Eliminating the Dept of Education @@

[Jalapeñomel]

Can we talk about this impact, since Trump has said he plans to do this?

Obviously, this is on my mind, lots of talk in schools, supposedly superintendents are prepping for this.

But also, how will this impact the college application process and affordability of higher education for basically the vast majority of the US?

This will eliminate the Federal aid, leaving it up to private loans for outside funding help (save for scholarships), correct?

[cherryvalance]

I am deeply concerned about this not only because of my job, but because my child has an IEP and relies on school-based services. Locally, people already complain about the costs of SpEd on our budget, so despite living in a "safe" state (NJ), it's only a matter of time before the demand to dismantle SpEd services succeeds. I yelled about this from the rooftops, but I think this is an area of messaging that Dems failed in when so many families rely on public education and SpEd services.

I don't have a reliable source about the loans, but I have seen chatter that the states can't possibly oversee current federal loans an repayment, and without a DOE, who is even holding that information? They claim it will all be privatized immediately and we'll be a the mercy of loan servicers with no oversight.

[erbear]

I’m pretty sure that this might be the end of my school since DEI is our jam. 328 years was a nice run 😭😭😭

I don’t know anything about student loans but making college only for the wealthy totally tracks.

[idahome]

I worry of the impact on current student loan holders. I imagine many will try consolidating with private lenders…and at some point I think those private lenders will be maxed out.

But I also have to think that they can’t dismantle a department instantly…I mean they have to put some wind down process in place?

[sent]

If I recall, historically private lenders got out of the student loan biz because people were purposely discharging their student loan debts in bankruptcies to get out of their obligations to repay them. Enter the federal government who increased the kinds of loan products and loan limits for students thus creating a loan system equivalent to a blank check. Tuitions promptly rose out of control to take advantage of the blank government loan check situation and thus we created the mess we have now. I'm over simplifying this, but I don't know that private lenders are wanting to get back into the student loan market.

So maybe some of the bigger colleges will be forced to use their endowments if they want to recruit a more diverse student body while smaller, less competitive colleges will close? We have less 18 year old now than we did in the 90s and earlier, so we don't need so many 4 year colleges in the first place. And then we'll open more private Trump University style trade schools? This would mean we would still need to have some level of federal loans because sketchy private schools like Trump U rely on students maxing out those federal loans. Rs can't let the gravy train totally dry up because how else will the white males have the capital to bootstrap their way up the ladder.

[ellipses84]

I know we are worried about no guardrails, and loyalist will probably be installed in a lot of high ranking positions and do shitty things, but I don’t think 🍊 will be an effective dictator. I don’t think he’ll get unanimous support from the group that couldn’t agree on a speaker of the house. They were really rank and file initially knowing he controlled the R party but his days are numbered because he’s old and if they all did band together they have enough justification to 25th amendment him. Plus I think he’d rather play golf, avoid jail, enrich his own pockets, and let them fight it out. He doesn’t have interest in actually working as President or following through with any of the lies or promises he said on the campaign trail. All the other Rs are up for re-election, don’t want to blow everything up or have their own evil idea about how they want to do things.

The Gov’t makes $$ off the interest from our Student loans. I think they’ll have a lot of backlash cutting the Department of Ed or any Federal Agency from a job loss perspective. @@it definitely kills me the special needs parents who voted R because they aren’t happy with how things are going with their kids IEP and it’s like, without it, you would have nothing! And private schools can kick your kid out regardless of vouchers or how much you pay them!

[lilac05]

ellipses84, this is my current thought/hope/dream.

It’s looking like the House will go to him, so it’s going to be rough and high risk for sure…but since he has nothing really to gain at this point (aside from making the stock market go up), I don’t know that he’ll be super motivated. He no longer needs his base to vote for him again. They’re useless to him now, so I wouldn’t be surprised if he dials down the rhetoric a little now.

In addition, the House and 1/3 of the Senate have to be thinking about midterm elections. I don’t think they’ll go all-in on his biggest ideas. I would guess that many of them have kids in public schools with special needs…or at least know people who do! (I know our rep has kids in our public schools.) They know midterms are hard when their party has the Presidency…and without Trump getting all of his rabid base fired up, many of his followers won’t vote in 2026. That’s my hope at this point. It’s the only thing I can do to protect my mental health atm.

[Velar Fricative]

I don’t think most people understand what’s federal and what’s state/local when it comes to education and policy. And I’m including myself in that.

I suspect the GOP knows this and won’t immediately axe the DOE. They’ll slowly chip away at the less popular things. I think they’ll take their time with SpEd funding, if they touch that at all. Considering their anti-higher education bent, I think colleges will be impacted first.

[Jalapeñomel]

I think Title I funding gets cut, so all the money going toward the lower income, super urban or super rural schools will likely go first. This would destroy public education.

[abs]

I don’t think they will totally do away with the Department of Education. That requires too much agreement and the R’s aren’t good at that.

Will funding be slashed even further? Yes. Will states be offered extra money for making Bible study part of the curriculum? Yeah probably.

