Ugh, this is still bothering me. Especially when she is talking about sitting in that room for hours and people like the immigrations officer barking questions at her like she did something wrong. She is a fucking hero, and this crappy treatment is pissing me off so bad.
I haven't heard any updates this morning. Any chance she isn't still cordoned off in some unused area of a hospital? Seriously, areas like that at night are so creepy.
Mx posted an article on CE&P and I'm pretty sure she was only quarantined for a few hours, the day she immediately got back and then was released. This article's wording was different though, so now I'm confused. I assumed all along that she was already released. Not saying that a horrible quarantine for 12 hours is ok, but it didn't seem like she was still in quarantine...I'll see if I can find more info.
Mx posted an article on CE&P and I'm pretty sure she was only quarantined for a few hours, the day she immediately got back and then was released. This article's wording was different though, so now I'm confused. I assumed all along that she was already released. Not saying that a horrible quarantine for 12 hours is ok, but it didn't seem like she was still in quarantine...I'll see if I can find more info.
He most certainly was manipulated into it by Christie. Cuomo is up for reelection. When Christie instituted the quarantine in New Jersey it put him in an untenable political situation. I still would vote against Cuomo for going along with it, and he is just as responsible since he could have said no, but of course Christie is behind this. Cuomo went from rational to "save a seat for me at the tea party table" on this one in about four hours.
Oh please. It was announced at a joint press conference. If he doesn't have the stones to lead his own way he has no business being the governor of NY.
I can agree with you on that while still thinking Christie goaded him into it. He shifted position in a single day. Not even over night. In one day.
Personally, I liked the point where Chris Christie claimed that she looked "obviously ill". Hell, how many people look good coming off an overseas flight to what she's dealt with coming back into the US (after dealing with a difficult situation in Africa)?
Not only that, where did Christie get his medical degree, since he said she is 'obviously ill'?
Oh please. It was announced at a joint press conference. If he doesn't have the stones to lead his own way he has no business being the governor of NY.
I can agree with you on that while still thinking Christie goaded him into it. He shifted position in a single day. Not even over night. In one day.
The whole thing is a clusterfuck, I don't know why I'm even arguing. I mean, I don't like the Cuomos, but that's no reason for me to go on about this! The whole thing about this doctor being asymptomatic when he was cruising around the city means nothing. He could easily have 'shown signs' while he was out instead of the next morning. The other doctor in NJ who was supposedly under voluntarily quarantine was also out and about shopping and eating. I don't want people rounded up and put in tents but when even medical professionals have become so incredibly stupid they cannot police themselves, what's the answer? Please stay inside isn't cutting it. It has to be something better than going from treating people who have to wandering the streets of NY and calling 911 when you get it. The police were the ones who "secured" his apartment. The police have no idea what they're doing with this shit!
I can agree with you on that while still thinking Christie goaded him into it. He shifted position in a single day. Not even over night. In one day.
The whole thing is a clusterfuck, I don't know why I'm even arguing. I mean, I don't like the Cuomos, but that's no reason for me to go on about this! The whole thing about this doctor being asymptomatic when he was cruising around the city means nothing. He could easily have 'shown signs' while he was out instead of the next morning. The other doctor in NJ who was supposedly under voluntarily quarantine was also out and about shopping and eating. I don't want people rounded up and put in tents but when even medical professionals have become so incredibly stupid they cannot police themselves, what's the answer? Please stay inside isn't cutting it. It has to be something better than going from treating people who have to wandering the streets of NY and calling 911 when you get it. The police were the ones who "secured" his apartment. The police have no idea what they're doing with this shit!
What? No.
I don't think you understand how this virus works and how signs and symptoms appear.
No, he could not have easily been out and about showing symptoms without a fever first. According to reports as soon as the doctor had a recorded fever he immediately reported it and was transported to the hospital. He wasn't having GI distress.
People generally don't start vomiting and having diarrhea, which is where the virus is pretty contagious as one of the first symptoms of the virus and being contagious.
One of the first signs of the virus is a fever, which is why they are monitoring temperatures. Then other symptoms begin such as a headache and general malaise. Again, GI symptoms of vomiting and diarrhea are still typically not present. The virus is only spread through direct contact with certain bodily fluids.
