Dogs--sizes; help me with choices?

[pinkpeony08]

Jan 6, 2023 12:02:53 GMT -5 DarcyLongfellow said:

I'm sure it's hard to hear a thread of people disagreeing with you. I understand wanting a puppy!

Just a few thoughts.

First, if you aren't up for fostering, how about watching a friend's dog for a weekend when they're out of town? It will at least give you an idea of how a dog would work with your family.

Second, google what to look for in a reputable breeder. If you decide to get a dog from a breeder, do not use a breeder who doesn't meet the criteria. Things like: not allowing dogs to go to their new home until 12 weeks, interviewing potential new owners - and not allowing just anyone to adopt a dog, all dogs in a litter should be spoken for immediately because the breeder has a waiting list - there should never be a couple dogs "left" from a litter, the mom and dad should not both be owned by the same breeder, both mom and dad should be champions.

Third, it's so easy to get caught up in differences like a 30 pound dog vs a 50 pound dog before you actually have the dog. Going in person to spend time with dogs, visiting the breeders' homes *with* your whole family, and just generally being exposed more to your chosen breed will all help you.

Finally, even if you feel strongly about using a breeder, I'd recommend visiting or volunteering at your local dog shelter. It will help you understand more of what you're looking for in a dog.

Agree!

The first few episodes of the pandemic puppy podcast are about are you ready for a puppy, what to look for in a breeder and how to pick a puppy from a breeder. If you aren’t up for what this poster recommended, I would at least listen to the podcast episodes.

[redheadbaker]

Jan 5, 2023 22:11:25 GMT -5 imojoebunny said:

Jan 5, 2023 21:58:04 GMT -5 redheadbaker said:

Why are you still here? 

?  

I'll keep asking until you acknowledge and apologize for being so fucking offensive in this thread: pandce.proboards.com/thread/630544/cancel-student-debt

[jobae1234]

I’m one of the rare people who has a doodle who is actually hypoallergenic. For those with mild allergies, a good test is to sit in a closed car with the dog for like 20 minutes and see if you react. I’d recommend that before you take ownership of any dog.

I’d go with the 9 week dog instead of the 7 week dog. It’s a 15 year commitment so $200 is nothing.

We got our doodle puppy from a rescue because he was not sold by his (unreputable, backyard) breeder. The rescue takes the unsold dogs so the breeder doesn’t euthanize them. Very sad. If you take the advice about fostering, you may be able to foster a local doodle puppy in a similar situation in order to try it out.

I think the thing people are responding to is that you seem to feel like you need things to go a really specific way so that this will be ok. Like obsessing down to a 15 lb difference in dog size. Those of us who have dogs know that you get what you get. One of my dogs wears diapers and has dementia at a young age. My rescue doodle has terrible separation anxiety and can’t be left alone unless we drug him (for real). He’s also on daily anxiety meds. He’s super neurotic in the way of many poodles, and in the way of poorly bred dogs in general sadly, but we knew that going into taking him. You HAVE to be able to flex, significantly, to make a dog work, and that is true times a million with a puppy. Anyone with four kids would struggle.

I admire you for thinking it through so thoroughly because so many people don’t do that.

And in your defense, it’s very hard to find a 1-2 year hypoallergenic dog in the rescue world. You can find 5 year old puppy mill parents with severe trauma. You can find small puppies. You can find senior dogs. This is exactly how I myself ended up with a puppy when I deeply didn’t want one. So I understand why you’re going the breeder route because I considered it myself. This is my second puppy so I went in with eyes wide open that puppies are truly horrible creatures and I will be fairly miserable until he’s about 2. My last puppy broke me down and made me cry every day. This time I’m a bit more prepared. We spend a ton of money on day care and bully sticks and dog walkers to make it easier. I’d eat ramen every day before I cut my day care budget. There are many days where I just can’t with him, even though he’s a fantastic puppy. He’s still a puppy and puppies are shit.

