Wdyt re invisible disability lanyards or similar ETA impt

[basilosaurus]

I know a number of you have children, or you yourselves have, invisible disabilities.

I'm in an area of the world with nearly zero accommodation for anything. Sidewalks, if they exist, often have a steep step up as a small example.

The airport I most regularly use, one with some of the most intl connections in the world (to 5 I think), has signs all over saying if you see someone with this lanyard it's for invisible disabilities, so be considerate.

I personally think it's great because it's certainly a region where people might yell at you for taking a priority seat or elevator. But I can imagine there are counter arguments

ETA OMG I didn't realize it corrected to red! I meant re. It's a butterfly on the lanyard. The sign says something like if you see a butterfly this person has an invisible disability so give them extra consideration

[hermione]

I understand the reasoning for them but don't like that people have to label themselves as different in order to be treated with respect.


I appreciate when conferences give different colored lanyards to let people know if the wearer was comfortable with close contact like handshakes (green), preferred no contact but didn't have a distance preference (yellow), or wanted 6 feet of space (red).

[waverly]

This might be something where if the region respects it and people can opt in or out as they wish, then fine. I can see some areas acting like people are lying still even with a red lanyard.

I do like hermione's conference lanyard. Even pre pandemic I didn't really want to shake random sales guys hands.

[bex1973]

Oct 4, 2023 8:53:21 GMT -5 hermione said:

I understand the reasoning for them but don't like that people have to label themselves as different in order to be treated with respect.


I appreciate when conferences give different colored lanyards to let people know if the wearer was comfortable with close contact like handshakes (green), preferred no contact but didn't have a distance preference (yellow), or wanted 6 feet of space (red).

This.

[VillainV]

Oct 4, 2023 8:53:21 GMT -5 hermione said:

I understand the reasoning for them but don't like that people have to label themselves as different in order to be treated with respect.

Yep.

[basilosaurus]

Oct 4, 2023 9:11:24 GMT -5 VillainV said:

Oct 4, 2023 8:53:21 GMT -5 hermione said:

I understand the reasoning for them but don't like that people have to label themselves as different in order to be treated with respect.

Yep.

I fully understand this. No one should have to out themselves.

But it is actually a region that it might actually garner respect and spread information about it. Quite the dichotomy! I think not many know about invisible disabilities worldwide. So in a place that doesn't really address physical, this seems pretty damn progressive

[VillainV]

Oct 4, 2023 9:44:41 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Oct 4, 2023 9:11:24 GMT -5 VillainV said:

Yep.

I fully understand this. No one should have to out themselves.

But it is actually a region that it might actually garner respect and spread information about it. Quite the dichotomy! I think not many know about invisible disabilities worldwide. So in a place that doesn't really address physical, this seems pretty damn progressive

I think there are very good intentions with the red lanyards, and I agree that it might be helpful as a way of educating people that invisible disabilities exist, and open up a dialogue about how to serve people in the community. I just wish it wasn’t necessary.

[seeyalater52]

Oct 4, 2023 9:44:41 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Oct 4, 2023 9:11:24 GMT -5 VillainV said:

Yep.

I fully understand this. No one should have to out themselves.

But it is actually a region that it might actually garner respect and spread information about it. Quite the dichotomy! I think not many know about invisible disabilities worldwide. So in a place that doesn't really address physical, this seems pretty damn progressive

That is likely true but it also places a lot of burden on people with invisible disabilities to make themselves visible in situations that can be uncomfortable in the name of educating and creating awareness. Disabled people are often asked to be object lessons for abled education so at least in the cultural contexts I am familiar with that is an added layer of exhaustion that adds to this being problematic.

[litskispeciality]

Oct 4, 2023 9:11:24 GMT -5 VillainV said:

Oct 4, 2023 8:53:21 GMT -5 hermione said:

I understand the reasoning for them but don't like that people have to label themselves as different in order to be treated with respect.

Yep.

