Question for those who have done major reno or build

[rikki]

How much extra (percentage is fine for comparison) were you over budget and how much longer did it take? I am ready to lose it with my builder and my stress is at an all time high. Wondering if I am off base. 

[RockNVoll]

I've been where you are and feel your pain. We built from scratch and kept a pretty tight rein on any creep. We were no more than a couple of percentage points over budget.

[dove]

I did a kitchen gut and didn’t go over budget but did go on a lot longer than anticipated. They said I’d have a new kitchen in time for Thanksgiving, then Christmas and reality was mid-January.
It was so worth it, though.

[Susie]

We did a bathroom gut reno, with a budget of $15k and no more than a week of completely unusable down time, since it was our only full bathroom.  Reality was more like $18k and 3 weeks, plus the extra weeks beyond that of limited function.  It wasn't totally done for almost 1.5 month, although we rigged things up to use it in the interim.  It was worth it, but ... sigh.

[devonpow]

We went waaaay over initial budget on our two major renovations (kitchen and basement/media room). Part of it was due to unexpected costs (1905 house - particularly in kitchen we discovered various things when we opened up the walls), but a lot of it honestly was due to DH (and me, but mostly him lol) having expensive taste and continually adding to the scope.

[cosmowife]

100% over budget (yes, double what we budgeted ugh). However, we hit MAJOR issues behind the walls - basically everything you could think of. Then when we were about to close up the house and start the finish work, we discovered that the entire HVAC system was totally shot (like even the duct work had disintegrated into nothing but dirt tunnels beneath the slab). We ended up having to put in a special system that was $40k because we don’t have a basement or attic and there was literally nowhere to run the new duct work except through bulkheads and tops of closets. So I hope you aren’t having as bad of an experience as we did!

[devonpow]

Oh for time our kitchen was done a week early (!) but was still a 4 month renovation. The media room we did last year took FOREVER, and got really stalled near the end waiting on cabinets and audio visual wiring. It was really frustrating. That one took 3 months which was crazy.

[simpsongal]

I projected $70k for our project, it’ll be $100k at the end. No differing site conditions just increased scope. Timeline is holding strong though! We’ll have a slight delay bc cabinets are taking 6-7 weeks.

[aprilsails]

We did our own first floor gut and complete renovation. Scope creep accounted for about $4k in additional costs on what should have been a $27k job. In the end we hired drywall and ceiling refinishers and a painter because it just wasn’t getting done. The schedule was the biggest issue because we were really beholden to BIL to help us with a lot of the work. I think it took two months longer than “planned”.

We did A full basement gut and renovation and also replaced our HVAc, water tank and relocated our utility room and laundry room to fix the layout. No scope creep and no extended work. Might have gone $1k over planned budget because some plumbing work had to be done in stages. The guys who did the work were starting a new house construction project that spring and were anxious to wrap our project up so they could get started. They did come back to do some minor trim work type stuff on a couple of rainy spring days, but we were certainly moved into and enjoying the space at that point. $30k budget.

For both of these projects we were very much our own GCs. We sourced and bought all the materials and often did our own labour. They were not spaces with fancy finishes either, in terms of hardwoods, IKEA cabinets or countertops. It was a big upgrade to a 20 year old starter home in terms of layout modification and cosmetics, but we were not dealing with structural, water or insulation issues.

[mrsukyankee]

We went about 5% over budget for our first reno, about 8% over for our second and 20% over for our third. The first two were more normal overages, but the third was due to needing more steels, making some changes in our choices about work and our local council asking for things we and our contractor didn't expect. Timelines always went over and the 3rd time went over quite significantly (multiple weeks). We expected the overages in time and money overall - I think we figured, based on average of speaking to others, of going over by about 10% in time and money.

[jinkies]

My SIL and I both just did major kitchen renos (gutted down to the studs, took out a wall).

Hers took at least double the original time estimate. She kept joking that he was trying to stall until they were close enough to Thanksgiving that he would get an invite.

I don't know how much over budget he was, but he was being paid hourly so I'm guessing a lot.

Our reno stayed on time, but I will say that the quality probably suffered because of it. Like, there was an entire section of toe-kick under the cabinets that we realized weeks later had not been attached to cabinets at all. I guess one of the workers leaned it up against the cabinet, and then they lost track of which sections had been nailed. We didn't realize until they were long gone and the dog knocked it out of place. The last patch of drywall that had to be spackled was also a mess because it was rushed (he did come back and fix it). Stuff like that. It stood out in comparison to my SIL's kitchen, which was meticulous.