Also, this paragraph from the article sums up how I feel and a ID professional's opinion is obviously more credible than what I've been saying
Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, said Sunday that not only do aggressive quarantines of asymptomatic health workers contradict science, but such measures could ultimately worsen Ebola's impact in Africa. "Let’s not forget the best way to stop this epidemic and protect America is to stop it in Africa, and you can really help stopping it in Africa if we have our people, our heroes, the health care workers, go there and help us to protect America," he told ABC. "If you put everyone in one basket, even people who are clearly no threat, then we have the problem of the disincentive of people that we need."
But the first symptoms could have occurred while he was out. That's why people are freaking out.
Fine, I get the fear. I felt the same way at first. Duncan's family was living with him for several days and did not catch this though. Neither did the nurse who assessed him on the first ER visit or the EMT workers. The amount of virus being shed increases exponentially as the illness progresses. At the peak of the illness a person is much more contagious than when they initially begin showing symptoms. Ebola is very contagious, but this is why the true risk comes to the people who take care of them at the peak of the illness.
But the first symptoms could have occurred while he was out. That's why people are freaking out.
If you're so fucking worried stay in your own damn house. We don't force people to live in tents on hospital grounds because they choose to spend their life helping those who are sick and in need.
I don't know the legalities of this. Does anyone have the power to trump the governor? Can a judge order her release? I don't think anyone federal can fix this, right?
But the first symptoms could have occurred while he was out. That's why people are freaking out.
And those people that are freaking out don't understand how the virus works. Which is also why people like Christie and Cuomo shouldn't be making mandatory quarantine decisions with no direct health care experience, especially no experience with Ebola.
If the virus worked in such a way that people started projectile vomiting, having diarrhea or bleeding with no other signs and symptoms first, then I would understand that a quarantine might be necessary. But until the virus changes I'm going to stick by the medical professional's expertise that quarantine isn't necessary for people with no signs or symptoms based on the science behind the virus.
ETA - what will the Ebola Response Coordinator (who has the same level of healthcare experience as the other 2 career politicians) be advising the president on? I think there are many things going on to try and calm the masses and most of them aren't making a lot of sense.
I don't know the legalities of this. Does anyone have the power to trump the governor? Can a judge order her release? I don't think anyone federal can fix this, right?
The courts are the most likely avenue. The POTUS can use the U.S. attorney to seek the nurse's release, probably on 4th amendment grounds and maybe on preemption over international travel. The nurse herself, DWB, and various other groups also have standing to make a fourth amendment challenge.
Whether the POTUS could simply order Christie to release her, and send in the national guard if he won't, I don't know; maybe, it's arguably within his power because she was seized at an airport, but it is complicated and I am sure the POTUS would not do it. It would raise huge federalism questions.
The nurse has retained counsel who is making a due process challenge, arguing the quarantine is overbroad. It implicates the fourth amendment because it is a seizure, so it must be narrowly tailored to survive judicial review. My guess is she will be released to her home; there's no way a judge would order someone showing no symptoms to be held in conditions worse than a prison, but I think there will still be an effort to appease the states (so I am assuming the outcome will be home quarantine).
But the first symptoms could have occurred while he was out. That's why people are freaking out.
And those people that are freaking out don't understand how the virus works. Which is also why people like Christie and Cuomo shouldn't be making mandatory quarantine decisions with no direct health care experience, especially no experience with Ebola.
If the virus worked in such a way that people started projectile vomiting, having diarrhea or bleeding with no other signs and symptoms first, then I would understand that a quarantine might be necessary. But until the virus changes I'm going to stick by the medical professional's expertise that quarantine isn't necessary for people with no signs or symptoms based on the science behind the virus.
Presumably both NY and NJ have public health departments, and people with knowledge who could advise Christie and Cuomo. Why are they ignoring the advice of their experts?
Again, I think it's pretty ballsy for Christie to state that this nurse was "obviously ill". I'm guessing that Christie gets off a 20+ hour flight looking fresh as a daisy himself, right?
