I'm sure I won't say this perfectly but I'm feeling really, really frustrated by the continued pushing of the idea that BS needs to present herself as composed, "play the game" etc, etc in order to rid herself of this conservativeship.
For one thing, I'm fairly certain this is a fallacy in the first place. It's series of complex laws and policies that are keeping it in place. Not a speech, and the fact that it is being presented this way in this post continuously is placing a TON of blame and responsibility on Spears who is the victim here.
Additionally there is a strong thread of a ableism here. Maybe it's not intentional but it sounds to me like the thought is that in order for BS to get out from this she must somehow present as perfect, composed, completely prepared and thereby the perfect victim.
It's ableist in that the suggestion in that unless Spears presents as "perfect" (composed, not rambling, saying everything just so) she is NOT competent.
There is a big area of grey between these two ends. Including the idea that because Spears is the victim in her conservativeship she doesn't KNOW all the ins and outs OF it, and blaming her for that ignorance is..in fact ableism.
I feel bad for her, and think that this situation could happen to any one of us, because it's the laws and systems in place that are chains.
It is an ableist system. It’s especially obvious in cases like this where the person has to literally prove they are mentally and physically “able” to take care of themselves. She’s not supposed to present herself as a victim, I’m not sure where that is coming from.
It’s really not a fallacy that she needs to follow the rules and law to overturn the conservatorship. She does have to prove that she can handle her own life and has a plan in order for it to end. We can wish that wasn’t the case all we want but that doesn’t change facts. It’s up to the judge. She needs to convince the judge she is a fully functional person and can take care of herself. The entire judicial system isn’t going to be overhauled overnight.
No one here is blaming Britney. I know I’ve said many times her lawyers are failing her by not working with her on her statement and filing the correct paperwork. I have no clue what the problem is there. They are the experts. They should be helping her and telling her what is going on. Maybe they are and she doesn’t understand. Maybe they aren’t doing their jobs and are stealing her money. Who knows?
There is a lot of hoops to go through to get conservatorship. They had expert witnesses and testimonies that said she couldn’t take care of herself and that satisfied the judge 13 years ago and to this day. This isn’t something that happens to people randomly. It takes time, money and a lot of effort to do. Being a conservator is a lot of work and responsibility. It’s difficult to end because people under it need a lot of care; they are severely mentally ill, have dementia or major developmental disabilities. No one is pulling people off the street and doing this to them.
Britney apparently had a major mental health crisis and was unable to care for herself so her family and the courts stepped in. If she is fine now then the yes, she does have to prove that to the court. It’s similar to how someone who lost custody of their children has to prove they are a fit parent to get them back. It’s how our legal system works.
I'm sure I won't say this perfectly but I'm feeling really, really frustrated by the continued pushing of the idea that BS needs to present herself as composed, "play the game" etc, etc in order to rid herself of this conservativeship.
For one thing, I'm fairly certain this is a fallacy in the first place. It's series of complex laws and policies that are keeping it in place. Not a speech, and the fact that it is being presented this way in this post continuously is placing a TON of blame and responsibility on Spears who is the victim here.
Additionally there is a strong thread of a ableism here. Maybe it's not intentional but it sounds to me like the thought is that in order for BS to get out from this she must somehow present as perfect, composed, completely prepared and thereby the perfect victim.
It's ableist in that the suggestion in that unless Spears presents as "perfect" (composed, not rambling, saying everything just so) she is NOT competent.
There is a big area of grey between these two ends. Including the idea that because Spears is the victim in her conservativeship she doesn't KNOW all the ins and outs OF it, and blaming her for that ignorance is..in fact ableism.
I feel bad for her, and think that this situation could happen to any one of us, because it's the laws and systems in place that are chains.
Complete agree. There have been several conservatorship lawyers interviewed on the news lately that have explained how Britney is being completely taken advantage of and has been f*cked over throughout the year. Saying that she should have been more well-spoken at her hearing is making me feel enraged.
On another note, Jamie’s lawyer is trying to blame Jodie Montgomery now, and she came back swinging. People has an article about it. She said she is going to start creating the path for Britney to have the support she needs as she works to end the conservatorship.
I haven’t read though the whole thread and I’ve never been a huge Britney fan but I’m heartbroken at how the legal system is failing her. I feel like this is similar to a catch 22 with child custody. The court should act in the best interest of her, but they are relying so much on past precedent. Things have gone fine since her dad has been conservator, so why change it? And she’s telling them that is not the case. I don’t understand why they can’t make incremental changes or allow changes on a temporary basis and re-evaluate in a few months with the goal being her regaining more independence. It’s ridiculous that she is nearly 40 and has less autonomy than a 16 year old regardless of mental health issues.
