Wapo will not endorse a candidate

[pixy0stix]

I'm not cancelling WaPo. I'm bitter that because people have cancelled or not wanted to pay for their news, thereby paying journalists, we're stuck with a news system that relies on billionaires to fund our news sources. Do you like what we, the general populace, have sown? Are we happy now?

[underwaterrhymes]

I’ve been paying for news since 2016. I am continuing to pay for The Atlantic and I donate to NPR annually.

I really don’t feel the need to continue to throw my money at newspapers that cannot take a stand against facism.

[pixy0stix]

Oct 25, 2024 16:26:03 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

I’ve been paying for news since 2016. I am continuing to pay for The Atlantic and I donate to NPR annually.

I really don’t feel the need to continue to throw my money at newspapers that cannot take a stand against facism.

That's fine. Most people do not.

AP News had an article in 2022 talking about this issue of newspapers not endorsing candidates anymore - apnews.com/article/newspaper-political-endorsements-ace6dbc5068a215057dce8f5e7b4e077

Newspapers are dying. People are getting their news from TikTok, and podcasts, and whatever fucking random twitterhead (or whatever platform). All of this comes down to - we no longer value written news, or journalistic sources.

Get mad at me, it doesn't change the facts.

[underwaterrhymes]

Oct 25, 2024 16:33:43 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Oct 25, 2024 16:26:03 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

I’ve been paying for news since 2016. I am continuing to pay for The Atlantic and I donate to NPR annually.

I really don’t feel the need to continue to throw my money at newspapers that cannot take a stand against facism.

That's fine. Most people do not.

AP News had an article in 2022 talking about this issue of newspapers not endorsing candidates anymore - apnews.com/article/newspaper-political-endorsements-ace6dbc5068a215057dce8f5e7b4e077

Newspapers are dying. People are getting their news from TikTok, and podcasts, and whatever fucking random twitterhead (or whatever platform). All of this comes down to - we no longer value written news, or journalistic sources.

Get mad at me, it doesn't change the facts.

I value solid journalism.

However, many sources I used to trust (and, indeed, paid for because I trusted them) have refused to call out racism, facism, and misogyny. One candidate, if elected, will be a dictator. The other will not and it’s astounding to me that every legitimate publication isn’t taking a very clear stand on this.

People are turning to Twitter and TikTok because some of the grassroots influencers ARE calling out bigotry and because it’s clear that Harris and Biden are being held to a different standard than Trump by the media.

I believe there is room for both and I’m eyeing other publications that are doing great work (like the Houston Chronicle and the Philadelphia Inquirer - both of which endorsed Harris this week).

But I cannot continue to support publications that are not uttering full-throated condemnations of Trump.

[pixy0stix]

Oct 25, 2024 16:43:45 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

Oct 25, 2024 16:33:43 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

That's fine. Most people do not.

AP News had an article in 2022 talking about this issue of newspapers not endorsing candidates anymore - apnews.com/article/newspaper-political-endorsements-ace6dbc5068a215057dce8f5e7b4e077

Newspapers are dying. People are getting their news from TikTok, and podcasts, and whatever fucking random twitterhead (or whatever platform). All of this comes down to - we no longer value written news, or journalistic sources.

Get mad at me, it doesn't change the facts.

I value solid journalism.

However, many sources I used to trust (and, indeed, paid for because I trusted them) have refused to call out racism, facism, and misogyny. One candidate, if elected, will be a dictator. The other will not and it’s astounding to me that every legitimate publication isn’t taking a very clear stand on this.

People are turning to Twitter and TikTok because some of the grassroots influencers ARE calling out bigotry and because it’s clear that Harris and Biden are being held to a different standard than Trump by the media.

I believe there is room for both and I’m eyeing other publications that are doing great work (like the Houston Chronicle and the Philadelphia Inquirer - both of which endorsed Harris this week).

But I cannot continue to support publications that are not uttering full-throated condemnations of Trump.

