Crisis pregnancy centers @@@

[mouse]

Sept 8, 2021 18:56:45 GMT -5 satsuma said:

I wish we lived in a society where decisions regarding pregnancy and parenting could be made irrespective of finances. This whole discussion just makes me sad. No one should be forced to continue an unwanted pregnancy even if their lives are perfect on paper, and no one should feel compelled to terminate what would be a wanted pregnancy if only they could get more workplace accommodations or financial support, etc.

Yes, truly pro-choice. I’m not completely well-versed in reproductive justice, but part of the idea is that you look at the whole person, not just specific reproductive choices when you engage in advocacy. Racism, immigration rights, sexism, etc all impact our reproductive freedoms and deserve attention and weight.

[basilosaurus]

They are terrible. They'll give a box of diapers and claim it's good. They'll claim they're criticize when they're not

[StrawberryBlondie]

Sept 8, 2021 17:55:05 GMT -5 isabel said:

Sept 8, 2021 16:09:47 GMT -5 isabel said:

This is where I am. We can debate all day long whether these places help pregnant people. What if the pregnant person doesn’t *want* a baby. No amount of support is going to make someone desire to have a child.

Quoting myself because ALSO pregnancy fucking sucks for a lot of people. So while adoption is a very real and valid option for a lot of people who don’t want to or can’t keep a child, that doesn’t mean someone should be forced to go through pregnancy and childbirth.

I had a relatively easy pregnancy and even it sucked a large chunk of the time. I can't imagine forcing even that on someone who didn't want a baby.

[AAM2012]

Sept 8, 2021 18:35:23 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

I have a Facebook friend who seems to be convinced that the solution to every abortion ban everywhere is women withholding sex from men. It’s so tone deaf. It reduces sex (and conception) to something women “give” men, and I really hate it.

Ewww!!!

[redheadbaker]

Sept 8, 2021 18:35:23 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

I have a Facebook friend who seems to be convinced that the solution to every abortion ban everywhere is women withholding sex from men. It’s so tone deaf. It reduces sex (and conception) to something women “give” men, and I really hate it.

Also, it wouldn't solve the issue of women needing abortions for medical reasons. 

[Patsy Baloney]

redheadbaker - bingo. There are so many reasons people have abortions, and a lot of things people don't think "count" as abortions are.

I HATE anti-abortionists and all the pain they cause. There is no compassion in someone who is against abortion and these laws are merciless.

I'd like to use the rest of this space to say fuck crisis pregnancy centers one more time.

[AJL]

Sept 8, 2021 21:21:33 GMT -5 redheadbaker said:

Sept 8, 2021 18:35:23 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

I have a Facebook friend who seems to be convinced that the solution to every abortion ban everywhere is women withholding sex from men. It’s so tone deaf. It reduces sex (and conception) to something women “give” men, and I really hate it.

Also, it wouldn't solve the issue of women needing abortions for medical reasons. 

What other reason do people need abortions if not for medical reasons? 🤨

[bronxgirl]

Sept 8, 2021 16:06:20 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

Sept 8, 2021 13:48:57 GMT -5 Michelle said:

No. This is a horrible take. People getting their rights taken away doesn't mean we have to fight it with other people's rights getting taken away.
This type of language stigmatizes further people who get abortions. People who get abortions are also people who have a relationship with the "sperm donor." I do not want my partner to have to get a vasectomy or be on birth control or to be forced to pay "child support" or wear a pregnancy suit. 
WTF.
I swear people have lost their minds when they talk about abortion and are so called "progressives."

And to answer the question about crisis pregnancy centers. No, they are horrible horrible places and there is no amount of "support" and money that would make them "Ok" even if they paid for someone's apartment, their kids college, etc. THEY ARE PURE EVIL AND ABUSE PEOPLE BOTH PHYSICALLY AND MENTALLY. 

I couldn't even get through the first couple lines of that post. thank you for taking one for the team and reading it and responding.

[atarianna]

Sept 8, 2021 21:35:43 GMT -5 AJL said:

Sept 8, 2021 21:21:33 GMT -5 redheadbaker said:

Also, it wouldn't solve the issue of women needing abortions for medical reasons. 

What other reason do people need abortions if not for medical reasons? 🤨

I will jump in and just say she is likely quoting Lysistrata. It’s a Greek comedy where all the women banned together to withhold sex from men until their demands were met.

ETA: I totally screwed up quoting. Sorry.

[wanderingback]

Sept 8, 2021 18:47:04 GMT -5 AJL said:

The solution to every abortion ban is to undo all the abortion bans. It's that simple. Banning abortion does not get rid of the need for abortion. But providing free birth control doesn't stop the need for abortion. Abortion is a safe medical procedure that is needed. Some people need cardiac surgery. Some people need appendectomies. Some people need abortions. End of story.

