Post by DotAndBuzz on Mar 12, 2023 22:00:35 GMT -5
UPDATE Welp. Therapy appt Wednesday, took the morning off yesterday after her dr appt, had a lovely breakfast together, she got to school around noon. Tennis started this week, which she wants to do and takes weekly lessons for (or - did until this winter schedule madness started). She's not good enough to make varsity, but she is excited to be on JV. Practices are 2 hours a day, either at 3:30 or 5:30. **THIS MORNING** she texts me to let me know she is *ALSO* going to audition for another theater thing. A sketch comedy show they put on in mid April. Practices are also after school, at 5:30. I've been texting her all morning telling her this isn't a good idea, commitments overlap, etc.
She insists.
Reminded her she was BEGGING to take a day off school because she was so tired and busy just 2 weeks ago. That she's setting herself up to be exhausted and over committed.
She insists it will be fine. A senior (who is already accepted to college, and is now just enjoying their last few months) is doing a varsity sport and this so "they're doing it, so obviously the time isn't an issue."
Y'all. I can't. I just flat out told her she's not going to be missing any school because she is choosing to overcommit to these activities. She will be the one telling the people in charge when she has to miss practice/rehearsal because of her choices. Maybe that makes me an uncompassionate hardass, but after deliberately spelling out the writing on the wall....literally, we've been texting about this, my logical points of caution/considerations are in print for her to see.....what else can I do? No one is gaslighting her into doing this. I tried to talk her out of it.
So round and round we go. Again. I'm just going to fully step back and let the chips fall where they may. If she crashes and burns, I guess so be it.
Background: 15 year old freshman, straight A's, in honors classes, I don't monitor/assist with her school work situation at all. LOVES theater. It's her people, she's not good enough to be a lead role, but she doesn't seem to care for now, she's found her social place in HS. Had a musical this weekend, is running on fumes from tech week, BUT has kept up with classes. Has substantial anxiety which we realized is the source of a lot of other mental health and executive function issues. Is in therapy, but hasn't been able to go for about a month because of theater.
Has been asking to stay home for a mental health day, because "you have no idea how tired I am." Okaaaay. She stays up till 11:30 because she is so bad at just sitting and grinding out her HW when she's home. takes SO many "breaks." Like, 30-60 minutes scrolling, just zoning out. Again, she gets it done, but she's getting way too little sleep because of how she does her HW. Rehearsals meant she wasn't home till 7:30-9 for a couple weeks, and not starting till late. In non-show seasons, she still dicks around and doesn't start until after dinner.
So. Performance this weekend. 4 shows in 3 days. Party at a cast member's house (a junior) Saturday night. She was there till 1 am. my dad took her, he was right around the corner and available and in communication via text - the party situation/specifics isn't what I was questioning. we live 30 minutes away, they got home at 1:30. We talked before about how tired she was going to be, she INSISTED she wanted to go, it was really important to her to be with her friends after the show....ok fine.
Got herself up and to her volunteering for this afternoon, which she loves. was 3 hour commitment. Didn't start homework until 8:45 tonight. Took an hour break, and starts in with the "I'm too tired, I need to take a day off from school."
So...go to bed? "You don't understand, I NEED a break, can I just take a day off, I'm so tired from the play."
I'm down with mental health days. If she was exhausted from academic work, I'd be there. But, you're burned out because you did a show, and then partied till 1:30 am, and....yes, you still have commitments. You don't get to take a day off to watch Netflix because you are wrecked from an extracurricular, and CHOSE to go to a party, is kind of where I'm landing. But H and I are getting serious tears and push back because "we don't understand."
Spring break is in 2 weeks. Are we way off base in insisting she go to school? I mean, writing that out sounds insane, but in talking to other people in our circle, their kids just....stay home if they need a break, like, all the time.
Post by wanderingback on Mar 12, 2023 22:05:39 GMT -5
Do you think this will become a regular ask if you say yes?
It definitely seems like a good life lesson of budgeting and prioritizing your time and sleep habits in general, but also people do need rest at certain points in their life.
If my kid hasn’t cashed in a break day all year I would totally yes. It sounds like this isn’t something your daughter tries to take advantage of, so I would probably indulge.
As an adult I have taken a day off for much less lol.
I am a mom of two teens, I get the frustration over stupid life choices. My 16 year old stays up late for no reason or lack of planning all the time and it’s hard to have sympathy.
I’d love to tell you to make her go to school and surely she will learn a lesson about making better choices, but she likely won’t. I’d give her the mental health day. It’s one day and she seems to need it given the tears and push back.
I don’t have a teen yet, so my thoughts might change in a few years.
What about telling her she can take Wed or Thursday off as a mental health day? It shows her you are listening and do care, but removes the connection to the late night out that you're concerned about.
Whether or not she should care about this aside, but her taking the day off after the play, a late night party, and daylight savings time will come across differently to teachers than a day off later in the week. One comes across as tired and didn't want to get out of bed in the morning. The other suggests you need rest and time for yourself. The difference is subtle, but could be important to some. (Again, whether or not this does/should matter is another discussion.)
