campermom I love the phrase "whole body listener"! When my DD was diagnosed with ADHD someone on here recommended the book "My Brain Needs Glasses" which was AWESOME to help DD understand that her medicines were to help her brain focus, just like her glasses do for her eyes. It was also a good way for her to explain it to others.
Post by traveltheworld on Oct 14, 2020 10:27:46 GMT -5
mae0111, hugs. That sounds really tough. Not sure how serious you are about boarding school, but my best friend went to boarding school for one year for Grade 6 as her parents were going through a very bitter divorce, she hated it at the time, but it did no lasting damage to her or her relationship with her parents. She grew up to be happy, successful, and has a very loving relationship with her parents now. Whatever decision you make, it doesn't have to be permanent.
mae0111 I am so sorry. I can't imagine what you are going through. She is so young and is probably starting the puberty hormone crazy stage on top of the rest.
I know I started my period is sixth grade I have also been told that some of the meds can clash hard with puberty hormones, do you think weaning her off of them for the next year or so would help?
mae0111 - What would happen if she didn’t study for a 6th grade test? She’d presumably fail or not do well yes? So why not let her? I’ve been there with my now 14 year old and I can tell you my obsession with her grades and her doing well almost destroyed our relationship and her (Caused some pretty serious depression issues that helped fuel a pretty dramatic downward spiral). It’s not worth it. 6th grade and really all of middle school is more about learning how to be successful on your own before the grades start to matter in high school. I wish I would have realized that with my oldest because the power struggles that we went through for grades that don’t matter weren’t worth it. I’m taking a very different approach for my middle kid who is in 6th grade. A more empathetic and logical consequences approach. I often thought of boarding school as well, turns out her depression was at the root of a lot of the things and once we got that under control and I stopped the power struggles with her over grades she’s a lot more pleasant to live with and I no longer wish I could just send her to boarding school. Anyway, ignore if that’s not relevant. Sorry things are so rough, middle school age is by far the hardest I’ve dealt with as a parent.
mrsGreeko - we’ve been letting her fail since the beginning of the school year. She refused to study, didn’t do well, would swear to study next time, then refuse, on and on. So last week she did poorly and I felt like we turned a corner. She had a test Tuesday. She studied for like 10 mins, seemed to know it when I quizzed her, and didn’t do well. When she told me I just said, “Oh well! I know you tried. We will try something else next time!” And she was enthusiastic.
Yesterday she just didn’t wanna (foot stomp).
She had a 97 average across the board last year with minimal effort. We are hoping to get her into a school that will be great for her exec functioning and ADHD issues, but it’s academically rigorous and she needs to try.
We’ve been focused on effort and not grades. Yesterday was “you need to review this stuff for 20 mins and let me quiz you, then go about your day” and the explosion started. It very quickly changed from a struggle about studying to being grounded for calling me a jerk and throwing things.
Life is a lot more peaceful when we just let her do what she wants.
Post by mustardseed2007 on Oct 14, 2020 11:59:58 GMT -5
DDOT: This is my new guy's second day on the job and I have to be home because DS threw up last night so of course DS and DD are both excluded today. The school asked that they both stay home but if he shows no sign of illness today, which so far he hasn't thank Jesus, then they can go back tomorrow. My nanny first said she'd come stay with him and then this morning said she didn't feel comfortable.
I've been messing with school all day, trying to get our crappy computer to let me print worksheets for DD. And when I call into the office it feels like everyone is walking through mud to get me the things I need to get work done.
mrsGreeko - we’ve been letting her fail since the beginning of the school year. She refused to study, didn’t do well, would swear to study next time, then refuse, on and on. So last week she did poorly and I felt like we turned a corner. She had a test Tuesday. She studied for like 10 mins, seemed to know it when I quizzed her, and didn’t do well. When she told me I just said, “Oh well! I know you tried. We will try something else next time!” And she was enthusiastic.
Yesterday she just didn’t wanna (foot stomp).
She had a 97 average across the board last year with minimal effort. We are hoping to get her into a school that will be great for her exec functioning and ADHD issues, but it’s academically rigorous and she needs to try.
We’ve been focused on effort and not grades. Yesterday was “you need to review this stuff for 20 mins and let me quiz you, then go about your day” and the explosion started. It very quickly changed from a struggle about studying to being grounded for calling me a jerk and throwing things.