[hermione]

As federal money gets cut or changes, I wonder about the effect it will have on Title IX.

[basilosaurus]

Nov 9, 2024 6:48:36 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

I think Title I funding gets cut, so all the money going toward the lower income, super urban or super rural schools will likely go first. This would destroy public education.

I have no expertise nor any personal stake in this (beyond wanting everyone educated), but do you think this will break into factions like denying funding for food during the summer?

They're so fucking callous they want kids to go hungry. I'm sure they also think those with extra needs just need bootstraps.

I do think it's appropriate to Godwin here that those kids needing extra resources and assistance shouldn't get it. Fucking assholes

[formerlyak]

sent “using their endowments” is a bit more complex than just making a change in spending. If the endowment money comes from donor dollars, and much of it does, the university can’t dig into the principal without donor permission or, if the donor is no longer with us, going to court to get it changed. What can be done now is having development officers at those schools focus on donors who will contribute to current-use scholarship funds with a restricted use to help students who may lose funding from federal loans.

[Jalapeñomel]

Nov 9, 2024 9:01:33 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Nov 9, 2024 6:48:36 GMT -5 Jalapeñomel said:

I think Title I funding gets cut, so all the money going toward the lower income, super urban or super rural schools will likely go first. This would destroy public education.

I have no expertise nor any personal stake in this (beyond wanting everyone educated), but do you think this will break into factions like denying funding for food during the summer?

They're so fucking callous they want kids to go hungry. I'm sure they also think those with extra needs just need bootstraps.

I do think it's appropriate to Godwin here that those kids needing extra resources and assistance shouldn't get it. Fucking assholes

Oh they’ll deny food for all year. They already hate feeding kids.

[Jalapeñomel]

From his website:

www.donaldjtrump.com/news/da7f3c42-76b5-42c0-9beb-475d649030ae


“Implement the direct election of school principals by the parents, as the ultimate form of local control.”

[cmeon]

www.chalkbeat.org/2024/08/24/if-trump-abolished-the-department-of-education-what-would-happen/

This is a good read- it talks about what the ED pays for, why the GOP ire exists, and discusses the reasons dismantling it probably won't happen.

The majority of school funding in my state comes from localities, then the state pays a big chunk- but federal money is a pretty low percentage of total K-12 budgets. Don't get me wrong, it would hurt to lose it (which is why all the bluster from our state government has never amounted to actually turning down the $$$).

He talks about sending funds to states that "comply" with his desires- I think it's a lot more likely that they make (probably absurd) changes to the ED, not dismantle it.

The parents electing principals thing is cracking me up- you can't get parents into schools for *anything* here. I've been volunteering with the same handful of grandparents for 10 years! Most parents seem to love the principals, even some pretty ineffective ones- so I don't see that going anywhere.

[Jalapeñomel]

Nov 9, 2024 17:07:04 GMT -5 cmeon said:

www.chalkbeat.org/2024/08/24/if-trump-abolished-the-department-of-education-what-would-happen/

This is a good read- it talks about what the ED pays for, why the GOP ire exists, and discusses the reasons dismantling it probably won't happen.

The majority of school funding in my state comes from localities, then the state pays a big chunk- but federal money is a pretty low percentage of total K-12 budgets. Don't get me wrong, it would hurt to lose it (which is why all the bluster from our state government has never amounted to actually turning down the $$$).

He talks about sending funds to states that "comply" with his desires- I think it's a lot more likely that they make (probably absurd) changes to the ED, not dismantle it.

The parents electing principals thing is cracking me up- you can't get parents into schools for *anything* here. I've been volunteering with the same handful of grandparents for 10 years! Most parents seem to love the principals, even some pretty ineffective ones- so I don't see that going anywhere.

The parents in the district where I teach HATE our principal, and they are actively campaigning to make sure he does not get tenure. They would fall all over themselves at the chance for picking a principal.

[abs]

Yeah parents picking the principal would be so bad. They would use it for revenge and to put in their friends that may or may not be qualified.

[sent]

Oh and also, let's not forget they still need some semblance of a Dept. of Education to allow more charter schools to crop up to allow for more money grifting and segregating. Draining local budgets to send students to them and maybe also throwing more federal money to them to get them up and running.

Ugh.

[basilosaurus]

Nov 10, 2024 9:21:00 GMT -5 sent said:

Oh and also, let's not forget they still need some semblance of a Dept. of Education to allow more charter schools to crop up to allow for more money grifting and segregating. Draining local budgets to send students to them and maybe also throwing more federal money to them to get them up and running.

Ugh.

You forgot indoctrinating.

[sent]

Nov 10, 2024 9:54:32 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Nov 10, 2024 9:21:00 GMT -5 sent said:

Oh and also, let's not forget they still need some semblance of a Dept. of Education to allow more charter schools to crop up to allow for more money grifting and segregating. Draining local budgets to send students to them and maybe also throwing more federal money to them to get them up and running.

Ugh.

You forgot indoctrinating.

I figured that falls under the segregating but yes, also this. 

