Travel from Tokyo to China & within China - Recs needed

[maddiepaddy]

Next summer My H and I are doing a trip to Tokyo and then to a few Chinese cities. I'm wondering primarily if anyone here has flown on China Eastern Airlines within China/Japan? They have by far the best deals, but I'm nervous after reading some online reviews. Is there a better but still reasonably priced option?

We have to fly (on AA with points, yay!) into Tokyo and out of Shanghai. I'm thinking that the best route will be Tokyo - Hong Kong - Beijing - Shanghai. I guess HK and Beijing are swappable. I'm also considering taking the high speed train from Beijing to Shanghai. I know it would work better to fly out of Beijing or HK, but it doesn't work with our schedule. 

Any suggestions, tips, etc would be greatly appreciated!

[GilliC]

I've flown China Eastern, and it wasn't much different from any other domestic Chinese flight. The airlines are all fine, but Chinese air passengers have a different flight etiquette from most of the world.

Expect people to have a gazillion carry-on items, and don't be too surprised if someone tries to take your bags out of the overhead compartment to put theirs in. It's also not a good place for hygiene freaks, because I've seen people spit on the floor before (it's okay; he rubbed it into the carpet with his shoe, so you wouldn't really know if you didn't see). And absolutely use the restroom before you board. The lavatories are frequently very aromatic and not particularly clean. This is not so surprising, considering it's not uncommon for people to squat on the toilet seat (Seriously. Sometimes there are shoe prints). Imagine how that plays out if there's turbulence!

On the upside... The service is usually polite (and often attractive, since many airlines have maximum age restrictions and appearance requirements). Many short flights still offer a small meal service. It's a fast and inexpensive way to get around in a huge country!

[Deleted]

I know that lots of people think that Xi'an is too touristy, but I really liked it there. I think it's worth going if you've never been.

If you have time I would do a Yangtze River cruise too. It's just a few days and the scenery was beautiful.

Also, in Beijing we ate at Haidilao Hot Pot. It's totally worth the wait.

www.tripadvisor.co.uk/ShowUserReviews-g294212-d1193046-r131541729-Haidilao_Hot_Pot-Beijing.html

In Shanghai you must got to Yang's fried dumplings. They do giant soup dumplings there that are to die for. I must have eaten there once a day for a few days straight. It's super cheap, but really good.

www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Restaurant_Review-g308272-d4086510-Reviews-Yang_s_Fried_Dumplings-Shanghai.html

[Deleted]

China Eastern is nice as far as Chinese carriers go. I don't like flying with them on long hauls if I can help it, as their larger planes tend to be older and the time I did fly them was my least favorite long haul flight ever.

GilliC is right on with her info about flying with mainland Chinese passengers - just be prepared and try not to get too frustrated (and board early if you have a carryon).

As for flying internally in China; China Eastern usually is not the cheapest in my experience. If you are looking to save money look into Spring Airlines or JuneYao Airlines - they are budget airlines and much cheaper typically. You won't have much legroom and the planes are not as clean or nice as regular priced airlines, but all those flights are fairly short so you won't suffer too long (DH is 6'5" and he copes). You'll probably have to go directly to their websites as they don't often show up on search engines. If you plan to do either Beijing to Shanghai or Shanghai to Beijing, I'd recommend taking the train. The time for travel will really be pretty similar and Shanghai Pudong and Beijing airports are known for bad delays. Beijing has something like 18% of flights leaving on time. The trains, on the other hand, are much more reliable and are very comfortable.


If you need any recommendations for Shanghai or have questions I can help (or try to) - I'm living here now.

Also, be prepared for a shock when going from Tokyo or Hong Kong to mainland China. Japanese culture is so much different from Chinese culture and HK is much more western than mainland China.

[wanderlustfoodie]

I've flown internally on China Eastern and it was fine.

How many days do you have for this trip? Your route isn't ideal since you're criss-crossing back and forth (going from north to far south, back north, then south again) so if you absolutely have to fly out of Shanghai, I would go Tokyo-Beijing-Hong Kong-Shanghai (you criss-cross one fewer time), or consider saving HK for another trip and subbing in Xi'an which was a favorite for us. Then you could move in a southern route the entire time: Tokyo-Beijing-Xi'an-Shanghai.