I could have written that a couple of years ago, but I don't think that anymore. 

We're going to end up with a fascist in office because we have killed journalism in this country. Whether via purity tests, or not paying for subscriptions. And it killed journalism. This is where we are.

Also, people on social media should be treated as editorialists. They are not journalists. People who turn to them for the news do not, at it's fundamental root, understand what journalism is. It's not endorsements. It's not picking sides. It's reporting the news in as unbiased light as possible, and that's going to make people pissed.

[weetabix]

Oct 25, 2024 16:16:50 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

I'm not cancelling WaPo. I'm bitter that because people have cancelled or not wanted to pay for their news, thereby paying journalists, we're stuck with a news system that relies on billionaires to fund our news sources. Do you like what we, the general populace, have sown? Are we happy now?

That's fair. I also have paid subscriptions to NYT and the Boston Globe so I'll have to reevaluate if this is the approach they all take.

[underwaterrhymes]

Oct 25, 2024 16:51:34 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Oct 25, 2024 16:43:45 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

I value solid journalism.

However, many sources I used to trust (and, indeed, paid for because I trusted them) have refused to call out racism, facism, and misogyny. One candidate, if elected, will be a dictator. The other will not and it’s astounding to me that every legitimate publication isn’t taking a very clear stand on this.

People are turning to Twitter and TikTok because some of the grassroots influencers ARE calling out bigotry and because it’s clear that Harris and Biden are being held to a different standard than Trump by the media.

I believe there is room for both and I’m eyeing other publications that are doing great work (like the Houston Chronicle and the Philadelphia Inquirer - both of which endorsed Harris this week).

But I cannot continue to support publications that are not uttering full-throated condemnations of Trump.

I could have written that a couple of years ago, but I don't think that anymore. 

We're going to end up with a fascist in office because we have killed journalism in this country. Whether via purity tests, or not paying for subscriptions. And it killed journalism. This is where we are.

Also, people on social media should be treated as editorialists. They are not journalists. People who turn to them for the news do not, at it's fundamental root, understand what journalism is. It's not endorsements. It's not picking sides. It's reporting the news in as unbiased light as possible, and that's going to make people pissed.

As it happens, I do agree with you. And - yes - let’s call out areas we want to see growth in a candidate.

In the Trump era, however, we have seen media ignore or downplay Trump while treating Clinton, Biden, and Harris as they would ordinarily. It’s not even subtle.

And WaPo has endorsed candidates since the 1980s. To stop in this vital year is shameful.

[pixy0stix]

Oct 25, 2024 17:00:30 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

Oct 25, 2024 16:51:34 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

I could have written that a couple of years ago, but I don't think that anymore. 

We're going to end up with a fascist in office because we have killed journalism in this country. Whether via purity tests, or not paying for subscriptions. And it killed journalism. This is where we are.

Also, people on social media should be treated as editorialists. They are not journalists. People who turn to them for the news do not, at it's fundamental root, understand what journalism is. It's not endorsements. It's not picking sides. It's reporting the news in as unbiased light as possible, and that's going to make people pissed.

As it happens, I do agree with you. And - yes - let’s call out areas we want to see growth in a candidate.

In the Trump era, however, we have seen media ignore or downplay Trump while treating Clinton, Biden, and Harris as they would ordinarily. It’s not even subtle.

And WaPo has endorsed candidates since the 1980s. To stop in this vital year is shameful.

But again, it was Bezos, not the editorial board and the people who are actually producing the news. Boycotting Amazon is more apt (as was mentioned earlier in this thread). Boycotting WaPo hurts the journalists and the publication as a whole.

I have a much more local example - my local newspaper is owned by Gannet, which as a company is incredibly problematic. However, I still pay for my local news because there are literally no other sources of news here. Why? Because people stopped paying for the news and it had to be bought by a larger company to remain open.

Do we (general) want to kill one of the major news chains in this country simply because the owner is an asshole?

