Republican debate #1

[maudefindlay]

Aug 23, 2023 20:58:39 GMT -5 rosiebear said:

Aug 23, 2023 20:54:35 GMT -5 erbear said:

She has a vagina.

Republican women get elected, though. Look at Kristi Noem. Although I suppose President is a bridge too far for them.

What if they have their period during a time of war?! My lord woman, she could press the button from all them hormones!

[Velar Fricative]

I am theorizing that DeSantis is no longer the frontrunner because national MAGA, previously only accustomed to reading about what he did in FL and watching brief media clips, now see he has zero tough guy persona, sounds boring, and doesn’t have the WWE-like superstar vibe that they see in Trump. Nor is he Trump’s ebullient cheerleader like Ramaswamy is. Because otherwise DeSantis’ quick fall just doesn’t make sense beyond acknowledging that collective American opinions change daily and you have to figure out when to peak at the right time to get the votes.

[underwaterrhymes]

Bottom line is Trump talks in plain language and says all the hateful things that his merry band of MAGAts are thinking. DeSantis is still awful (so, so awful) but he talks too much like any other politician.

[StrawberryBlondie]

Aug 23, 2023 20:51:58 GMT -5 rosiebear said:

I don’t watch R politics too closely, but Haley seems formidable. Why do people think she’s a weak candidate?

She's a woman.

[lilac05]

Aug 24, 2023 1:51:04 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

It's there anything worth rewatching?

@sharonsaysso watched it and posted summaries on her stories. It’s easy to spend just a couple of minutes on it & you can click through as fast as you’d like but still get the gist.

I agree that Haley looked the strongest last night. I loved her putting Vivek in his place about foreign relations & her quoting the phrase about if you want to get something done, ask a woman. Her policies are still trash, but mostly in line with what I expected from Republicans pre-Trump era.

[ESF]

Aug 23, 2023 20:51:58 GMT -5 rosiebear said:

I don’t watch R politics too closely, but Haley seems formidable. Why do people think she’s a weak candidate?

Even if Haley were palatable to a general election, she's got to get through a GOP primary.

The GOP is no longer dominated by polite fiscal conservatives who feel like bigotry is a small price to pay to save $127 a year on federal taxes.

It's dominated by raving lunatics who care about owning the libs and Hunter Biden.

[ESF]

Don't underestimate Ramaswammy. He's completely batshit but he's not boring. The maniacs who voted for Trump want to be entertained and he delivered a show.

I hope I'm wrong but he's the only one that left me nervous last night.

[Velar Fricative]

Aug 24, 2023 9:03:36 GMT -5 ESF said:

Don't underestimate Ramaswammy. He's completely batshit but he's not boring. The maniacs who voted for Trump want to be entertained and he delivered a show.

I hope I'm wrong but he's the only one that left me nervous last night.

I won't. I think DeSantis is sweating because he expected to be the heir apparent if Trump ends up in jail (or dead), which is why he has mostly shied away from attacking Trump aggressively, but now Ramaswamy is the MAGA standard bearer. Especially since he's "not a politician" either. 

[lilac05]

Aug 24, 2023 9:03:36 GMT -5 ESF said:

Don't underestimate Ramaswammy. He's completely batshit but he's not boring. The maniacs who voted for Trump want to be entertained and he delivered a show.

I hope I'm wrong but he's the only one that left me nervous last night.

Agreed. He definitely has the character that Trump supporters like. Overly confident and proudly spews completely incorrect info and passes it off as fact without skipping a beat. His ideas are absolutely atrocious, but his delivery of them is actually really good. He’s charismatic, he’s “not a politician”, he’s young with a ton of energy, he’s got a big smile that he flashes often…He’s incredibly dangerous.

[litebright]

Aug 23, 2023 20:51:58 GMT -5 rosiebear said:

I don’t watch R politics too closely, but Haley seems formidable. Why do people think she’s a weak candidate?

See, IMO the issue with Haley is that she comes off as too intelligent/reasoned/acknowledging reality for the R base at this point. 

I actually would not be surprised if the GOP elects a woman president before the Dems do. If someone in the Ann Coulter vein ran and really leaned into giving the base the nastiness & lies that it has proven with Trump that it wants, they'd elect that kind of woman over most of the guys on-stage last night, I think. 

I think the Dems have more of an issue with people waffling on "I don't know why, I just don't LIKE her" and that resulting in less enthusiasm and fewer independents voting for a woman candidate. I'd love to be wrong, but both HRC's loss to Trump and Kamala Harris' star not rising as much as I think it should have as VP, makes me pessimistic. 

[scm1011]

Huh, I didn’t watch but it’s interesting that the thoughts here differ wildly from the performance grades The Boston Globe gave out. They gave Pence an A+, Christie a B+, and Nikki Haley a D.

[Velar Fricative]

Haley would have had a shot in, like, 2012. Not now, not in the MAGA Era.