Life is a lot more peaceful when we just let her do what she wants.
I’m not saying let her do what she wants, I’m saying as she gets older she has more control over her life. In any case, I say this in the most gentle way possible, the academic rigorous school that you want her to go to might not be there right place for her if she isn’t interested in being academically rigorous. It absolutely is not the end of the world if she can’t or doesn’t get in. I say that as someone who just moved all 3 of my kids from an extremely academically rigorous K-12 school into our regular neighborhood schools and all 3 (I also have one ADHD kiddo) of my kids are so much happier. Academically rigorous is super for some kids, but not all of them.
I see a lot of parallels with your DD and my oldest from what you’ve posted. Including major friend drama starting in 5th grade and an extreme indifference to school starting in 6th (she’s ID’ed as gifted and I know what her IQ was when she started kindergarten which made me feel like she should be able to do better than she was, plus she’d always done great in the past). It’s more complicated than that and ultimately it was self sabotage because of my extreme focus on her grades. Yeah I could let it go briefly here and there, but never for very long. PDQ: it ultimately led to cutting and suicidal thoughts and a faux suicide attempt. If I could go back I would have let her actually fail (except I don’t think she would have, but a C or even a D would not have been the end of the world for her to get) early on in 6th rather than worrying so much over grades that don’t matter at all. Again, maybe there really aren’t parallels, but I wouldn’t wish what resulted in our case on any other parent.
mrsGreeko, thank you for sharing, and I definitely hear you.
I am hoping DD1 can go to the new school next year for a lot of reasons. She will have the opportunity to play in a musical group, be in a play, pursue sports. They have an extensive academic resource center to help kids with all sorts of learning disabilities. None of this is available to her right now, and it wouldn't be available if we switched her back to public school. But, it's tough. Not impossible, it's not even close to on par (academically) with most of the independent schools in our area. It's a nice place with a strong sense of community, but they ask a bit of their students. Her current level of effort (less than 10 minutes combined for 2 subjects of homework and studying for a test) won't cut it. Maybe an hour of homework a night on a bad night? Just more rigorous than her current school. It would be good for her in so many ways.
The grades and the effort are such a small piece of what's happening. Every time she is told "no", she explodes. Sometimes it's around being told that her homework is incorrect, and I'd like to sit with her to review it and help her to understand her mistakes. Sometimes it's because it's time to put the iPad away for the evening. Sometimes it's because I'm not serving what she wants for dinner. Sometimes it's because I asked her to take a shower. It could be hormones, but it's been happening like this for years. YEARS. At least 7 years.
Her therapist doesn't think that this behavior is linked to her ADHD. There are absolutely NO behavioral issues anywhere else. School, grandparents' houses, friends' houses - everyone says that she's a delight. The problem is in our home. She doesn't want to do what she doesn't want to do, and she will make everyone miserable until we let her do what she wants.
mae0111 , as I have said before she reminds me so much of my nephew. I don't think he is diagnosed as ADHD. In fact, I don't think he has a technical diagnosis. I think he did have bouts of depression, but my mom and I wonder if eventually he might get a mood disorder diagnosis.
He is fine at school. He did soccer, and I think that was fine. They did therapeutic horse riding. Obviously with Covid, he isn't seeing friends a ton, but he sees some of them, and he is fine there. But in the home with my sister, BIL and my mom he does the same thing. Hours and hours long tantrums. My sister took him and his brother on vacation, and she couldn't get him out of bed for 3 hours. He is told to empty the dishwasher or told no, and he just doesn't do it or it is the worst thing ever. He will be 13 this December.
He almost failed last year because he didn't do any of the e-learning. The school told them they didn't have to and then changed it later. He had to turn in the assignments before June 30 to pass, and I think he barely squeaked by. Nothing phases him in terms of punishment or taking things away.
I don't know what the answer is because my sister hasn't figured that out either. She's had him evaluated, and he has seen counselors.
waverly - it’s an awful way to live. For a while we just acted like a family of 3 and just let DD1 do whatever she wanted (within reason and bounds of safety). It was much more peaceful, but it made me sad.
