Sulfate free, educate me

[pinkpeonies]

So I'm currently using Alterna Bamboo shampoo, which is supposed to be sulfate free. But when I read the ingredients, sulfate is listed as one of them, along with a couple of other things I didn't think would be in there.

I really need a shampoo that won't fade my color so quickly, I get colored every 5 weeks and I just feel like my color fades out so quickly in those 5 weeks.

I'm considering trying Wen, but I just don't know if it's worth the price, it seems you either love it or hate it.

[SallyJ]

I use Loreal Professional recommended by my stylist. My color will last more than 8 weeks, but I get it colored sooner because of the roots. It doesn't foam at all and was a struggle to get used to.
www.amazon.com/LOreal-Professional-Vitamino-Shampoo-8-45-Ounce/dp/B000KQBQTI/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1340133166&sr=8-8&keywords=loreal+shampoo

[valhaman]

I'm using the Aveeno sulfate-free one and I really like it. It probably has sulfate alternatives, I haven't checked. It's been almost a month since I got my hair highlighted and it still looks pretty fresh to me. I was actually surprised, the Biolage I used to use seemed to fade it after only a couple washes! The Aveeno is cheaper too, so that's nice.

[bimbi284]

I am really liking my Nature's Gate Pomegranate Sunflower shampoo.

I dye my hair red and blue (aka the worst colors when it comes to fading), and my color looks good forever. I can get the blue to stay for about a month and my red grows out really nicely, so really its just the roots that are the problem. I usually get my hair done every 8 weeks (give or take).

[FormerCityGirl]

I wash every 2-3 days using Alterna Caviar and heavily coat my hair in conditioner for swimming. I have hot pink highlights that haven't been touched since April. We've only done my roots since then. I've heard that pink is another really hard one to keep looking good. I also go to a Kadus Salon and that's supposed to be one of the best color lines out.

[bimbi284]

Jun 19, 2012 17:22:08 GMT -5 cab1217 said:

Which reminds me, Bimbi and Former, are you guys using semi perm. or perm. colors? My red faded nasty (damn you, Avida,) but it's ok cause I'm going to go purple red now. (Dunno if you remember the picture I posted?) Any recs?

ETA: Don't you dare say Manic Panic or Punky Color. I will shank you both.

For the red, I get a demi perm color. Not sure which color line they use, but in the past I've had Aveda and Schwarzkopf. I like the Schwarzkopf better, but Aveda works okay in my hair as well. For the blue, my stylist uses Special Effects hair dye....for touch ups, I use Manic Panic cuz its cheaper, and works well in my hair ! I think for a purple red though, you wouldn't need to use any of the "funky" colors. The color lines I've seen samples of all seem to have purpley reds.

**runs and hides to avoid a Cab shankin'**

[FormerCityGirl]

Jun 19, 2012 17:22:08 GMT -5 cab1217 said:

Which reminds me, Bimbi and Former, are you guys using semi perm. or perm. colors? My red faded nasty (damn you, Avida,) but it's ok cause I'm going to go purple red now. (Dunno if you remember the picture I posted?) Any recs?

ETA: Don't you dare say Manic Panic or Punky Color. I will shank you both.

I get mine done with Kadus Permanent Color at a salon. It's a really natural gentle color that lasts forever, especially in the crazy colors.

I'm thinking of going to this for my appointment that I thought was today, but was not:

[bimbi284]

Jun 19, 2012 17:31:01 GMT -5 FormerCityGirl said:

Jun 19, 2012 17:22:08 GMT -5 cab1217 said:

Which reminds me, Bimbi and Former, are you guys using semi perm. or perm. colors? My red faded nasty (damn you, Avida,) but it's ok cause I'm going to go purple red now. (Dunno if you remember the picture I posted?) Any recs?

ETA: Don't you dare say Manic Panic or Punky Color. I will shank you both.

I get mine done with Kadus Permanent Color at a salon. It's a really natural gentle color that lasts forever, especially in the crazy colors.

I'm thinking of going to this for my appointment that I thought was today, but was not:

OMG I LOVE that!!

My blue sections kinda looked that that today (bleached to greenish to blue) when she was stripping my root color to touch up.

[FormerCityGirl]

Jun 19, 2012 17:33:04 GMT -5 bimbi284 said:

Jun 19, 2012 17:31:01 GMT -5 FormerCityGirl said:

I get mine done with Kadus Permanent Color at a salon. It's a really natural gentle color that lasts forever, especially in the crazy colors.

I'm thinking of going to this for my appointment that I thought was today, but was not:

OMG I LOVE that!!

My blue sections kinda looked that that today (bleached to greenish to blue) when she was stripping my root color to touch up.

Do you think I can pull it off? That's my only worry. I love the pink, but want different since Nicole Richie did it last week. I don't want people to think I'm copying her when I did it first.

