This is not true in general (I'm sure one could always find an exception). Wind farms are huge but the space between turbines is usually very compatible with farming or ranching. Wind farms are usually not located in forested areas.
you're out west, aren't you? around here (thinking of PA mostly) they tend to be on ridge lines, and said mountains are still treed because they're smaller than yours.
looks like this when freshly installed: But I woudln't call this a TON of clearing...and they do tend to replant around them except for access road and right around the base.
Yes, and the majority of U.S. wind farms are also in areas that don't require even that amount of tree cutting, though obviously there are exceptions (and many of these exceptions are in the East as you mention).
Huh. Is this the universe trying to tell me to try again to find a handyman to fix my broken gas stove exhaust fan? Though I'm pretty sure even the broken fan only vented to the attic....
Wind farms are great in some areas of central eastern WA state. The hills only have sage brush, other small plants, rocks & dirt. There are very few trees in theses areas.
This is really interesting. We have a gas cooktop with a fancy little hood that you press a button and it comes up from the island, but I'm pretty sure it's not vented to the outdoors. I do have a snake plant close to it, so hopefully that'll take on some of the gases...
Working in the electric utility business, I have a hard time reconciling what is going to happen over the next 15 or so years as the need for electricity is going to massively grow due to the pushes away from gas powered anything. The fossil plants are having to shut down (which I totally get) but they also produce the most amount of electricity out of all the renewables combined, for far less cheaper and are able to be stored unlike the solar, water and wind productions. And apparently a wind farm takes out a TON of trees and/or farmland to be productive for the demands so that sucks too. I don't have the answers but I'm fairly certain it's not going to be Americans willing to lower their energy consumption b/c if the past 18 months has taught us anything, it's that we're selfish assholes who only care about ourselves.
This is not true in general (I'm sure one could always find an exception). Wind farms are huge but the space between turbines is usually very compatible with farming or ranching. Wind farms are usually not located in forested areas.
But companies have to purchase the land to build them and typically farmers aren’t willing to just loan out some of their farmland for the turbines. At least that’s been the experience my company has come across.
We have propane. I’ve been wondering what it would cost to convert to all electric, but wow, $35,000 is out of the question for us right now.
I read that as being for 2 stoves, 2 furnaces, and 2 water heaters, as it was for both sides of a duplex. So maybe not a very representative price tag.
Post by SusanBAnthony on Oct 7, 2021 18:32:22 GMT -5
I really struggle with this because electricity is pretty expensive since you lose a lot of it along the transmission lines. Maybe it's all propaganda but I've heard my whole life that heating with electric is way more expensive than gas.
We just had our electric upgraded from 100 amp to 200. It's about 3000$ to pay an electrician to do it for you. You can't really do it yourself even if you are pretty handy, unlike a lot of electrical projects. We did it for other reasons but a side benefit would be being able to add more circuits for electric car charging or electric stove in the future.
Of course we just bought a new gas range 2 years ago to replace our old one, but we do have an exterior venting range hood.
I lived almost 50 years before I was in a house with a gas stove (this one). Everything else has been all electric, minus a could places with oil heat. I think Maryland is far too far north for heat pumps/electric heat. But other than that, I had no issue with electric stoves.
Now you’ve got me thinking about our hood. It is not on an exterior wall, nor does it go outside. I am really weird in that I can stand fan noise, so I wonder if I would use it as much as I should.
My dad has a heat pump with propane back up at his house in rural MD. The propane kicks in when it gets really cold.
This is not true in general (I'm sure one could always find an exception). Wind farms are huge but the space between turbines is usually very compatible with farming or ranching. Wind farms are usually not located in forested areas.
But companies have to purchase the land to build them and typically farmers aren’t willing to just loan out some of their farmland for the turbines. At least that’s been the experience my company has come across.
This varies widely, but often the land is leased using agreements that allow the owners to continue to use the land between the turbines. In some areas, this is actually very lucrative for the farmer or rancher because they get lease payments for the turbines in addition to whatever else they are using the land for. This is definitely not everywhere but not uncommon.
I lived almost 50 years before I was in a house with a gas stove (this one). Everything else has been all electric, minus a could places with oil heat. I think Maryland is far too far north for heat pumps/electric heat. But other than that, I had no issue with electric stoves.
Now you’ve got me thinking about our hood. It is not on an exterior wall, nor does it go outside. I am really weird in that I can stand fan noise, so I wonder if I would use it as much as I should.
Heat pump technology has come a long way in the last several years; you can get ones that are good for heating even when it’s below 0 (Farenheit) outside. We converted our house in Maine to mini-split heat pumps 2.5 years ago and we stay warm all winter (and cool in the summer).
I’m surprised that only 35% of homes cook with gas. ...
I just thought it through, and of the five places I've lived for any real amount of time only one has had a gas stove. Unfortunately for this article it's our current one.