I also feel like there are so many reasons to remove her dad. That she’s requested a change in conservator after many years should be enough. This should have happened when her dad and son got in an altercation and it impacted her visitation time. I don’t think a conservator who is profiting immensely from her is the best choice and has the past relationship history is a good idea. Major decisions could be by committee of 2-3 people. They could further define what the conservator is allowed to have control over, I.e. financial decisions over $10k, make sure she is getting mental health care regularly, but not things like reproductive decisions or leaving her home getting her nails done (beyond what is legally allowed - if a nail salon in CA was allowed to be open, she should have been able make the adult decision to go to it or not).
The IUD shows they are medically controlling her. If she wants another kid, even if she had a disability that completely prevented her from physically taking care of them, she has the means to hire nannies or do whatever she needed to to make sure her child was taken care of. I have no doubt they are controlling her with meds, which may be needed but it also allows them to be extremely manipulative of her and with her not being allowed to seek her own counsel, almost everyone around her is controlled by her dad (except maybe her boyfriend).
There seem to be two options- everyone is conspiring against her, or there is info we don’t know.
One thing that this thread made me think is, what if some of Britney’s complaints aren’t true? Like how the judge said Britney hasn’t petitioned to get married. So Britney is saying her father is controlling her and refusing to allow her to marry, but she hasn’t tried to get married? Is she engaged? Maybe she blames her father for things that aren’t his fault, is what I mean. Her complaints about her nails, I see both sides- she should be allowed to make that (at the time dangerous) decision but I can see how a reasonable conservator would say no, this is a life or death medical decision and your nails can wait. How did she not know she could petition to end the conservatorship until “8 days ago?” There’s been a “Free Britney” movement for years. Does she forget? Does she not understand? Does she not have Google? There’s something up.
I don’t KNOW if any of this is true, but it’s a possibility. Maybe many of Britney’s allegations aren’t based in reality, but people involved lack the ability to correct her publicly due to confidentiality.
This is basically where I am at. A ton of it doesn’t add up but we don’t know what or why. Are her lawyers awful grifters who don’t care about her or are they telling her things and she doesn’t understand?
The recent New Yorker article strangely relies heavily on Sam Lutfi who always around troubled women when they are at their low points—Britney, Courtney Love and Amanda Bynes— and I don’t think he’s a trustworthy source at all. They briefly mention some of the controversy, legal issues and many allegations about him but then treat what he and his sister are saying as reasonable and true. Why? That just seems like poor journalism.
There must be massive NDAs for everyone she comes in contact with so I get there isn’t much info out there but I wish places would just say that. Interviewing people who don’t really know what is going on and who aren’t trustworthy doesn’t really help but I guess it sells ads.
At the very least it seems like she needs a team that is completely neutral but I don’t know who or how they can get that.
There seem to be two options- everyone is conspiring against her, or there is info we don’t know.
One thing that this thread made me think is, what if some of Britney’s complaints aren’t true? Like how the judge said Britney hasn’t petitioned to get married. So Britney is saying her father is controlling her and refusing to allow her to marry, but she hasn’t tried to get married? Is she engaged? Maybe she blames her father for things that aren’t his fault, is what I mean. Her complaints about her nails, I see both sides- she should be allowed to make that (at the time dangerous) decision but I can see how a reasonable conservator would say no, this is a life or death medical decision and your nails can wait. How did she not know she could petition to end the conservatorship until “8 days ago?” There’s been a “Free Britney” movement for years. Does she forget? Does she not understand? Does she not have Google? There’s something up.
I don’t KNOW if any of this is true, but it’s a possibility. Maybe many of Britney’s allegations aren’t based in reality, but people involved lack the ability to correct her publicly due to confidentiality.
Post by iheartthe90s on Jul 4, 2021 12:04:01 GMT -5
The thing about the lawyers profiting off her: if she got rid of the conservatorship, couldn't she set up some type of "family office" bank situation for herself? I've heard of really wealthy people doing this where they basically handle everything legal and financial for you including things as mundane as paying your bills. They don't control what you do but they facilitate what you want to do and give advice if they think you're spending down your capital too quickly, making dangerous investments, etc. etc. Maybe that is the type of more unrestrictive help she needs.
The thing about the lawyers profiting off her: if she got rid of the conservatorship, couldn't she set up some type of "family office" bank situation for herself? I've heard of really wealthy people doing this where they basically handle everything legal and financial for you including things as mundane as paying your bills. They don't control what you do but they facilitate what you want to do and give advice if they think you're spending down your capital too quickly, making dangerous investments, etc. etc. Maybe that is the type of more unrestrictive help she needs.
