Booze and state laws: this made me LOL

[Cicero]

Indiana Brewhouse Complies with Dumb State Law Using Microwaved Hot Dogs and Canned Soup

The Bank Street Brewhouse in New Albany, Indiana, encourages hungry patrons to order from local takeout joints and local food trucks. But that's not good enough for state liquor authorities, which require brewpubs to offer a weirdly specific configuration of food.

Thus the "Bank Street Brewhouse Indiana Statutory Compliance Restaurant Menu" was born.



This page-long exercise in subversion includes $10 microwaved hot dogs with no toppings, $10 canned soup, and $5 instant coffee, black. It's just so...beautiful.

The shot above originated on Reddit, but Roadtrippers beat us to the Reddit ripoff and adds even more photos of this protest masterpiece to the mix:



Stupid state liquor laws aren't all bad news for this Indiana brewhouse, though. As the bottom of their menu reminds patrons, they are the only game in town when it comes to carry-out beer on Sundays. You win some, you lose some.

ETA: Sorry, link: reason.com/blog/2014/09/11/indiana-brewhouse-complies-with-dumb-sta

[2curlydogs]

So, basically they want to be zoned or whatever as a brewpub (which to me implies restaurant and, hence, a menu), not as a bar, which is what they technically are. And are doing the minimum to achieve that.

Ok then.

[tacokick]

Sept 12, 2014 14:42:23 GMT -5 2curlydogs said:

So, basically they want to be zoned or whatever as a brewpub (which to me implies restaurant and, hence, a menu), not as a bar, which is what they technically are. And are doing the minimum to achieve that.

Ok then.

I know in some places "brew pubs" can brew beer on site while bars cannot.

[pt716]

So can you not have a brewery with a tasting room in IN?

[2curlydogs]

Sept 12, 2014 14:51:16 GMT -5 tacokick said:

Sept 12, 2014 14:42:23 GMT -5 2curlydogs said:

So, basically they want to be zoned or whatever as a brewpub (which to me implies restaurant and, hence, a menu), not as a bar, which is what they technically are. And are doing the minimum to achieve that.

Ok then.

I know in some places "brew pubs" can brew beer on site while bars cannot.

Yes, that is the case here in WI. We have several. They all feature a full menu. The word "pub" being kinda crucial.

If they're just a place that brews beer, that's a brewery. Some breweries even offer tastings.

If they're just a place that serves beer, that's a bar.

I am ok with state laws requiring a place that brews their own beer and sells it on site to serve food as well or license as a brewery. KWIM?

[lasagnasshole]

Considering Indiana doesn't allow the sale of alcohol while the polls are open on Election Day and doesn't have Sunday alcohol sales, I'm a-ok with any and all efforts to subvert the state's stupidity.

Frankly, the liquor laws should disqualify it from being labeled Midwestern.

[2curlydogs]

Sept 12, 2014 14:53:32 GMT -5 pt716 said:

So can you not have a brewery with a tasting room in IN?

There was a similar fight on this going on in WI. Over distilleries, though.


expressmilwaukee.com/article-permalink-17955.html

[mominatrix]

IIRC, there's a law here that says if you serve hard liquor, you have to offer hot food, and there are a number of places that comply by having frozen foods and a microwave... But they just do it, they don't rook people by charging them ten bucks for one... I dunno... I always thought it was a good idea to have, and good that the liquor licensing people were OK with that solution.

[Cicero]

Sept 12, 2014 14:42:23 GMT -5 2curlydogs said:

So, basically they want to be zoned or whatever as a brewpub (which to me implies restaurant and, hence, a menu), not as a bar, which is what they technically are. And are doing the minimum to achieve that.

Ok then.

It's a microbrewery with an attached tasting room. Apparently IN law requires that such establishments have on hand to serve at least 25 people hot sandwiches, hot soups, coffee, and milk.

The other page of the menu is a schedule of nearby food trucks, info for carry-outs, and the numbers of nearby restaurants who will deliver to their tasting room.

[pescalita]

The statute reads to me like you cannot sell alcohol for consumption on the premises unless you're a restaurant. Are there not bars in IN?

That is a weirdly specific food list, and I don't blame them for making fun of it.

[Cicero]

Sept 12, 2014 15:07:15 GMT -5 mominatrix said:

IIRC, there's a law here that says if you serve hard liquor, you have to offer hot food, and there are a number of places that comply by having frozen foods and a microwave... But they just do it, they don't rook people by charging them ten bucks for one... I dunno... I always thought it was a good idea to have, and good that the liquor licensing people were OK with that solution.

My assumption is that the prices are so high to keep them from having to restock their supplies. I doubt anyone is going to want a $10 hot dog when there are tons of reasonably priced options around you are encouraged to bring in and eat in their establishment.

[2curlydogs]

I guess I'm just annoyed at their approach. Don't like the law? Lobby to change it. I find nothing in evidence this place is trying to do the same in addition to their "protest menu".

That's what local distilleries did here - got together and successfully lobbied the legislature to allow them to operate under existing tasting room laws. This is Wisconsin, though. We're awesome like that.