She says she doesn’t know why she is grounded today. Doesn’t seem to get it. Today since I’m not arguing with her, but won’t let her out with her friends, she’s picking fights with DD2.
She will now misbehave in front of others, which is new. She’s never disrespectful if DH or I aren’t there, but she will not tantrum in front of others.
I wonder if it would be easier if her behavior was the same everywhere. Like, at least I would know what to expect?
mae0111 - that sounds really tough. The school we had our kids had also allowed for foreign language, sports, drama, more field trips, etc that aren’t options at our neighborhood schools. It was also a GT school so they were supposedly equipped to deal with all of the issues that GT kids have and had a very high proportion of twice exceptional kids so they should have been better able to deal with all kinds of things. In any case, it was really hard to give that stuff up, but my mom pointed out to me that we could give our kids those opportunities outside of school and it made me realize that I could. But, I feel you, it was really really hard to give all of that up and send them to our neighborhood schools that didn’t have the same opportunities and didn’t have the same academic rigor. It felt like I was giving up on their path to success (I’ve come to the realization that there are millions of different paths to success and what school you go to or what grades you get don’t matter on most of them). But, for us, it’s been by far one of the best decisions we’ve made. It probably was a little too late for my 9th grader as she’s pretty anti-school now from the academic rigor for so long, but maybe she will come around. I also have come to realize that homework is the devil and what I thought were reasonable amounts of homework at our old school was actually creating the environment in my household that was becoming completely toxic to me and the kids. They have essentially no homework at their new schools and everything is so much better. They can pursue their own hobbies and passions without the stress of homework over them. And they do.
I will also say that DH and I just finished parenting classes as part of the therapy stuff for our ADHD kid and they were incredibly helpful. I wish they would offer parenting classes easier because I sure as hell didn’t know how to go about finding any. And dealing with extreme tantrums such were a big part of it. If you haven’t taken any, I’d recommend them highly. Not because I think you are a bad parent or anything, but because I think they are helpful to all parents, but especially with ADHD kids (all the other parents in our class had ADHD kids too).
In any case I hope you figure it all out with her and find some peace in your household with her and she with you. It’s a really tough age.
mae0111 - What would happen if she didn’t study for a 6th grade test? She’d presumably fail or not do well yes? So why not let her? I’ve been there with my now 14 year old and I can tell you my obsession with her grades and her doing well almost destroyed our relationship and her (Caused some pretty serious depression issues that helped fuel a pretty dramatic downward spiral). It’s not worth it. 6th grade and really all of middle school is more about learning how to be successful on your own before the grades start to matter in high school. I wish I would have realized that with my oldest because the power struggles that we went through for grades that don’t matter weren’t worth it. I’m taking a very different approach for my middle kid who is in 6th grade. A more empathetic and logical consequences approach. I often thought of boarding school as well, turns out her depression was at the root of a lot of the things and once we got that under control and I stopped the power struggles with her over grades she’s a lot more pleasant to live with and I no longer wish I could just send her to boarding school. Anyway, ignore if that’s not relevant. Sorry things are so rough, middle school age is by far the hardest I’ve dealt with as a parent.
I'm here. I teach middle school. When I say it doesn't matter in the long run, it doesn't matter at all. Let her fail. It could really help and it most likely won't hurt.
Have you talked to a school counselor? Her teacher or advisor?
Middle school kids are frustrating as hell and while a fair amount of this is normal, a 6 hour tantrum is not. I hope you can find someone to get through to her...sounds tough
"Hello babies. Welcome to Earth. It's hot in the summer and cold in the winter. It's round and wet and crowded. On the outside, babies, you've got a hundred years here. There's only one rule that I know of, babies-"God damn it, you've got to be kind.”
waverly - it’s an awful way to live. For a while we just acted like a family of 3 and just let DD1 do whatever she wanted (within reason and bounds of safety). It was much more peaceful, but it made me sad.
She says she doesn’t know why she is grounded today. Doesn’t seem to get it. Today since I’m not arguing with her, but won’t let her out with her friends, she’s picking fights with DD2.
She will now misbehave in front of others, which is new. She’s never disrespectful if DH or I aren’t there, but she will not tantrum in front of others.
I wonder if it would be easier if her behavior was the same everywhere. Like, at least I would know what to expect?
