Disney Responds to Cheats

[livinitup]

Rich folks hiring disabled guides to game the system makes me ragey. And now it ends badly for the disabled.  


t.money.msn.com/now/disneyland-revamps-its-disabled-access-passes


Disneyland revamps its disabled access passes
 
Abuse of a good system that helped lots of people led to the change, but the theme park's new program is missing a key, simple measure. 

File photo of visitors walking on Main Street at Walt Disney World on June 5, 2012, in Lake Buena Vista, Fla.John Raoux-AP
When my family and I went to Walt Disney (DIS -0.40%) World earlier this summer, I got a Guest Accommodations Card (GAC) because of my Parkinson's disease, which let us avoid many of theme park's long lines. I probably won't get this help on my next visit to the "Happiest Place on Earth" -- whenever that may be -- because people were abusing the system.

The GAC came into focus earlier this year after media outlets such as the New York Post reported that wealthy park visitors were hiring tour guides who qualified for these passes so that they could move ahead of other patrons in line. Getting a GAC isn't easy. Disney doesn't publicize them much, and people have to apply for them in person at the park.

Strangely, though, Disney World didn't require me to submit any sort of proof of my medical condition. I was able to use my GAC without incident.

According, to MiceAge, a website that tracks Disney, the company is discontinuing the GAC as of Oct. 9 at Disneyland and Disneyland California Adventure and replacing it with what the company calls the Disabled Assistance System (DAS). Though the MiceAge story doesn't mention Disney World, it seems likely that the policy will apply there as well.

Unlike the GAC, which can be used throughout the park, only one ride at a time can be reserved using the DAS. Disney may be solving one problem but creating many others.

Children with autism, some of whom can't wait for anything, may be in tough spot because many of them find the park overwhelming. As Jo Ashline, the mother of a son who is on the autism spectrum, wrote on the Special Needs Orange County site: "The Guest Assistant Card almost guaranteed that meltdowns would be minimal and rarely did we leave the park in turmoil. ... I'm not trying to #$%& on anyone's parade here, but watching the parades may be the only thing we'll be able to do when this thing is implemented."

As a parent of a child with a mild form of autism, I sympathize with Ashline. The meltdowns she refers to can be volcanic in their fury. For Parkinson's sufferers, waiting in the hot sun isn't easy, either. I certainly was glad I had the GAC.

The new system probably would have made my stay at the park far less enjoyable. A better approach would be for Disney to keep the GAC but require a doctor's note from applicants, something that people with legitimate issues wouldn't mind doing. A company spokesperson couldn't be reached for comment on this story.

Disney seems to be pushing a one-size-fits-all approach to a situation that is often quite complicated. I hope the company will reconsider this move.

[8675309]

Jo A. (who did the interview) is my good friend. She's 100% right. I've seen first hand how much that pass impacts the kind of experience their family has at Disney. Her son Andrew GLOWS on rides. It pisses me off that Disney would make things MORE challenging for the disabled because of a few bad apples. There are ways around this and they better figure it out ASAP.

[Deleted]

This makes me so mad. Disney is not legally allowed to ask for proof part of ADA rules. So don't assume everybody is willing to bring in a note. Disneys gac was one of the reasons we choose disney passes over the other parks. But not with the revamp it really does us no good. It's just starting other issues. I get what they are doing but it's not 1 size fits all

[joshlyman]

Sept 23, 2013 17:04:58 GMT -5 @bean said:

This makes me so mad. Disney is not legally allowed to ask for proof part of ADA rules. So don't assume everybody is willing to bring in a note. Disneys gac was one of the reasons we choose disney passes over the other parks. But not with the revamp it really does us no good. It's just starting other issues. I get what they are doing but it's not 1 size fits all

This. I hate fucking people that have ruined this.

I have only had 1 experience with disabled access at Disney (a couple weeks after my dad's knee replacement surgery) and it was the only way he could get in any rides. In that situation we could have dealt with the new system, but I know many that wouldn't be able to.

[tripleshot]

That really sucks that people abused the GACs, but Disney is not legally allowed to ask for a dr note.