Yes. It seems like the court could set up a trust for her and have it managed by a reputable organization. My good friend manages trusts and has to deal with all kinds of people who aren't capable or responsible enough to manage the wealth given to them by family, and so they have an allowance and a certain budget that the trust manager uses to manage their finances and give them "fun money" allowance to use however they want - nails and hair in her case.
I can't see how the courts refuse to see the conflict of interest here. Her parents have lived off her talent her whole life. They have a vested interest in keeping her under lock and key and they benefit more from her money than she does. A trust would be much less of a conflict of interest.
Would be great to see her sister help get her free.
And another thought - I listened to the transcript. It sounded just as coherent - if not moreso - than many Trump speeches as President of the United States of America. He had the nuclear codes and you could barely understand him sometimes. And yet he was free to lead the free world.
“ A Los Angeles Superior Court judge has cleared Britney Spears to hire her own lawyer in the long drawn-out battle over her conservatorship. And the pop star has chosen Mathew S. Rosengart, a prominent Hollywood lawyer and former federal prosecutor, to take up her case.”
Where in the sequence of events do they consider or rule on removing her dad from the conservatorship? All discussions aside about her mental health, it seems like that's the primary thing she wants.
Where in the sequence of events do they consider or rule on removing her dad from the conservatorship? All discussions aside about her mental health, it seems like that's the primary thing she wants.
The article I linked said her new lawyer will be requesting that.
Where in the sequence of events do they consider or rule on removing her dad from the conservatorship? All discussions aside about her mental health, it seems like that's the primary thing she wants.
And where's the consideration that her father and the conservatorship may be the cause of her mental health issues?
Brittany is posting topless-lite pics on IG. The comments are something else.
Yeah, it was the fist image that popped up when I opened Instagram to show my mom something 🙄 I really can't imagine having teenage kids and posting that publicly, let alone imagine how it's going to look in court.
Brittany is posting topless-lite pics on IG. The comments are something else.
Yeah, it was the fist image that popped up when I opened Instagram to show my mom something 🙄 I really can't imagine having teenage kids and posting that publicly, let alone imagine how it's going to look in court.
Brittany is posting topless-lite pics on IG. The comments are something else.
Yeah, it was the fist image that popped up when I opened Instagram to show my mom something 🙄 I really can't imagine having teenage kids and posting that publicly, let alone imagine how it's going to look in court.
Brittany is posting topless-lite pics on IG. The comments are something else.
Yeah, it was the fist image that popped up when I opened Instagram to show my mom something 🙄 I really can't imagine having teenage kids and posting that publicly, let alone imagine how it's going to look in court.
Brittany is posting topless-lite pics on IG. The comments are something else.
Yeah, it was the fist image that popped up when I opened Instagram to show my mom something 🙄 I really can't imagine having teenage kids and posting that publicly, let alone imagine how it's going to look in court.
urg. I'm not done. this is EXACTLY the kind of shit that makes me mad for Brittany and everybody else who struggles with their mental health and ends up in a situation like this. The idea that making a decision to post a racy insta pic should somehow have bearing on court decisions is ASININE. Like, you're right it's not going to look good in court. But WHY THE FUCK IS THAT??? Lots of people of sound mind post half naked insta pics ALL THE GODDAMN TIME. this woman has made a goddamn fortune in part by titilating audiences with her body while singing and dancing. But because she wants to hold her goddamn titties and take a hot pic we're going to tutt tutt and think that's a a valid reason for the courts to decide she can't handle her own affairs. Would I do it? nah. My tits don't look that good, and my career is not based on people thinking I'm hot though.
What you said is what so many fucking busy bodies are thinking, so pls dont' feel the need to defend yourself - but THIS is not ok actually. IT SOUDLN'T MATTER ONE LICK IN COURT. IT JUST FUCKIGN SHOULNT'. when I got all shouty in the other thread about how this whole system is fucked, THIS is the kind of thing I meant. She very well may have had a period where she could not manage her own affairs or make her own legal decisions. But it sure as shit seems like from what people who seem to know things have said here, and how this whole thing is portrayed that she has to be 100% perfect, 100% articulate, 100% crystal clean spotless girl scout behavior in order to regain control of her own life and that's just not ok. it's not. That's too high of a bar. Maybe she's actually not at all ok and can't make her own decisions. Or maybe she's just a messy person who might fuck shit up and the people riding her gravy train are afraid to let her crash and burn like a normal fucking person. It's awfully hard to tell, but people talking about stupid shit like a boob shot in insta as actually somehow being relevant to her court case make me see red.
