Moms with low supply

[D2M]

Hi MMM, my daughter is 4 weeks old today and breastfeeding has been a challenge from the get go. At her first weight check, she dropped a normal amount of weight but then continued to drop for the next two a few days apart. I met with an LC and got all kinds of tips. By the fourth weight check, both the ped and the LC agreed supply was the problem. Even now, pumping gets very little from my breasts (maybe 1 oz if my H gives her a bottle and I pump during a session).

So we've been supplementing with 2 oz of formula or pumped milk at every nursing session and she finally gained a good amount of weight at her last appointment. She is a much happier baby. In the meantime, I'm taking every suggestion from the LC and the Internet to boost supply: pumping after every nursing session, eating steel cut oatmeal every day, drinking tons of water/eating a lot, taking fenugreek, goats rue and brewers yeast tablets, drinking raspberry leaf and nettle tea 3x a day ...

What am I missing? And has anyone successfully gone from supplementing for this long to exclusively BFing?

[heythere]

I'm so sorry you're dealing with this. I've been there, and I know how frustrating and exhausting it can be. Plus it made me so angry at my body and disappointed that I couldn't do this "natural" thing I was planning to do.

My first month or so with DD sounds almost identical to what you wrote-- losing weight, weighed feedings where she only got like .5 oz, supplementing after each feed while I pumped 12-15 times/day, trying every thing imaginable to increase supply (drinking insane amounts of water, tea, eating tons of oatmeal, dark beers, brewers yeast, goats rue, fenugreek, some other herbal thing I can't remember, and I even ordered domperidone online.

Ultimately, I wasn't able to increase my supply and it was determined that I have insufficient glandular tissue (hypo plastic breasts). But- that didn't stop me from nursing DD until she was 2.5 years old. I just combo fed with formula for her first year and then only nursed at night after that. Nursing was largely for comfort but she did get some milk from me.

During the week, I sent formula to daycare and I pumped at work to make a supplemental bottle for the night time. On the weekends and overnight, I nursed on demand and supplemented with formula.

I was so much happier when I stopped pumping all the time. That said, there is nothing anyone could have said while I was in the thick of it (for her first 9-10 weeks of life) because I had to do it to try everything.

So long story short - it is possible to combo feed for the long term if you want. I also have a friend who had to supplement for the first 2 months for her son but was able to EBF after that and she nursed her second child fully from day 1. It's also ok if you decide to go exclusively to formula.

Good luck! Breastfeeding is the LEAST natural "natural" thing I've ever done.

[Yankees21]

This is probably not what you want to hear, but I tried all of that and was never able to get to EBF, my supply just didn't want to cooperate. Our pediatrician mentioned a prescription to take but said it's not recommended if you have a history of depression, which I do. Good luck to you; it is so difficult!

[indylady]

Here are the lactation cookies I made (I doubled the chocolate chips): www.food.com/recipe/oatmeal-chocolate-chip-lactation-cookies-by-noel-trujillo-192346

It sounds like you're doing everything you can! I had low supply too - I was able to produce more milk eventually. Good luck!

[D2M]

heythere, wow, nursing until 2.5 is amazing. If I have to combo feed for the long term, I am much more at peace with it than I was a couple of weeks ago. How did you pump 12-15 times a day?? I feel like I'm already permanently attached to either DD or the pump, ha.

[D2M]

Jul 6, 2014 9:57:03 GMT -5 Yankees21 said:

This is probably not what you want to hear, but I tried all of that and was never able to get to EBF, my supply just didn't want to cooperate. Our pediatrician mentioned a prescription to take but said it's not recommended if you have a history of depression, which I do. Good luck to you; it is so difficult!

I also declined the prescriptions after a long chat with my husband. I don't have a history of depression but I was really weepy post partum (bc of breastfeeding!) snd he really didn't think it was a good idea. We both also were not keen to take drugs that were not FDA approved for breastfeeding.

pennypenny, I tried powdered brewers yeast and it made me want to hurl. I put it in brownies and muffins and it was fine but my LC said the tablets would give the same result (and fewer calories).

