the guys listed as a co-author on that NEJM link) but at the time, the paper was still going through peer review before being published. 

www.nytimes.com/2020/06/03/health/coronavirus-blood-type-genetics.html

Yeah- I was thinking of the responses to your post with the NY Times article.  I remember being worried and then some of our medical/science people came in and said "It doesn't really tell us much other than maybe/possibly it might be something but we don't really know quite yet."  But that was a few weeks ago and I didn't know if this was confirmation or something new.  

[rubysoh0]

Jun 22, 2020 18:35:21 GMT -5 frlcb said:

Jun 22, 2020 18:16:34 GMT -5 winecat said:

meganew - Recently? Her most recent post was about a week ago.

rubytue - I thought so too.

She does instagram stories often during the week. She is awesome and breaks down tons of info.

She’s my favorite IG follow right now

[basilosaurus]

winecat its not that these abo results are meaningless. It's more that they're clinically useless right now.

For instance I know im at an elevated risk for certain cancers due to my mom. I screen earlier and more frequently. That's clinically significant. It won't alter the genetic factors beyond control, but I have practical steps and treatment

Blood type is equally beyond control. What would I personally do differently with o instead of a? Not a single thing. What can medicine do for me differently? Nothing yet.

But, these are important findings still. Take for instance breast cancer. There was a type that used to be the most deadly. Then they found a drug that specifically worked on that type so now they do testing on the tumor and choose treatment accordingly. Now it's the most survivable type. But that can sometimes take literally decades between what's seen in a lab and what's in use in clinical settings.

Now, if there were limited resources, maybe they'd prioritize testing a type people first and be more aggressive with early treatment. But that's where you get into nnh (numbers needed to harm) and nnt (numbers needed to treat). That's why recommendations for things like Pap smears and mammograms are regularly reevaluated.

For covid19, the test, though uncomfortable, is pretty much no risk. And it's cheap and readily available. There isn't a harmful treatment like chemo or radiation. You self isolate or get quarantined in a facility (depending on your country). It will suck, but it likely won't harm you, and you'll be on the radar for early intervention if needed and will keep others safe. A false positive is unlikely to affect you in a meaningful way. So the nnh is a non factor. Test test test regardless blood type. And maybe, someday, hopefully soon, that can turn into better treatment.

And that's more than anyone probably cares to know.

[krystee]

I have two friends who just found out they are going to be laid off next week. I think companies had to retain employees through the end of June for the PPP to be forgivable, and then they’re free to lay off. I was thinking we’d see a decline in unemployment soon with things opening up, but now I’m wondering if there will be another big unemployment wave.

[mysteriouswife]

Shelby County TN (Memphis) May go back to phase 1

www.wmcactionnews5.com/2020/06/22/shelby-county-commissioner-requests-return-phase-after-spike-covid-cases/

[Jalapeñomel]

Jun 22, 2020 22:47:09 GMT -5 mysteriouswife said:

Shelby County TN (Memphis) May go back to phase 1

www.wmcactionnews5.com/2020/06/22/shelby-county-commissioner-requests-return-phase-after-spike-covid-cases/

I hope AZ follows. I’m worried about my family and friends there.

[aurora]

Excellent thread by Andy Slavitt on how we're going wrong with COVID as Americans. I'm posting the final tweet.

[sofamonkey]

Jun 22, 2020 23:06:36 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

Jun 22, 2020 22:47:09 GMT -5 mysteriouswife said:

Shelby County TN (Memphis) May go back to phase 1

www.wmcactionnews5.com/2020/06/22/shelby-county-commissioner-requests-return-phase-after-spike-covid-cases/

I hope AZ follows. I’m worried about my family and friends there.

Yes. My aunt and uncle are in AZ now. They usually come back to WA by now, by the travel time is too much, and AZ is safer in the long run. I hope it stays safer. Ugh. So many foolish, emboldened choices happening in too many places. 😖

[WOT?*]

Jun 23, 2020 1:09:19 GMT -5 sofamonkey said:

Jun 22, 2020 23:06:36 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

I hope AZ follows. I’m worried about my family and friends there.

Yes. My aunt and uncle are in AZ now. They usually come back to WA by now, by the travel time is too much, and AZ is safer in the long run. I hope it stays safer. Ugh. So many foolish, emboldened choices happening in too many places. 😖

Is it really? Ugh. A friend if mine is headed down to AZ to get her folks and bring them back up.

I'm worried about heading to FL in September. There's a "must go" that I feel I "must go" but I'm terrified of being in a group of FL residents. Guest list is being cut to about 50 but I still think that's about 49 too many for my comfort. But it's an I-can't-skip-if-at-all-possible. I'm actually thinking of buying an RV and driving so I'm not in a plane or in hotel rooms. I can swing by Vegas and pick up my mom and bring her along. But that means H likely won't be able to go unless he can work from a table while I'm driving...and the way I drive and the way he back-seats me, that's not going to be at all a possibility. lol. (And no, we won't be buying an RV just for this. We've been considering it for some time and we really need and want to get out and see more of the country. Glamping is so much better for my old body than sleeping on the hard ground. Although I *did* buy a tent last week. ;P 

[al dente]

I found this interesting about how Hawaii has handled COVID. Our numbers are very good, but I never knew if it was just from being so isolated or what.

www.google.com/amp/s/www.politico.com/amp/news/magazine/2020/06/19/hawaii-covid-success-story-322919

Also I got tested today, although of course I’m feeling much better now so I don’t think I have it. But guess I’ll find out tomorrow.