We don't always use our hood because the fan is really loud. I guess it's time to fix that, at least.
I’ve hardly ever even been to a home that didn’t have a gas stove! I know one person with a glass top.
I lived almost 50 years before I was in a house with a gas stove (this one). Everything else has been all electric, minus a could places with oil heat. I think Maryland is far too far north for heat pumps/electric heat. But other than that, I had no issue with electric stoves.
Now you’ve got me thinking about our hood. It is not on an exterior wall, nor does it go outside. I am really weird in that I can stand fan noise, so I wonder if I would use it as much as I should.
Heat pump technology has come a long way in the last several years; you can get ones that are good for heating even when it’s below 0 (Farenheit) outside. We converted our house in Maine to mini-split heat pumps 2.5 years ago and we stay warm all winter (and cool in the summer).
I'm super intrigued by mini-split. We have central air with AC and gas furnace, but I hate that it's always 10 degrees hotter upstairs than downstairs, and wonder of we should switch to mini-split, vs replacing our furnace and AC unit with a traditional whole house heat pump.
Heat pump technology has come a long way in the last several years; you can get ones that are good for heating even when it’s below 0 (Farenheit) outside. We converted our house in Maine to mini-split heat pumps 2.5 years ago and we stay warm all winter (and cool in the summer).
I'm super intrigued by mini-split. We have central air with AC and gas furnace, but I hate that it's always 10 degrees hotter upstairs than downstairs, and wonder of we should switch to mini-split, vs replacing our furnace and AC unit with a traditional whole house heat pump.
Our original heating system is FHW with an oil-burning furnace, so mini-splits were our only option for A/C, which was my original impetus for wanting them installed. When we found out we could also get units that would provide heat in our winters, that was a bonus.
Things we love about our heat pumps: we save (a little bit of) money heating using electricity vs. heating oil and we don’t have to deal with oil deliveries; our house is more comfortable day and night because heat pumps work best when they stay at a consistent temperature setting, so no more using a programmable thermostat to drop the temperature overnight in the winter for cost savings and we can keep the house more consistently cool in the summer than we could with window unit A/Cs; we have five mini-split units and each one has its own control so each space can have a separate temperature setting and the units work independently as needed.
Downsides: if we lose power in the winter, we can’t use our heat pumps (but we still have the oil furnace for backup, which we can run with the small portable generator we own). Also, it wasn’t cheap. We spent about $16k for 5 mini-splits with two low temperature rated outdoor units for our 2300 sq. ft. house and we also had to install an electrical sub-panel because we were out of room in our main panel.
Overall, we’re very happy with our mini-splits. I think my DH has personally convinced three or four of his co-workers to install them in their houses!
I now feel justified in hating the gas stove we had in the house we rented for a while.
we rented a place for a few years with a gas stove that must have been a few decades old. It had pilot lights and I spent so much time/energy stressing about them because every now and then they'd go out. It always smelled like gas in the kitchen, and it got to the point that I couldn't go to bed if I hadn't checked to make sure those tiny little flames were still burning. We're in a place with a glass top stove now. It was definitely an adjustment relearning how to cook on electric, but I'll take that over anxiety about gas leaks any day.
Our water heater runs on gas, but it's in a utility closet just outside our back door so I don't worry about it as much. Though I do still have moments (usually when I'm paranoid or anxious about something else) when I swear I can smell gas. I would be perfectly fine going all electric and having a backup generator for power outages.
I've cooked on 2 types of electric stoves (the old coil type and halogen), gas, and induction. By FAR my favorite is induction. I will never willingly go back to gas again.
I just thought it through, and of the five places I've lived for any real amount of time only one has had a gas stove. Unfortunately for this article it's our current one.
We don't always use our hood because the fan is really loud. I guess it's time to fix that, at least.
I’ve hardly ever even been to a home that didn’t have a gas stove! I know one person with a glass top.
me? Lol. We do and did in our last apartment, too.
We have a heat pump too. I had never even heard of such a thing before moving here but it seems to work fine. We have backup heat available if the heat pump goes down (which it did last winter, but that was due to shitty installation, not the heat pump itself). I don't really fully understand how it works but after having gas heat all of my life until we moved to Baltimore, I was afraid our bills would be huge. They really aren't. Living in a center unit townhouse helps, I'm sure, but I haven't found my energy costs to be anymore here with all electric than they were in Iowa with gas heat/electric stove.
I lived almost 50 years before I was in a house with a gas stove (this one). Everything else has been all electric, minus a could places with oil heat. I think Maryland is far too far north for heat pumps/electric heat. But other than that, I had no issue with electric stoves.
Now you’ve got me thinking about our hood. It is not on an exterior wall, nor does it go outside. I am really weird in that I can stand fan noise, so I wonder if I would use it as much as I should.
