Parents w/ different political beliefs than you

[wanderlustmom]

Aug 1, 2020 21:18:43 GMT -5 Dumbledork said:

Aug 1, 2020 20:58:54 GMT -5 wanderlustmom said:

I’m lucky that even living in a red state and growing up in a Republican family, almost everyone I love and spend time with is Democrat/Liberal and passionately doesn’t like Trump.

However, my dad and brother are Republicans (I am fine with that) but they voted for Trump and will again. They don’t try to push it on me (they’ve teased me as obvious liberal all my life, they call me a bleeding heart liberal and I’m okay with it because it feels like they respect me.) I am disappointed these last four years haven’t changed them but they will at least discuss Trumps issues.

3 of my 4 high school best friends also voted for Trump. It’s tough. They don’t try to convince me and they know where I stand. But I’m sad. I brought up Black Lives Matter and they got quiet. So I love them but I will never understand that choice. I don’t feel that way about people who support Republicans, I feel that way about Trump supporters.

Nah.

Susan Collins is a Republican and has openly “worried” about Trump’s terrible actions. Guess how much she’s done to actually stop him.

How did Republicans act during impeachment? Why is Trump still in office?

Fuck Republicans that aren’t actively voting and speaking out against this administration and the current state of the GOP. Fuck that they can look at their party and still claim it as party of their identity. They don’t have to be a Dem but they can’t still claim the gop and be cool with me.

Thank you. I see your points. I would wish they would consider leaving the party and taking a public stand against Trump. But I can’t help but love my dad, brother and friends. They do respect my opinion which helps a lot. I am a very vocal outspoken liberal and have been my whole life. And the good news is, no new Trump voter gets in my life.

[Dumbledork]

Aug 1, 2020 21:30:28 GMT -5 wanderlustmom said:

Aug 1, 2020 21:18:43 GMT -5 Dumbledork said:

Nah.

Susan Collins is a Republican and has openly “worried” about Trump’s terrible actions. Guess how much she’s done to actually stop him.

How did Republicans act during impeachment? Why is Trump still in office?

Fuck Republicans that aren’t actively voting and speaking out against this administration and the current state of the GOP. Fuck that they can look at their party and still claim it as party of their identity. They don’t have to be a Dem but they can’t still claim the gop and be cool with me.

Thank you. I see your points. I would wish they would consider leaving the party and taking a public stand against Trump. But I can’t help but love my dad, brother and friends. They do respect my opinion which helps a lot. I am a very vocal outspoken liberal and have been my whole life. And the good news is, no new Trump voter gets in my life.

Gross.

So what you mean to say is that you’re a performative liberal.

[macmars45]

My H tried to have a meaningful respectful email conversation with his parents (life long die hard Rs). It didn't end well. H was very hurt and disappointed.

H was raised on fox news/all the GOP crap and didn't fully decide what he believed politically until 2015/2016. He also didn't vote with any regularity before that time.

My parents do not talk about politics in front of me/my sisters. Just recently they have a tiny bit. They vote D. Thankfully.

[lilac05]

Neither of my parents are dedicated Republicans, but both voted for Trump. My mom was anti-Hillary and didn’t pay enough attention to truth of Trump before voting and was swayed by my dad to vote for him. She was one who had hope that he’d surround himself with good people. She will not vote for him again. However, I firmly believe that is because of many long, hard discussions that we have had over the last several years. It dumbfounds me how she cannot see that the values that she actually has do NOT line up with the Republican Party, ESPECIALLY the Trump Administration. My Dad watches too much Fox News and hangs out on FB way too often, but I still believe that there’s a chance that he will vote for Biden in November. I never shy away from hard conversations and call him out on his BS...but I’m one of the only vocal liberals in his life who he respects and who will stand up to him. If I don’t, no one will, and he will be a lost cause. I will not give up the fight.

It has damaged our relationship in several ways, but I refuse to ignore it, back down, or cut him out where he will see it as “typical liberals who don’t listen to anyone else.” I realize this is not the way that others choose to do it, but it’s what makes me feel like I have a chance of making a difference. I can’t control what happens in Washington, but I can stand firm and feel like I’m “fighting the good fight” on the home front. Honestly, it also helps that we live in another state and I don’t see him very often...I very possibly could make a different decision if we were closer.

