Ever had ethical problems with your job?

[niq]

Have you ever had a job that you thought might be actually bad for the world? Like, I dunno, you did video editing for a porn company, or you defended oil coal companies from environmental litigation, or underwrote subprime mortgage-backed securities. Anything where you thought your job might be doing more harm than good.

Considering sending my resume to an online gambling company and a certain privacy-destroying social networking website.

[konapoppy]

I help make some bad companies more evil. But I also make good companies better. I think most companies do both good and not so good things. The industries you listed wouldn't phase me. Big oil, tobacco, and Monsanto would be no goes for me.

[rupertpenny]

I'm an archivist so there is a professional obligation to preserve the historical record for future researchers in an unbiased way.

My first full time job was working in the personal office of a Senator and there was definitely the implication that if I ever saw anything irregular that I should turn it over to my supervisors so it could presumably be removed from the collection/destroyed.

This made me kind of uncomfortable, but it was the middle of the recession and I had an MA in history, a boatload of student loan debt, and no other prospects. Luckily I never encountered anything even remotely sketchy.

[Deleted]

The clinic where I work has turned it to a disaster in the last year and patients are getting very poor care. So yes, every day.

[Poppy]

Hmm, well kind of. I've worked for a couple fabless semi-conductor companies (meaning that all products are manufactured in China, for example). That bothered be and I would have very much preferred working somewhere like Int.el for that reason. I also worked on some products that were used for military applications (weapons specifically) but I was very far removed from that application - we just made building blocks and our products were used for all kinds of things. I was ok with that, although at one time I interviewed with a military contractor and they asked whether I'd be comfortable working on weapons and I wouldn't - that crosses the line for me. DH works on military stuff, but it's more safe-transport related. I have mixed feelings about it.

Just in general I feel a little conflicted about working in electronics because of environmental and human rights issues, and I sometimes fantasize about changing careers to something I'd feel better about.

For your examples, I'd have to know more about the industry and how it's regulated to decide how I felt about the first, but the second wouldn't phase me.

[mellymel]

There was some shady stuff happening at my first job after college. But not something that was widespread or impacting anyone outside of the company negatively. But, still. Fortunately I've worked for highly ethical companies since that time.

[mlt]

I work in biglaw and some of my cases have made me feel a lot of guilt. Defending insurance companies that screwed people, etc. I tell myself I'll make it up someday by working at my dream job (environmental nonprofit). Most of my cases are big company v big company so I don't feel bad. If more of my work was little guy versus big company I would quit. I don't think I could stand it.

[shortstax]

I worked for a hot second in "admissions" (SALES) for a for-profit IT certification "school" that targeted low income people with the lure of "in 6 months you could be in a high-paying IT career!"

It was sad. For about 5-6 months, I bought what they were selling hook, line, and sinker. Opportunity, you can do this! Well, nope. It was expensive (about $25k for 6 months) that people paid with in Sallie Mae loans, and after the 1st class "graduated" I realized that the "we must maintain a minimum of 70% job placement for each class to keep our credentials" line that we were required to use as part of our pitch was complete bull.

There were no job placements. Very few people who took the classes even passed the certification exams. It was a money mill. Our executives were getting rich off the hope of the downtrodden. Needless to say, I wasn't there long.

PS - a few years after I left, they filed bankruptcy, locked all of their doors nationwide on Xmas eve with no notice, didn't pay employees a final paycheck, and didn't refund the people who were currently in classes. Nice.

[RandZB]

Yes.

[delawarejen]

I've prepared tax returns for people working under someone else's Social Security number (they file a tax return under a TIN, not under the wrong SSN that is on the W2's, because filing under the wrong SSN would be tax fraud.) Working under a wrong SSN (which is generally because you're not legal to work in the US) is still illegal of course, and will artificially inflate the FICA earnings of the person whose SSN is being used, but the IRS doesn't report those mismatches to other authorities.

I'd prefer not to do that, and I won't do it going forward as I was uncomfortable with our organization participating however tangentially in identity theft. (Edit - I wasn't paid, I was a volunteer.)

[Deleted]

I work in oil and gas but specialize in energy efficient retrofits and processes. I can sleep at night. I would apply to the social networking site but draw the line at the online gambling. I, personally, have known way too many people devastated by gambling addictions.

[justjen]

Not the same, but I once worked for a startup funded by the money of owner's father. He made billions in big tobacco. So while the job was nothing unethical, my paycheck certainly came from a squicky source

[hamster]

I've got morals and standards, but I don't know that those companies would be over my threshold.

[ohyouknow]

I work for the military and see massive amounts of money squandered nearly daily. It's sickening.

[L]

I suppose in a perfect job market, we'd all be able to work wherever we wanted and could choose only to work for employers that we 100% believe in and that make the world a better place.