And it’s not always a procedure!
Abortion with pills is just as safe.

And for those wanting to do something, you can spread the word about self-managed care/ordering abortion pills online.
Go to plancpills.org/guide to find out more information and share on social media. It’s a website with a wealth of information. People can get pills mailed to them in all 50 states and US territories.
Of course abortion care with the procedure in all trimesters needs to be more accessible as well everywhere, but most pills are safe to use at home and everyone needs to know all their options.

[goldengirlz]

Sept 8, 2021 21:21:33 GMT -5 redheadbaker said:

Sept 8, 2021 18:35:23 GMT -5 goldengirlz said:

I have a Facebook friend who seems to be convinced that the solution to every abortion ban everywhere is women withholding sex from men. It’s so tone deaf. It reduces sex (and conception) to something women “give” men, and I really hate it.

Also, it wouldn't solve the issue of women needing abortions for medical reasons. 

Or rape, or incest. And sometimes women just want to have sex. How does my decision of refusing to have sex with my pro-choice H stick it to Abbott in any way, shape or form? And also, we need to stop thinking of men as sex-crazed robots who are ruled by their penises; that’s classic toxic masculinity right there. Most of them in the pro-life camp are motivated by pure misogyny.

This chick proves that even vehemently pro-choice liberals can be ignorant about why people have abortions and/or hold antiquated ideas about sex and gender roles.

ETA: I do take some of these posts (like michelle’s) in the spirit they’re intended. Biology is unfair and that’s even more reason to protect women’s bodily autonomy. But there’s a better way to say it, like the analogy that’s gone viral comparing outlawing abortion to forcing people to donate their organs. Even dead people can refuse to donate in this country. So why do we force women to “donate” their uteruses to save another human being (regardless of whether you consider those cells a “human being” or not)?

[ellipses84]

I think your description is very accurate. It’s religious based and while they help people from other religions, they still can choose who they help, how much they help, what strings are attached and there’s a limit to how many people they can help. Resources vary a lot by location whether urban or rural, red state or blue (and of course R’s are often trying to reduce social services that would help).

[basilosaurus]

Sept 8, 2021 22:03:40 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

Sept 8, 2021 18:47:04 GMT -5 AJL said:

The solution to every abortion ban is to undo all the abortion bans. It's that simple. Banning abortion does not get rid of the need for abortion. But providing free birth control doesn't stop the need for abortion. Abortion is a safe medical procedure that is needed. Some people need cardiac surgery. Some people need appendectomies. Some people need abortions. End of story.

And it’s not always a procedure!
Abortion with pills is just as safe.

And for those wanting to do something, you can spread the word about self-managed care/ordering abortion pills online.
Go to plancpills.org/guide to find out more information and share on social media. It’s a website with a wealth of information. People can get pills mailed to them in all 50 states and US territories.
Of course abortion care with the procedure in all trimesters needs to be more accessible as well everywhere, but most pills are safe to use at home and everyone needs to know all their options.

There's also women on web. They've included the us in their list of countries that are affected by anti choice policies.

Even in this Muslim country there's an exception for fetal anomalies and health, both physical and mental, of the woman. When Texas doesn't even meet the standards of a theocracy, you know they're fucked up. They're the same people who rant about sharia law, too. At least here you can go to sharia court if you want but civilian is always an option.

[wanderingback]

Sept 9, 2021 2:58:53 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Sept 8, 2021 22:03:40 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

And it’s not always a procedure!
Abortion with pills is just as safe.

And for those wanting to do something, you can spread the word about self-managed care/ordering abortion pills online.
Go to plancpills.org/guide to find out more information and share on social media. It’s a website with a wealth of information. People can get pills mailed to them in all 50 states and US territories.
Of course abortion care with the procedure in all trimesters needs to be more accessible as well everywhere, but most pills are safe to use at home and everyone needs to know all their options.

There's also women on web. 

Women on Web has created a "subsidiary" (not sure if that's the correct term) called Aid Access (separate website) that specifically ships within the US, depending on what state you're in you can get the pills faster from Aid Access (and the follow up care information/resources are different for people in the US), hence why they created Aid Access separately. All of that information is on the PlanC website...the PlanC website is a resource that shows all the vetted organizations that ship pills with the correct ingredients within the US. There are lots of places that ship pills in the US, so that's why I gave the PlanC website that gives that information so it can be widely shared. 

[msmerymac]

Sept 8, 2021 21:34:17 GMT -5 Patsy Baloney said:

redheadbaker - bingo. There are so many reasons people have abortions, and a lot of things people don't think "count" as abortions are.