[irishbride2]

Sept 12, 2014 15:15:07 GMT -5 pescalita said:

The statute reads to me like you cannot sell alcohol for consumption on the premises unless you're a restaurant. Are there not bars in IN?

That is a weirdly specific food list, and I don't blame them for making fun of it.

Lots of bars, but now that you mention it I can't think of one that didn't at least serve some food.....even the crappiest of crappy college bars.

[pt716]

Sept 12, 2014 15:08:05 GMT -5 Cicero said:

Sept 12, 2014 14:42:23 GMT -5 2curlydogs said:

So, basically they want to be zoned or whatever as a brewpub (which to me implies restaurant and, hence, a menu), not as a bar, which is what they technically are. And are doing the minimum to achieve that.

Ok then.

It's a microbrewery with an attached tasting room. Apparently IN law requires that such establishments have on hand to serve at least 25 people hot sandwiches, hot soups, coffee, and milk.

The other page of the menu is a schedule of nearby food trucks, info for carry-outs, and the numbers of nearby restaurants who will deliver to their tasting room.

This is weird to me, most if the microbreweries I go to don't serve food.

[UMaineTeach]

Sept 12, 2014 15:15:07 GMT -5 pescalita said:

The statute reads to me like you cannot sell alcohol for consumption on the premises unless you're a restaurant. Are there not bars in IN?

That is a weirdly specific food list, and I don't blame them for making fun of it.

It is a weird food list.
Summer comes some time and no one is going to buy your hot soup, no matter how fresh or canned it is.

Maine's law says something like you have to have food $2 in value for every person your bar can hold. This is of course for a straight up bar. It might say something like 'and we don't mean just chips' but I forget.

"Every on-premise licensee required to sell food shall maintain a food inventory of $2.00 per seat and shall keep on hand dishes and utensils to serve the maximum seating capacity. Utensils and dishware may be paper or plastic. Every on-premise licensee will keep separate records of all food purchased and sold, and separate records of liquor purchased and sold. Soft drinks may not be included as food sales."

ok, this is the "not just chips" clause... only for "Class A lounge"

 Class A Lounges must offer food for sale during all times they are serving liquor. For purposes of this rule, the term "food" refers to cold or hot meals, including sandwiches, salads, and other forms of solid nourishment including, but not by way of limitation, hamburgers, cheeseburgers, hot dogs, pizzas, and other food items which customarily would appear on a well balanced menu. The term "food" specifically does not include prepackaged snack foods, such as popcorn, chips, or pretzels.

I don't know if the bar I go to is a class A lounge (it feels like a class D lounge...), but they only have popcorn, chips, candy bars, pickled eggs, and pickled sausage.

[LoveTrains]

My favorite neighborhood bar does not have food. It's a bar. But they wanted to alter their liquor license to stay open one hour later (I think until 1 am instead of midnight) so then they had to offer "food service."

Which means that they got a microwave and a bunch of microwave burritos on hand. They don't advertise these microwave burritos, but I suppose you could order one if you were desperate, which is stupid because its on a main street with a ton of actual restaurants and you can bring in take out from any restaurant into the bar. I even get pizza delivered (from down the street) to the bar.

This bar also has beef jerky and chips available.

[5thofjuly]

Sept 12, 2014 15:30:26 GMT -5 2curlydogs said:

I guess I'm just annoyed at their approach. Don't like the law? Lobby to change it. I find nothing in evidence this place is trying to do the same in addition to their "protest menu".

That's what local distilleries did here - got together and successfully lobbied the legislature to allow them to operate under existing tasting room laws. This is Wisconsin, though. We're awesome like that.

Oh, trust me. They have. For years.  Politicians have absolutely dug in their heels when it comes to alcohol in Indiana.

[eclaires]

This is Indiana, where you can't buy booze on Sundays or election day. Plenty of people have lobbied to change things. It's not new, but nothing is changing.

This place is in my hometown and it's my parents' favorite place. They used to serve a full menu but they were losing money like crazy with it, from what I understand, so they switched their business model and ended up having to do this. It's a really cool place, and they named one of their beers after a local band that's recently gotten pretty popular (the drummer is the son of my mom's best friend).

SO EVERYONE CAN TAKE THEIR CRITICISM OF THIS AND SHOVE IT.  

[cville]

I can't really understand finding this anything other than funny. I'm practically married to the rule of law, but sometimes adhering to the letter in absurdist fashion is necessary when the law is stupid and unlikely to be changed.

[teflepi]

Sept 12, 2014 15:30:26 GMT -5 2curlydogs said:

I guess I'm just annoyed at their approach. Don't like the law? Lobby to change it. I find nothing in evidence this place is trying to do the same in addition to their "protest menu".

That's what local distilleries did here - got together and successfully lobbied the legislature to allow them to operate under existing tasting room laws. This is Wisconsin, though. We're awesome like that.

while I agree change is the real goal, I give you a very liberal state in many laws but still doesn't allow alcohol on Sundays in most places..easier said than done.