My dad has a heat pump with propane back up at his house in rural MD. The propane kicks in when it gets really cold.
Yes, that’s a good option. Unfortunately, not realistic everywhere. Like our all electric homes in the area have been townhomes, with tiny back yards. My first home had a yard that was 15 feet by 20 feet. I mean, sure, we *could* have put a bottle of gas out there. But space choices.
And yes, heat pumps are getting better. We toured one house over the winter that had mini split units blowing out warm air. Actually warm air. I was in awe. But still, most people won’t replace it until it dies, not just because they want warm air. I mean, you won’t freeze *to death* in a heat pump house. It’s just the air feels cool when it’s blowing.
But then again, every time I read about a house explosion, I would be happy in my all electric house.
I just thought it through, and of the five places I've lived for any real amount of time only one has had a gas stove. Unfortunately for this article it's our current one.
We don't always use our hood because the fan is really loud. I guess it's time to fix that, at least.
I’ve hardly ever even been to a home that didn’t have a gas stove! I know one person with a glass top.
I think this is ~*regional*~ and also depends on the age of the housing stock. I've had gas in every place I've lived in the Mid-Atlantic but never had it in Florida where most of the housing has been built more recently.
They is pushing me to get quote for a gas fireplace conversion to electric. Ours is 27 years old, the fan is really loud, and it doesn't produce enough heat to be functional. I like the ambiance of a fireplace though and it makes a nice focal point in our living room.
We've moved though all the must-dos in our house this past year, now making a list of things we'd like to do. This is sitting at the top now.
the gas stov is the only thing we have that is gas in our house (water is solar heated and no heating systems!).
Unfortuantely nearly all electricity produced here is oil generated so clean electricity isnt an option. Our gas stove uses gas cylinders (so not piped) and is in a kitchen where we always have the windows wide open (as we do in all rooms of the house). I should get an air monitor to see what difference it makes to us.
However, as we live somewhere where it is not usually to lose electricity for several days every couple of years due to hurricanes, I do not want to have an electric stove and get stuck without anythign to cook with or boil water to drink.
I’ve hardly ever even been to a home that didn’t have a gas stove! I know one person with a glass top.
me? Lol. We do and did in our last apartment, too.
We have a heat pump too. I had never even heard of such a thing before moving here but it seems to work fine. We have backup heat available if the heat pump goes down (which it did last winter, but that was due to shitty installation, not the heat pump itself). I don't really fully understand how it works but after having gas heat all of my life until we moved to Baltimore, I was afraid our bills would be huge. They really aren't. Living in a center unit townhouse helps, I'm sure, but I haven't found my energy costs to be anymore here with all electric than they were in Iowa with gas heat/electric stove.
Yes! It is you. I wasn’t going to call you out. lol Everyone else we know has gas stove regardless of how new their house is and you know I would notice!
We have a 6-burner gas stove for “reasons” that DH insisted upon. Not only did that thing cost $4k more than a normal stove, we also had to do a $2400 HVAC upgrade to our house to put in a make up air unit so that when the exhaust vent is running the house has enough air to not become a negative vacuum. Super fun. It actually has an interlock to the fan though that as soon as you turn on the gas stove the hood fan kicks on at medium speed, so I’m not as concerned about indoor air quality.
Not good for climate change for sure. I wanted an induction stove. DH really likes to cook with real woks which pretty well require gas so here we are.
We have a 6-burner gas stove for “reasons” that DH insisted upon. Not only did that thing cost $4k more than a normal stove, we also had to do a $2400 HVAC upgrade to our house to put in a make up air unit so that when the exhaust vent is running the house has enough air to not become a negative vacuum. Super fun. It actually has an interlock to the fan though that as soon as you turn on the gas stove the hood fan kicks on at medium speed, so I’m not as concerned about indoor air quality.
Not good for climate change for sure. I wanted an induction stove. DH really likes to cook with real woks which pretty well require gas so here we are.
I know you're in the frozen north, and it's too late since you already did it....but for anybody else in a similar situation a friend of mine just put in a dedicated crazy high btu wok burner in his outdoor kitchen setup so he can *really* get that wok hei without tanking his indoor air quality. can be totally portable, and a cheap one is ~$100. think of it like just having a gas grill - you just pull it out of the corner of the shed and fire it up when you want to make a stir fry. easy peasy.
eta: does you no good in terms of sustainability of fossil fuels, but at least you're only using the propane as needed.
Our only natural gas is our furnace, and it’s due for a replacement. It’s tough because it works fine, but the next thing that breaks is the main something something and that point it’s dead. So it’s been on the list and we’re looking into it now. We think we want a heat pump, but we already have ducting, so probably a full house unit? Or the house isn’t that big, and the upstairs gets so hot when the heater runs, maybe ductless? I need to see what the options are.