We stayed largely on budget, but we had negotiated a flat rate for labor as opposed to paying them an hourly rate. We did owe about $1500 extra at the end because of some extra work we had him do while he was here.

[dr.girlfriend]

Probably not what you want to hear, but the only cost overrun was related to our roof replacement, because we turned out to have multiple layers of asphalt shingles over cedar shingles, so it took them twice as long. Even that I think might not have gotten passed along to us separately if we hadn't broken the roof out as a separate cost related to solar. Otherwise, we went over our alottments in a few ways, most notably our floors -- I basically got really picky about the floor and it was $4k extra for the one I chose. Otherwise, it was small things like faucets, etc. that we just cash-flowed our overages.  We also did built-ins that added another $10k-ish.  All in, I would expect that we spent about $205k as opposed to our original $150k plan, but $40k of that was for solar/roof (but then we got 30% back in tax credits), $4k was overage on floors, and then another $15k for built-ins and miscellaneous overages.

The timeline for the renovation itself went as planned. The planning stage took a whole year longer than we planned, mostly because of delays related to zoning and our architect, who was dealing with her husband's terminal illness so she was not getting plans done but we also were not comfortable pressuring her.

[ssmjlm]

When we did our custom build we didn't go over budget by much. Mostly on finishes, things like special glass in the kitchen cabinets, upgrading counter tops in some bathrooms, lighting (both recessed and regular). We pretty much stayed on time once we broke ground.

My parents are doing a custom build now and if you ask my dad, they haven't been on budget for anything, but that's all their doing based on what they picked. I did think they stayed on budget in bathroom fixtures and lighting fixtures. Time wise they've had some delays due to COVID and things shutting down, since that was right when they were getting ready to close on the construction loan and break ground.

[k3am]

We did a gut reno of our bathroom last year. Original time estimate was 4 weeks, I assumed it would take at least 6, and in reality, it took closer to 4 freaking months. Mainly because they kept screwing everything up and having to do things 2-3 times before they got it right.

Price wise, we were 32% over budget. A couple items were due to change orders on our end - like heated floors, that hadn't been budgeted in, but most of them weren't.

I will never use this company again, and I will take every opportunity to advise others not to as well. Anytime I see their name pop up on Nextdoor or elsewhere, I have to leave a comment.

[sandandsea]

We ended up at 20% over budget, mostly due to our own choosing of more expensive finishes. But we decided consciously that it was worth it. We were also given a 6 week timeline that turned into 4 months due to the contractor’s supplier issues. Our contractor was okay but the two places he recommended were bad. We don’t recommend or not recommend him. The finished product is great even though it was a pain getting there.

[Mrs.flang]

I don’t even remember how much over in cost we went, probably around 10%. The time overrun was more what drove me crazy. Original timeline was 3 months. We moved into my parents house and were there for 5 months, and the project still wasn’t completed. It dragged on for about 2 more months at the end with all the little punch list items and problems we found after moving back in ...

[hbomdiggity]

We completely reworked the layout of the back of the house (3 rooms), which also required residing two sides of the house. I don’t recall exact cost overruns, but it wasn’t terrible.

We self performed a lot. While that helped keep the overruns (well the entire budget) manageable, it also meant the schedule went from a hopeful 4-5 months to 11 before we had a functioning master bath.

And then we ended up relocating for a job 2 months later.

[dr.girlfriend]

Oct 20, 2020 21:58:37 GMT -5 hbomdiggity said:

We completely reworked the layout of the back of the house (3 rooms), which also required residing two sides of the house. I don’t recall exact cost overruns, but it wasn’t terrible.

We self performed a lot. While that helped keep the overruns (well the entire budget) manageable, it also meant the schedule went from a hopeful 4-5 months to 11 before we had a functioning master bath.

And then we ended up relocating for a job 2 months later.

OH NO!!!!  Hopefully it was worth it in sweat equity!

[hamster]

We did an addition last year. Our contractor said he hoped he could beat his initial quote, but we ended up right on (I actually think he took a slight hit to get us there.) However we ended up adding a bunch of stuff to put us well over. That final bill about made me choke.

[mrsukyankee]

rikki, just thought I'd follow up and see how things are going. Sounded like you posted at a moment of frustration - feel free to bitch on here, we've all done it!

[rikki]

I can’t believe that I forgot I posted this.

