I'll try to keep this short but that's not my strong suit haha. My DS will be 5 in August. Swim lessons are important to me for obvious reasons; we have a boat and spend a lot of time at the pool and lake; I was also a lifeguard and love the water so I want my DS to be a proficient swimmer. He loves the water but is always wearing a life jacket or puddle jumper. We do not have any indoor pools where I live, so options for lessons are basically summer only. We did some mommy & me lessons maybe 3 years ago, then the following year I think lessons got canceled because of a teacher being sick, and then last year they weren't offering anything because of Covid. So, we haven't had many opportunities for lessons. Lessons offered this summer were ages 5 and up, and I asked if it would be OK for him to join since he's not quite 5 yet, vs. waiting for next year, and they said that was fine. I tried to pump him up for them, explained how he'd learn how to swim without a floatie like some of his older friends, said we could get a special toy if he completed the week and did a good job listening. He seemed into it. I was hopeful.
We get to the pool today and he.would.not.get.in.the.pool. He just kept circling me and staying near me and refusing to get in. The threat of me not getting him the toy he really wanted (a transformer) did not work. Me saying he would lose his tablet and TV for the rest of the week (definitely his currency) also did nothing. He kept saying that "he didn't know any of those kids" and "he didn't want people looking at him" and that "he just wants to do his own stuff in the pool." I got frustrated with him and tried forcing him (not the best idea, I know) in and then he tried to pinch and bite me. The head lifeguard (whose also a local teacher) was super nice and patient to him, tried to talk to him, got him a snack, said he could just watch, etc. but he never got in for the entire 1.5 hours. I spoke with her and decided to ultimately switch him to the Mommy and Me lessons that are next week in the evening, hoping he'll do better with me in the water with him, but I know he'll have a tough time listening there too. At least I'll be in the water to redirect him though.
I am just SO embarrassed. He was one of the only kids who just would not get with the program. All the other kids were listening and doing a great job. This is also part of a pattern where he doesn't seem to do great in group activities. He was a hot mess in gymnastics a few years ago. Which leads me to worry because I have him signed up for soccer in the fall and my mental state can't take him acting like that at every game/practice. He seems to be fine at daycare and also at this one day a week camp thing that he goes to, though, so I don't know. I just worry based on these behaviors, only wanting to do what he wants to do, etc. - that he will struggle with behavior when he goes to school (he starts preschool in the fall).
I'm not sure my goal in posting exactly except I'm super upset and if any of you all have advice, commiseration, etc. I would greatly appreciate it.
I think this is pretty common and it comes down to patience, which is hard. In my 4 yo's swim class last month, there was one kid who was just not having it. The instructor didn't force anything and tried to engage him at his level. The goal changes from helping them become proficient swimmers to just being comfortable in the water first.
My older kid was like this with some activities when he was younger (karate). I understand the frustration & embarrassment. I was like WTF kid!? He's not like that for all activities. This was just one he didn't like.
I've been there and I was also that kid! I actually would recommend you leaving during his lessons, if that is allowed. Maybe have him sit on the side of the pool. He may eventually participate. He may not, but observing is also an important skill.
Just wanted to say that my kids have taken a ton of swimming lessons and at that age, there is always at least one kiddo who doesn’t want to do it and refuses! Indoor pool. Outdoor pool. Always at least one.
My kids never refused swimming, but DD put up a fight for most other things including preschool, pre-K, kinder, dance, gymnastics, etc. it was a thing where she didn’t want to leave me and also didn’t want people to look at her, but she enjoyed the activities. So. Effing. Frustrating.
Been there - with both of my kids actually. When Ds1 was 3 he wouldn’t get in. It was a week long thing and we went everyday and I think he got in at the end of the 4th day? I didn’t try again until he was 5 or 6. Ds2 also was stubborn about getting in the first session we did.
Bc of covid I signed them up for semi private lessons last summer (age 4 and 7) and ds2 loved them and never refused.
I’ve also had the kid who didn’t want to participate in soccer so we just sat and watched most of the time. It’s ok. Not all kids are cut out to be in big loud group activities. He may surprise you and love it but if he doesn’t s that’s ok too. You’ll find an activity that is more his speed. But, you don’t know unless you try!
I know it can feel embarrassing. I remind myself that their behavior/actions are a form of communication and to just try to be patient. Also if other parents are judging you that’s their issue. Karma will get them lol.
Don’t be embarrassed. Kids are just kids. In every beginner swim class my kids have been in, there’s always been one kid who won’t get in/screams & cries/gets in but refuses to do anything except hang on for dear life.
Also remember, he was given a special accommodation to register for that class. He’s not 5 yet. All of the other kids are at least 5. Kids make huge developmental strides right around that age. It’s not fair to him to compare him to the behavior of kids who are older than him.