[sent]

Aug 24, 2023 9:06:27 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

Aug 24, 2023 9:03:36 GMT -5 ESF said:

Don't underestimate Ramaswammy. He's completely batshit but he's not boring. The maniacs who voted for Trump want to be entertained and he delivered a show.

I hope I'm wrong but he's the only one that left me nervous last night.

I won't. I think DeSantis is sweating because he expected to be the heir apparent if Trump ends up in jail (or dead), which is why he has mostly shied away from attacking Trump aggressively, but now Ramaswamy is the MAGA standard bearer. Especially since he's "not a politician" either. 

Trump brought the racists out in full force like I have never seen in my life. 

I do not believe for one minute that base will vote for someone who is not white. 

[DarcyLongfellow]

If, God forbid, I were forced to choose a president from that stage last night, Nikki Haley would be it. Her policies are awful and she definitely panders to right wing "required" talking points like being anti-choice, but she came across as intelligent and not easily cowed by men shouting at her.

Vivek gives me the creeps. That smile. Commentators keep referencing his "big smile" as a positive thing, but it came across as so fake and manic to me. Every time he smiled, I got horror movie vibes.

[jeaniebueller]

Aug 24, 2023 5:45:32 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

I am theorizing that DeSantis is no longer the frontrunner because national MAGA, previously only accustomed to reading about what he did in FL and watching brief media clips, now see he has zero tough guy persona, sounds boring, and doesn’t have the WWE-like superstar vibe that they see in Trump. Nor is he Trump’s ebullient cheerleader like Ramaswamy is. Because otherwise DeSantis’ quick fall just doesn’t make sense beyond acknowledging that collective American opinions change daily and you have to figure out when to peak at the right time to get the votes.

Every time DeSantis opens his mouth, I can't believe *That's* his voice. His voice doesn't match his persona. He acts like he was created in a lab.

[cous0226]

so CNN did a mini focus group of 15 people and they asked who won and the majority said Vivek. This R party is so fucked with these nutter crackpots. They will not recover for years from this unless Trump dies but it may even still stick around after that. We learned in the midterms that the country rejected crazy and I hope that Biden can win this election if it's Trump which seems like it will be. I think some of the R voters just care about drama and Hunter and who is sticking it to the D's.   They are literally too stupid to look at the bigger picture.  

[shopgirl07]

Aug 24, 2023 9:28:34 GMT -5 scm1011 said:

Huh, I didn’t watch but it’s interesting that the thoughts here differ wildly from the performance grades The Boston Globe gave out. They gave Pence an A+, Christie a B+, and Nikki Haley a D.

I read this article too and thought it was so off base! They overrated Pence and Christie and severely underrated Haley.

I thought the WaPo gave a better recap.

[litebright]

Aug 24, 2023 10:08:34 GMT -5 cous0226 said:

so CNN did a mini focus group of 15 people and they asked who won and the majority said Vivek. This R party is so fucked with these nutter crackpots. They will not recover for years from this unless Trump dies but it may even still stick around after that. We learned in the midterms that the country rejected crazy and I hope that Biden can win this election if it's Trump which seems like it will be. I think some of the R voters just care about drama and Hunter and who is sticking it to the D's.   They are literally too stupid to look at the bigger picture.  

It won't end when he dies. I feel like most of the MAGAs won't ever believe that he dies, they'll cook up some theory that he had to go into hiding or is carrying out "secret missions" (lofl that anyone would think this of Bonespurs); never mind that he's really old and it would be perfectly natural for him to die at any point. 

It'll be like Elvis, only a gazillion times worse. AI-created photos or video that "prove" he's still alive, someone like the people behind Q will claim to be communicating messages from him ... 

[rubytue]

DarcyLongfellow, I came away with the same feelings as you on Halley. Like, no way would I be happy. But maybe her or Christie if I was forced to end up under someone on that stage.

In a text thread from last night, a friend was saying he thought Vivek won. I asked what he meant by winning a debate, and he said the most zingers. So yeah, this is what counts as winning these days. I fear for the future.

[erbear]

Aug 24, 2023 8:28:51 GMT -5 lilac05 said:

Aug 24, 2023 1:51:04 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

It's there anything worth rewatching?

@sharonsaysso watched it and posted summaries on her stories. It’s easy to spend just a couple of minutes on it & you can click through as fast as you’d like but still get the gist.

I agree that Haley looked the strongest last night. I loved her putting Vivek in his place about foreign relations & her quoting the phrase about if you want to get something done, ask a woman. Her policies are still trash, but mostly in line with what I expected from Republicans pre-Trump era.

Yes. She's not someone I would ever vote for, because many of her policies just don't align with mine, but she is a candidate I'd like to see in the general  when elections were more sane. Except I was very very turned off by her casual transphobia at the end — so pandery to me and obviously harmful and disgusting. So bye Nikki.

[erbear]

Aug 24, 2023 9:28:34 GMT -5 scm1011 said:

Huh, I didn’t watch but it’s interesting that the thoughts here differ wildly from the performance grades The Boston Globe gave out. They gave Pence an A+, Christie a B+, and Nikki Haley a D.