[D2M]

Jul 6, 2014 10:39:38 GMT -5 indylady said:

Here are the lactation cookies I made (I doubled the chocolate chips): www.food.com/recipe/oatmeal-chocolate-chip-lactation-cookies-by-noel-trujillo-192346

It sounds like you're doing everything you can! I had low supply too - I was able to produce more milk eventually. Good luck!

Thank you for the support. I am glad your supply went up and I'm sort of hoping it miraculously will happen for me but I'm trying to be realistic.

[Deleted]

Not breastfeeding is ok, too.

I was so much happier after I stopped torturing myself for just two ounces a day total from both breasts.

Not worth it.

[narockshard]

No advice yet as I fear I may be having the same issues. My daughter is 10 days old today and will have a weight check on Tuesday to see. But I do want to offer hugs and support as I understand how hard it is to deal with...the first few days of her life were pure agony on me and I probably only feel better today because yesterday was the first day I was able to feed her without supplementing, although it might have been a fluke. I was crying daily about it and felt like absolute crap that my body just didn't/doesn't seem to be cooperating. It's also been extremely hard on me because I sort of feel alone in this compared to the moms in my life that I know. They all seem to have this crazy abundance of milk and I just feel like a total failure. So I guess all I'm trying to say is that I get the frustration, you're not alone, and I feel for you...I'm almost tearing up for you knowing how frustrating everything is. But like everyone always says, at least look at your baby girl and know that she will be healthy and will thrive and you're an awesome mom no matter how you feed her.

ETA: I realize that last part is easier said than done though. When I get in my (likely postpartum hormone driven) weepy state of mind, nothing really consoles me...sigh. This is so hard!

[Deleted]

Hang in there, guys.

And if your breasts don't make much, sometimes that's just how it is.

People will ask you if you tried any number of things (while they're overflowing with luscious lactation themselves), and it's fine to tell them to go fuck off in your head. LOL.

[starlily]

Jul 6, 2014 9:57:03 GMT -5 Yankees21 said:

This is probably not what you want to hear, but I tried all of that and was never able to get to EBF, my supply just didn't want to cooperate. Our pediatrician mentioned a prescription to take but said it's not recommended if you have a history of depression, which I do. Good luck to you; it is so difficult!

This was also my experience last time. I am off to a similar start this time as well. The difference is that this time I'm not beating myself up over it.

[glauren]

Like heythere I have IGT, so I'm unable to EBF. We've been combo feeding since DS was one month old - at first, nursing on demand every feeding and supplementing with a bottle afterward if needed, then as he got older I alternated BFing and FFing for every feeding, and now primarily nursing in the evening and MOTN and FFing the rest of the time.
I was pretty crushed when I realized I couldn't EBF, but it's actually turned out to be a great thing for our family. H and I alternate wake ups and I don't have to stress about how many ounces I pump at work. The only reason I keep BFing is because I enjoy it, and I think DS does too. I'd throw in the towel in a hot minute if we didn't.
Here's the thread I posted on supplementing back in November - hopefully it's helpful?
pandce.proboards.com/thread/253230/supplement-formula-bf-successfully
((hugs)) it sucks and I'm sorry.

[heythere]

Jul 6, 2014 11:05:50 GMT -5 D2M said:

heythere, wow, nursing until 2.5 is amazing. If I have to combo feed for the long term, I am much more at peace with it than I was a couple of weeks ago. How did you pump 12-15 times a day?? I feel like I'm already permanently attached to either DD or the pump, ha.

That was advice from the first LC I worked with- to pump for 15 mins after every single feeding at the beginning. I only lasted about a week doing that and i was miserable. There was absolutely zero time to sleep while maintaining that schedule. Looking back, I don't know why I didn't say "this is crazy" and stop long before I did.

With my second, who is 6 months old now, I promised myself I would not drive myself crazy and spend most of my mat leave stressing over nursing. I nurse when I can, and then give formula. I pump at work but if I miss a session, oh well. He's not nearly as interested in nursing as my daughter was (who knows if it's bc I pushed it more with her or just his natural preference) so we'll see how it goes but I kind of don't see him still nursing at 1, much less at 2.5.

Easier said than done, I know, but try not to stress over it. In the long run, the time that they nurse and/or take formula is so so short.