[dochas]

jobae1234 , made a really good point about not being able to control things. It does not seem like something you can be talked out of, so I won't try. Just know that you can do everything "right", but this is a living thing and there is a certain amount of "you get what you get", except in this situation there might be A LOT of upset and there's no undoing it. We got a dog during the pandemic, which was when we had planned for 2 years to get one, but because of the pandemic there were no rescues available. My husband loves German Shepherds, had several growing up. His family all had or has German Shepherds. Went to a reputable breeder. Met the parents. Know the family he was born into. He's a sweet dog. Loyal, loving, funny, cute. Also - Highly, highly reactive. Extremely anxious and it turns out one of the bigger dogs from the litter. (range of sizes in the litter, they could not have told any of us what size dog we would end up with) All I wanted was a dog I could walk and hike with and I can't even leave the house with him. My husband is with him at the vet now discussing the possibility of medication so we can try work with a behaviorist. This is after 2.5 years of patiently working with him on the leash, only when I can find times when there is no one in the street, only to have all of our progress reset every time the seasons change or a new person with a new schedule moves into the neighborhood. I am glad that my son has this companion, because they have a great relationship and adore each other. But he's completely wild around kids so it's difficult or impossible for my son to have friends over. He can't go to daycare because he can't be around other dogs. Can't be boarded. We did our research, we were ready for all the work of a high energy breed and this has not worked out the way we had hoped AT ALL.

ETA: It might be easy to think that you can do the right things and avoid this situation. But we had a trainer right away. Even though it was a pandemic we saw a lot of people outside our house when he was a puppy because dog people won't let a pandemic keep them from a puppy. LOL We saw family. We didn't just stay inside from the day we got him. 

[nicolewi]

jobae1234 dochas

Thank you for your THOUGHTFUL feedback. I do appreciate it very much. I'm so sorry for the things you've had happen with your dogs. Dochas, your situation sounds very difficult and probably not sustainable as-is. I hope you will be able to work with the behaviorist and that things will get better.

I do know that I totally can't control everything. I think that's precisely WHY I am so focused now on making the best decisions I can with the parts I CAN control, b/c I know how much will be a crapshoot later. I fully realize things will happen (just like with kids) that I cannot predict or control. The only part I can do is make the best decisions with the info I have on hand right now. It sounds like Dochas did what I am trying to do and then had it go sideways. Obviously that can happen, but I'm crossing everything it does not.

[dochas]

Jan 7, 2023 11:27:15 GMT -5 nicolewi said:

jobae1234 dochas

Thank you for your THOUGHTFUL feedback. I do appreciate it very much. I'm so sorry for the things you've had happen with your dogs. Dochas, your situation sounds very difficult and probably not sustainable as-is. I hope you will be able to work with the behaviorist and that things will get better.

I do know that I totally can't control everything. I think that's precisely WHY I am so focused now on making the best decisions I can with the parts I CAN control, b/c I know how much will be a crapshoot later. I fully realize things will happen (just like with kids) that I cannot predict or control. The only part I can do is make the best decisions with the info I have on hand right now. It sounds like Dochas did what I am trying to do and then had it go sideways. Obviously that can happen, but I'm crossing everything it does not.

I hope it goes well for you! It's harder when you have kids. We wanted a puppy so we would know he was safe and hadn't been abused. Now having one I think it's possible to know their disposition and I would get a younger dog who had been fostered. But clearly the world is full of dogs that don't have any of these issues. I see them out everywhere having fun. LOL I honestly never considered the possibility that I wouldn't be able to get him used to long, carefree walks or the enormous impact it would have on our lives. For a while I didn't even want to get out of bed in the morning because I felt so trapped by him.

To end on a positive note - the vet gave us a prescription to use on an as-needed basis. I hope it helps him. We have a vacation house that he loves when he gets there but he cries in the car the entire way and it's heartbreaking. Hopefully it will calm him for that and help me take him for longer walks. I think it will make any kind of training or behavior therapy easier on him and more successful. The fact that the vet doesn't think it's abnormal worries me a little!! LOL

[gummybear08]

Groomer checking in.

Please find a (good)groomer and make sure they are accepting new (doodle) clients. And you get on a grooming schedule. Most of my doodles are on 4-8 week schedules and range from $70-135 depending on size. I haven’t taken new clients for a couple years and I don’t enjoy grooming 95% of my doodle clients. Owners want a fluffy ungroomed look. Most leave the salon shaved pretty short and kept pretty short because owners don’t do the maintenance at home.

When it comes to sizing in my experience sizing is a crapshoot. I’ve had clients told they are getting a mini doodle and ends up 50+lbs. also some doodles that really shed that owners are always so upset by since breeders promise hypoallergenic and non shedding dogs.