Try to keep things positive. Chances are really good that he will come around and do just fine. As far as soccer, he might be the kid on the field picking dandelions. And that’s OK! That comes with the territory. And again, there’s one on every team. If you go with the flow, give him a little space, and really encourage him when he does what is asked, he will figure it out and start to participate. But if you fight him on it, it will become a miserable power struggle. My good friend had the dandelion picker in soccer and I learned a lot from her attitude. She just let him be and let him figure out his path. He now LOVES soccer and is a great player…a few years after only caring about the weeds.
Also - I wouldn’t borrow worry about following directions at school yet - teachers are magic and they have lots of strategies and experience plus - they aren’t the parent so kids tend to be more compliant. Plus, that’s part of why he’s going to preschool! To learn those social skills and grow emotionally. It may not be a smooth road but I bet he will flourish. And if he needs extra help the teachers and you and your H will be there.
Post by icedcoffee on Jul 12, 2021 12:03:32 GMT -5
I think this is super common. My kid is in swim lessons and when he was in level 1 SOOOOOOOO many kids just cried the whole time. It was insane. I totally understand where you are coming from as I also get pissed if my kid doesn't do some random thing I've decided in my head he should do. I would back off for now. He will learn to swim when he wants and in the meantime he will have to wear a puddle jumper or life jacket. You could try mommy and me, but I wonder if that will even help. I would potentially consider a private lesson before I'd do mommy and me.
Also--just because he does this at swimming doesn't mean he'll do it at soccer. My kid was a hot mess at soccer, but he is the polar opposite at swimming. He's attentive, engaged and the teachers beg for us to keep them in their classes when he graduates from one class to the next. At soccer I think they preferred he quit. LOL
Post by icedcoffee on Jul 12, 2021 12:05:23 GMT -5
Oh also--can your H take him to swim lessons? I get super embarrassed and stressed about my kids behavior at soccer so now that's my H's thing. Same with haircuts. I handle swim where he's a perfect angle. It's just that my H doesn't really give a shit and let's it roll off better than me. As a result DS tends to not behave like a lunatic like he does with me. I think he smells my fear. LOL
I have this kid, too! He's 11 now, and things have improved SO much over the years. He's come so far from where he was at your DS's age. He was a hot mess in group activities, didn't want to participate, made a scene, etc.
He eventually was diagnosed with anxiety, including social anxiety, and we've learned how to do things that work for him. He's also been in therapy and worked with the school counselors on coping techniques.
Re: swimming, we put him in one-on-one lessons and that is what worked for him. Re: the rest of life, he has gotten better in groups over time.
My daughter will also be five in August. She has been in the pool before this summer but nothing regular or organized. I swam competitively and want her to learn. We joined a swim club for the summer and do a mix of baby pool with no puddle jumper and big pool with it. Kids learn a lot from just playing so I’m letting that be for now.
I have taken off her puddlejumper in the big pool and tried to get her to float and kick but she’s scared. I get it. I’m letting her lead the way for now and exposing her as much as I can to the pool, water, moving, etc.
All that said, I think a Mommy and Me class is totally appropriate! He’ll learn to swim. It may not be as fast as the kid classes but maybe it’ll be a speed that’s better for him right now.
I would try to drop him off and leave or hide. He may react differently with the teacher than he does with you around. I know my DS is this way.
It also backfired when I tried to leave him at soccer and let him figure it out. The start of the first session was so all over the place with too many kids of different ages, that by the time they corralled him into his age group, he was bewildered. I checked back in after 10 minutes to find him standing there looking like he was scared and about to cry so I took him out for the rest of the session. The following week my husband took him and said he refused to participate so we decided he's not quite ready for that yet.
Thanks for all the feedback! I agree with all of you saying he may have done better had I dropped him off, however, it did not appear to be a drop off event. All the other parents stayed. I tried going to sit on a chair away from the pool and directed him toward the other kids but he just kept following me and would not leave my side. icedcoffee, my H couldn't take him because he had jury duty. He's also a high school principal and works 12 months anyway. The mommy & me lessons will be at 7pm though so I may consider having him bring DS instead.
court26, I know there's at least one kid, I just didn't want it to be mine! lol. There was another little boy who was crying and wouldn't get in, but he was not as openly defiant about it as my DS. He seemed legit scared (I know being afraid manifests in different ways though).
I talked with his daycare teacher when I dropped him off after lessons and told her about how upset I was, and she did make me feel a little better saying he does pretty well there and listens and does what he needs to do, so I don't think all is lost here.
I do think he does better when he isn't with me, which doesn't make me feel great about my parenting skills.