[lurknomore]

I've had the same experience almost identically times three. My second daughter was the worst in terms of production. DD3 is 15 weeks and seems to be the best so far. I nursed and pumped at work until 9-10 mo and nursed until 11 with each of my older two. It sucks but once I was at peace with supplementing and searched myself from the pump after every feeding it got so much better. I tried dom with DD2 and it didn't help.

The only thing I will suggest is trying more milk special blend. It has the fenugreek etc in it but also have goats rue. It works way better for me than fenugreek, tea and everything else put together. It is more expensive than the others but works much better for me. I joke with DH that between all the supplements, hospital pump rentals, organic formulas (last 2 haven't tolerated DHA so we have to use a formula without it) I have the most expensive breast milk ever!!

GL and hang in there. Do what is best for you and don't look back.

[lilac05]

You're doing a great job. Do whatever makes you happiest. If that's doing anything and everything for just a small amount of milk, go for it! If it's supplementing, do that! If it's switching to formula, your baby will still be great!

That said, the two biggest things that have helped my supply are eating enough calories myself (AKA eating like a teenage boy...it's seriously embarrassing sometimes the amount of food I can consume!) and putting baby to the breast. The pump never helps much...baby is much better at teaching your body supply & demand. You could consider taking a "nursing vacation"...no chores, errands, etc for a couple of days. Just you feeding baby as much as the two of you can tolerate. If she wakes, feed her. Cries? Feed her. Diaper change? Feed her. Etc.

I struggle with supply this time. I SAH, so I don't have to pump. I refuse to do it because it just stresses me out. I don't respond well to the pump this time. At 11 months, I still only get 2 oz if I've skipped a feeding, but I'm certain that he takes a lot more than that when I feed him! At times when my supply feels really low, I make a point to feed him more often & that seems to help. I'm a huge advocate for BFing, but if I had gone back to work, I would most certainly have at least supplemented or switched completely.

If you want her to have breastmilk, but don't really care if it's YOUR milk, there are lots of options for obtaining other milk...Free and paid options.

In the end, do what's best for you. I promise you'd baby will be the happiest when mom is the happiest.

When you post here, if you know what you want, please be clear. If you just want to vent about low supply, tell people you don't want advice, you just want to vent (then tell the ones who will inevitably say "have you tried..." To shut up.). If you're willing to go through hell and high water & don't want people telling you to just stop, it's OK to say that, too. If you feel discouraged and are ready to switch to formula and want support from others, you'll find that, too.

[D2M]

Thanks everyone for the insight and support. It helps to hear from other women who have gone through the same thing. Like narockshard, I felt pretty alone about this. Everyone I know overflows with "luscious lactation" (love it).

glauren, that thread is really helpful -- thank you! I wonder if I have IGT, too. I know it's not about size, but I do have small boobs compared to every other woman in my family. Did your OB diagnose you?

lilac05, I like the idea of a "nursing vacation." At this point, I'm a lot more accepting of combo feeding because DD is really so much happier than she was but I still am holding out hope that things will improve so I'm still willing to try almost anything.

[pugz]

I had really low supply. I know @misoangry did too but she was able to pump for quite awhile (I only made it a month, for me, pumping only an oz a day was too little for the amount of time it ate up).

Underlying problems for me were PCOS, late term preemie that slept instead of sucked, and possibly IGT. My breasts did not change AT ALL while pregnant or after I had her.

From what I've read since then I would probably be open to domperidone (not reglan) but next time I will probably just formula feed from the start, we'll see.

[lurknomore]

If I recall there is no real diagnosis for iGT without a lot of teating and most drs don't really care to do because in the grand scheme of things it isn't really a diagnosis that does anything except make you feel better (or worse maybe!). I have rather large boobs, esp compared to others in my family. I was FF but my mom nursed my sisters. I seem to recall something about a large cleavage space between boobs, which I do have. I can't remember what else. I didn't dig too far because, like I said, knowing more wasn't going to change my situation.

GL and if you have more questions, feel free to ask!

[Deleted]

Jul 6, 2014 20:05:39 GMT -5 pugz said:

I had really low supply. I know @misoangry did too but she was able to pump for quite awhile (I only made it a month, for me, pumping only an oz a day was too little for the amount of time it ate up).

I didn't make it much longer.  I think I went for about 10 weeks.