CNN has the opposite (Haley A, Pence B+ and Christie C)

[rubytue]

Aug 24, 2023 10:43:13 GMT -5 litebright said:

Aug 24, 2023 10:08:34 GMT -5 cous0226 said:

so CNN did a mini focus group of 15 people and they asked who won and the majority said Vivek. This R party is so fucked with these nutter crackpots. They will not recover for years from this unless Trump dies but it may even still stick around after that. We learned in the midterms that the country rejected crazy and I hope that Biden can win this election if it's Trump which seems like it will be. I think some of the R voters just care about drama and Hunter and who is sticking it to the D's.   They are literally too stupid to look at the bigger picture.  

It won't end when he dies. I feel like most of the MAGAs won't ever believe that he dies, they'll cook up some theory that he had to go into hiding or is carrying out "secret missions" (lofl that anyone would think this of Bonespurs); never mind that he's really old and it would be perfectly natural for him to die at any point. 

It'll be like Elvis, only a gazillion times worse. AI-created photos or video that "prove" he's still alive, someone like the people behind Q will claim to be communicating messages from him ... 

I mean, there are already folks believing JFK and jr and Diana are still alive and going to take back the world. 

[TR]

Aug 24, 2023 10:43:13 GMT -5 litebright said:

Aug 24, 2023 10:08:34 GMT -5 cous0226 said:

so CNN did a mini focus group of 15 people and they asked who won and the majority said Vivek. This R party is so fucked with these nutter crackpots. They will not recover for years from this unless Trump dies but it may even still stick around after that. We learned in the midterms that the country rejected crazy and I hope that Biden can win this election if it's Trump which seems like it will be. I think some of the R voters just care about drama and Hunter and who is sticking it to the D's.   They are literally too stupid to look at the bigger picture.  

It won't end when he dies. I feel like most of the MAGAs won't ever believe that he dies, they'll cook up some theory that he had to go into hiding or is carrying out "secret missions" (lofl that anyone would think this of Bonespurs); never mind that he's really old and it would be perfectly natural for him to die at any point. 

It'll be like Elvis, only a gazillion times worse. AI-created photos or video that "prove" he's still alive, someone like the people behind Q will claim to be communicating messages from him ... 

Yeah, but this won't affect actual politics at that point. They'll fade into the rest of the conspiracy theories out there.

[cattledogkisses]

Aug 24, 2023 9:03:36 GMT -5 ESF said:

Don't underestimate Ramaswammy. He's completely batshit but he's not boring. The maniacs who voted for Trump want to be entertained and he delivered a show.

I hope I'm wrong but he's the only one that left me nervous last night.

Agreed.  The Republican base isn't interested in serious candidates, they like bombastic showmen who will own the Libs with zingers.  Ramaswamy is political dilettante, but he understood the assignment and gave them what they wanted.

[ESF]

I weep over these newspaper grades.

Nobody who is willing to support a guy who incited an insurrection that almost got a candidate on the stage killed should be getting a passing grade.

And sweet baby Jesus all the coded anti-trans bullshit with the girls sports.

They are all trash people and the media has learned nothing.

[Beagle]

Has anyone seen the gif of DeSantis making a statement and then trying to smile?

It's going to haunt my nightmares.

[suburbanzookeeper]

Aug 24, 2023 16:26:02 GMT -5 Beagle said:

Has anyone seen the gif of DeSantis making a statement and then trying to smile?

It's going to haunt my nightmares.

After seeing the videos of him next to Homelander from The Boys, I can't unsee it. 

[sonrisa]

Aug 24, 2023 16:26:02 GMT -5 Beagle said:

Has anyone seen the gif of DeSantis making a statement and then trying to smile?

It's going to haunt my nightmares.

He's the new Ted Cruz. All the same bluster and build up leading to a creepy, failing, presidential bid.

[mrsukyankee]

Aug 24, 2023 9:03:36 GMT -5 ESF said:

Don't underestimate Ramaswammy. He's completely batshit but he's not boring. The maniacs who voted for Trump want to be entertained and he delivered a show.

I hope I'm wrong but he's the only one that left me nervous last night.

I saw a news article about voters up north who were undecided Repubs who all thought he was the winner of the night and one they'd vote for. My brain went haywire for a moment after reading that.

[maudefindlay]

Aug 24, 2023 8:52:44 GMT -5 ESF said:

Aug 23, 2023 20:51:58 GMT -5 rosiebear said:

I don’t watch R politics too closely, but Haley seems formidable. Why do people think she’s a weak candidate?

Even if Haley were palatable to a general election, she's got to get through a GOP primary.

The GOP is no longer dominated by polite fiscal conservatives who feel like bigotry is a small price to pay to save $127 a year on federal taxes.

It's dominated by raving lunatics who care about owning the libs and Hunter Biden.

And those lunatic people who enjoy white privilege (even though they deny being priveledged). They want the "good old days" where white men run everything, women stay home, and the lgbtq community are in the closet.