[underwaterrhymes]

Oct 25, 2024 17:11:45 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Oct 25, 2024 17:00:30 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

As it happens, I do agree with you. And - yes - let’s call out areas we want to see growth in a candidate.

In the Trump era, however, we have seen media ignore or downplay Trump while treating Clinton, Biden, and Harris as they would ordinarily. It’s not even subtle.

And WaPo has endorsed candidates since the 1980s. To stop in this vital year is shameful.

But again, it was Bezos, not the editorial board and the people who are actually producing the news. Boycotting Amazon is more apt (as was mentioned earlier in this thread). Boycotting WaPo hurts the journalists and the publication as a whole.

I have a much more local example - my local newspaper is owned by Gannet, which as a company is incredibly problematic. However, I still pay for my local news because there are literally no other sources of news here. Why? Because people stopped paying for the news and it had to be bought by a larger company to remain open.

Do we (general) want to kill one of the major news chains in this country simply because the owner is an asshole?

I think it’s more than just him being an asshole, though. What other ways is he influencing stories that are less visible than this?

Also, how does someone let a publication know that they’re not happy with the direction they’re heading other than refusing to help fund it? I’m happy to fund quality journalism and will shift around where I’m giving to reflect that. I just donated to the Mississippi Free Press. And, as I mentioned, I pay for The Atlantic and NPR and am looking at The Houston Chronicle and The Philadelphia Inquirer.

I don’t pretend that dropping my subscription will make Bezos go “oh no! What have I done?!” But I don’t know of any other way to express my displeasure with the direction they’re heading. I don’t buy Chik-fil-A or shop at Hobby Lobby because I fundamentally disagree with the owners’ stance on LGBTQ rights. I’m open to suggestions here. I have a limited amount of money to spend on journalism, but it’s important to me. I’m not giving up on journalistic giving altogether; just changing which ones I want to support right now.

[pixy0stix]

I don't have the answers for you. I just know that killing journalism contributes to fascism.

[neverfstop]

What's interesting is that their refusal to endorse has generated at least 50x the amount of attention. Now what should/would have been a given & something expected has just outraged a ton of people who expected it & given some smug satisfaction to those who don't likely even read the paper.

[sequins]

underwaterrhymes, WaPo published a follow-up article that Bezos killed the endorsement. And several writers have written opinion pieces calling this decision a terrible mistake and such.


www.washingtonpost.com/style/media/2024/10/25/washington-post-endorsement-president/

www.cnbc.com/2024/10/25/jeff-bezos-killed-washington-post-endorsement-of-kamala-harris-.html

[curbsideprophet]

helpcenter.washingtonpost.com/hc/en-us/articles/27922623511195-Subscription-access-for-government-employees

WaPo also recently stopped providing free subscriptions for government and military employees. I do wonder who’s decision that was. Certainly not helping convince those who may have been debating paying for their own subscription.

[livinitup]

Well, I’m definitely not getting a Wapo subscription now.

[basilosaurus]

What I don't understand is why they wouldn't take a stand against the guy who openly threates free press and promises retribution.

You can make the argument that they shouldn't be in the business of endorsing candidates generally. But surely you can advocate against the person who is a direct threat to your profession and employer

[underwaterrhymes]

Oct 26, 2024 3:50:09 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

What I don't understand is why they wouldn't take a stand against the guy who openly threates free press and promises retribution.

You can make the argument that they shouldn't be in the business of endorsing candidates generally. But surely you can advocate against the person who is a direct threat to your profession and employer

But the argument that they shouldn’t endorse at all really should have come when they started endorsing in 1987.

They have endorsed in every election cycle since then. To not do so now is hugely problematic. Tell us after this election cycle you’re leaving the business of endorsing. Not 11 days before a critical election.