[basilosaurus]

It started in the w years when my grandpa sent military propaganda. Maybe he thought since I was a mil spouse I'd appreciate it. NOPE. I once politely asked him to stop sending propaganda which started a family shit storm because they love taking behind our backs. But it ended, and the relationship recovered. I realize I'm the lucky one.

My sister who actually is in view with neede refuses to denounce her awful trump loving anti gay neighbor friends. That, among other reasons, is why we don't talk. I had hope for her. She voted Obama. Her husband just is too apathetic to vote (how?!). And she's right they're great friends to her in their lily weir mcmansion neighbor with a token Indian family. She just won't see past personal interactions into how voting affects others.

I speak to her maybe 3 times a year and it always ends in an argument. I truly believe she just plain didn't like me. We were never close growing but tried to repair the last 15 or so years. It briefly worked. Trump and her new neighborhood ended that. Like when a neighbor after we'd been drinking heavily, he more than most, brought his gun to show off how cute and pink it was for his wife. I went to bed.

[Eagles]

I cut off like...75% of my family. And just blocked a lifelong friend the other day (tbh, I only kept the superficial relationship going bc she lost her father shortly before her wedding and I wanted to support her).

Does it suck? Yeah. But I can't play nice and pretend they're good people deep down. They're not. Good people don't support the cruelty and immorality at the root of this shit.

FIL watches Fox News a lot and the last time I saw him and was essentially bombarded by his rants about the liberals, I told H that I'm unsubscribing from family gatherings for the rest of the year. Obviously now covid has given me an assist there.

[emilyinchile]

Aug 1, 2020 20:58:54 GMT -5 wanderlustmom said:

However, my dad and brother are Republicans (I am fine with that) but they voted for Trump and will again. They don’t try to push it on me (they’ve teased me as obvious liberal all my life, they call me a bleeding heart liberal and I’m okay with it because it feels like they respect me.) I am disappointed these last four years haven’t changed them but they will at least discuss Trumps issues.

I don't want to pick on you personally, but the bolded doesn't match up. The fact is that someone who votes for Trump does not respect women. I'm sure your brother and father believe that they respect you as an individual, but their actions say otherwise. They can sit there and pay lip service all day long to you being entitled to your views and supporting you, but at the end of they day, they're actively trying to curtail your rights.

My dad is an old-school conservative, and I get a lot of joy out of calling him a secret Democrat because since George W he wouldn't have voted for any of the GOP candidates because he doesn't think a supposedly conservative party should be regulating what people do in their bedrooms or with their pregnancies. We definitely don't see eye-to-eye on a lot of the visibilization of minority rights, but through conversation he's come a long way. My half-sister would apparently vote for Trump if she were a US citizen, so I'm glad she's not because "but Trump is evil, and voting for him makes you evil" would be a conversation that would go horribly and not change anyone's mind, but I'd have it because it's the right thing to do.

[gibbinator]

My sister has been drinking the alt right kool-aid since she moved to a conservative province. She's the only one in the family. It's rough because we've always been close.
Now, I'll say she does think trump is a ridiculous joke, but she's been sliding into white man conspiracy theories, which is super odd (ever since watching the red pill). Anyway, she thinks Canada is a racism free utopia but is hilariously hypocritically against refugees immigrating, thinks white men are persecuted, blah blah blah.
I think a lot of it is the whole white fragility stuff and not wanting to accept hurt feelings.
Now she will listen to reason and sometimes I can convince her that her opinions are wrong, but I only see her once a year so I don't get much chance to be a positive influence on her.

[SwimDeep]

Aug 1, 2020 15:47:09 GMT -5 Dumbledork said:

I cut contact with my sister.

In order to try to respect and accommodate her views, I was pushing myself into a smaller and smaller box. Eventually I realized that I was putting an absurd amount of energy into making myself acceptable for her comfort, and she wasn’t doing a damn thing to reciprocate.

One example: I wouldn’t bring up anything lgbtqia pride related because I knew it made her uncomfortable, but she would openly talk about lgbtqia being sinful and evil and a chosen, Anti-American lifestyle. Spending time with her and the views she would share caused me stress and hurt, and her refusal to change behavior made it clear she didn’t want an actual relationship with me.