I HATE anti-abortionists and all the pain they cause. There is no compassion in someone who is against abortion and these laws are merciless.

I'd like to use the rest of this space to say fuck crisis pregnancy centers one more time.

I can't tell you how enraged I feel when anti-choicers tell me my abortions are "different" or "don't count" or wouldn't be affected by abortion bans, at which point I send them the link to Savita Halappanavar's wikipedia page. 

It's the exact same medical procedure. Pharmacists can still refuse to give a patient "abortion drugs" regardless of the reason. A banned medical procedure is unlikely to be taught in medical schools. Morality bans are likely to convince doctors that trying to justify D&Cs for medical reasons is just too much hassle, at which point they'll get out of the practice altogether. 

[msmerymac]

There's an ice cream stand in my parents' town that I no longer frequent because the family that owns it is crazycakes and instead of a tip jar, the jar is for donations to the local crisis pregnancy center. My husband unthinkingly put the change from a $20 (probably around $2.50) in the jar once and I told him when we walked away what it was and he just about died.

Leave it to anti-choicers to not only donate to a shitty organization, but to deny their employees tips and/or subtly trick their customers who think they're giving tips into donating to a shitty organization.

[Michelle]

Sept 8, 2021 16:06:20 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

Sept 8, 2021 13:48:57 GMT -5 Michelle said:

My proposal:

Texas needs to pass a law that holds sperm donors equally accountable for unwanted pregnancies by doing the following:

1) Requiring all sperm donors to get reversible vasectomies OR take the "male" birth control pill
2) If their birth control fails and they put a person in the position of carrying an unwanted pregnancy, they must pay the person $10,000 cash no later than 7 weeks after the conception date or as soon as the person knows they are pregnant, whichever is later.
3) In addition to paying the pregnant person money, the donor need to wear a pregnancy suit either under or on top of their clothes starting at 3 months of pregnancy that weighs 10 pounds, and they must submit regular pictures of them wearing the suit to work, to the gym, to any social gatherings, throughout the week. At least one pic every week at their job and one in their community somehow. Every week after that they must go to the closest unwanted pregnancy stations for sperm-generating people and add an extra pound of weight to their pregnancy suit. The purpose of this suit will be to have them experience a portion of the physical pain a biologically pregnant person experiences during their unwanted pregnancy, as well as the public shaming and constant questioning about what they are going to do about the baby, how the pregnant person is handling the unwanted pregnancy, have they looked into adoption, etc. Edit - if anyone catches them without their pregnancy suit on - even at home and in their bed - they can sue them for $1000 for each instance.

4) When the pregnant person gives birth, the sperm donor has to go to the unwanted pregnancy station for sperm donors, turn in their pregnancy suit, and get punched in the gut 3-5 times and then kicked in the balls. And then every day for the first week they have to go back and get kicked in the balls again.


After this is in place, I suspect the restrictions on abortions will go down. "My personal medical situation, my business."


edited for gender inclusion

No. This is a horrible take. People getting their rights taken away doesn't mean we have to fight it with other people's rights getting taken away.
This type of language stigmatizes further people who get abortions. People who get abortions are also people who have a relationship with the "sperm donor." I do not want my partner to have to get a vasectomy or be on birth control or to be forced to pay "child support" or wear a pregnancy suit. 
WTF.
I swear people have lost their minds when they talk about abortion and are so called "progressives."

And to answer the question about crisis pregnancy centers. No, they are horrible horrible places and there is no amount of "support" and money that would make them "Ok" even if they paid for someone's apartment, their kids college, etc. THEY ARE PURE EVIL AND ABUSE PEOPLE BOTH PHYSICALLY AND MENTALLY. 

There is a healthy amount of sarcasm in there. If such proposed language was put forward, it might help men see how intrusive they are being on our bodies and our rights to make decisions about them.

That kind of "law" would never ever pass. 

[Michelle]

Sept 8, 2021 20:08:54 GMT -5 StrawberryBlondie said:

Sept 8, 2021 17:55:05 GMT -5 isabel said:

Quoting myself because ALSO pregnancy fucking sucks for a lot of people. So while adoption is a very real and valid option for a lot of people who don’t want to or can’t keep a child, that doesn’t mean someone should be forced to go through pregnancy and childbirth.

I had a relatively easy pregnancy and even it sucked a large chunk of the time. I can't imagine forcing even that on someone who didn't want a baby.

I moved from being "pro-choice because my religious belief about abortion shouldn't infringe on your rights in a non-theocratic nation" position to flatly pro-choice after I had a baby. It can be such a quality-of-life-altering experience with down-stream health implications that a woman should have a choice on whether she is willing to put her body through that or not. And we only get so many years on this earth. If we aren't willing to devote one of them to a particular pregnancy, we shouldn't have to.