ETA the CEP part: When I first started looking into this, it became clear what a load of bull “clean burning” natural gas is. I somehow had fallen under the impression that it was an environmentally friendly alternative to baseboard heating (and I’ve always lived in areas with hydroelectric power), so I’m a little pissed. Then they killed our state carbon cap bill. So really, fuck those guys. It might be a little more $ up front, but I want out.
We just replaced our propane stove with an electric one. We didn't do the whole house conversion (our house is still heated with propane), but it cost ~$500 to get the new outlet and wiring for the electric stove and cap off the gas pipe. Just throwing that out there in case anyone is overwhelmed by the price tag in the article. It's just a baby step, but, at least for us, it was an affordable one.
me? Lol. We do and did in our last apartment, too.
We have a heat pump too. I had never even heard of such a thing before moving here but it seems to work fine. We have backup heat available if the heat pump goes down (which it did last winter, but that was due to shitty installation, not the heat pump itself). I don't really fully understand how it works but after having gas heat all of my life until we moved to Baltimore, I was afraid our bills would be huge. They really aren't. Living in a center unit townhouse helps, I'm sure, but I haven't found my energy costs to be anymore here with all electric than they were in Iowa with gas heat/electric stove.
Yes! It is you. I wasn’t going to call you out. lol Everyone else we know has gas stove regardless of how new their house is and you know I would notice!
I'm always in the minority in that I hate my gas stove. But our house is all gas everything. We recently bought a new stove and I really wanted to switch to electric, but we would need to have a high voltage plug put in and that is apparently a bigger project than I thought, so it will have to wait. I think eventually I want to get an induction cooktop. We have a grill outside with a side burner and H does a lot of our cooking on it instead of inside the house (mostly to avoid the smell/mess).
I used to complain about our gas stove all the time and everyone disagreed with me and told me I'd end up loving it. Twelve years later and I still wish I had electric.
We've been in our house 4 years and everyone said gas is so amazing, but I don't get the appeal. I burn everything I try to cook now because my cast iron pans heat so unevenly, and water doesn't boil any faster. I don't get it.
I'm always in the minority in that I hate my gas stove. But our house is all gas everything. We recently bought a new stove and I really wanted to switch to electric, but we would need to have a high voltage plug put in and that is apparently a bigger project than I thought, so it will have to wait. I think eventually I want to get an induction cooktop. We have a grill outside with a side burner and H does a lot of our cooking on it instead of inside the house (mostly to avoid the smell/mess).
I used to complain about our gas stove all the time and everyone disagreed with me and told me I'd end up loving it. Twelve years later and I still wish I had electric.
We've been in our house 4 years and everyone said gas is so amazing, but I don't get the appeal. I burn everything I try to cook now because my cast iron pans heat so unevenly, and water doesn't boil any faster. I don't get it.
omg the water boiling drives me insane! I was so vindicated when I read that gas is actually the slowest for boiling water. Electric is faster and induction is the fastest. We bought a tea kettle and boil water in it and then pour it into a pit for making pasta, etc. 🤦🏾♀️
I also hate that the sides of my pans get super hot so stuff always burns on the edges. I have to use wider pans than I need. There is definitely a learning curve.
I'm not doing away with my gas stove in Texas until the electrical grid is addressed. The gas stove is what got us through the freeze since we could still cook, drink hot broth/tea, boil water when needed, wash dishes with heated water, and heat hot water bottles to warm up the bed and ourselves when the temp was in the teens and we had no heat.
Post by basilosaurus on Oct 14, 2021 15:03:49 GMT -5
I grew up with a gas stove. It was very important as we'd lose power daily, sometimes for hours (not in 'Murca). From a young age I learned how to use the stove with a lighter since pilot lights don't work without electric. (somehow my sister never learned this lesson) We also didn't have a/c so windows were always open. And fans when the power was on. And, yes, we all knew between gas generators and gas stoves that explosions weren't uncommon. I knew of one house that exploded 3 times (thankfully, residents were off island all times) before they just gave up and left the country.
Electric is cost prohibitive in much of the world. My allotment, US gov't provided, for utilities in Japan was over $500/mo, over 10 years ago, with gas heat (a/c was used only a few weeks a year). It would have been a shitton more with electric heat.
So, yes, pretty much as always, environment vs cheap/affordable. And it falls on the end consumer, not the corporations. And the poor who will suffer most from the environmental risks.
I currently have a 2 burner gas hob. I've never seen anywhere in Asia that I've lived not have that kind of set up. My propane tank is in the cabinet underneath. It's a flipping flame thrower. At lowest setting, I get a roaring boil and basically have to hover over the stove, turning it on and off as I cook. So I'm probably getting all the fumes. I'll crack the windows above when I cook now.
In HI I think apartments about a certain number of stories weren't allowed gas.