My other thing is that the hate she would spew isn’t politics. If she wants to debate free speech with me, cool. But she just wants to argue about denying human rights and I refuse to talk with a brick wall.

The way you put it hits so close to home for me. I also found that I was shrinking myself to make the rest of my family comfortable. I didn't know how to express that until just now.

I'm only in contact with one of my sisters at this point. I've cut off the older members of my family. The younger members can decide for themselves if they want a relationship with me. I'm not going to push it. Also not going to hope for it...

My parents would send propoganda emails back when I first got married and moved out. I started fighting back, realized that was bad for my mental health, and then just cut contact. I didn't have a grown up conversation with them about it. I just ghosted.

[seeyalater52]

Aug 2, 2020 5:45:15 GMT -5 emilyinchile said:

Aug 1, 2020 20:58:54 GMT -5 wanderlustmom said:

However, my dad and brother are Republicans (I am fine with that) but they voted for Trump and will again. They don’t try to push it on me (they’ve teased me as obvious liberal all my life, they call me a bleeding heart liberal and I’m okay with it because it feels like they respect me.) I am disappointed these last four years haven’t changed them but they will at least discuss Trumps issues.

I don't want to pick on you personally, but the bolded doesn't match up. The fact is that someone who votes for Trump does not respect women. I'm sure your brother and father believe that they respect you as an individual, but their actions say otherwise. They can sit there and pay lip service all day long to you being entitled to your views and supporting you, but at the end of they day, they're actively trying to curtail your rights.

My dad is an old-school conservative, and I get a lot of joy out of calling him a secret Democrat because since George W he wouldn't have voted for any of the GOP candidates because he doesn't think a supposedly conservative party should be regulating what people do in their bedrooms or with their pregnancies. We definitely don't see eye-to-eye on a lot of the visibilization of minority rights, but through conversation he's come a long way. My half-sister would apparently vote for Trump if she were a US citizen, so I'm glad she's not because "but Trump is evil, and voting for him makes you evil" would be a conversation that would go horribly and not change anyone's mind, but I'd have it because it's the right thing to do.

And if you truly see that as respect and not as support for an ideology that is set on curtailing your rights, there’s a word for that: privilege. I dont associate with people who don’t think my family is entitled to safety and civil rights. Despite my many, many privileges there are huge aspects of my life and civil rights that are very much dependent on who is in power politically (and that isn’t limited to Trump in any way because most other Republicans and the party platform aren’t any better on the things that impact me directly.) It’s interesting to see how many people of privilege are hiding behind it to justify what their loved ones would like to do to others in this country. I dont usually say “must be nice” but... must be nice to feel so insulated from the real world impacts of their positions.

[simpsongal]

For those with religious conservatives in their family, suggest they check out Tony Campolo.

I find so much disturbing about our current political landscape but the sheep like hijacking of the evangelical vote is insane to me (eta: not in a historical context. I realize the church has been complicit in racism and oppression For eons).

[sunnysally]

Aug 1, 2020 21:06:02 GMT -5 Dumbledork said:

To be clear:

Putting people in cages with grotesque conditions at the border is not politics.
Murder of Trans people in our country is not politics.
LGBTQIA rights and visibility is not politics.
Murder of Black people in our country and the refusal to hold their murderers accountable is not politics.
Anti-semitism and xenophobia is not politics.

A lot of the shit that you’re ignoring in your family’s views is not politics.
It’s denial of human rights.

By continuing relationships with them, you are saying that your relationship with this person is more important than someone else’s right to live with life, liberty, pursuit of happiness, all that jazz. You’re just shrugging off someone’s rights so you can have strained conversations on holidays.

Come on. We’re still saying this here? People have been kicked off the board for this. People have left the board for this. Silence is violence.

Why is this so hard for people to understand? I've cut off several people. I miss some aspects of the relationships. However, the lives and rights of all people people is more important than some superficial friendship. Cutting off bigots is the least I can do.

[Jalapeñomel]

Aug 2, 2020 6:53:45 GMT -5 seeyalater52 said:

Aug 2, 2020 5:45:15 GMT -5 emilyinchile said:

I don't want to pick on you personally, but the bolded doesn't match up. The fact is that someone who votes for Trump does not respect women. I'm sure your brother and father believe that they respect you as an individual, but their actions say otherwise. They can sit there and pay lip service all day long to you being entitled to your views and supporting you, but at the end of they day, they're actively trying to curtail your rights.