I'll third this. My dad lives in a state that famously doesn't give AF about ADA. There are several newer buildings that don't have an elevator at all, or only have one for a huge building (full of senior citizens). It's really opened my eyes to visible and invisible disabilities. Either way I don't think you should have to identify to get a service or respect. Especially for how difficult it is for some to get tested, diagnosed and so on. Whatever's good for those who disclose, is good for everyone. Hell, some days I just don't want to take the stairs as I'll be out of breath when I get to my destination so an elevator would be awesome. All of this to say just make the building, airport, bus station ADA accessible, and clearly post on your homepage how to privately receive more specific accommodations when necessary. 

Sometimes it's also temporary, and therefore harder to get an accommodation. That's not fair or right.

I went to a conference a couple of times that did a workshop with presenters. One thing they really hammered home was to consider invisible disabilities by making larger, easier to read text, EVERYONE use the microphone even if you're "super loud and everyone can hear you without it" and so on. I co-presented with a colleague who missed the prep workshop and refused to use the mic day of. I was mad, and embarrassed when we got the annon survey that we should have used the mic.

[litskispeciality]

Also to seeyalater52's point, we as a society need a lot more training on this. Coming from Higher Ed it was discussed more often than corporate, but still we always had someone speak up in a public forum to disclose an invisible disability and explain (again) why it needs to be considered without making the individual disclose. Some people might not even disclose this to their employer or wherever they might need an accommodation, and that's their choice. We shouldn't add more pressure or burden to them, as they have to then explain why they need whatever they need.

There are added layers in the work place as well, such as if you the employee then get a "special" (set) break time, or an extra break or whatever is right for you that your colleagues don't get. I'm sure there's pressure to disclose why you get "something special", when it could be eating at a certain time so your blood sugar doesn't drop to dangerously low levels. I worked with someone who ate at their desk because they couldn't be guaranteed to step away at that time, and that should be illegal.

There have been a few posts in here alone about potential ADA violations by employers, and I assume the employee didn't disclose, or were just so literally tired of fighting it, of pushing for what they need, that they just work through it and potentially hurt their health.

[basilosaurus]

Did anyone else read Robyn's book in elementary? A vignette that always struck with me was librarians giving her a hard time using the staff elevator (she had permission and the key) to go up to second floor. She had cf in an era where life expectancy was you were lucky to go to uni. That was my introduction to invisible disabilities although it wasn't explained like that then. It's probably banned in Florida now :/

I'm guessing the signs and lanyards were not a psa asking anything of passengers to explain, but more a response to incidents. And the signs basically say back tf off (I don't have pictures).

It's a start in a world with no ada. And maybe if people realize it's a real thing for those who choose to identify there are others out there who don't.

But if course the burden should absolutely not be in the individual to explain. I was just impressed the airport thought it important enough to identify the issue and post explanations throughout. I wish I remembered exact wording.

I still wish we'd all just know this inherently.

[basilosaurus]

Omg I'm so sorry I didn't catch that. No red sign! Here's what they have to say.

www.malaysiaairports.com.my/media-centre/news/klia-now-more-inclusive-safer-and-friendlier-facilities-and-services-passengers

[basilosaurus]

It still doesn't address hidden disabilities that have physical affects, but I was pretty impressed with the program.

I'm so sorry it sent people down red label paths.

[sofamonkey]

It just seems very ableist. Like, perhaps we just approach everyone in a non douchey, understand way. Or stop to think how people with disabilities, visible or invisible, would like things handled. Because placing the burden on the affected population, and also branding them so they are a spectacle to behold (and gossip about, or pick apart, etc etc etc) is not really the answer. For many reasons.

[wise_rita]

Oct 4, 2023 10:58:48 GMT -5 sofamonkey said:

It just seems very ableist. Like, perhaps we just approach everyone in a non douchey, understand way.

OP is talking about a part of the world that is decades and decades away from getting to where the USA is today. Of course this is ideal, but these comments are Western-centric.