[wanderingback]

Sept 9, 2021 9:44:39 GMT -5 Michelle said:

Sept 8, 2021 16:06:20 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

No. This is a horrible take. People getting their rights taken away doesn't mean we have to fight it with other people's rights getting taken away.
This type of language stigmatizes further people who get abortions. People who get abortions are also people who have a relationship with the "sperm donor." I do not want my partner to have to get a vasectomy or be on birth control or to be forced to pay "child support" or wear a pregnancy suit. 
WTF.
I swear people have lost their minds when they talk about abortion and are so called "progressives."

And to answer the question about crisis pregnancy centers. No, they are horrible horrible places and there is no amount of "support" and money that would make them "Ok" even if they paid for someone's apartment, their kids college, etc. THEY ARE PURE EVIL AND ABUSE PEOPLE BOTH PHYSICALLY AND MENTALLY. 

There is a healthy amount of sarcasm in there. If such proposed language was put forward, it might help men see how intrusive they are being on our bodies and our rights to make decisions about them.

That kind of "law" would never ever pass. 

Yes but sarcastic language like that stigmatizes people for a variety of reasons. I know this because when I provide care and people who choice to disclose things to me I can absolutely tell that some people feel shame & stigma because of all the messages that they see/hear.
I really think people need to listen to long term activists & providers, especially Black & Hispanic people, when talking about abortion care. Another example given above was saying that women should refuse to have sex with men, which again I understand the sarcasm, but is again stigmatizing. And when people say certain language is harmful, then listen to them.
The vast majority of people support abortion care in this country. It’s just really unfortunate that the anti movement is small yet mighty. So, such sarcastic language does nothing but harm people that seek abortion care and does absolutely nothing to improve access to care whatsoever.

This is a guide more specifically for journalists reporting on abortion, but everyone can review it for general lessons on appropriate language- prh.org/reporterresource/
Notice that it doesn’t mention that using sarcastic language is helpful or recommended.

[bronxgirl]

Sept 9, 2021 9:44:39 GMT -5 Michelle said:

Sept 8, 2021 16:06:20 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

No. This is a horrible take. People getting their rights taken away doesn't mean we have to fight it with other people's rights getting taken away.
This type of language stigmatizes further people who get abortions. People who get abortions are also people who have a relationship with the "sperm donor." I do not want my partner to have to get a vasectomy or be on birth control or to be forced to pay "child support" or wear a pregnancy suit. 
WTF.
I swear people have lost their minds when they talk about abortion and are so called "progressives."

And to answer the question about crisis pregnancy centers. No, they are horrible horrible places and there is no amount of "support" and money that would make them "Ok" even if they paid for someone's apartment, their kids college, etc. THEY ARE PURE EVIL AND ABUSE PEOPLE BOTH PHYSICALLY AND MENTALLY. 

There is a healthy amount of sarcasm in there. If such proposed language was put forward, it might help men see how intrusive they are being on our bodies and our rights to make decisions about them.

That kind of "law" would never ever pass. 

Yes, we all realize you were being sarcastic.  That doesn't make it any less offensive, nor does it do anything to advance the arguement.

[somersault72]

My coworker is leaving to go work at one. Partly because of the work, partly because they won't make her get the vaccine (the major health care providers in the region are all requiring employees to be vaccinated this fall).

[sonrisa]

Sept 9, 2021 11:51:48 GMT -5 somersault72 said:

My coworker is leaving to go work at one. Partly because of the work, partly because they won't make her get the vaccine (the major health care providers in the region are all requiring employees to be vaccinated this fall).

Have you point out the irony of deeply not wanting something in her body (even if others think that it is best for her to have it there) so much so that she'll change her career. But then going to a job where she is going to be pushing other people to have something in their bodies (something much more substantial than a vaccine) because she thinks it's best for them (even if they don't)?

[Patsy Baloney]

The local crisis pregnancy center is spreading the misinformation/disinformation that the covid vaccine causes stillbirths, so please rocket all of these places into the sun.

[NewOrleans]

We had a batshit awful poster here who volunteered at one and they made women earn points by going to mass and parenting classes 🙃

[AJL]

Sept 9, 2021 12:14:19 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

We had a batshit awful poster here who volunteered at one and they made women earn points by going to mass and parenting classes 🙃

This makes me angry. It happens, also, in faith sponsored or run homeless shelters. Weaponizing religion helps no one.

[msmerymac]

Sept 9, 2021 12:14:19 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

We had a batshit awful poster here who volunteered at one and they made women earn points by going to mass and parenting classes 🙃

OMG, was it AW? Or V2? So much batshit.