[bimbi284]

Jun 19, 2012 17:32:29 GMT -5 cab1217 said:

Jun 19, 2012 17:27:57 GMT -5 bimbi284 said:

For the red, I get a demi perm color. Not sure which color line they use, but in the past I've had Aveda and Schwarzkopf. I like the Schwarzkopf better, but Aveda works okay in my hair as well. For the blue, my stylist uses Special Effects hair dye....for touch ups, I use Manic Panic cuz its cheaper, and works well in my hair ! I think for a purple red though, you wouldn't need to use any of the "funky" colors. The color lines I've seen samples of all seem to have purpley reds.

**runs and hides to avoid a Cab shankin'**

Ha ha ha! I used to use Manic's Vampire red, and it was perfect, but it stains the bathroom like whoa! I am thinking about mixing Satin V1 with my Loreal Mega Reds that I already have. We shall see how it goes. It's been a while since I've messed with color like that. I am also cutting my own hair.


THIS is what happens when mothers put their daughters down. They rebel by giving themselves crazy makeovers! HA HA!

Yeah, the bathroom stainage is a problem, but I cover all the affected surfaces with shitty towels, and am suuuuuuuper careful when applying. Then do my first couple of washes in our kitchen sink, which is stainless steel. After that, no stains! Granted, I'm only doing a couple of panels vs my entire head of hair.

[bimbi284]

Jun 19, 2012 17:37:24 GMT -5 FormerCityGirl said:

Jun 19, 2012 17:33:04 GMT -5 bimbi284 said:

OMG I LOVE that!!

My blue sections kinda looked that that today (bleached to greenish to blue) when she was stripping my root color to touch up.

Do you think I can pull it off? That's my only worry. I love the pink, but want different since Nicole Richie did it last week. I don't want people to think I'm copying her when I did it first.

I think you could! I think it would look cool with some "in-between" tones too. So like a more purpley magenta thrown in with the bright pink and darker purple. Or just maybe more of a rich purple than what is in the pic, since I can see that going gray in just one wash....as if its not saturated enough, ykwim?

Oh, and sorry for hijacking your post OP! Seriously though, sulfate free is the way to be!!!

[FormerCityGirl]

Jun 19, 2012 17:50:14 GMT -5 bimbi284 said:

Jun 19, 2012 17:37:24 GMT -5 FormerCityGirl said:

Do you think I can pull it off? That's my only worry. I love the pink, but want different since Nicole Richie did it last week. I don't want people to think I'm copying her when I did it first.

I think you could! I think it would look cool with some "in-between" tones too. So like a more purpley magenta thrown in with the bright pink and darker purple. Or just maybe more of a rich purple than what is in the pic, since I can see that going gray in just one wash....as if its not saturated enough, ykwim?

Oh, and sorry for hijacking your post OP! Seriously though, sulfate free is the way to be!!!

That's what I was thinking. The stylist is really awesome at blending and color placement with no bleed. She has an art degree too. That's a new requirement for me to have in a colorist.

OP, sulfate free, less washing, and protecting color from elementsworks wonders. Again, sorry for the threadjack!

[house]

OP, I am a chemist and am going to jump in and say it is incorrect that anything that ends in "-ate" is a sulfate. Anything that ends in that suffix just means it has four oxygen. For example, nitrate has nitrogen with four oxygen attached. So nitrate does not equal sulfate. Sulfate has one sulfer molecule with four oxygen molecules attached. I hope this makes sense.

[house]

Here is a list of sulfate free shampoos

Pureology – All Shampoos sulfate free
John Masters Organics
Jonathon Product – Green Rootine Shampoo
Kiss My Face – Miss Treated Shampoo
AG Hair Cosmetics – Color Savour Sulfate free Shampoo
DS Laboratories – Revita Hair Growth Shampoo
Samy Salon Systems – Fat Hair Sulfate free
L'Oreal – Everstrong Reconstructing Shampoo
RedKen – Nature's Rescue Detox Shampoo

[bimbi284]

Here's some ingredients to pay attention to, found here in the "warnings" section: www.wikihow.com/Follow-the-Curly-Girl-Method-for-Curly-Hair

"Check to make sure your shampoo does not contain any sulfates listed here. Instead, look for the mild cleansers in the ingredient list if you need to use shampoo occasionally for cleansing or after swimming in chlorinated water. (In contrast, salt water from the ocean is actually beneficial for curls as sea salt is a natural curl enhancer.)

Some common sulfates are Alkylbenzene sulfonate, Ammonium laureth or lauryl sulfate, Ammonium or Sodium Xylenesulfonate, Sodium C14-16 Olefin Sulfonate, Sodium cocoyl sarcosinate, Sodium laureth, myreth, or lauryl sulfate, Sodium lauryl sulfoacetate, TEA-dodecylbenzenesulfonate, Ethyl PEG-15 cocamine sulfate, and Dioctyl sodium sulfosuccinate.