Also remember, he was given a special accommodation to register for that class. He’s not 5 yet. All of the other kids are at least 5. Kids make huge developmental strides right around that age. It’s not fair to him to compare him to the behavior of kids who are older than him.
You're totally right. That said, there were a couple other old 4 year olds in there I believe, but clearly my DS just isn't ready.
I'm going to try the Mommy & Me - I somewhat know the teacher of those, so I may just reach out to her ahead of time to warn her that he had a hard time with the other lessons and we're going to try our best.
As an ex-swim instructor the best thing to do is to talk to the pool ahead of time and drop him off and let the instructor/staff get him in the pool. 99% of the time when mom/dad is out of the way the kid gets in. You don't have to completely leave but you need to go far enough away that he can't see you. Also don't put an almost 5 year old in a mommy and me class. Those are meant for the under 3 crowd.
Post by InBetweenDays on Jul 12, 2021 12:46:59 GMT -5
First of all, there is no reason to be embarrassed. It isn't a parental fail nor is it a moral failure of your son. Some kids just need more time to feel comfortable in these situations and some may never completely feel comfortable.
DD (now 15) was the same way with group activities at that age. At the Gymboree classes she wanted to just hang out with me. She'd barely participate in gymnastics, and her first year of soccer (age 5) she would just stand there on the field not participating at all (but she was adamant that she wanted to play so we kept her on the team).
For swim lessons we ended up doing 1-on-1 lessons at our gym rather than group lessons and it went MUCH better. For soccer it just took time. The entire first year she barely participated but the second year she started getting into it. Now she plays both soccer and lacrosse for her high school teams.
I think this is pretty common and it comes down to patience, which is hard. In my 4 yo's swim class last month, there was one kid who was just not having it. The instructor didn't force anything and tried to engage him at his level. The goal changes from helping them become proficient swimmers to just being comfortable in the water first.
My older kid was like this with some activities when he was younger (karate). I understand the frustration & embarrassment. I was like WTF kid!? He's not like that for all activities. This was just one he didn't like.
I have exactly zero patience (which I need to work on for sure) so it definitely is hard. As soon as he started acting like a fool I was over it.
As an ex-swim instructor the best thing to do is to talk to the pool ahead of time and drop him off and let the instructor/staff get him in the pool. 99% of the time when mom/dad is out of the way the kid gets in. You don't have to completely leave but you need to go far enough away that he can't see you. Also don't put an almost 5 year old in a mommy and me class. Those are meant for the under 3 crowd.
Yes, this is just difficult the way the pool is set up, there's really nowhere to hide. Had I known this would happen I could have maybe pretended I was leaving at the outset and hidden in the entryway or something, but he was too far gone by the time we started and wouldn't leave my side, so I couldn't hide.
I get what you're saying about mommy & me but at this pool the advertisement says ages 1-4 and they asked me if I wanted to switch him to those, so they seem to think it's fine?
I do think he does better when he isn't with me, which doesn't make me feel great about my parenting skills. [/quote]
I know you’ve probably heard this many times, but behavior like this is quite the opposite of reflecting poorly on your parenting skills. It means he trusts you so completely that he can act on 100% of his emotions, no matter how ugly, and you will still love him and be there for him. He feels no need to suck it up or sugarcoat things for you. As a mom, it’s exhausting and frustrating, though!
I do think he does better when he isn't with me, which doesn't make me feel great about my parenting skills.
No, you're doing fine!
I think this is like the kids who sob and cling and daycare drop-off and are fine 5 minutes later. I know both of mine have been that kid at some point.
Well, I would absolutely stop saying he will be punished for this.
Second, I would try to figure out if he is actually anxious or just trying to push my buttons.
Third, I would do everything in my power to act like I don’t give a flip what he does during these lessons. At mommy and me “oh, you don’t want to get in the pool, that’s cool. Sit on this chair and I will be in the water having fun.”
Fourth, I would the reward even the very tiniest of strides. “Oh, you stuck your toe in the water, woohoo, ice cream tonight!!” And recognize that this kid probably won’t learn to swim this summer, but might get a little more comfortable in the water. You are now playing a long game.
Post by thebreakfastclub on Jul 12, 2021 13:34:19 GMT -5
My son took lessons once a week, year round, from ages 3-8, so I have seen it all with him and other kids. It took a year for my son to put his head under water.
He was a typical preschooler and played soccer without concern, has no fears or anxiety. Some kids are just not comfortable in the water and it takes time.
If there is truly no ymca, no swim club, maybe I'd look for a private instructor who can use a hotel pool. There is no way 8 weeks of lessons a year would have made my son comfortable. He needed weekly pool time to make progress.
