Raw feeding - help

[sandollar1010]

XP-from the nest
So my current pup is just a year old. We are adopting a 3 year old dog in 2 weeks. The new dog is fed a raw diet, and I will continue with it so he doesn't have to deal with a diet change in addition to his new home. My current girl is on grain-free kibble, but with all of the recalls I am ready to switch her to raw too. I really want them to have the same diet to make things easy. Anyway, there is so much info out there about raw, I feel really overwhelmed. I basically want to know how much/what to feed at each meal - I know 2-3% of body weight, but what does that amount to... a chicken quarter, a rack of rib, etc.? I am in MA and don't have access to a lot of diverse meat - so I need to look at cost and what is available. It will likely be a lot of chicken, some beef and pork, canned fish (as it's cheaper than fresh), and anything that the butcher has on sale. Pre-made raw isn't an option due to the cost. My dog is 65lbs and the new dog is about 55lbs. They will be eating twice a day. I have read it's best to just switch and not to do any transition. What can I expect from the change - loose poop, vomit, etc? How long before she is fully acclimated? Will they need any additional supplements? Any info you have is much appreciated. TIA!

[calico]

I don't have any advice for you, but good luck with the transition. Feeding raw is something that I would LIKE to do with our dog, but I don't think that will ever happen.

[welder'swife]

This is a good website for starting out.
preymodelraw.com/

[sandollar1010]

Thanks welder'swife! That is one of the better sites I've seen. It seems like it keeps things simple, plus it has co-ops... really helpful!

[MissusTexas]

As far as weighing the meat, I just went to a thrift store and bought a small food scale. I bet they're cheap at Walmart.

You're right- you want to switch her cold turkey and some changes you might expect after switching are smaller poops (a good thing!), loose stools in the first week, and some "detox" signs like eye goop.

Don't forget to start small with organ meat- like a thumbnail size piece of liver for the first week and then increase slowly.

I used preymodelraw.com to get started, and it is a GREAT guide but I strongly disagree that you should wait weeks to introduce organ meats. I switched my dog from a grain free kibble to raw with no organ meat and on the 4th day he was acting so lethargic it was scary. I added in some organ meat and he perked up within 12 hours! They need the nutrients!

The cheapest way I've found to do raw is go buy whole chickens for as cheap as you can (I called around and found them for .79/lb at Kroger), buy beef heart (which I found packaged for less than a dollar per lb at a grocery store down here called H-E-B), cut up the chicken and add it to the meat, throw in some organ meat (beef liver and kidney are usually cheap), throw in quart size ziplocs and keep in the freezer. I put one in the fridge to start thawing every time I feed. Of course, if you can add in other meats like venison, pork, lamb for variety, that's even better!

PMR is a great site, and here are some others with great info and community support:

www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm is another good one


http//rawfeddogs.net/

www.rawlearning.com/rawfaq.html

http:rawfed.com/myths/index.html

pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/

groups.yahoo.com/group/oldrawguys/ (for older dogs and cats)

pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/CarnivoreFeed-Supplier/

pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/RawChat/

www.rawmeatybones.com/

I use these forums all of the time, so if you have any questions the people are really good about answering them:

dogfoodchat.com/forum/raw-feeding/

www.dogster.com/forums/Raw_Food_Diet

HTH!

[independencegirl74]

MissusTexas pretty much has you covered! But I'll add in my info from switching a puppy to raw, too.

Ditto on the food scale, and get a digital one (so much easier to read!). Ours was not expensive at all.

Start with feeding around 2.5% body weight for each dog per day (cut in half for 2 meals would be 10-11 oz/meal for your 55-lb dog and about 13 oz/meal for your 65-lb dog). See how they do. If they start losing weight, feed more; if they start getting a little too padded, decrease. Some dogs need as little as 1.5%, while others need 5-6%!!

I followed the advice of the PMR site and of the people on the dogfoodchat site MT posted above and started with chicken backs, nothing but chicken backs for over a week. They're super bony, with little meat on them, which helps bind things up on the back end so you're less likely to get runny poops. Within the first couple of days of us switching Zoey, her poops went from soft/mushy on kibble to super tiny hard balls; it was awesome! Raw poop also disintigrates faster than kibble poop . If you can't get chicken backs, leg quarters are good and boney too.

Then just very slow intro new protein sources into your chicken routine, like turkey, pork, beef, etc, whatever you have available! Talk to butchers - we found out that ours has a K-9 pile every week of stuff they're no longer able to sell for people and it gets marked down to .99$/lb or less; H just scored 40 lbs of boneless chicken thighs for $25 thanks to them!

Also check out ethnic markets. We find organ meats for Zoey at an Asian mart; they're closer to $1.50- 1.75/lb, but since she's only getting about an oz+/day, I'm okay with spending a touch more on them. I have yet to find beef heart at a decent price though. You can always freeze chicken hearts in a big clump and give them that one day as their boneless meat! Hahahaha.

Lots of luck to you. It's really great you only have to transition the one dog, since the new one is already on it!

[sandollar1010]

Thank you thank you!! Thanks for the warning about the organ meat, I would have freaked out if she got lethargic since she is very high energy. I'll try to get a scale too, I think that will really help in the beginning. I'll check out some of the forums as well. It sounds like after a few weeks I'll get the hang of it.. it's just a bit intimidating at first

[MissusTexas]

Good luck and congrats on being a raw feeder!! Your dogs will thank you

[troopersmom]

You could also look into premade raw until you can get all your supplies ready to go. Bravo, Stella & Chewey's, and some others out there. I loved feeding raw b/c their poop is so small and it just disappears no need to pick it up.

[sandollar1010]

I know premade will be too costly to feed regulary, but I'd like to have some on hand just in the event we need a quick meal. Is one brand less expensive than the rest, or are they all about equal?

[aileen]

I fed my dogs and cats raw for almost 2 years, but recently stopped because it was just costing too much and too much of a hassle for our 7 cats and dogs. Plus, our freezer held maybe two weeks of food so we kept having to buy things when they weren't on sale. Plus -- my husband and I are vegetarian so it was tough to deal with THAT MUCH raw meat. We might go back to it when we have less pets.

Anyway -- when I switched I had all sorts of responses. Some of my dogs took to it right away and one took a lot of convincing. I started with chicken for the first few weeks. For the dog that wouldn't eat it, I would take boneless pieces and very lightly sear it on both sides so it smelled yummy. I had to start with bite size chunks seared. Then I moved to bigger seared chunks. Then less and less cooking, etc.

The cats were harder, but since you just have dogs it shouldn't be too hard. As far as what to expect, I think my dogs might have vomited once or twice, but other than that no side effects.

Also -- when you're introducing new meats, do a little at a time with chicken. I gave my dogs pork one day and ended up with raw pork all over the carpet when they puked it up later. Apparently they're allergic.

Good luck & good for you!