We were expecting a change order for our roof and a couple of small things, probably about 30k or so. We never agreed to any changes verbally or otherwise other than the roof and minor electric. We knew they made some masonry changes, etc but most of them were their mistakes or things they said were no problem and that they would handle. We never agreed to any plumbing additions nor did we even know there was an issue. We got a $106,000 change order. Our contract says all change orders need to be signed in advance. I’m seething and we are getting ready for a fight but also just want our house done and to move back in - we were supposed to be back in early October.
ETA - all of these things have already been done

[rikki]

Also, none of this is for anything cosmetic. I am picking some different finishes that cost more than budgeted, but that was a choice, and I feel like I actually benefit from it.

[dr.girlfriend]

Nov 15, 2020 14:37:29 GMT -5 rikki said:

I can’t believe that I forgot I posted this.

We were expecting a change order for our roof and a couple of small things, probably about 30k or so. We never agreed to any changes verbally or otherwise other than the roof and minor electric. We knew they made some masonry changes, etc but most of them were their mistakes or things they said were no problem and that they would handle. We never agreed to any plumbing additions nor did we even know there was an issue. We got a $106,000 change order. Our contract says all change orders need to be signed in advance. I’m seething and we are getting ready for a fight but also just want our house done and to move back in - we were supposed to be back in early October.

That sounds unacceptable to me.

[zarapipe]

Wow. That is insane! So basically it sounds like stuff the builder should have put in the original quote? My husband is a builder, mainly new builds, but occasionally a large remodel. Must of his homes are high end- custom homes upwards of $2 million. He spends days and days bidding a job, down to the nails. His quotes end up being 10-15 pages, legal page length and everything is broken down. He rarely goes over although this year material is increasing rapidly. Other than owners picking finishes over the budgeted allotment he rarely goes over. He constantly says that builders never spend time quoting and often give rough figures and then go over, leaving customers understandably upset.

[rikki]

Nov 15, 2020 21:18:23 GMT -5 zarapipe said:

Wow. That is insane! So basically it sounds like stuff the builder should have put in the original quote? My husband is a builder, mainly new builds, but occasionally a large remodel. Must of his homes are high end- custom homes upwards of $2 million. He spends days and days bidding a job, down to the nails. His quotes end up being 10-15 pages, legal page length and everything is broken down. He rarely goes over although this year material is increasing rapidly. Other than owners picking finishes over the budgeted allotment he rarely goes over. He constantly says that builders never spend time quoting and often give rough figures and then go over, leaving customers understandably upset.

The best part is he told us he prides himself on doing the best bids so he doesn’t go over. He claims these were mostly unforeseen but when pressed I don’t think they actually were. Ugghhhh

[winecat]

rikki- That sounds awful. I hope the resolution isn't too painful.

[ssmjlm]

Oh man, that looks like some really bad planning on their part. I probably would ask for detailed costs breakdown and go over what was discussed and given prior approval. Everything else they would need to probably cover, or cover at least 75%.

[bhnumbers]

We did a major, 3 story addition. Overall it took more than twice as long as our contractor promised. By the time we were able to move back in, the house was livable, but there were dozens of things important things that still needed to be done. They told us the whole project would be done in 8 months, we finally fired them at 16 months.

The main reason we went way over budget was because we had to hired another contractor to finish up what they left undone and fix a bunch of stuff they messed up. We ended up going to mediation and they were ordered to pay us a settlement that covered a good portion (but definitely not all) of the extra work we had to pay for.

[aprilsails]

rikki that change notice would be straight up illegal in my jurisdiction. You need to have the cost in hand, in writing (email counts) before the work goes ahead. I would look to see if they are a member of a state or local construction association of BBB. If they are, I would not hesitate to leverage the use of a complaint to any and all of those groups to have them drop the price. I might also be tempted to retain a lawyer.

You need to go back and see if you have any documentation with respect to increased costs from them. Texts and emails count. I would fight this if I were you. It would be worth it for that much money. Hell, o spent a morning fighting with our builder over a $4000 Change notice where he did the math wrong.

[aprilsails]

rikki I would also ask him to break it up. Take the line items that you agreed to and for which the price seems reasonable (if there are any actually) and highlight them and send them back to him. I would pay those so as not to be seen as overly combative.

In my experience, all CCNs are priced 25-50% over actual cost. This doesn’t surprise me considering I work in the construction field. So there is always wiggle room but I get the impression he is out to lunch.