My dad is an old-school conservative, and I get a lot of joy out of calling him a secret Democrat because since George W he wouldn't have voted for any of the GOP candidates because he doesn't think a supposedly conservative party should be regulating what people do in their bedrooms or with their pregnancies. We definitely don't see eye-to-eye on a lot of the visibilization of minority rights, but through conversation he's come a long way. My half-sister would apparently vote for Trump if she were a US citizen, so I'm glad she's not because "but Trump is evil, and voting for him makes you evil" would be a conversation that would go horribly and not change anyone's mind, but I'd have it because it's the right thing to do.

And if you truly see that as respect and not as support for an ideology that is set on curtailing your rights, there’s a word for that: privilege. I dont associate with people who don’t think my family is entitled to safety and civil rights. Despite my many, many privileges there are huge aspects of my life and civil rights that are very much dependent on who is in power politically (and that isn’t limited to Trump in any way because most other Republicans and the party platform aren’t any better on the things that impact me directly.) It’s interesting to see how many people of privilege are hiding behind it to justify what their loved ones would like to do to others in this country. I dont usually say “must be nice” but... must be nice to feel so insulated from the real world impacts of their positions.

And to keep with this, why is it ok for them to shirk your feelings? They certainly don’t tip toe around you?

I’ve been talking a lot to my mom about a Trump, and she’s come a long way. We can civil discussions about the situation, and although she’s not a democrat per se, she will not be voting for Trump again.

I don’t ignore my dad. I don’t let him talk about things I disagree with. I don’t let him say racist things without calling him out every single time. I tell him how I feel a lot. I’m not gonna be the one to bite my tongue.

If he wants to have a relationship with me, he is gonna have to listen to me. I don’t think he will ever come around, but I will not stop trying.

(I do block him on FB, because I don’t think my friends should be subjected to him)

[cville]

Aug 2, 2020 10:05:32 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

Aug 2, 2020 6:53:45 GMT -5 seeyalater52 said:

And if you truly see that as respect and not as support for an ideology that is set on curtailing your rights, there’s a word for that: privilege. I dont associate with people who don’t think my family is entitled to safety and civil rights. Despite my many, many privileges there are huge aspects of my life and civil rights that are very much dependent on who is in power politically (and that isn’t limited to Trump in any way because most other Republicans and the party platform aren’t any better on the things that impact me directly.) It’s interesting to see how many people of privilege are hiding behind it to justify what their loved ones would like to do to others in this country. I dont usually say “must be nice” but... must be nice to feel so insulated from the real world impacts of their positions.

And to keep with this, why is it ok for them to shirk your feelings? They certainly don’t tip toe around you?

I’ve been talking a lot to my mom about a Trump, and she’s come a long way. We can civil discussions about the situation, and although she’s not a democrat per se, she will not be voting for Trump again.

I don’t ignore my dad. I don’t let him talk about things I disagree with. I don’t let him say racist things without calling him out every single time. I tell him how I feel a lot. I’m not gonna be the one to bite my tongue.

If he wants to have a relationship with me, he is gonna have to listen to me. I don’t think he will ever come around, but I will not stop trying.

(I do block him on FB, because I don’t think my friends should be subjected to him)

This is how my mom is and has been with her brother. He leans right, and we're the only family with whom he's in contact (his sisters are crazy right wing and they've cut each other off for other reasons; my mom and the rest of us are estranged from them too).

In the years since she's been doing this, with support from the rest of us, he's moved a bit. He and I also discussed frankly the Charlottesville incident and the "you/Jews will not replace us" chant. His favorite person in the world is my daughter. I pointed out that she's half Jewish and they were talking about her. He got reeeeeeeeeeal quiet.

I think he's seen how we're all kind and thoughtful and experienced in the world so not the hothouse flower idiot snowflakes Fox News et al would have right wingers believe. Change is possible with effort. But he also knows we'd all cut him off in a heartbeat. That helps.

[katfco]

My dad finally unfriended me on Facebook last year because he was tired of seeing me post things he thought were calling him racist.