[spinnaker5]

Oct 25, 2024 17:33:57 GMT -5 underwaterrhymes said:

Oct 25, 2024 17:11:45 GMT -5 pixy0stix said:

Also, how does someone let a publication know that they’re not happy with the direction they’re heading other than refusing to help fund it? I’m happy to fund quality journalism and will shift around where I’m giving to reflect that. I just donated to the Mississippi Free Press. And, as I mentioned, I pay for The Atlantic and NPR and am looking at The Houston Chronicle and The Philadelphia Inquirer.

I don’t pretend that dropping my subscription will make Bezos go “oh no! What have I done?!” But I don’t know of any other way to express my displeasure with the direction they’re heading. I don’t buy Chik-fil-A or shop at Hobby Lobby because I fundamentally disagree with the owners’ stance on LGBTQ rights. I’m open to suggestions here. I have a limited amount of money to spend on journalism, but it’s important to me. I’m not giving up on journalistic giving altogether; just changing which ones I want to support right now.

I’m here. I subscribe to The Atlantic, donate to NPR, am registered for Politico (free account, so I’m sure they’re selling my info), and just signed up yesterday for a monthly subscription to the Guardian as noted above. I’m happy to spend money for good journalism, and with the WaPo’s move, I want to take that money elsewhere. I think the points about also dropping Amazon and not shopping at Whole Foods make sense, but given the size and operational breadth of both of those (esp Amazon), subscriber or shopper drops there will be hardly visible compared to what the WaPo is likely going to see on its monthly dashboard. That doesn’t mean discontinuing support for those is pointless or a bad idea, just that the WaPo cancellation rates will be a clear and unmistakable expression of the impact of their decision. 

Bottom line, this is one more example of the miserably horrific place we’re in right now, annd all the more of a gut punch after the electric enthusiasm of August. Hopefully the flood of early voting is in her favor and will reduce the impact of these late October surprises.

[stuffandthings]

Oct 26, 2024 3:50:09 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

What I don't understand is why they wouldn't take a stand against the guy who openly threates free press and promises retribution.

You can make the argument that they shouldn't be in the business of endorsing candidates generally. But surely you can advocate against the person who is a direct threat to your profession and employer

That’s exactly why they can’t, though. From a pure business perspective:

-If they endorse Harris and she wins, it won’t have made a difference. No one is swayed by newspaper endorsements anymore and everyone expected WaPo to endorse her.
-If they endorse Harris and Trump wins, he has been very public about going after media organizations that cover him negatively in any way. So they’ll make themselves targets.

It makes perfect sense from a business perspective—it’s low risk low reward. Unfortunately it’s also cowardly and bad journalism.

[sonrisa]

For people wondering if there is an alternative to cancelling a subscription: write a letter to the editor. Those are a long standing part of the newspaper industry and its dialogue with readers. You can explain exactly how you feel, etc. it also keeps you in the conversation.

[tiki]

I would do both - cancel (even if you re-subscribe later on) and also write in. It's absolutely somebody's job to monitor subscription metrics and present on them to management. Those data points will be seen and send a message.

[neverfstop]

Axios
www.axios.com/2024/10/25/news-media-endorsements-president-2024-election?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter_axiosam&stream=top


An Opinion section rebellion grew through the evening as nine, then 11, 12, 13, now 16 columnists signed onto a statement saying their employer's "refusal to endorse a presidential candidate is a mistake."

Ruth Marcus, a Post columnist who's a Harvard law grad, called it "the wrong choice at the worst possible time."
Editor at large Robert Kagan resigned in protest.

[neverfstop]

Don’t Cancel The Washington Post. Cancel Amazon Prime.
The subscription money enriching Jeff Bezos could instead be spent on the journalism crucial to preserving democracy.

gift www.theatlantic.com/culture/archive/2024/10/washington-post-bezos-amazon-prime-cancel/680421/?gift=GFJ6rZk7EjP1WLiLmK2-qK-h6qIp67ta8pAWc5CBtuk&utm_source=copy-link&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=share 

As Max Tani reported in Semafor, relying on accounts from anonymous sources, “in the 24 hours ending Friday afternoon, about 2,000 subscribers canceled their subscriptions.” (In the same piece, Tani quoted a source saying that the number of canceled subscriptions was “not statistically significant.”) NPR, citing internal Post correspondence, reported that “more than 1,600 digital subscriptions had been cancelled less than four hours after the news broke.”