I am curious - for the actual lawyers here - IS something like this relevant? please say no.
Britney Spears new attorney files for new conservator, an experienced CPA who is apparently a forensic accountant with experience handling portfolios over $35M.
ETA: I just read that her lawyer got the hearing moved from December to September to have her father removed and a new conservator appointed. He's doing his job well. Good for her for picking him to represent her.
Britney Spears new attorney files for new conservator, an experienced CPA who is apparently a forensic accountant with experience handling portfolios over $35M.
ETA: I just read that her lawyer got the hearing moved from December to September to have her father removed and a new conservator appointed. He's doing his job well. Good for her for picking him to represent her.
I love that she has this lawyer now. It sounds like he's not going to let her dad off so easily.
Yeah, it was the fist image that popped up when I opened Instagram to show my mom something 🙄 I really can't imagine having teenage kids and posting that publicly, let alone imagine how it's going to look in court.
urg. I'm not done. this is EXACTLY the kind of shit that makes me mad for Brittany and everybody else who struggles with their mental health and ends up in a situation like this. The idea that making a decision to post a racy insta pic should somehow have bearing on court decisions is ASININE. Like, you're right it's not going to look good in court. But WHY THE FUCK IS THAT??? Lots of people of sound mind post half naked insta pics ALL THE GODDAMN TIME. this woman has made a goddamn fortune in part by titilating audiences with her body while singing and dancing. But because she wants to hold her goddamn titties and take a hot pic we're going to tutt tutt and think that's a a valid reason for the courts to decide she can't handle her own affairs. Would I do it? nah. My tits don't look that good, and my career is not based on people thinking I'm hot though.
What you said is what so many fucking busy bodies are thinking, so pls dont' feel the need to defend yourself - but THIS is not ok actually. IT SOUDLN'T MATTER ONE LICK IN COURT. IT JUST FUCKIGN SHOULNT'. when I got all shouty in the other thread about how this whole system is fucked, THIS is the kind of thing I meant. She very well may have had a period where she could not manage her own affairs or make her own legal decisions. But it sure as shit seems like from what people who seem to know things have said here, and how this whole thing is portrayed that she has to be 100% perfect, 100% articulate, 100% crystal clean spotless girl scout behavior in order to regain control of her own life and that's just not ok. it's not. That's too high of a bar. Maybe she's actually not at all ok and can't make her own decisions. Or maybe she's just a messy person who might fuck shit up and the people riding her gravy train are afraid to let her crash and burn like a normal fucking person. It's awfully hard to tell, but people talking about stupid shit like a boob shot in insta as actually somehow being relevant to her court case make me see red.
I am curious - for the actual lawyers here - IS something like this relevant? please say no.
But it likely will. Having gone through just a divorce and custody case, my lawyer advised me on what not to send via text to my ex and what not to post on social media, and how she had seen those things work against (or for if the other party posted them) her clients.
I really don't give two shits if people want to take nude pics of themselves - hell, I have. But common damn sense says posting them on social media is not the brightest idea. Can you imagine if a dude had posted a dick pic with a star covering it? Would people be saying it was empowering, or just weird?
urg. I'm not done. this is EXACTLY the kind of shit that makes me mad for Brittany and everybody else who struggles with their mental health and ends up in a situation like this. The idea that making a decision to post a racy insta pic should somehow have bearing on court decisions is ASININE. Like, you're right it's not going to look good in court. But WHY THE FUCK IS THAT??? Lots of people of sound mind post half naked insta pics ALL THE GODDAMN TIME. this woman has made a goddamn fortune in part by titilating audiences with her body while singing and dancing. But because she wants to hold her goddamn titties and take a hot pic we're going to tutt tutt and think that's a a valid reason for the courts to decide she can't handle her own affairs. Would I do it? nah. My tits don't look that good, and my career is not based on people thinking I'm hot though.
What you said is what so many fucking busy bodies are thinking, so pls dont' feel the need to defend yourself - but THIS is not ok actually. IT SOUDLN'T MATTER ONE LICK IN COURT. IT JUST FUCKIGN SHOULNT'. when I got all shouty in the other thread about how this whole system is fucked, THIS is the kind of thing I meant. She very well may have had a period where she could not manage her own affairs or make her own legal decisions. But it sure as shit seems like from what people who seem to know things have said here, and how this whole thing is portrayed that she has to be 100% perfect, 100% articulate, 100% crystal clean spotless girl scout behavior in order to regain control of her own life and that's just not ok. it's not. That's too high of a bar. Maybe she's actually not at all ok and can't make her own decisions. Or maybe she's just a messy person who might fuck shit up and the people riding her gravy train are afraid to let her crash and burn like a normal fucking person. It's awfully hard to tell, but people talking about stupid shit like a boob shot in insta as actually somehow being relevant to her court case make me see red.