[overture]

You also can't bring your baby into liquor stores in Indiana. Wtf.

When I was in Portland for my birthday, I kind of loved that the bars had to serve food. All the bars we went to had embraced it and had pretty decent menus.

[y4m]

Virginia had laws like this until very recently (like a year ago). Removing them has led to an awesome explosion in micro breweries.

Make a stupid law, get stupid compliance.

[origami]

I know so little about alcohol-producing/selling laws and I'm constantly flabbergasted by how complicated and over-regulated it is. Team Microbrewery.

[Deleted]

WTF with no kids in liquor stores? Our local store gives out lollipops at the register and the big one down the road has a little play corner with toys.

[Deleted]

This shocks me not at all, because I'm from Indiana and menus like this are not rare. This particular brew house is pretty awesome. The owner is super liberal and loves to cause a ruckus. A lot of big right wingers refuse to go there. More for me!

We have plenty of bars in Indiana, but they are required to serve, at a minimum, hot soup, hot sandwiches, coffee, milk, and soft drinks. Even if they're just microwaving it. A lot of bars will make you a sandwich and a can of soup if you ask, and they have it listed on an official menu. But they don't hand out those menus, and most of them really don't want you to ask for it. I've seen a lot of people order grilled cheese off a George Foreman grill when someone needs to sober up at the end of the night at my favorite bar.

I'm not sure why minors aren't allowed in liquor stores here. You can walk up in a store like CVS or Wal-Mart and stock your cart with liquor while your kid sits in front of the cart, but you can't take them in a liquor store.

They also can't sell liquor on Christmas. Because everyone should celebrate Jesus' birthday.

[Deleted]

If there is one thing government and corporations have taught us, it is this:

It is perfectly okay to do whatever you fking like to make as much money as possible, as long as it is legal.

It is only a moral problem to skirt around laws if you are an actual human or small business, then it is reprehensible behaviour! And it is pure evil if you use the current laws to your advantage when you are receiving benefits.

Unless you are a corporation or politician. Then it is patriotic and good for the world.

[curbsideprophet]

Sept 13, 2014 16:02:32 GMT -5 nursecramer said:

Indiana also has really weird laws regarding children in establishments that sell liquor. For example, you can't go into a liquor store with a kid, even an infant. Restaurants that serve alcohol have certain seating areas for minors. This especially sucks when you go out to dinner at like 5pm, because you know, you have little kids... the rest of the restaurant is EMPTY, but there's a 40 minute wait for one of the four tables where minors can be seated because all the other parents who have little kids are also eating dinner then.

This is just crazy and sounds like a PITA for parents. Can the people in this section order a drink if they want one? Do all restaurants have this section, even upscale ones? At what age do you no longer need to sit in the special section?

[eclaires]

Sept 14, 2014 0:53:09 GMT -5 papiercherri said:

This shocks me not at all, because I'm from Indiana and menus like this are not rare. This particular brew house is pretty awesome. The owner is super liberal and loves to cause a ruckus. A lot of big right wingers refuse to go there. More for me!

We have plenty of bars in Indiana, but they are required to serve, at a minimum, hot soup, hot sandwiches, coffee, milk, and soft drinks. Even if they're just microwaving it. A lot of bars will make you a sandwich and a can of soup if you ask, and they have it listed on an official menu. But they don't hand out those menus, and most of them really don't want you to ask for it. I've seen a lot of people order grilled cheese off a George Foreman grill when someone needs to sober up at the end of the night at my favorite bar.

I'm not sure why minors aren't allowed in liquor stores here. You can walk up in a store like CVS or Wal-Mart and stock your cart with liquor while your kid sits in front of the cart, but you can't take them in a liquor store.

They also can't sell liquor on Christmas. Because everyone should celebrate Jesus' birthday.

Now I'm wondering if we know any of the same people; sounds like you're from the area where I grew up!  My family still lives there, and we go back frequently.  

[njw]

They are probably a brewery with a tasting room and it's probably illegal in IN.  It's not uncommon.  Liquor laws are extremely outdated in many states.

The brewery DH works for in CT had to go to court to get laws changed so they could sell both growlers and pints in their tasting room.  Before the law changed you could either sell pints or sell beer to-go, but it was illegal to do both.

Getting laws changed for this stuff takes time and is expensive so this brewery is just taking advantage of a loophole and I don't blame them.  

[sugarglider]

Sept 13, 2014 16:02:32 GMT -5 nursecramer said:

Indiana also has really weird laws regarding children in establishments that sell liquor. For example, you can't go into a liquor store with a kid, even an infant. Restaurants that serve alcohol have certain seating areas for minors. This especially sucks when you go out to dinner at like 5pm, because you know, you have little kids... the rest of the restaurant is EMPTY, but there's a 40 minute wait for one of the four tables where minors can be seated because all the other parents who have little kids are also eating dinner then.

The ropes (to section off the bar area)! I remember going off to college in NY and realizing that wasn't a thing everywhere.