Do you think this will become a regular ask if you say yes?
It definitely seems like a good life lesson of budgeting and prioritizing your time and sleep habits in general, but also people do need rest at certain points in their life.
She asks constantly.
She has taken a day this fall, and I try to be understanding because her anxiety truly impacts her functioning. But that’s also why she is in therapy, so she can learn how to manage it, and not shut down/completely disconnect when it ramps up. I understand the need for a break. But the time management and prioritization is what’s bothering me about this.
And she has the example she sees in her peers who roll into school late/leave early/just don’t show because they need to chill.
You don't get to take a day off to watch Netflix because ...
Perhaps a middle ground?
My mother's rule was always if you are sick enough to be home, then you should take the day to rest. No TV, no phone time, no leisure reading, Completing missed school work or homework was okay, but otherwise we were expected to rest.
So in a case like this, I might offer my kid something like: "If you need a day to rest and reset. Let's talk about it. It would be a no screens, no texts day. You could choose between physically resting and recuperating in bed, or something physically active and just a mental rest like a big hike. Is that what you are looking for?"
And if she says yes and picked on of those two, or a combo (or something like a meditation day, whatever), then I can see allowing it.
Straight As, self-motivator, volunteering- I would let her take a day. Maybe set a limit? One day in fall, one day in spring. It sounds like she’s juggling a lot and taking a night to celebrate and a day to recover won’t change her overall behavior/expectations of herself.
Post by goldengirlz on Mar 12, 2023 22:32:24 GMT -5
Is it possible she has ADHD? It looks so different in girls and boys.
Also, if therapy alone isn’t helping, have you thought about adding medication?
If she seems like she needs a mental health day, I would let her take it. I basically majored in extracurriculars in high school and college and they were just as important to my future career as coursework was. (And probably gave me an edge over other students with the same grades.) Saying it was “only” an extracurricular that made her tired … I don’t know, feels like an arbitrary distinction.
I think if it were my kid, I’d let her take the day, but with the understanding that if her anxiety and time management issues continue to overwhelm her, it may be time to explore other options beyond therapy.
I'm a softie. And also my neighbor is the high school/middle school drama and music teacher, he has 3 kids (son is friends with my son) and his wife and I walk our dogs together and the schedule seems pretty brutal. He's had 1 day off in the last month (including weekends) because of the rehearsal schedule. I had NO clue it was this intense, tonight was opening weekend and they've started rehearsals for the middle school play. I feel REALLY bad for the guy and seeing it through his wife and kids makes me sympathetic for how grueling it seems to be, so I would let her have a day off.
But also I might make some new rules about structuring her time. Like no phone between the hours of x and y so she can get her homework done and be in bed at an earlier time.
Post by mcppalmbeach on Mar 12, 2023 22:40:14 GMT -5
Given all her credentials, I’d say allowing a mental health day in the fall and 1 in the spring seems reasonable. I am a hard ass about stuff like this and wish I wasn’t so it comes from that place. Also, I’d allow tv but no phone / texting / scrolling. I feel like you can veg with tv, but the constant scrolling with phones isn’t mentally allowing a break. My son is 14 in 8th grade and we’re starting to really get into time management and priority setting.
I've read the whole thread, and I am team Give the Teen a Mental Health Day. I am exhausted just reading everything she keeps up with, and it's significant even with time management issues (which don't make it any less valid).
Post by Patsy Baloney on Mar 12, 2023 22:50:06 GMT -5
I took tons of mental health days in high school. I was in everything, did everything, volunteered, had awesome grades, it wasn’t a big deal. I think my senior year I missed close to 20 days? Definitely got the truancy letter, lol.
I dunno, I don’t think it’s that serious and kids are under an immense amount of stress that we never were as children.
Do you think this will become a regular ask if you say yes?
It definitely seems like a good life lesson of budgeting and prioritizing your time and sleep habits in general, but also people do need rest at certain points in their life.
She asks constantly.
She has taken a day this fall, and I try to be understanding because her anxiety truly impacts her functioning. But that’s also why she is in therapy, so she can learn how to manage it, and not shut down/completely disconnect when it ramps up. I understand the need for a break. But the time management and prioritization is what’s bothering me about this.
And she has the example she sees in her peers who roll into school late/leave early/just don’t show because they need to chill.
If she asks constantly then I would definitely try to come up with a better long term solution. Yes I know easier said than done with a teen!
Is her anxiety well managed? Is she in too many activities? Does she need a different structure for homework time? Yes people need to rest but you shouldn’t be so stressed out as a teenager that you need to miss school regularly.
But to answer your question I think it’s fine to say yes this time and then come up with a good long term solution.
I might allow her one, but with caveats like some others have mentioned. She needs to do something during the day that will truly be reading and recharging her, so not scrolling on her phone/social media. Maybe getting a certain amount of schoolwork done if she's behind.