My mom is anti-Trump and apolitical, but is very literal when it comes to the Bible, so she and I have disagreed about several things. (Pdq: DD will be coming out to her next time we see her and it’s going to be interesting)

My FIL is an anti-Trump diehard republican. We’ve had many discussions over the years and sometimes we just to shut it down.

[gummybear]

My family is extremely hardcore, straight-ticket Republican. My uncle has actually been involved in local politics most of his life and I grew up in an area that is (well, was) so deeply entrenched in political supercontrol that it was a well-known thing that unless you registered with one party it could affect things like trash pick up and emergency services.

The past four years have actually been pretty interesting. My mom despises Trump and wrote in in 2016. My dad is a tougher sell, but I think even he is done. My uncle has pretty much said his party as he knows it is gone and he doesn't even want to vote at all. None of them identify with the Republicans as they currently present themselves.

I'm pretty sure I can convince my mom to vote for Biden instead of writing in, and maybe even my dad. Biden is literally "one of them" - a blue-collar Irish Catholic. It's not a hard sell. They love him. It's just 60 years of brainwashing they need to get over. They KNOW I'm right.

[lilypad1126]

I just don’t get how so many people who say they are anti-racism, anti-Trump, etc are still able to sit quietly while their friends/family spout Trump’s bullshit. Is it fun when I call my dad, mom, other family out on their racism? No. But it has to be done. In the case of my parents, it’s come from a place of ignorance, and I’ve seen them work on changing their behavior. They all hate Trump and I’ve convinced most of them to donate to Biden’s campaign because I think it’s important.

My “friends” who are racist, bigoted, etc? I’m done with them. They are no longer my friends. And let’s be real, we probably weren’t real close friends to begin with. I’m numb to it at this point. They get unfriended and blocked the first time they posit a racist, shitty meme because I don’t want to see it. Human rights is important to me, so if you want to have a relationship with me, they have to important to you too.

My mom and I were discussing this yesterday and were talking about This whole thing feels a little like “as a woman you shouldn’t make a scene”. Like, it’s ok if I disagree with Trump and the Rs stance on human rights, but it might upset people if I say something against it. And because I’m a woman, I get hit With things like “don’t get your panties in a twist/calm down/it doesn’t affect you why are you making a scene”. Fuck that. You want to discuss actual politics with me, ok. But human rights? No, we cannot have a difference of opinion and I will not agree to disagree.

[NewOrleans]

If you keep Trump supporters who “respect and love you” in your life, they face no repercussions or accountability for their evil. It’’s a form of complicity. No parent of mine would ever know their grandchildren and would also not have a daughter anymore and it would be on them to explain that shit to others.

[goldengirlz]

Aug 1, 2020 21:29:26 GMT -5 winecat said:

Right? What's "fine" with being a republican? Oh, they say they're a fiscal conservative? All that seems to mean is 'no skittles for poor people' because the GOP is so far from being the party of fiscal conservatism or small government. It's all just a nice, tidy bow to cover for their racism.

Yes, racism is a system as much as it’s more overt displays of what we typically think of as racist acts.

I think the reason I reacted to the “otherwise he’s such a nice guy” comment is because most (if not all) of the people I know who continue to support Trump also have deeply problematic views and/or refuse to examine why those views perpetuate racism. They could still be “good” people — upstanding citizens, kind, generous, etc. — but eventually it gets harder and harder to reconcile their views with my own values.

The OP said “most” of the comments were helpful and I’m guessing she didn’t include my comment in that statement. So I’ll tell this story instead. When we lived in the Bible Belt a few years ago, we didn’t exactly advertise that we were Jewish. I met many lovely people with whom I thought I could be friends. But every so often, someone would begin to let on that they held, er, colorful opinions about Jewish people. Some of these opinions might have been rooted in ignorance. Others might have been rooted in their own deeply held religious beliefs. But if they weren’t willing to examine those opinions — if they doubled down on them — then we couldn’t be friends. No matter how much I previously liked them otherwise.

That’s why I said it’s a privilege to be able to look away when people hold bigoted views. If you really identified with the marginalized groups who are being hurt (and even dying) because of Trump’s policies, then you couldn’t support the people who support those policies.

(And again, racism crosses party lines too.)