[bab]

I saw this earlier and we might just stick with Universal, Hershey and other parks instead. Disney has their head up their ass if they think this is good for buisness.
We went to Disney 3 years ago and had a great time because of the pass. There is no way DD would have made it in those 2 hour lines. This new policy makes no sense. You can reserve a spot on one ride, wait 2 hours for it and then put your name in for another 2 hour wait? No Disney. I will not waste my money there when there are other parks that can accommodate my DD.

[Deleted]

Sept 23, 2013 17:14:11 GMT -5 joshlyman said:

Sept 23, 2013 17:04:58 GMT -5 @bean said:

This makes me so mad. Disney is not legally allowed to ask for proof part of ADA rules. So don't assume everybody is willing to bring in a note. Disneys gac was one of the reasons we choose disney passes over the other parks. But not with the revamp it really does us no good. It's just starting other issues. I get what they are doing but it's not 1 size fits all

This. I hate fucking people that have ruined this.

I have only had 1 experience with disabled access at Disney (a couple weeks after my dad's knee replacement surgery) and it was the only way he could get in any rides. In that situation we could have dealt with the new system, but I know many that wouldn't be able to.

It really makes me mad. I go to disney with a family member who sometimes only has 3 'good hours' so using the gac was a dream, letting us ride rides with her child and be in and out within her 'good hour' window. It was worth the money because we still got to do a bunch of rides. We tried the same thing as universal, who has the card. We got to ride about 2 rides and a show because everything was atleast a 40 min wait. After an hour and half, she was done, Had to leave. 300$ for 2 and half rides. Now disney it makes me said.

[8675309]

Sept 23, 2013 17:19:53 GMT -5 luckydog said:

Sept 23, 2013 17:04:58 GMT -5 @bean said:

This makes me so mad. Disney is not legally allowed to ask for proof part of ADA rules. So don't assume everybody is willing to bring in a note. Disneys gac was one of the reasons we choose disney passes over the other parks. But not with the revamp it really does us no good. It's just starting other issues. I get what they are doing but it's not 1 size fits all

I worked in ticketing and some of our best seats were ada seats. People would call pissed all the time that these seemingly healthy people get better seats. But we could not ask for any documentation or ask why or ask how the tickets will be used etc. All we said was for season packages that we hoped half the tickets were used for ada reasons but we understood that sometimes you want to give a set of tickets away without hassle. Blah blah blah.

Not all disabilities are obvious either. Try telling that to an angry customer. But I would imagine a lot of the ada people at Disney do not have obvious disabilities especially if they ate rising rides.

I tried bolding it but can you explain what you mean by your last sentence?

[Deleted]

Sept 23, 2013 17:38:05 GMT -5 8675309 said:

Sept 23, 2013 17:19:53 GMT -5 luckydog said:

I worked in ticketing and some of our best seats were ada seats. People would call pissed all the time that these seemingly healthy people get better seats. But we could not ask for any documentation or ask why or ask how the tickets will be used etc. All we said was for season packages that we hoped half the tickets were used for ada reasons but we understood that sometimes you want to give a set of tickets away without hassle. Blah blah blah.

Not all disabilities are obvious either. Try telling that to an angry customer. But I would imagine a lot of the ada people at Disney do not have obvious disabilities especially if they ate rising rides.

I tried bolding it but can you explain what you mean by your last sentence?

I think she's just saying people who use gacs look 'normal' so when people see them in special seating or front of the line, they get angry. But eff that noise.

[saraandmichael]

Sept 23, 2013 17:38:05 GMT -5 8675309 said:

Sept 23, 2013 17:19:53 GMT -5 luckydog said:

I worked in ticketing and some of our best seats were ada seats. People would call pissed all the time that these seemingly healthy people get better seats. But we could not ask for any documentation or ask why or ask how the tickets will be used etc. All we said was for season packages that we hoped half the tickets were used for ada reasons but we understood that sometimes you want to give a set of tickets away without hassle. Blah blah blah.

Not all disabilities are obvious either. Try telling that to an angry customer. But I would imagine a lot of the ada people at Disney do not have obvious disabilities especially if they ate rising rides.