--------------
Amazon is the biggest store in the world, the second-largest private employer in the United States, and the reason Bezos was rich enough to buy the Post in the first place. And Amazon, as I have previously reported, is powered by Prime, which in and of itself generates tremendous revenue for the company, in addition to facilitating ever more shopping. Last year, the company’s revenue from its membership offerings alone came to $40.2 billion. This is roughly twice as much as the 2022 revenue of every publicly traded newspaper company in the country combined, and infinitely more than that of the Post, which in May reported that it had lost $77 million in the past year, largely as a result of declining paid readership. The United States has roughly 127 million households. Recent estimates show that U.S. consumers hold 180 million Prime subscriptions and fewer than 21 million newspaper subscriptions.

[neverfstop]

Again, I have no delusions that cancelling either will have much of an impact. Tax the fuck out of billionaires (see Elon musk thread) and break up the monopolies.

[Nonny]

Oct 26, 2024 3:50:09 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

What I don't understand is why they wouldn't take a stand against the guy who openly threates free press and promises retribution.

You can make the argument that they shouldn't be in the business of endorsing candidates generally. But surely you can advocate against the person who is a direct threat to your profession and employer

It's because of the threats that they are acting this way.

They are "obeying in advance" - they see an authoritarian ruler who is potentially about to come into power again, they know he's a shitpig who both 1) threatens journalists and the free press, and 2) holds power over their other businesses. In the case of Bezos, it's Blue Origin, and in the case of Soon-Shiong, it's ImmunityBio.

So they see the authoritarian, and they decided to try to preemptively get on his good side to protect themselves. But the problem with this is that they are giving the orange menace more power now than he currently has, and are setting themselves up to be further intimidated and bullied in the future. 

---
Timothy Snyder (in the linked substack post) is an author/historian who focuses on authoritarians.

[neverfstop]

NYT went in for kamala.... www.nytimes.com/interactive/2024/10/25/opinion/what-trump-says.html?smid=threads-nytopinion&smtyp=cur

I think this is their print edition

www.threads.net/@nytopinion/post/DBoUyVmud81

[wanderingback]

I honestly didn’t even know Bezos bought the Washington Post, wow. I don’t have a subscription, nor do I shop on Amazon so I’m just here to say it’s all fucked up!

[hillaryshimmy]

Oct 25, 2024 14:49:07 GMT -5 Velar Fricative said:

Oct 25, 2024 12:43:27 GMT -5 penguingrrl said:

Gotta be honest, I’m getting very nervous that they know a fascist regime is inevitable and are too afraid to speak against it.

This is my fear too.

PDQ:

[since I was mentioned]

The whole nation should be afraid.

This is not the election to sit this one out unless you have reason to believe another 2016 could happen. And in this sexist world, it's very possible - even probable. The odds are not in our favor. Get your asses out there, women, and vote! Support Pizza at the Polls. Get Kamala Harris in the white house!

[sonrisa]

I don’t think this is about getting ahead of censorship - I think Bezos is another toxic billionaire helping his fascist buddy, Trump. He’s a wannabe Elon Mush on this, just like everything else.

[mrsd2006]

It's about government contracts as well. If they endorse KH, and Trump wins, no cushy goverment contracts for Amazon.

from 2019:

abcnews.go.com/Business/amazon-lost-10b-pentagon-contract-trumps-personal-vendetta/story?id=67606505

[shauni27]

Oct 28, 2024 8:54:46 GMT -5 wanderingback said:

I honestly didn’t even know Bezos bought the Washington Post, wow. I don’t have a subscription, nor do I shop on Amazon so I’m just here to say it’s all fucked up!

I somehow did not know this either. Or had forgotten.