[lilac05]

I think that the culture where you are makes a big difference in this discussion. TLDR: US: Opposed. Other Cultures: Open to discussion as a PART of a change.

Regardless of where you are and what the culture is, I wish there was absolutely no need for anything like this. The onus shouldn’t be on the people with invisible disabilities to make an announcement to the world that they deserve respect and understanding.

However, that’s not the world that we live in, especially in your part of the world. (I’ll never forget the feeling I had when I realized I had been literally around the world when studying abroad, and other than the babies in an orphanage in India and the occasional elderly person with a cane, I had seen essentially no one in public with a visible disability anywhere…a stark contrast to what I was used to in the US.) Turning the culture around to accept people with differences takes a lot of time and money…and people deserve acceptance NOW. A campaign to bring awareness is one small thing that can start to make a turn. A baby step. And people can always decide not to wear it if they don’t care to.

In the US, I would be opposed to this. We have the education and awareness. No one needs to share any part of themselves with everyone who sees them just to be treated with dignity and respect. People who are disrespectful to others are not going to be any nicer to people because they’re wearing a certain lanyard. And if someone thinks they’d be more understanding if they saw a lanyard, then they should be questioning why they wouldn’t just be understanding to everyone in the first place.

[orval]

We have had the sunflower lanyards at our airport (Charlotte) for years. I have never noticed anyone with them but they do exist.
hdsunflower.com/ www.cltairport.com/sunflower/

[wanderingback]

I guess you’re positing just to just have the conversation, correct?

I don’t know exactly where you live, but culture and context certainly matter, so I think that makes a big difference in regards to an opinion about this as someone who isn’t from that country/culture.

[sofamonkey]

Oct 4, 2023 11:25:11 GMT -5 wise_rita said:

Oct 4, 2023 10:58:48 GMT -5 sofamonkey said:

It just seems very ableist. Like, perhaps we just approach everyone in a non douchey, understand way.

OP is talking about a part of the world that is decades and decades away from getting to where the USA is today. Of course this is ideal, but these comments are Western-centric.

Which is an important distinction. However, why move towards the wrong direction just because they’re behind?

[mich1]

Oct 4, 2023 9:11:24 GMT -5 VillainV said:

Oct 4, 2023 8:53:21 GMT -5 hermione said:

I understand the reasoning for them but don't like that people have to label themselves as different in order to be treated with respect.

Yep.

I am parked here with my invisible disability.

[Poeticxpassion]

I have utilized the sunflower lanyard in many airports in the US and Europe. To me, it’s more of a signal to airport staff then the people around me. It’s an optional program, and I think it’s great to have for those who want it.

I put on the lanyard to show I need additional time and help with baggage. It never had anything to do with getting respect.

[basilosaurus]

Oct 4, 2023 12:14:07 GMT -5 sofamonkey said:

Oct 4, 2023 11:25:11 GMT -5 wise_rita said:

OP is talking about a part of the world that is decades and decades away from getting to where the USA is today. Of course this is ideal, but these comments are Western-centric.

Which is an important distinction. However, why move towards the wrong direction just because they’re behind?

it's actually moving in the right direction considering how backwards so many places are. Recognizing any disability exists is an improvement.

I fear my red= red auto correct and the reaction tainted my question. In sorry for that

[jamaicam]

Oct 4, 2023 13:03:33 GMT -5 Poeticxpassion said:

I have utilized the sunflower lanyard in many airports in the US and Europe. To me, it’s more of a signal to airport staff then the people around me. It’s an optional program, and I think it’s great to have for those who want it.

I put on the lanyard to show I need additional time and help with baggage. It never had anything to do with getting respect.

This - I view it as something to signal to airport staff that I may need extra help. I havent used it yet but I will next time I travel (we don't have it in airports here but they do in the UK).. For example, when it comes to boarding, I cant stand in the line for ages. I do not use a wheelchair but have a stick but that isnt always clearly visable among my children and bags! The lanyard is an easy way for the gate staff to see me and to allow me to skip the line to board. 