I tried bolding it but can you explain what you mean by your last sentence?

I think she means you can't always tell when someone is disabled. For example, we use the pass because even though we infuse E to 100% before we go, he would likely end up with a bleed (or multiple bleeds) if he were walking/standing all day long. Many people would look and see a healthy 6 year-old child and wonder how/why we have a gac.

[bab]

Sept 23, 2013 17:41:05 GMT -5 @bean said:

Sept 23, 2013 17:38:05 GMT -5 8675309 said:

I tried bolding it but can you explain what you mean by your last sentence?

I think she's just saying people who use gacs look 'normal' so when people see them in special seating or front of the line, they get angry. But eff that noise.

I think that is what she meant too.  And I agree.  Eff them.  I don't give a shit what anyone thinks when we go to the front of the line.  People need to mind their own buisness!

[8675309]

Sept 23, 2013 17:43:55 GMT -5 saraandmichael said:

Sept 23, 2013 17:38:05 GMT -5 8675309 said:

I tried bolding it but can you explain what you mean by your last sentence?

I think she means you can't always tell when someone is disabled. For example, we use the pass because even though we infuse E to 100% before we go, he would likely end up with a bleed (or multiple bleeds) if he were walking/standing all day long. Many people would look and see a healthy 6 year-old child and wonder how/why we have a gac.

Ok, that makes sense.

[bab]

Sept 23, 2013 17:49:56 GMT -5 kooshball said:

Sept 23, 2013 17:33:03 GMT -5 bab said:

I saw this earlier and we might just stick with Universal, Hershey and other parks instead. Disney has their head up their ass if they think this is good for buisness.
We went to Disney 3 years ago and had a great time because of the pass. There is no way DD would have made it in those 2 hour lines. This new policy makes no sense. You can reserve a spot on one ride, wait 2 hours for it and then put your name in for another 2 hour wait? No Disney. I will not waste my money there when there are other parks that can accommodate my DD.

Why? The ADA stuff for Universal kind of sucks. It basically works the same... you come back at a certain time. You don't get to skip lines for long wait times.

That was not my experience.  We went last summer and were able to get on the rides right away.  We did not have to go and come back for anything,  not even the Harry Potter stuff that had just opened. 

[bab]

Sept 23, 2013 17:58:33 GMT -5 kooshball said:

Disney is limited on what they can do by law/ADA. This seems like the next best way to discourage abuse. I used one of these passes and it is nice but most rides have fastpass which is usually the same line as the ADA folks.

We went to Dinsey 3 years ago and they gave us a pass that allowed us to go to the Fast Pass line.  There were several ride operators who allowed us to go to the front of the fast pass line. 

[bab]

They aren't really "discouraging abuse" with this new policy, they are discouraging parents with disabled children from bringing their families to those overpriced parks. I'm not spending $600 on admission to be aggrivated. I could just go to Hershey.

[bab]

Sept 23, 2013 18:20:56 GMT -5 kooshball said:

Sept 23, 2013 17:57:59 GMT -5 bab said:

That was not my experience.  We went last summer and were able to get on the rides right away.  We did not have to go and come back for anything,  not even the Harry Potter stuff that had just opened. 

Then you got the super lucky pass. They have multiple different 'levels' and from what I can tell (they don't publish the info I don't think) there is only one of many that let you go to the front of the line. The forums on the subject seem to indicate a lot of families get hassled on getting what they need. Ie, they have a child with autism and are given family room access while someone else waits in line.

Oh I didn't know they had different levels.  I just told them at the desk I was there with my autistic daughter.  She was having a little meltdown while we were getting the pass, so they knew I wasn't bullshitting.  If they continue with their same service, I will choose Universal 100% of the time over Disney. I think Universal could actually use this to their advantage if they are smart.

[speckledfrog]

I know that asking for proof has already been covered, but I don't see how it would fix the problem, since the hired tour guides with disabilities still have disabilities and could get passes.

[bab]

Sept 23, 2013 18:31:39 GMT -5 luckydog said:

Sept 23, 2013 17:51:38 GMT -5 8675309 said:

Ok, that makes sense.