Some mild cleansers, less drying and included in modified CG, are Cocamidopropyl betaine, Coco betaine, Cocoamphoacetate, Cocoamphodipropionate, Disodium cocoamphodiacetate or cocoamphodipropionate, Lauroamphoacetate, and Sodium cocoyl isethionate."

[house]

Ha! I just opened the Target beauty bag which has two samples of shampoos for Color treated hair. One from Aveeno and one from Garnier. Guess what? They both have sulfates! Garnier color shield has sodium laureth sulfate yet the packaging says "bold color even after 45 washes". ^o) Aveeno living color has Ammonium lauryl sulfate.

[bimbi284]

Jun 19, 2012 19:55:46 GMT -5 house said:

Ha! I just opened the Target beauty bag which has two samples of shampoos for Color treated hair. One from Aveeno and one from Garnier. Guess what? They both have sulfates! Garnier color shield has sodium laureth sulfate yet the packaging says "bold color even after 45 washes". Aveeno living color has Ammonium lauryl sulfate.

Grr...makes me so mad when I see that stuff!

LIES! ALL LIESSSSS!!! :@

[house]

Not necessarily all lies. These were formulated with other ingredients that protect the hair color but I am not a formulation chemist so I do not know exactly how it works. SLS and ALS both are detergents that clean your hair by removing oils. I think the safest choice for color treated hair is to go sulfate free.

[house]

Thanks cab, I will take a note on the purology quality and price. However, as a chemist I still have to say that sulfoacetate and sulfosuccinate are not the same as sulfate. These three are completely different chemical compounds. So their label claim is correct that they are sulfate free.

[house]

And please don't hate me cuz I love chemistry.

[bimbi284]

Jun 19, 2012 20:43:14 GMT -5 house said:

And please don't hate me cuz I love chemistry.

LOL...not at all! I appreciate fellow nerds ;D

[house]

Jun 19, 2012 19:00:02 GMT -5 cab1217 said:

Jun 19, 2012 18:37:08 GMT -5 house said:

OP, I am a chemist and am going to jump in and say it is incorrect that anything that ends in "-ate" is a sulfate. Anything that ends in that suffix just means it has four oxygen. For example, nitrate has nitrogen with four oxygen attached. So nitrate does not equal sulfate. Sulfate has one sulfer molecule with four oxygen molecules attached. I hope this makes sense.

Ok, but for the purpose of shampoo/cleansers, and the cleansing properties those ingredients (the -ates in question) doesn't that make them some kind of sulfate alternative? Of course you won't find nitrate in shampoo. From my understanding, (what H is telling me, who was a chemistry major,) these ingredients are similar to sulfate in the way that they work, which to me, means they can also trap the essential oils needed to keep hair healthy and hair color in. H seems to agree with me, but I'd like your opinion on my opinion, as well, house. The ingredient I listed above on my earlier response is no doubt similar, just not as harsh.

You are correct that they are sulfate alternatives. They are companion ions to stabilize the lauryl/laureth components. They will not be as effective in cleaning hair as sulfates, leaving hair somewhat naturally oily. Also leaving some dirt in the process.
As for the -ate comment. Sodium benzoate is a common preservative found in shampoos, but not a sulfate.
Does this make sense?

[house]

I have curly hair too! I just started using lower sulfate shampoo and noticed the not so squeaky clean. It will take while to get used to the idea and practice of keeping my natural oil and less foam. My shampoo is Suave and I just got scolded for using this brand. Lol.
FWIW, I think a good hair colorist is also a great chemist!

[stumpy]

I used to use Pureolgy but then they got rid of my kind. (The straight -- in the blue bottles) I hate the smell of the Smooth (orangey bottle) and I am all about the smell of stuff.
I am very sensitive to smell/scents -- so Pureolgy is out.

I now use Kevin Murphy. Sulphate free and my color lasts a long time. I now I have purple highlights and another girl at the salon uses Kevin Murpy and her purple has lasted for at least six to eight weeks. We shall see with mine.

It's amazing how many odd looks I get now that I have purple in my hair. Man, people judge a lot!!!

[stumpy]

Jun 20, 2012 13:53:02 GMT -5 cab1217 said:

Jun 20, 2012 13:46:56 GMT -5 stumpy said:

I used to use Pureolgy but then they got rid of my kind. (The straight -- in the blue bottles) I hate the smell of the Smooth (orangey bottle) and I am all about the smell of stuff.
I am very sensitive to smell/scents -- so Pureolgy is out.

I now use Kevin Murphy. Sulphate free and my color lasts a long time. I now I have purple highlights and another girl at the salon uses Kevin Murpy and her purple has lasted for at least six to eight weeks. We shall see with mine.

It's amazing how many odd looks I get now that I have purple in my hair. Man, people judge a lot!!!

The salon did it . . . I looked at the package, but don't remember the name. I know it's not as readily available -- so not the cheap stuff.

What purple dye did you use?