Unfortunately, at least in my industry, it's far from a perfect job market. I can't change anything that my company may or may not have done in the past, but I can control what I do here and what those around me do, and I ensure that those things are unquestionably above the line. That's enough for me.

[monsterz]

I am talking with companies about breaking encryption on web sites. Basically allowing people to snoop on SSL traffic. Makes me feel icky but there is money to be had there in theory.

And if you're sending your resume out we have a ton of openings

[VillainV]

I'm in the military, often at the "pointy end of the spear." So, yes. Sometimes I've feared that my professional actions have, in the long run, done more harm than good (through no fault of anyone, that's just the nature of war sometimes).

I think just because a company might take part in actions that cause people harm, it doesn't mean that it's necessarily an "evil" company, or that working there would make you a bad person.

[wise_rita]

Jul 31, 2014 9:15:49 GMT -5 @missy1 said:

I would apply to the social networking site but draw the line at the online gambling. I, personally, have known way too many people devastated by gambling addictions.

This is interesting to me. What about working for Anheiser-Bush? Big pharma? The products of these companies have ruined lives, but they're not evil.

[Deleted]

I work in pharmaceuticals. I don't have a problem with the industry as a whole. I know some people do.

I've never had to do anything that I thought was unethical.

[msmerymac]

I work tangentially in the subprime financial industry, so yes. Although I've become a bit immune to it over the years. What I do specifically is more business-to-business and not on the customer side.

[lasagnasshole]

When I practiced, I did insurance defense. Some of our cases, I felt totally fine representing the insurance company because the plaintiffs were being ridiculous.

But too often the insurance company was just being a dick. Really? You don't want to pay the policy limits when the car crash killed someone? Fuck you.

[halfpint]

I did a lot to squash union/organizing mentality and maximize how much work we could squeeze out of people without paying them more.

I feel the need to go and work for the other side to atone for my sins.

[livinitup]

My profession is social work, so anything really unethical is probably going to be illegal, too - so I couldn't work like that. I did see some BAD case work and HORRIBLY run programs - in other departments. I felt okay continuing good work in my department but I didn't feel great about the agency as a whole. When they combined programs and things started to affect my work, I quit.

I'm really glad that I have choices than mean I don't have to work for an evil company. But I don't blame anyone for accepting employment who doesn't.

[Deleted]

Well I've worked for both a coal mining electricity generator and for big oil. I don't see either as ethically wrong.

I would never work for a payday loan company. I may be ok with gambling. Not sure.

[spunkarella]

When I was in public practice, I felt pressure from clients and one partner to file what I considered to be unethical tax returns. Thankfully, the two partners I worked with the most had my back. I think some shady stuff went on at times, but I didn't take part and don't know (or want to know) details.

And I think it's all relative. The firm would say I had a more "conservative" approach and the partner in question was "aggressive." He would have been willing to fight his tenuous positions in tax court. I would have been willing to fight on behalf of the IRS.

This is why I sucked at being a tax accountant and tried to avoid tax work at all costs.

[rubytue]

I'm a bleeding heart liberal, and I've worked for DoD twice. Once during the mid-90s, with not much going on, and just writing software for analysis. But my most recent stint was during war time working in systems designed to kill. I justified it by it saving US soldier lives, but in the end, I couldn't do it. Plenty can, and that's great. We need them. Our soldiers need them. But it was not for me.

Doing cool stuff for good pay is great, but only you can decide if you can do it at the expense of your personal beliefs.

[toesie]

I wouldn't work for a gambling company because it does not interest me at all. The privacy one, I'd do it.

[Deleted]

Jul 31, 2014 9:45:20 GMT -5 wise_rita said:

Jul 31, 2014 9:15:49 GMT -5 @missy1 said:

I would apply to the social networking site but draw the line at the online gambling. I, personally, have known way too many people devastated by gambling addictions.

This is interesting to me. What about working for Anheiser-Bush? Big pharma? The products of these companies have ruined lives, but they're not evil.

Ha! I interviewed for Anheuser Busch out of college. You get free cases of beer as a job perk, btw. I would have no problem working for the type of companies you mentioned. We don't have any personal experiences with drinking or drug addictions but there are quite a few people that we know of with gambling addictions. It's just more prevalent in my culture/background so I just personally would not feel okay with it.

[Deleted]

My old firm defended a bank accused of helping fund terrorists. I never worked on the case (and would refuse to if asked).

I've had ethical issues with clients lying and such (always in pro bono cases) but have been able to resolve them.

I like my work because I find it entirely morally neutral. I help one type of big, evil corporation fight other big, evil corporations. The only question is which big, evil corporation is ultimately liable. I don't know that I could do the kind of work that directly and negatively affects people's rights.

I'm fine with online gambling though.

[Deleted]

I do regulatory and environmental for an o&g company. It can be hard sometimes.