For restaurants:
Beijing: dadong was fantastic for Peking Duck. Black Sesame Kitchen is really fun.
Shanghai: Old Jessie (for Shanghainese) and Lost Heaven (Burmese); Jia Jia Tang Bao for steamed dumplings; Yang's for fried dumplings
Hong Kong: Bo Innovation, Felix, Hutong, Lung King Heen (this was several years ago. there are a lot of new, great restaurants that have opened since then)
Din Tai Feng is a chain in lots of cities that is good for dim sum

[Deleted]

I'll second the recommendations for Lost Heaven in Shanghai and Din Tai Feng. If you're interested in trying Xinjiang Chinese food there is a good restaurant called YeLiSheLi in Shanghai. I can give you the address if you want it. Xinjiang food uses more lamb and spice rubs and yogurt and has these great hand pulled noodles - its very different from other types of Chinese food.

[GilliC]

I also love Din Tai Feng for steamed buns and dumplings. I don't know about the others, but the one in Beijing focuses on that and doesn't offer the same variety as a traditional dim sum restaurant. The others might be different?

I agree with juliash that Xinjiang is definitely worth trying. It is not at all what you would expect from Chinese food. Yangrouchuanr (spiced lamb skewers) are my favorite street food, but if you're not adventurous (or foolish) enough to buy them from a guy grilling them on an impromptu sidewalk brazier, they're just as good from a proper restaurant.

For Beijing duck, Da Dong was our go-to for visitors (the original at Dongsishitiao), and I like it much better than Quanjude. I also really enjoyed Liqun, and getting there is an experience in itself!

As for a few other suggestions to fill however many days you're spending in China:
- Hot pot. There's the more traditional hot pot with a few flavor choices per pot, but I also love Suan Tang Yu (sour fish soup).
- Sichuan. If you haven't had Sichuan peppercorns before, this is a must. Now that they can be imported into the US, they've become a bit more common, but if you have the stomach for spicy food, it's worth trying authentic Sichuan food. Easier to find, and easier on the stomach, Gongbaojiding (the original Kung Pao chicken) can be found on quite a few homestyle restaurants and is always a favorite.
- Vegetarian. Even if you're not a vegetarian, it's amazing what vegetarian restaurants in China can do with non-meat ingredients. A lot of the time this means carefully reproducing meat dishes with non-meat ingredients. Which is kind of strange when you think about it (for the Buddhists who don't want to hurt animals but still want to eat them?), but it's impressive nonetheless.

[maddiepaddy]

Thanks, everyone, these are all great recommendations and very helpful. I definitely feel better now about the inter-city flights. I will look up all the restauant recs. I am slowly trying to get H to be a bit more of an adventurous eater before we go

Wel will have 2 full days plus partial travel days in each Tokyo, Hong Kong, and Beijing. We'll have a more 'leisurely' 4 full days in Shanghai. I know its tight, but we can only be there for so long, and we don't know when we'll be back to that part of the world, so we want to see as much is as reasonable. The suggestion to replace HK or Beijing with Xi'an is good, but H will be sad if we miss Beijing and I've always wanted to go to HK, so this is what we came up with.

I don't think anyone posted any hotel recs. We're hoping to stay between $150-$200 a night. If anyone has suggestions, they would be greatly appreciated!

[GilliC]

Why 4 days in Shanghai? No offense to @juliash, but I feel like there's a lot more to see in Beijing. Especially if you're planning to go out to the Wall (which you should). I've spent three days in Shanghai (one of which we spent out in one of the water towns) and we were already visiting lesser sights like the aquarium.

[wanderlustfoodie]

Of all those cities, Shanghai was the least exciting to me. It just feels like a big modern city. I would try to spend more time in Tokyo or Beijing than Shanghai.

[maddiepaddy]

Jan 17, 2014 13:12:23 GMT -5 wanderlustfoodie said:

Of all those cities, Shanghai was the least exciting to me. It just feels like a big modern city. I would try to spend more time in Tokyo or Beijing than Shanghai.