I would try to address the taking breaks from homework issue with her more. Someone on mm moms posted a link to a podcast that talked about distractions that I found helpful for myself (I think I may have ADHD) that talked about two different types of distractions. I can try to find the link again. But one type are soft distractions, that really rest your brain- taking a walk with no phone with you - may not be realistic with her evening hours, but maybe taking a break to sit and do something else truly relaxing for the brain for a bit. Drink some tea, take a shower, something like that. The hard distractions- scrolling online, etc, she needs to set a time limit on so it doesn't suck her into it and suddenly an hour has gone by. So yes, she can scroll for a bit, but it is only 20 minutes and when that timer goes off she's back to the homework. And maybe a limit of one break of each kind pretty evening? I'm still trying to figure it out myself, but it has been a helpful way to think about things.
Do you think she could have ADHD? My SD also takes a LONG time to complete tasks and we always chalked it up to anxiety but now I’m thinking it could be ADHD.
Post by gretchenindisguise on Mar 13, 2023 0:20:39 GMT -5
L asks constantly.
We give each kid 1 skip day per semester, mostly no questions asked.
Directly on this topic - I was really annoyed at L last week. She overextended herself because I was talked into allowing it - I’m totally regretting it. Anyways- then she got actually physically sick on top of it. She had dress rehearsal Tues. She stayed home Weds. Opening night Thurs.
I was pretty annoyed. But she was legit sick and with rehearal for 2 other shows + 2 other runs of current show - I knew if she didn’t have a day off she wouldn’t be able to get over her cold. I normally would have told her to buck up. But yeah.
We had a long conversation about stretching too thin.
I’m also wondering if ADHD could be at play here. She sounds SO much like me.
I agree with other that I would allow the mental health day, but I would want to talk with her about what that day might look like so she can make the most of it. I would NOT recommend banning her phone because that to me sounds like a punishment. But I would ask her about coming up with a plan to catch up on her schoolwork while taking some timed breaks.
Straight As, self-motivator, volunteering- I would let her take a day. Maybe set a limit? One day in fall, one day in spring. It sounds like she’s juggling a lot and taking a night to celebrate and a day to recover won’t change her overall behavior/expectations of herself.
I usually let Lucy have one mental health day per trimester. (This year she had Covid and then the flu so that is not happening). I say let her stay home. My mom let us stay home for a mental in hs.
Post by emilyinchile on Mar 13, 2023 5:41:51 GMT -5
Whatever the reason, even if it's her own poor time management, it sounds like she's really overwhelmed and needs a second. I'd give her the day off, then continue to focus on therapy and finding ways to help her improve the homework/bedtime situation on a daily basis. You aren't going to solve that root issue by refusing a day off, and it sounds like that's the real issue.
Also, the idea of taking a supposed mental health day to do homework sounds like everything that is wrong with our society.
Damn, in that situation, I would have suggested the mental health day to her to avoid her becoming physically ill.
I tend to look at high school holistically. In many ways, the skills and experiences from her play experience are as critical to preparing her to be successful in life are at least as critical as whatever she's learning in Honors Geometry. Let her have her party and let her veg out today.
I agree with the others about screening her for ADHD; her time management skills sound exactly like every woman I know with ADHD. I have a seriously successful niece who wasn't diagnosed with ADHD until her mid-30s. Getting the diagnosis has been life-changing for her. Understanding her challenges with executive function has helped her put routines in place that have reduced her baseline anxiety tremendously.
The time stuff is hard. And it can be infuriating for those in relationships with them. I grew up with a mom with ADHD and have a son and the niece with it. As an experiment, I asked them each how long it would take to drive from my house to my mom's. This is a drive familiar to each of them. Mom describes it as 5 minutes away. Niece said 5 or 10 minutes. DS said 12 minutes. The real answer is 18 minutes under ideal circumstances. Things always take longer than they expect, so they are always stressed to complete tasks in the insufficient time they've allotted themselves which worsens the anxiety piece.
I would have no issues letting her take a day. Sounds like you have a responsible, self motivated teen. I dont know a single teen that would skip a cast party (or any big social event their friends are all going to) to stay home and sleep.
I would give the mental health day. That is an exhausting weekend, she has straight As, sounds like a great kid, and hasn't taken a mental health day since the fall. Let her take a break.
Post by starburst604 on Mar 13, 2023 6:31:59 GMT -5
As a former high school drama kid, I’d give her the day. When a show finishes up there’s sometimes a little depression after. Yes, she made her choices but my memories of cast parties are some of my best memories and I’m glad she enjoyed it to the fullest!
Teens generally have a hard time getting enough sleep due to their natural sleep rhythm and early school start time. So her homework and/or other activities may not be the main culprit for her needing a day off.
I really don't understand the problem with taking a couple days a year of to sleep in then do something fun. Who cares if she watches Netflix, mindlessly scrolls on her phone, or whatever. It would probably be just the mental break she needs for a day. I don't think she needs to do anything productive if she takes it off.
I think knowing when to take a mental health day and relaxing is part of learning how to manage life.