Sorry, but yep that's exactly what I meant. For example, at a venue, someone with epilepsy looks totally normal but if the have a seizure, you want the extra space and easy to access seating. But this brings up another point, where do we draw the line? What if you are prone to migraines and standing in a hot line for 2.5 hours only to be subjected to Its A Small World over and over triggers a migraine, should we accomodate the what-ifs? Is a diagnosis required?  What severity must you continually suffer to be ada? Does it varu from a sporting event to Disney?

I'm not defending or arguing. But ada accomodations are hard. As a reasonable human you have sympathy like for the pp who won't renew because her kid can't stand in line without it being really hard. It is totally crappy that she has a legitimate reason and the cheaters took it.

Also I'm pissed about the rich mom who said something like, "this is how the one percent do disney," regarding hiring a "guide." F that. Build your own disney

I disagree with this.  Accommodating people with special needs was never a problem until those rich assholes ruined it.  It's not like people were constantly trying to get ADA access because they suffered from occassional migraines.  Resonable people used the accommodations as they should be used and there were no issues for years!

[elleblue]

Sept 23, 2013 19:04:12 GMT -5 pagas said:

Sept 23, 2013 18:31:39 GMT -5 luckydog said:

Also I'm pissed about the rich mom who said something like, "this is how the one percent do disney," regarding hiring a "guide." F that. Build your own disney

What pisses me off the most is that those people can buy private VIP tours from Disney itself for front of the line access to EVERYTHING.  There is no need for the disabled guide. 

When I worked there almost a decade ago, that's not at all how it worked. Having a VIP tour guide did not get you front of the line/backdoor access to attractions unless you were deemed a "security risk" aka celebrity. I cannot tell you how many wealthier people booked a tour, thinking this very thing and were less than amused upon finding out that it didn't work that way. Those were always my least favorite tours - I'd spend the whole time running around getting various fastpasses even begging for extras from attraction cast members etc so I could sort of make up the difference.

[bcv513]

Even having a doctor's note won't stop all abuse. My uncle proudly tells everyone that his friend who is a doctor wrote him a fake note for Disney. He used the GAC the whole trip.

[elleblue]

Sept 24, 2013 10:42:21 GMT -5 pagas said:

Sept 24, 2013 10:39:13 GMT -5 elleblue said:

When I worked there almost a decade ago, that's not at all how it worked. Having a VIP tour guide did not get you front of the line/backdoor access to attractions unless you were deemed a "security risk" aka celebrity. I cannot tell you how many wealthier people booked a tour, thinking this very thing and were less than amused upon finding out that it didn't work that way. Those were always my least favorite tours - I'd spend the whole time running around getting various fastpasses even begging for extras from attraction cast members etc so I could sort of make up the difference.

It's the way it works now, or at least that is the way it has worked for the past 3 years.

It's possible they became more lax about it in recent years, as when I was there they were doing a huge crackdown on it. lol It's also possible that DL and DW operate differently too - I can only speak for DL as I never worked at the other park.

[cleo29]

It's a shame that people were abusing the system. When I have been there, I never noticed a huge run on the ADA lines either.

I wonder if things will tweaked some more. And really, if it is that important for these people to not wait in a long line, then go when the parks are at lower volumes. I mean, if that is the goal, then go about it in a legit manner.

[anlo]

I really hate people today. Just chalk this up as one more experience my son and family will likely never enjoy.

Yes, that sounds melodramatic. I'm just pissed at the world right now.

[elleblue]

Sept 24, 2013 10:50:32 GMT -5 pagas said:

Sept 24, 2013 10:45:24 GMT -5 elleblue said:

It's possible they became more lax about it in recent years, as when I was there they were doing a huge crackdown on it. lol It's also possible that DL and DW operate differently too - I can only speak for DL as I never worked at the other park.

I can speak for both.  One of DH's former co-workers took his family on Radiator Springs Racers like 10 times in a row.  Another talks about being driven right up to Test Track from MK to ride it.  You can get a ton done in the time, but I think it sort of takes the fun out of it.  I am guessing Disney realized that if people are spending a few grand on a few hours, they get front of the line.  There was apparently reserved seating for parades/fireworks as well.