[heyyounotyouyou]

Don’t let perfection get in the way of progress is my thought on a lot of these comments.

[wise_rita]

Oct 4, 2023 14:19:50 GMT -5 heyyounotyouyou said:

Don’t let perfection get in the way of progress is my thought on a lot of these comments.

Ain't this the truth.  

"The worldview of people in a different time and place from where I am right now is invalid because it's not relevant to me" is doing nobody any favors.

Meet people where they are and go forward from there.  Don't write them off because their perspective differs from yours. 

[sofamonkey]

Oct 4, 2023 14:19:50 GMT -5 heyyounotyouyou said:

Don’t let perfection get in the way of progress is my thought on a lot of these comments.

I’m not sure people are going for perfection over progress in here. Many (but likely not all) are coming from people with invisible disabilities and how they feel about this being a new reality for them. So, while I agree with you, we also need to listen to the real voices of people that would be impacted by something like this.

[heyyounotyouyou]

Oct 4, 2023 16:32:42 GMT -5 sofamonkey said:

Oct 4, 2023 14:19:50 GMT -5 heyyounotyouyou said:

Don’t let perfection get in the way of progress is my thought on a lot of these comments.

I’m not sure people are going for perfection over progress in here. Many (but likely not all) are coming from people with invisible disabilities and how they feel about this being a new reality for them. So, while I agree with you, we also need to listen to the real voices of people that would be impacted by something like this.

Agree. And those people, in this very thread, are also saying it’s a good thing, yes?

[wildrice]

Oct 4, 2023 17:39:59 GMT -5 mofongo said:

I’m sure I am missing something, but how would airport staff know you need assistance for an invisible disability if they weren’t notified, in some fashion?

This is where I am. If someone doesn't need any accommodation, I am assuming they don't need to self identify. I don't think it's anyone's responsibility to raise awareness of whatever by identifying themselves, but it sounds like if they don't need anything and don't want others to know they can just - not do that? 

I am also confused about why a red lanyard is any different or worse than a butterfly lanyard so maybe I'm just missing something in this whole thread.

ETA: I actually read the link and IDK, to me it sounds good! I don't have autism or a child with autism so IDK if those are things they actually need, but it sounds like they've really gone out of their way to provide a positive experience for people who may experience air travel differently from the majority. 

Also people can be selfish jerks, maybe not as much in Malaysia as in the US, but if it helps someone avoid being a target of anger because they need to jump the line or get priority seating on a shuttle, I would think that would be preferable to being yelled at. Everyone SHOULD be kind to one another but that's not reality and a lot of people are particularly dicks when traveling. Again, it sounds like if you are not comfortable identifying yourself, there is no requirement to. But hopefully knowing you are less likely to end up being a target of anger if you take a seat might make you more comfortable actually taking the seat instead of suffering because you don't want anyone to get mad at you.

[VillainV]

Oct 4, 2023 17:39:59 GMT -5 mofongo said:

I’m sure I am missing something, but how would airport staff know you need assistance for an invisible disability if they weren’t notified, in some fashion?

I guess I didn’t realize it was for employees to know to give extra assistance? I was thinking in terms of if someone was seated in a priority seating area (like on a bus or shuttle) or used an accessible restroom, so other patrons knew not to berate them. (Yes, I have seen people get yelled at for stuff like this…)

[wanderingback]

I don’t have a disability so I’m not commenting on whether people should have to identify themselves, but I do wish there were a universal symbol for "I’m having shitty day so please give me a little grace."

I was in a store recently a this person pretty much ran me over turning the aisle and didn’t say anything. I was like wow, that was kinda rude. But then I saw them a few minutes later with what looked like a newborn and I was like aww maybe in that newborn haze of little sleep and wondering wtf did I just get myself in to. I mean no one has the right to be a straight up asshole but we all have those moments where we might need extra, time, space and/or grace.

Sorry somewhat off topic, carry on.