I'm sure you and GilliC are right about this, but my H is attending a conference in Shanghai, which is why we're even going on this trip in the first place I'll definitely have a few days mostly on my own there, so I'm going to try to save shopping, etc for Shanghai. 

[Deleted]

Ha, I was about to agree with others, that 4 days in Shanghai is really too many, but it looks like you are stuck with that.

Shanghai is a big modern city. The best things to do are shopping the fake markets, going into the taller buildings, and a few museums. It really lacks in historic and cultural sights and the ones we do have pale in comparison when you've been to places like Beijing.

maddiepaddy If you need a shopping guide for some of the local markets, let me know. That is something I've become fairly proficient in living here. But know that you don't really want to do brand name shopping here as the import taxes are exorbitant. Most of the locals do much of their brand name shopping elsewhere: HK, U.S. etc. so they can avoid the taxes. You can get some great fakes here though

Hotel recs: We loved the nights we spent at Shichahai Shadow Art Performance Hotel in Beijing and have recommended it to others who have also really enjoyed it. It is definitely within your budget - we paid around $100 night and that was during a holiday. It is just a short walk to Huaihai Lakes and is in the middle of hutongs, so very local. It has nice and clean, but small rooms and the staff spoke decent English and was fairly helpful. www.tripadvisor.com/Hotel_Review-g294212-d2070236-Reviews-Shichahai_Shadow_Art_Performance_Hotel-Beijing.html

I don't have any good recs for Tokyo as we rented a flat because there were 5 of us going. In Hong Kong, DH and I stayed at the Best Western Hotel Harbour View...it was ok. I wouldn't recommend it as it was a pretty far walk to get to much of anything. All the rooms in HK are tiny.

Shanghai: There are two sides of the city: Pudong - East Side of the river, and Puxi - West side of the river. Stay on the Puxi side. The only things in Pudong you might want to do are the fake market at the Science and Technology Museum and Lujiazui (Financial District) to see the largest buildings in the city. Those two places are easily reached via Metro. The majority of the rest of the stuff is in Puxi: Old Town/YuYuan, People's Park and Square, East Nanjing Lu, etc. We've stayed at the Courtyard by Marriott in Xujiahui and liked it there, but I'm not sure about pricing as it was paid for by DH's company. It is a short walk to 3 different metro lines. Where is your H's conference? You might want to stay close to there or close to a metro line that leads there. I can give you more specific recs if you're interested.

You're visiting during the summer, no? Make sure that wherever you stay in Shanghai has air conditioning as it gets pretty much unbearably hot here during June/July/August/early September. It's very humid and often in the high 90's low 100's but feels hotter. A lot of expats take long vacations back to their home countries during the summer because it is so miserable.

Hope that's all helpful!

[maddiepaddy]

Thanks, @juliash ! This is all so helpful. I'll let you know when I get to planning more of an exact itenarary for Shanghai. Insight you have on markets, etc will be really great!

[katfco]

I don't have any hotel or restaurant recommendations, since I was there 10 years ago. Most of the time we sought out little hole in the wall places to eat. If the locals like it, it's worth checking out and is likely cheaper.

Culture shock in terms of etiquette can be, well, a shock. The reason for the footprints on the toilet seat is because Chinese toilets are the squatting ones, so that's what they're used to.

When you're in Shanghai, it might be fun to take the train over to Suzhou for a day. There are some beautiful gardens over there.

[GilliC]

Jan 18, 2014 14:09:45 GMT -5 katfco said:

The reason for the footprints on the toilet seat is because Chinese toilets are the squatting ones, so that's what they're used to. 

I assumed this went without saying. It doesn't change the fact that squatting on a toilet seat in a turbulence-prone airplane is a recipe for misplaced urine.

At least when people squatted on the sitters at our office, the building tended to stay put, so the bathrooms remained slightly more sanitary. However, management still felt the need to force everyone into a conference room for a PowerPoint presentation on 'How to use the toilet.' (To be fair, a lot of expats were sketchy about knowing which direction to face for each of the various squatter styles.)