[fumbalina]

I cut down the time I see my family. They are conservative and I am not. I do not mince my words and I will tell them what they are saying is racist, or does not respect x type of person. Because of this, they believe I am an extremely angry person and roll their eyes at me. I chose to interact with them 2-5 times a year because I would rather not be completely cut out of the information pipeline in the family. I chose not to bring up anything that I feel strongly about because it is not good for my blood pressure.

I do not want to completely cut out the family because I have extreme difficulty in making friends and my entire list of friends fits on one hand with extra fingers. I have about a dozen acquaintances as well, but if we do not end up at the same event, we would never even think of talking. As is, I already end up feeling isolated, even without COVID restrictions, so I do not want to minimize my social circle even more. I also do not want the younger generation to not see people who hold differing views.

[Queen Dick, Hibernating Bear]

I'd honestly rather have zero friends and family than bigoted ones.

[Queen Dick, Hibernating Bear]

But that would be easy for me.

You probably can't tell but I'm not really a people person.

[CurlyQ284]

Everyone in my family is a Democrat except my dad. We have a bad relationship going back to my teenage years as well. I unfollowed him on facebook and my mom has told him he is not allowed to comment on my posts. I see him for about a week each year and we do not talk about politics (another one of moms rules). She and I talk about stuff when he isn't around when I visit.

The only reason he is still in my life at all is because he is still married to my mom.

[W.T.Faulkner]

I haven’t cut my conservative relatives off only because I know that if I do, they’ll be completely insulated in their Fox News Republican social bubble. And I’m going to call their shit out. I think it’s my responsibility to do so. I think cutting them off, at least for me, shirks that responsibility.

[pandora89]

My husband told his mom just last week that she was a racist after she complained to him about a mosque going up near her.

[Deleted]

The mental gymnastics in this thread by some of you is amazing.

[mskitkat]

My sisters and I have successfully converted my mom from a Catholic one issue pro life voter to alllllmost being ready to call herself pro-choice. She’s not quite there, but in all other aspects she is now a flaming liberal and cannot see herself ever voting Republican again. I am so proud.

[fryjack2]

Aug 2, 2020 11:28:57 GMT -5 cville said:

Aug 2, 2020 10:05:32 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

And to keep with this, why is it ok for them to shirk your feelings? They certainly don’t tip toe around you?

I’ve been talking a lot to my mom about a Trump, and she’s come a long way. We can civil discussions about the situation, and although she’s not a democrat per se, she will not be voting for Trump again.

I don’t ignore my dad. I don’t let him talk about things I disagree with. I don’t let him say racist things without calling him out every single time. I tell him how I feel a lot. I’m not gonna be the one to bite my tongue.

If he wants to have a relationship with me, he is gonna have to listen to me. I don’t think he will ever come around, but I will not stop trying.

(I do block him on FB, because I don’t think my friends should be subjected to him)

This is how my mom is and has been with her brother. He leans right, and we're the only family with whom he's in contact (his sisters are crazy right wing and they've cut each other off for other reasons; my mom and the rest of us are estranged from them too).

In the years since she's been doing this, with support from the rest of us, he's moved a bit. He and I also discussed frankly the Charlottesville incident and the "you/Jews will not replace us" chant. His favorite person in the world is my daughter. I pointed out that she's half Jewish and they were talking about her. He got reeeeeeeeeeal quiet.

I think he's seen how we're all kind and thoughtful and experienced in the world so not the hothouse flower idiot snowflakes Fox News et al would have right wingers believe. Change is possible with effort. But he also knows we'd all cut him off in a heartbeat. That helps.

I said this same thing to a friend who was bashing Islam - "You do realize I was raised Muslim and we are raising the boys to know more about Islam than Catholicism, right?"  I could almost see the lightbulb go off over his head. 

 

[fryjack2]

Aug 2, 2020 17:52:56 GMT -5 pandora89 said:

My husband told his mom just last week that she was a racist after she complained to him about a mosque going up near her.

Are we related?  Is your H a sibling of my H's cousin who's lives in NYC? 

[fryjack2]

It shouldn't be hard it is to disconnect yourself from a Trump supporter-which is different from a Republican- it should be a morally easy choice.

Your parents are have a Trump flag hanging off their garage? Ask them to name one thing he has done to better their lives. If they can, please report back because I am generously curious.