I have bought purebred dogs from breeders. I used to be adopt don’t shop, but I’m not against responsible breeders now. But am so over the doodle craze. BUT every single doodle client is obsessed over their dogs. Most groomers dislike the doodle owner more than the dogs themselves because they are clueless on the high maintenance needs on grooming and training.

[devonpow]

Ditto the grooming cost and finding a groomer. Particularly now - I think all the pandemic puppies are causing an issue. We have had a regular groomer for 5 years now, when I called to make her last appointment they didn’t have availability until MARCH (she needs to be groomed every 6 weeks). I had a hard time finding another groomer who was taking new clients to get in her before March - finally found one 30 minutes away at a cost of $125 (I normally pay $80) and had to go through the whole vaccine record, temperament test, interview etc to get in. And I live in Boston so it’s not like there is a lack of groomers. Also we keep her very short because the maitanence involved in keeping a medium or long fluffy coat is a lot, so if the aesthetics of a fluffy doodle matter don’t rely on it or be prepared for an hour of brushing a day.

[wanderlustmom]

I hope you love the dog you get! Just selective bias here, no judgement at all--but we've been so happy with all of our shelter rescue pets. There are so many puppies and dogs that need homes--maybe consider it?

[mofongo]

Jan 8, 2023 15:46:24 GMT -5 wanderlustmom said:

I hope you love the dog you get! Just selective bias here, no judgement at all--but we've been so happy with all of our shelter rescue pets. There are so many puppies and dogs that need homes--maybe consider it?

In this situation especially, since there are so many things OP wants that won’t be known with a puppy!

[wanderlustmom]

Jan 8, 2023 15:50:57 GMT -5 mofongo said:

Jan 8, 2023 15:46:24 GMT -5 wanderlustmom said:

I hope you love the dog you get! Just selective bias here, no judgement at all--but we've been so happy with all of our shelter rescue pets. There are so many puppies and dogs that need homes--maybe consider it?

In this situation especially, since there are so many things OP wants that won’t be known with a puppy!

yes I have so many friends that adopted older rescues and they have all been so pleased. The rescues will work closely with you to find the right dog

[minna]

If you are insistent on getting a puppy from a breeder, I’d look into getting a standard poodle. Medium sized, smart dogs, and you can get one from a reputable breeder. If allergies are a concern, they’re a better gamble than a “doodle”.

No good breeder breeds doodles because they aren’t a breed.

[icedcoffee]

I have an honest question. How come when people insist they need a “hypoallergenic” dog they get a mutt that is 50% one of the most allergy laden dogs in the world like a golden or lab (don’t get me wrong I love goldens and labs but they’re not the most tidy dogs lol)

Have you considered one of the many naturally less allergic dogs? Bichon Frise, Maltese, Afghan Hound and poodles are some great options.

[wanderingback]

Jan 8, 2023 17:20:03 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I have an honest question. How come when people insist they need a “hypoallergenic” dog they get a mutt that is 50% one of the most allergy laden dogs in the world like a golden or lab (don’t get me wrong I love goldens and labs but they’re not the most tidy dogs lol)

Have you considered one of the many naturally less allergic dogs? Bichon Frise, Maltese, Afghan Hound and poodles are some great options.

Yes this confused me as well. Why not get a poodle? It’s still no guarantee that they won’t cause someone allergies, but seems like less of a gamble and could go to a reputable breeder if someone insists on that.

[redhead610]

Jan 8, 2023 17:20:03 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I have an honest question. How come when people insist they need a “hypoallergenic” dog they get a mutt that is 50% one of the most allergy laden dogs in the world like a golden or lab (don’t get me wrong I love goldens and labs but they’re not the most tidy dogs lol)

Have you considered one of the many naturally less allergic dogs? Bichon Frise, Maltese, Afghan Hound and poodles are some great options.

I do not understand this either. I worked at an animal hospital for 4 years. There is no such thing as a hypoallergenic dog, as many react to not the fur/hair but the dog itself. And lab/Golden mixes absolutely bother people with allergies (me!) no matter what they are mixed with, and yes, the breeds that don't shed much like a Bichon tend to be better for allergy sufferers.