[rachers]

Well, I’m in the hell of Sarah Huckabee Sanders and her LEARNS ACT which gives money to private (mainly Christian) schools while depleting from our public schools under the guise of “making things equal”. You can google the list of who is benefiting from this and who isn’t, and surprise surprise..

[penguingineer]

Nov 10, 2024 10:41:14 GMT -5 rachers said:

Well, I’m in the hell of Sarah Huckabee Sanders and her LEARNS ACT which gives money to private (mainly Christian) schools while depleting from our public schools under the guise of “making things equal”. You can google the list of who is benefiting from this and who isn’t, and surprise surprise..

82% if people using vouchers with LEARNS never attended public school. We aren’t reaching “underprivileged” children with this lie. We’re subsidizing the rich.

[ellipses84]

I saw an interesting idea from someone in Seattle, which isn’t a particularly religious place. It was basically to create our own community spaces, call them churches, benefit from the tax free status and use them for whatever we need to in the fight against this administration and Christian Nationalism. I feel like if things get really bad in public ed, then we may need to start creating our own private and charter schools so there are options for indoctrination free education. I know that’s their plan to destroy public ed and might be a privilege to have that option, but it still might better serve the most vulnerable than they will.

[Jalapeñomel]

Charter schools still receive funding from the federal government, which is part of the reason they’re under the umbrella of public schools. They will absolutely feel the hit if the DoE is eliminated or severely cut.

publiccharters.org/charter-schools-program/

[basilosaurus]

Nov 10, 2024 12:36:28 GMT -5 ellipses84 said:

I saw an interesting idea from someone in Seattle, which isn’t a particularly religious place. It was basically to create our own community spaces, call them churches, benefit from the tax free status and use them for whatever we need to in the fight against this administration and Christian Nationalism. I feel like if things get really bad in public ed, then we may need to start creating our own private and charter schools so there are options for indoctrination free education. I know that’s their plan to destroy public ed and might be a privilege to have that option, but it still might better serve the most vulnerable than they will.

There are such things as secular aka "atheist" (atheism isn't required) churches. I don't think they're tax exempt. There is also the satanic temple which I believe is considered a religious organization. Its primary purpose is promoting church/state separation and combatting things like christian nationalism, etc. It's more of a political org, but iirc they do enjoy the special class extended to religious orgs that all other non-profits do not get (don't get me started on that!)

[ellipses84]

Nov 10, 2024 15:17:07 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

Nov 10, 2024 12:36:28 GMT -5 ellipses84 said:

I saw an interesting idea from someone in Seattle, which isn’t a particularly religious place. It was basically to create our own community spaces, call them churches, benefit from the tax free status and use them for whatever we need to in the fight against this administration and Christian Nationalism. I feel like if things get really bad in public ed, then we may need to start creating our own private and charter schools so there are options for indoctrination free education. I know that’s their plan to destroy public ed and might be a privilege to have that option, but it still might better serve the most vulnerable than they will.

There are such things as secular aka "atheist" (atheism isn't required) churches. I don't think they're tax exempt. There is also the satanic temple which I believe is considered a religious organization. Its primary purpose is promoting church/state separation and combatting things like christian nationalism, etc. It's more of a political org, but iirc they do enjoy the special class extended to religious orgs that all other non-profits do not get (don't get me started on that!)

We can all become Quakers again. They did a lot for women’s suffrage and the abolitionist movement. Since they were a religion from early America nobody can argue with it.

[mommyatty]

My big concern is not having a way to hold schools accountable for not following IEPs. Our state got sued for cutting funding to districts that had too big a percentage of kids on IEPs. Once a school hit a certain percentage they just stopped evaluating kids for SPED services. So there needs to be oversight.

[mcsangel2]

Nov 12, 2024 11:59:59 GMT -5 ellipses84 said:

Nov 10, 2024 15:17:07 GMT -5 basilosaurus said:

There are such things as secular aka "atheist" (atheism isn't required) churches. I don't think they're tax exempt. There is also the satanic temple which I believe is considered a religious organization. Its primary purpose is promoting church/state separation and combatting things like christian nationalism, etc. It's more of a political org, but iirc they do enjoy the special class extended to religious orgs that all other non-profits do not get (don't get me started on that!)

We can all become Quakers again. They did a lot for women’s suffrage and the abolitionist movement. Since they were a religion from early America nobody can argue with it.

My early American forbears were Quaker; I'm a non practicing/agnostic Lutheran these days but from what I know of Quakerism, I could get on that train. Especially if it would help in the fight against nationalism.

[mrsslocombe]

I assume that current college loans will be moved under the umbrella of the Dept of Treasury. I'm torn on how much they will cut back on issuing new loans-the government makes money off of them, so they might be persuaded to keep some of that (and jack up rates). But I'm sure Pell Grants and other grants are going to be eliminated. The DOE also has a lot of programs for Veterans, I wonder if they will keep those and just move them to DVA.

There will be major effects to this, but I think a lot of this is "symbolic" and to claim a victory against the "woke agenda", since a lot of the publicized DOE work has to do with protecting students' civil rights. But most of the money spent on the DOE will just get moved to other departments, since college loans make up a majority of the budget.