I am curious - for the actual lawyers here - IS something like this relevant? please say no.
But it likely will. Having gone through just a divorce and custody case, my lawyer advised me on what not to send via text to my ex and what not to post on social media, and how she had seen those things work against (or for if the other party posted them) her clients.
I really don't give two shits if people want to take nude pics of themselves - hell, I have. But common damn sense says posting them on social media is not the brightest idea. Can you imagine if a dude had posted a dick pic with a star covering it? Would people be saying it was empowering, or just weird?
I don't give a flying fuck if it's empowering or weird. I'm not sure how that's relevant? It's not indicative (at least to me...I suppose you could argue otherwise if you really wanted to go there) of a diminished mental capacity such that you shouldn't be allowed control of your own affairs. the fact that a judge's interpretation of moral character and sound decision making ability as shown by things like how classy your social media postings are is relevant to something like child custody or divorce proceedings or mental health is really flipping shitty. It's something I hate about our entire system, that we're still such a prudish society and make judgements that have huge affects on people's lives based on stupid shit. You might think it's trashy or weird or inappropriate to be seen by children, but one can be trashy or weird or inconsiderate of the delicate eyes of the youths and still be of sound mind.
also a dick is not the same thing as boobs. but that's totally secondary.
Yeah, it was the fist image that popped up when I opened Instagram to show my mom something 🙄 I really can't imagine having teenage kids and posting that publicly, let alone imagine how it's going to look in court.
urg
I am curious - for the actual lawyers here - IS something like this relevant? please say no.
In and of itself, probably not super relevant. With that said, her lawyer probably isn't particularly pleased.
The pictures she posted aren't terrible. I mean, there's no nips or anything showing. But she's just giving out the "other side" evidence to use against her. I'm guessing they're going to work the angle of "she has really really bad judgment" pretty hard, so if I had to guess, these photos would be one of a whole basket of evidence to that regard.
I am curious - for the actual lawyers here - IS something like this relevant? please say no.
In and of itself, probably not super relevant. With that said, her lawyer probably isn't particularly pleased.
The pictures she posted aren't terrible. I mean, there's no nips or anything showing. But she's just giving out the "other side" evidence to use against her. I'm guessing they're going to work the angle of "she has really really bad judgment" pretty hard, so if I had to guess, these photos would be one of a whole basket of evidence to that regard.
That's...as expected I guess. But if it'd been on an album cover it'd been a-ok! Hrm.
In and of itself, probably not super relevant. With that said, her lawyer probably isn't particularly pleased.
The pictures she posted aren't terrible. I mean, there's no nips or anything showing. But she's just giving out the "other side" evidence to use against her. I'm guessing they're going to work the angle of "she has really really bad judgment" pretty hard, so if I had to guess, these photos would be one of a whole basket of evidence to that regard.
That's...as expected I guess. But if it'd been on an album cover it'd been a-ok! Hrm.
Well, if it was an album cover, it probably wouldn't have been her decision. 😉
That's...as expected I guess. But if it'd been on an album cover it'd been a-ok! Hrm.
Well, if it was an album cover, it probably wouldn't have been her decision. 😉
That's the part that grates on me. It's apparently fine if the cash cow is directed by her (male, mostly) handlers to bare her body in her performances she is essentially being compelled to do for their financial benefit, but how dare she get to make similar decisions about her own body, she's clearly an unstable bimbo with no self respect.
Well, if it was an album cover, it probably wouldn't have been her decision. 😉
That's the part that grates on me. It's apparently fine if the cash cow is directed by her (male, mostly) handlers to bare her body in her performances she is essentially being compelled to do for their financial benefit, but how dare she get to make similar decisions about her own body, she's clearly an unstable bimbo with no self respect.
This is my biggest issue with it. As a lawyer, I agree with those who say this probably wasn't a great idea. But that's because I would be advising my client to lay as low as possible to avoid giving the other side ANYTHING to talk about or raise - whether it's valid or not is sort of beside the point at this juncture, strictly speaking for the purpose of her upcoming hearings. But the fact that she is FORCED to parade around on stage in view of millions of people in a similar state to make money for these vultures, but is going to be eviscerated in court by the same people for CHOOSING to show her body in the same manner is all manner of royally fucked up.