[icedcoffee]

Jan 9, 2023 11:03:09 GMT -5 redhead610 said:

Jan 8, 2023 17:20:03 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I have an honest question. How come when people insist they need a “hypoallergenic” dog they get a mutt that is 50% one of the most allergy laden dogs in the world like a golden or lab (don’t get me wrong I love goldens and labs but they’re not the most tidy dogs lol)

Have you considered one of the many naturally less allergic dogs? Bichon Frise, Maltese, Afghan Hound and poodles are some great options.

I do not understand this either. I worked at an animal hospital for 4 years. There is no such thing as a hypoallergenic dog, as many react to not the fur/hair but the dog itself. And lab/Golden mixes absolutely bother people with allergies (me!) no matter what they are mixed with, and yes, the breeds that don't shed much like a Bichon tend to be better for allergy sufferers.

It's crazy.  I read once that when people talk about "dog smell" it's actually their saliva and not their fur.  When my house starts to smell like dog I wash anything that might have his saliva on it and sure enough it helps despite the fact that my house is covered in beagle glitter (I mean, fur). 

[InBetweenDays]

Jan 8, 2023 17:20:03 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I have an honest question. How come when people insist they need a “hypoallergenic” dog they get a mutt that is 50% one of the most allergy laden dogs in the world like a golden or lab (don’t get me wrong I love goldens and labs but they’re not the most tidy dogs lol)

Have you considered one of the many naturally less allergic dogs? Bichon Frise, Maltese, Afghan Hound and poodles are some great options.

No kidding. But I'm guessing most people saying they want a Doodle because they are "hypoallergenic" are only using that as an excuse/justification for buying an overpriced mixed breed dog with the relatively more instant gratification they can get by going through these backyard breeders.

We have friends and family members with somewhat serious pet allergies who have had great success with purebred Italian Water Dogs and West Highland Terriers (from reputable breeders). But of course that took more planning and time than many people are willing to put in.

[wildrice]

Jan 8, 2023 17:20:03 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I have an honest question. How come when people insist they need a “hypoallergenic” dog they get a mutt that is 50% one of the most allergy laden dogs in the world like a golden or lab (don’t get me wrong I love goldens and labs but they’re not the most tidy dogs lol)

Have you considered one of the many naturally less allergic dogs? Bichon Frise, Maltese, Afghan Hound and poodles are some great options.

I don't get this either. I think poodles are awesome and would probably be my first choice if I were adopting a specific breed of dog. Maybe people picture poodles with the traditional, silly looking poodle hair cut? Because I definitely wouldn't want that, lol.

My sister has a shih tzu (that she thinks is actually a mix, but looks exactly like a purebred so who knows - he was a rescue with no history) and that's another great dog I never realized I'd like. He is kind of funny looking with his underbite, but he's very low maintenance and sweet. My BIL is allergic to dogs and has no problems with theirs. I guess that's not a good fit for someone looking for a companion with a really active lifestyle, but the upside is that they don't have to walk him unless they want to!

[jobae1234]

Jan 8, 2023 17:20:03 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I have an honest question. How come when people insist they need a “hypoallergenic” dog they get a mutt that is 50% one of the most allergy laden dogs in the world like a golden or lab (don’t get me wrong I love goldens and labs but they’re not the most tidy dogs lol)

Have you considered one of the many naturally less allergic dogs? Bichon Frise, Maltese, Afghan Hound and poodles are some great options.

I’m a doodle owner. My other dog, and the dog before that, were Shih tsus and I freakin love them. I was Team Poodle but my husband couldn’t stand the idea. I think the poodle breed has a bad reputation, because a lot of people have an aversion to them or think of them as snappish and bad with kids (not saying that’s true). They need an image overhaul or something. Rebranding. Lol.

[estrellita]

Jan 9, 2023 13:32:31 GMT -5 InBetweenDays said:

Jan 8, 2023 17:20:03 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I have an honest question. How come when people insist they need a “hypoallergenic” dog they get a mutt that is 50% one of the most allergy laden dogs in the world like a golden or lab (don’t get me wrong I love goldens and labs but they’re not the most tidy dogs lol)

Have you considered one of the many naturally less allergic dogs? Bichon Frise, Maltese, Afghan Hound and poodles are some great options.