I don't know. I know my nephew has thrown tantrums in parking lots, and that was very disruptive because it was a safety issue with the cars as well.
mommyatty - no ODD, because it’s only me and DH. She’s perfectly behaved in school, sports, for her piano teacher, most sitters. Our former nanny will also catch the brunt of her temper because she spent so much time caring for her. Very respectful of all authority figures except for me and DH... probably because she doesn’t see us as authority figures.... which is 100% our fault.
TWERK and DDOT: I held crow pose for 20 seconds multiple times today, so I don't think it's just a fluke. I'm kind of feeling like a yoga rockstar today lol.
mae0111, If it truly is just behavior issues with you and H, maybe you almost need a "super nanny" type consultant to help you create behavior plans and reset expectations? When my kids are totally off the wall at home, I try to remind myself that home is their safe space and they feel like they can let their guards down there after holding it in all day at school.
Tomorrow is going to be my kids’ last day with our school pod. We’ve been doing it for the last two months, everyday 8-12 until we went back hybrid four weeks ago, and 3 days 8-12 since. We have a two week fall break and when school starts again on 11/2, we’re going to do the distance learning support program through the ymca Monday/Wednesday (the kids are in school in person Tuesday/Thursday), and then we’re on the wait list for Fridays at the Y.
I was sort of the one who put together the school pod, but another family hosted it in their garage, and my first grade boy and their son just had too much fun together/had behavior issues, and the teacher was not great at ‘classroom management.’ So it made it really hard for the host parents to work. I wanted to make the decision to leave before it got to the point where they might ask us to leave, and making the decision before fall break gives them time to find a couple other kids so the teacher can still have a job and current other families can still go. I feel very lucky to have made friends with the two other families, and wanted to leave soon enough to stay friends with them. I’m sure we’ll still have outdoor play dates.
Going back hybrid meant there’s essentially no instruction on the 3 asynchronous days, so I’ll be fine if the YMCA is more just like day camp and we have to help 1st-grade DS some with school work those evenings. It will be amazing to not have them come home at noon 3x a week and interrupt our work days. So fingers crossed it works out ok.
I suspect that there will still be behavior issues after we’ve left. But at least I won’t have to stress about inconveniencing other parents.
k3am, my DD was using my iPad today when I was texting with the other pod moms about our decision, and she came into my office in tears. I do feel bad for her because she likes the pod and would be fine anywhere - our decisions revolve around what’s best for DS, since he needs more school help and is tougher behaviorally.
I tried to explain how tough this year is for everyone and that I’m sure she’ll make friends at the YMCA program too. I promised lots of play dates with the pod kids, and said we could ask the pod teacher to come tutor her if she wanted. I also expect complaints from DS, since when he’s in his morning zoom everyday he’s still going to see his two classmates at the pod
sdlaura I’m tired of things being so hard. We all want what’s best for our kids. Our kids don’t see that, but that’s really all that we are aiming for.
k3am, sdlaura - it sounds like you’re both doing the right thing. I’m sorry that it’s been so tough.
I’m struggling with whether or not to pull my kids for the winter term. The windows are open at school no matter what. We’ve already had some 40° days and my kids were freezing. It’s only going to get colder here. They can’t learn like that. Kids supposedly can’t wear hats or coats in the classroom and must be in uniform. Teachers let them wear coats but the principal makes them take them off.
They town where the school is located has gone red, as have most surrounding towns. The spike is tied to a hockey tournament, so the principal had doubled down and is keeping the school open “with more caution”. So no chance of closing windows. I want to pull them when the weather gets cold again, but the kids want to stay in school.
Yeah it really doesn’t seem sustainable, but she hasn’t come up with another option. She has hepa filters in the classrooms and now the heat is on, but I just don’t see how this can continue. I need to talk to the principal about it because the teachers agree that the kids can’t learn when they’re cold.
mae0111, Our middle school is in the same boat with the open windows. The school is so, so old the ventilation system is awful. Renovations for the school passed on the ballot in the spring, but obviously couldn't happen fast enough to solve covid air problems. It sucks.
On the flip side, our school building is relatively new, they put in fancy new filtration systems, and we have the climate where windows can stay open or they could teach year round outside. Plus we’ve had low covid numbers this whole time. Yet there seems to be no plan to move from hybrid to full time.