[mrsukyankee]

www.theguardian.com/world/live/2020/jun/23/uk-coronavirus-live-latest-news-updates-pubs-restaurants-cinemas-and-museums

Our idiot gov't is getting rid of social distancing by using a 1 metre+ rule. Which is basically useless. We're opening up pubs and restaurants as well as hairdressers on 4 July.

"A new optimism is palpable, he says.

But it would be too easy for coronavirus to return. That is why the government is trusting the people to be careful."

He's going to blame people for not being careful versus his opening things up when there are still tons of cases in big cities, including London. This is going to be a shit show.

[abs]

Jun 22, 2020 23:06:36 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

Jun 22, 2020 22:47:09 GMT -5 mysteriouswife said:

Shelby County TN (Memphis) May go back to phase 1

www.wmcactionnews5.com/2020/06/22/shelby-county-commissioner-requests-return-phase-after-spike-covid-cases/

I hope AZ follows. I’m worried about my family and friends there.

TX, too.  We have a new mask mandate finally so I hope that helps but I think it's too little too late.  Too many people here are ignoring doctors and carrying on like it's a normal summer.  So hospitals are nearing capacity and they are admitting adults to the children's hospital in the Houston medical center.  Things here are just great.

[RitzyHeifer]

Jun 22, 2020 22:47:09 GMT -5 mysteriouswife said:

Shelby County TN (Memphis) May go back to phase 1

www.wmcactionnews5.com/2020/06/22/shelby-county-commissioner-requests-return-phase-after-spike-covid-cases/

Interesting to me personally bc someone from Memphis just yesterday was complaining to me that our college campus is closed* because everything is fine and we should open up everything

*we are operational, just not physically on campus, but a video call isn’t good enough for her precious child....

[breezy8407]

krystee I'm sorry to hear that about your friends. My company did layoffs recently. People who were furloughed were fully laid off. It sucks. We lost a large percentage of my department. I kind of knew it would happen with how things are going, but its still hard when it does.

Our furnace blower fan (I think) stopped working yesterday, so we have someone coming to look at it tomorrow. Without it, there is no AC, so it has to be done. But I am silently panicking about having a stranger in our house. I know they wear masks and feet coverings and all, but its such a leap from how we've been living since March.

[winecat]

Jun 22, 2020 21:28:33 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

winecat its not that these abo results are meaningless. It's more that they're clinically useless right now.

For instance I know im at an elevated risk for certain cancers due to my mom. I screen earlier and more frequently. That's clinically significant. It won't alter the genetic factors beyond control, but I have practical steps and treatment

Blood type is equally beyond control. What would I personally do differently with o instead of a? Not a single thing. What can medicine do for me differently? Nothing yet.

But, these are important findings still. Take for instance breast cancer. There was a type that used to be the most deadly. Then they found a drug that specifically worked on that type so now they do testing on the tumor and choose treatment accordingly. Now it's the most survivable type. But that can sometimes take literally decades between what's seen in a lab and what's in use in clinical settings.

Now, if there were limited resources, maybe they'd prioritize testing a type people first and be more aggressive with early treatment. But that's where you get into nnh (numbers needed to harm) and nnt (numbers needed to treat). That's why recommendations for things like Pap smears and mammograms are regularly reevaluated.

For covid19, the test, though uncomfortable, is pretty much no risk. And it's cheap and readily available. There isn't a harmful treatment like chemo or radiation. You self isolate or get quarantined in a facility (depending on your country). It will suck, but it likely won't harm you, and you'll be on the radar for early intervention if needed and will keep others safe. A false positive is unlikely to affect you in a meaningful way. So the nnh is a non factor. Test test test regardless blood type. And maybe, someday, hopefully soon, that can turn into better treatment.

And that's more than anyone probably cares to know.

Thank you for posting.  I love science; it's not my forte though so I appreciate the 'like I'm 5' explanations.   

What I've seen people post is that they're seeing it as a "pre-existing condition" type of thing so they take more precautions than they would otherwise.  It kind of makes sense.  If someone has a medical condition that would make them more likely to have a severe response, they take more precautions than someone without.  

[sofamonkey]

Jun 23, 2020 2:05:54 GMT -5 WOT?* said:

Jun 23, 2020 1:09:19 GMT -5 sofamonkey said:

Yes. My aunt and uncle are in AZ now. They usually come back to WA by now, by the travel time is too much, and AZ is safer in the long run. I hope it stays safer. Ugh. So many foolish, emboldened choices happening in too many places. 😖

Is it really? Ugh. A friend if mine is headed down to AZ to get her folks and bring them back up.

I'm worried about heading to FL in September. There's a "must go" that I feel I "must go" but I'm terrified of being in a group of FL residents. Guest list is being cut to about 50 but I still think that's about 49 too many for my comfort. But it's an I-can't-skip-if-at-all-possible. I'm actually thinking of buying an RV and driving so I'm not in a plane or in hotel rooms. I can swing by Vegas and pick up my mom and bring her along. But that means H likely won't be able to go unless he can work from a table while I'm driving...and the way I drive and the way he back-seats me, that's not going to be at all a possibility. lol. (And no, we won't be buying an RV just for this. We've been considering it for some time and we really need and want to get out and see more of the country. Glamping is so much better for my old body than sleeping on the hard ground. Although I *did* buy a tent last week. ;P 

It’s only safer for them by circumstances, not in general.

Have you thought about renting an RV? That could be fun!!