No kidding. But I'm guessing most people saying they want a Doodle because they are "hypoallergenic" are only using that as an excuse/justification for buying an overpriced mixed breed dog with the relatively more instant gratification they can get by going through these backyard breeders.

We have friends and family members with somewhat serious pet allergies who have had great success with purebred Italian Water Dogs and West Highland Terriers (from reputable breeders). But of course that took more planning and time than many people are willing to put in.

My friends have a Spanish water dog because it's the only dog they could find that the H didn't react to.

[tarajane]

Jan 9, 2023 20:18:40 GMT -5 jobae1234 said:

Jan 8, 2023 17:20:03 GMT -5 icedcoffee said:

I have an honest question. How come when people insist they need a “hypoallergenic” dog they get a mutt that is 50% one of the most allergy laden dogs in the world like a golden or lab (don’t get me wrong I love goldens and labs but they’re not the most tidy dogs lol)

Have you considered one of the many naturally less allergic dogs? Bichon Frise, Maltese, Afghan Hound and poodles are some great options.

I’m a doodle owner. My other dog, and the dog before that, were Shih tsus and I freakin love them. I was Team Poodle but my husband couldn’t stand the idea. I think the poodle breed has a bad reputation, because a lot of people have an aversion to them or think of them as snappish and bad with kids (not saying that’s true). They need an image overhaul or something. Rebranding. Lol.

Agreed. We don't have a dog because my H doesn't want one but we dogsit a poodle sometimes. She is so great with the kids.

[lucybrown]

I believe we’re in the same area. This rescue has a bunch of doodles to choose from. It’s an option anyway. We’ve adopted from them in the past. Might remove some of the guesswork on size, personality, etc.

www.jrspupsnstuff.org/dogs

[jobae1234]

Jan 20, 2023 20:41:06 GMT -5 lucybrown said:

I believe we’re in the same area. This rescue has a bunch of doodles to choose from. It’s an option anyway. We’ve adopted from them in the past. Might remove some of the guesswork on size, personality, etc.

www.jrspupsnstuff.org/dogs

This looks like how I got my dog! Lots of 6 month olds. That’s when they’re too old for breeders to sell them. This is a great resource! You can get the kind of temperament that works best for you!

[lucybrown]

Jan 21, 2023 9:56:59 GMT -5 jobae1234 said:

Jan 20, 2023 20:41:06 GMT -5 lucybrown said:

I believe we’re in the same area. This rescue has a bunch of doodles to choose from. It’s an option anyway. We’ve adopted from them in the past. Might remove some of the guesswork on size, personality, etc.

www.jrspupsnstuff.org/dogs

This looks like how I got my dog! Lots of 6 month olds. That’s when they’re too old for breeders to sell them. This is a great resource! You can get the kind of temperament that works best for you!

At 6 months old, they’re still very trainable too. Rescue dogs usually have wonderful volunteers that have done some of the heavy lifting with potty training, crate training, socialization, etc.

Obviously I’m very biased to rescue dogs. If I were ever going to consider a designer mutt, this is the route I’d go.

[pinkpeony08]

Jan 20, 2023 20:41:06 GMT -5 lucybrown said:

I believe we’re in the same area. This rescue has a bunch of doodles to choose from. It’s an option anyway. We’ve adopted from them in the past. Might remove some of the guesswork on size, personality, etc.

www.jrspupsnstuff.org/dogs

I’m also in the area and have heard very good things about this rescue! A former co worker fosters for them!

[lucybrown]

Jan 22, 2023 12:14:57 GMT -5 pinkpeony08 said:

Jan 20, 2023 20:41:06 GMT -5 lucybrown said:

I believe we’re in the same area. This rescue has a bunch of doodles to choose from. It’s an option anyway. We’ve adopted from them in the past. Might remove some of the guesswork on size, personality, etc.

www.jrspupsnstuff.org/dogs

I’m also in the area and have heard very good things about this rescue! A former co worker fosters for them!

They have a great reputation. Our last dog was adopted from there. He passed in August and I’m very slowly starting to look for our next pooch.

[pinkpeony08]

There are even some adorable Aussiedoodles playing in the snow… www.facebook.com/groups/jrspupsnstuff/?ref=share&mibextid=S66gvF

[maudefindlay]

Ok nicolewi what did you decide to do?