[pugz]

Jul 6, 2014 20:10:04 GMT -5 @misoangry said:

Jul 6, 2014 20:05:39 GMT -5 pugz said:

I had really low supply. I know @misoangry did too but she was able to pump for quite awhile (I only made it a month, for me, pumping only an oz a day was too little for the amount of time it ate up).

I didn't make it much longer.  I think I went for about 10 weeks.

I only made it 4 so 10 weeks sounds like a long time to me!  

I may try to BF again next time but I won't try pumping again since it didn't help my supply.  Some people respond well to the pump though, wish I did.  

[glauren]

@d2m no - my OB had never heard of IGT. My LC used some specific terms that hinted at it...insufficient storage space, I think? I can't remember, but whatever it was led me to google and find IGT.
I don't think size matters (although mine are small), but more shape and spacing between. I also had no change during pregnancy, which is another possible indicator.
GL with whatever path you choose! But as you can see, you aren't alone!

[arch01]

Hindsight being 20/20, I would've quit pumping a lot sooner than I did. I pumped until 11 months. DS never learned to effectively transfer milk and I had a low supply, even with taking dom. I "nursed" him every night until 6 months old-more for me than for him. I wanted it to work so badly but it just didn't.

Good luck with whatever path you choose. Either way it's OK.

[huskymom]

Jul 6, 2014 9:56:05 GMT -5 heythere said:

I'm so sorry you're dealing with this. I've been there, and I know how frustrating and exhausting it can be. Plus it made me so angry at my body and disappointed that I couldn't do this "natural" thing I was planning to do.

My first month or so with DD sounds almost identical to what you wrote-- losing weight, weighed feedings where she only got like .5 oz, supplementing after each feed while I pumped 12-15 times/day, trying every thing imaginable to increase supply (drinking insane amounts of water, tea, eating tons of oatmeal, dark beers, brewers yeast, goats rue, fenugreek, some other herbal thing I can't remember, and I even ordered domperidone online.

Ultimately, I wasn't able to increase my supply and it was determined that I have insufficient glandular tissue (hypo plastic breasts). But- that didn't stop me from nursing DD until she was 2.5 years old. I just combo fed with formula for her first year and then only nursed at night after that. Nursing was largely for comfort but she did get some milk from me.

During the week, I sent formula to daycare and I pumped at work to make a supplemental bottle for the night time. On the weekends and overnight, I nursed on demand and supplemented with formula.

I was so much happier when I stopped pumping all the time. That said, there is nothing anyone could have said while I was in the thick of it (for her first 9-10 weeks of life) because I had to do it to try everything.

So long story short - it is possible to combo feed for the long term if you want. I also have a friend who had to supplement for the first 2 months for her son but was able to EBF after that and she nursed her second child fully from day 1. It's also ok if you decide to go exclusively to formula.

Good luck! Breastfeeding is the LEAST natural "natural" thing I've ever done.

I had a very similar experience with dd1. Except I never pumped quite that many times in the early days....and I definitely couldn't keep up with it! Domperidone only yielded me maybe 2-4 oz extra a day. Once I started combo feeding my stress went way down. With dd2 I promised myself I wouldn't put myself through it again...and this time? I have freaking oversupply and pump 10-15 oz at a time. Such a different experience.

You're doing a great job! I nursed while supplementing to 21 months and it worked for us.

[CloudBee]

We had to supplement from day one.

My advice:
- if you're content pumping, any little bit is great
- have no guilt
- be careful with Fenugreek as it can cause major spit-up and tummy troubles
- eat oatmeal, try lactation cookies and brewers yeast or beer if you want to try something natural
- be aware of time spent away from, or not holding your baby when pumping (I have regrets that I pumped so much)

[D2M]

Thanks again, everyone. I was beating myself up that introducing a bottle too early had doomed my breastfeeding but I'm pretty at peace right now that I just don't have an amazing supply. My daughter's latch has gotten better, though, and when I pump, the milk comes out faster, so there's that. I'm going to keep nursing and pumping and focus on keeping baby happy. I'm also going to go to a local breastfeeding support group and do a weighted feeding.

huskymom, that's crazy how your experiences were so different!

CloudBee, I didn't know that about fenugreek. I've noticed that I'm way more gassy in recent days so I'm going to pay attention to DD, too.