By age 5, he was good in the water and now can do strokes, etc. But it was a long process.
We have the same kid and we are similar parents. (hugs) beerlover.
Mine's refusal to do things are tied to his fears of dogs, stairs, sharks and swathers however. I'm waiting him out. He's 5 and he will learn to swim at some point. He's in therapy to deal with the dog & stairs fears. We're all just doing the best we can. I react so poorly to his challenges because my emotions are so involved. I was an excellent prek teacher because while I liked most of the kids I taught, I could easily take my emotions out of the equation. Also, I got plenty of breaks from all my students. Being a SAHM is exactly the opposite.
This is super common but frustrating. My kiddo is a big-time observer, so I rely on taking him places to check them out before we go for real (like for a lesson or something). It takes the pressure off and let’s him get used to the environment and see what is going to happen.
Well, I would absolutely stop saying he will be punished for this.
Second, I would try to figure out if he is actually anxious or just trying to push my buttons.
Third, I would do everything in my power to act like I don’t give a flip what he does during these lessons. At mommy and me “oh, you don’t want to get in the pool, that’s cool. Sit on this chair and I will be in the water having fun.”
Fourth, I would the reward even the very tiniest of strides. “Oh, you stuck your toe in the water, woohoo, ice cream tonight!!” And recognize that this kid probably won’t learn to swim this summer, but might get a little more comfortable in the water. You are now playing a long game.
I think it's a little of both. I think it's possible he was legitimately nervous, but he doesn't really act this way in any other situation. He'll go right up to kids at the park or pool and play. He also had no issues starting a new weekly kid's day thing where had to get on a bus and interact with new kids. So the whole "I don't know those kids" excuse seemed odd to me.
I'm sure you're right that I should not have started talking about punishment. It didn't feel right when I was doing it, but I didn't know what else to do besides threaten to take stuff away. Clearly it also didn't work anyway.
Appreciate the other suggestions and I will try and put them into play next week. I am really bad at pretending the behavior doesn't phase me but I will try.
The most frustrating thing to me is that he's not afraid of water at all and loves it. He's just always in some kind of flotation device and that needs to stop eventually. It just may not be this summer. The issue for him is more about the group activity, but I just don't get it.
Is there time that you can be at that pool for open swim? We do lessons but we also go to open swim to honor the kids' requests to just do whatever they want in the pool.
Yes, we go to this pool a fair amount and he gets to run around and do whatever he wants. I'm guessing that's part of the struggle for him, that he wasn't allowed to do that today and had to listen and follow instructions. :/
If there is truly no ymca, no swim club, maybe I'd look for a private instructor who can use a hotel pool. There is no way 8 weeks of lessons a year would have made my son comfortable. He needed weekly pool time to make progress.
It's not even 8 weeks of lessons, its literally 4 days lol. This is what they offer, several "sessions" of 4 days in a row.
The closest YMCA is 45 minutes away and I just did not want to do that trip during the work week for lessons, but its something I may need to consider.
My H knows a ton of kids on swim team being their principal and all so I could certainly figure out a private lesson situation at some point though. I was just hoping he could try the local pool option first. But alas.
macmars45, hugs to you as well. That would be really challenging!
I also react poorly to any not-great behavior from DS, mostly because of anxiety and also getting easily frustrated. Like today, I had already spiraled out of control to "he'll never listen to anyone and have a terrible time when he goes to school" which is completely ridiculous. But its what my brain does.
Maybe also try explaining to him exactly what is covered in the lessons. My DD is a real perfectionist and gets nervous thinking the lessons mean she has to be able to do all the things right away. We had to explain to her that "in this class you will start doing XYZ with help, you will play water games, you will learn how to be safe in a pool". With swimming, at least in the program taught at our rec centre, the levels go up by tiny little steps. The very beginners courses will not teach your kid how to swim. They will teach assisted floats, blowing bubbles, putting face in the water (they don't force it), kicking, that kind of stuff. The next level might be "putting your head under", try to float by yourself", kick to the other side using a flutter board". Maybe he got nervous that he wouldn't be able to "learn to swim" right away?
I also tell my DD very matter of fact that "everyone has to take swimming lessons", the same way I tell her "everyone has to go to school".
Post by chickadee77 on Jul 12, 2021 14:26:54 GMT -5
I WAS this kid. Sorry. I will say the "right" environment/instructor makes a world of difference - for instance, as a kid I hated both YMCA and YWCA for reasons that I would now call borderline - if not all-out - abusive. However, our local university offered small group classes and allowed me to wear goggles (a huge no-no in the other environments) and I was swimming by the end of the session. As a parent, I can imagine how frustrating it is, but maybe just keep talking to him and finding out where his issues lie. They may surprise you -