How long did you work for DLR?  I think it would be a great job, if not for all the people =)

I worked there for two years. I really enjoyed it (and yeah, sometimes the people were a complete pita but then there were others that more than made up for it).

Special seating at parades/shows/fireworks was always part of the package when I worked there. And again, we worked hard as tour guides to get extra FPs, sometimes the tour office even handed them over to us knowing the expectation would be backdoor access. (heh) I also tried to make friends with as many attractions cast members as I could because sometimes they'd then do favors for me when they saw me out on tour (like letting my guests ride twice in a row if they wanted). I do know that in the years prior to when I was there, having a VIP guide was basically giving guests that access, but they cracked down on it because of abuses. I'm not at all surprised that they relaxed that policy because some guests were pissed that they didn't get to cut the lines when they were paying a bunch of extra money. I know they upped the price of the guides in recent years so they probably decided to make it more expensive to weed out some of the people and then just let it go. Can't believe how easy VIP guides have it now! *shakes cane*

[Deleted]

You know what DISNEY could do? Use its lobbyists to get an exception to the privacy laws for amusement park disability passes. Require a handicap permit,proof of legal disability, or a doctor's note. The laws are impediments for Your Local Small Business. Disney could get around it if they really put some effort into it. And if they aren't willing to then yes, they should resume the old system and any abuse is on them.

[Deleted]

Oh, and if I paid for VIP access I would be pissed if I had to wait in line. I hate Disney lines.

[elleblue]

Sept 24, 2013 11:03:59 GMT -5 pagas said:

elleblue Did you have to work your way up to VIP guide?  I think it would be such a fun job, I always smile when I see them in their plaid outfits on a ride.  I figure you have to be a custodian or something for a year or two...pay your dues.

Usually that's how it's done, but I was cast immediately as a Guest Relations cast member. The director at the time hired me herself, I think they needed a ton more people for the upcoming summer, so they cut corners. Then once in GR, you learn some of the scripts of the tour spiels and are tested/auditioned to be a tour guide. Then once you've done that for a few months, you can be selected to be a VIP guide and go through special training for that. It was a ton of fun and I got to know the ins and outs of the park really well. Some days I miss it, but then I think of all the irritations (people in City Hall insisting on GACs when they didn't need it - lol) and I decide I'm better off not having to deal.

What's funny is my mother was one of the first VIP tour guides, back in the 60's when all the tour guides were young women. So I was a legacy guide! lol You should see some of the costumes she had to wear! Omg, so so funny.

[peachykate]

Sept 23, 2013 18:01:41 GMT -5 bab said:

Sept 23, 2013 17:58:33 GMT -5 kooshball said:

Disney is limited on what they can do by law/ADA. This seems like the next best way to discourage abuse. I used one of these passes and it is nice but most rides have fastpass which is usually the same line as the ADA folks.

We went to Dinsey 3 years ago and they gave us a pass that allowed us to go to the Fast Pass line.  There were several ride operators who allowed us to go to the front of the fast pass line. 

Disney is getting rid of Fast Pass which is probably part of the problem in favor for something called Magic Bands.  I've only read a few articles but it sounds pretty similar, only 3 "fast passes" per day and only good for one park per day.   It sounded like an awful idea before I read about what they did with the gac.  

Hopefully they will realize this isn't going to work for people and change the policy.

[bab]

Sept 24, 2013 10:48:53 GMT -5 anlo said:

I really hate people today. Just chalk this up as one more experience my son and family will likely never enjoy.

Yes, that sounds melodramatic. I'm just pissed at the world right now.

I completely understand your sentiment.  I am so sorry.

[bab]

Sept 24, 2013 10:43:17 GMT -5 bcv513 said:

Even having a doctor's note won't stop all abuse. My uncle proudly tells everyone that his friend who is a doctor wrote him a fake note for Disney. He used the GAC the whole trip.

I'd like to believe this sort of appalling behavior is more the exception than the rule.