She had a temperature of 100 at arrival at the airport. 2 Democrat governors along with Christie have taken this route. A tent is a pretty bad quarantine plan - but I would want more days of normal temps and a negative blood test before she continues with her life in public.
She had a temperature of 100 at arrival at the airport. 2 Democrat governors along with Christie have taken this route. A tent is a pretty bad quarantine plan - but I would want more days of normal temps and a negative blood test before she continues with her life in public.
No, she did not have a temp of 100 at arrival. Here's a quote from an article with an interview with her.
At first, her temperature -- taken with a forehead scanner -- was 98 degrees.
Hours later, with her cheeks flushed with anger over being held without explanation, another scanner check recorded her temperature as 101 degrees, she wrote.
"The female officer looked smug. 'You have a fever now,'" she wrote. "I explained that an oral thermometer would be more accurate and that the forehead scanner was recording an elevated temperature because I was flushed and upset."
She eventually got a police escort to a hospital, where her temperature was measured again at 98.6 degrees -- normal. And she tested negative for Ebola, she wrote in the Dallas newspaper.
ETA - what will the Ebola Response Coordinator (who has the same level of healthcare experience as the other 2 career politicians) be advising the president on? I think there are many things going on to try and calm the masses and most of them aren't making a lot of sense.
The ebola response coordinator is there for interagency coordination. We didn't need more experts, we needed someone to coordinate the experts. I have seen a fraction of the cluster it can be working with multiple agencies when I worked in wing command centers in the AF, so this makes sense to me.
ETA - what will the Ebola Response Coordinator (who has the same level of healthcare experience as the other 2 career politicians) be advising the president on? I think there are many things going on to try and calm the masses and most of them aren't making a lot of sense.
Well if the masses weren't doing shit like pulling their kids from school because their principal just went to Africa (not even West Africa, just Africa) or screaming about how you can catch it through a sneeze then maybe they wouldn't have to constantly be talking people off the fucking ledge. They really haven't been changing the core of what they're saying but apparently it means fuckall when confronted with a nation of kneejerk fuckfaces.
It doesn't really seem to me like one message is being sent. A family in CT has been quarantined because they were in West Africa. A doctor treating Ebola patients wasn't quarantined and now has it. And the statement on that should have been that there was no risk of transmission because it's only transmitted by xyz, not that everything is fine because his fever hit this morning and not last night in the bowling alley. There's been a lot of ridiculous reactions - the family was quarantined because they're black and the doctor wasn't because he's white. They blamed the nurse in TX because she's a woman and not a male doctor. The state of TX is to blame because it's TX. I'm stunned that there is no plan at all for any of this and not one soothing, in control voice who can convince people that anyone knows what the fuck they're doing.
Thank goodness she was allowed home. My fingers are all triply crossed that she doesn't become sympomatic at some point, I don't know that I can handle the "i told you so" responses that would flow from that.
Thank goodness she was allowed home. My fingers are all triply crossed that she doesn't become sympomatic at some point, I don't know that I can handle the "i told you so" responses that would flow from that.
This is a moot point. She is not contagious while she is asymptomatic and if she did become symptomatic, I'm sure she would do the right thing.....like the doctor did.
It is really bothersome to me that politicians are playing on the fear of the general public. There was an article I read last night where either Cuomo or Christie (I don't remember which one) that stated that the CDC will be catching up to their recommendations.
Thank goodness she was allowed home. My fingers are all triply crossed that she doesn't become sympomatic at some point, I don't know that I can handle the "i told you so" responses that would flow from that.
This is a moot point. She is not contagious while she is asymptomatic and if she did become symptomatic, I'm sure she would do the right thing.....like the doctor did.
It is really bothersome to me that politicians are playing on the fear of the general public. There was an article I read last night where either Cuomo or Christie (I don't remember which one) that stated that the CDC will be catching up to their recommendations.
It should be a moot point, but idiots will still say "I told you so" if she eventually gets sick because they don't understand science.
I really fear for the future of math and science in the US....
For example, when a participant of the study was told that he had a one-in-thirteen-million chance of contracting the virus, his response was, “Whoa. Thirteen million is a really big number. That is totally scary.”