Breastfeeding Pills' Risky Results

[OscarQ]

I'm sorry Pugz but I totally laughed. Not only can you pray the gay away but you can pray for increased BM supply. Awesome! And that must be what I did wrong. I didn't pray for my BM supply. Damn. I'll remember that for next time.

And eclaires is right. People are assholes - especially when it comes to mommy stuff and breastmilk vs formula is just the beginning.

[Deleted]

Aug 7, 2012 13:25:30 GMT -5 laurenpetro said:

every time there's a BFing post there are a ton of stories from you guys about how horribly people made you feel when you stopped and it crazy to me. not that i don't believe you, but holy shit.

am i the only one whose doctors didn't guilt the shit out of me for stopping pumping at 6/8 weeks? i never once got a guilt trip from anyone about stopping. even my mom, who was pretty heavily pro-BFing, never said a word about it. she was never one to hold her tounge so it must not have bothered her at all.

I had a pedi give me a lecture on the marvels of breastfeeding along with the condescending, you must be a lazy skank overtones at petey's 2 month check up.

Mind you this kid was never breastfed. I mean that ship had long sailed.

[eclaires]

All of the people in my life were really supportive. I was hardest on myself, honestly. No one else made me feel that way - at least no one I care about or was close to.

[mominatrix]

I haven't read anything but the OP (yet)... But my first thought is 'is this news?'

Maybe it's the circles I run in, but the side effects of Reglan have been out there for quite a while.

...and as for off-label uses... Why is it so sinister when we're talking about breastfeeding, but not sinister when we're talking about off label uses of drugs for inducing labor? I seem to remember a lot of conversation that amounts to, ” if a doctor is prescribing it, it must be safe, I trust my doctor more than Dr. Google or Riki Lake.”

...via mobile.

[Deleted]

Eh, I was judged from both sides. I got crap for BFing and I got crap for switching to formula at 9 months.

Both sides are judged. It is what it is.

[mominatrix]

Aug 7, 2012 12:49:41 GMT -5 cookiemdough said:

Aug 7, 2012 12:47:13 GMT -5 emmybean said:

I was rx'ed reglan with nary a warning or a discussion. I only knew that it was to attempt to help my supply. It was given to me 3 days after MPT was born at my first LC appt. it was only later that I realized it was something that could be potential harmful for me.

Can LC's write prescriptions?

Not somebody who's just an LC, or even an IBCLC.

...via mobile.

[mominatrix]

Aug 7, 2012 13:14:19 GMT -5 NewOrleans said:

I wonder what LLL's position is on the use of Reglan and Domwhat'sit.

You can look it up on the website, I'm sure.

At the meetings I've been to, when the drugs have come up, what I've heard has been...

Talk to your doctor.

Reglan can trigger or exacerbate PPD. Take it with caution, especially if you're otherwise at risk.

Some moms have find success with.Dom P. Talk to your doctor.

...via mobile.

[Deleted]

Aug 7, 2012 13:31:45 GMT -5 eclaires said:

All of the people in my life were really supportive. I was hardest on myself, honestly. No one else made me feel that way - at least no one I care about or was close to.

This was pretty much me too. I got a few side-eyes and the occasional comment when I would crack a bottle of formula open in public, but the people in my life were really supportive. It was actually my mom and my pediatrician that really kept me from totally losing my mind when I was beating myself up.

[mominatrix]

Aug 7, 2012 13:15:02 GMT -5 pugz said:

someone pass me a beer. I was just told I need to pray more and my supply will increase.

where's my shank?

I hear Guinness is oft-prescribed to help boost supply.


...via mobile.

[emmybean]

I should clarify that the rx was called in by the LC to my OB at my first lactation consultant. Neither the LC or my OB voiced any concerns or potential risks with taking reglan.

[thejackpot]

IRL most of the friends recognize the dangers associated with these drugs on the Bump though, there is certainly the camp that pushes doing anything possible to continue bfing.
I was hard on myself because I wanted to make it to a yr. That was the magic date for me. I made it beyond that but there was the awful weekend when I was sick and instructed not to bf that I nearly drove myself batty. It was crazy cakes for a kid who will now eat Pop Tarts for breakfast if you let him ;0

[mominatrix]

Aug 7, 2012 13:41:29 GMT -5 emmybean said:

I should clarify that the rx was called in by the LC to my OB at my first lactation consultant. Neither the LC or my OB voiced any concerns or potential risks with taking reglan.

Then you were terribly mis-served by them. I've heard about PPD and Reglan since the first time I ever heard of it.

...via mobile.

[emmybean]

Aug 7, 2012 13:44:22 GMT -5 mominatrix said:

Aug 7, 2012 13:41:29 GMT -5 emmybean said:

I should clarify that the rx was called in by the LC to my OB at my first lactation consultant. Neither the LC or my OB voiced any concerns or potential risks with taking reglan.

Then you were terribly mis-served by them. I've heard about PPD and Reglan since the first time I ever heard of it.

...via mobile.

That's the point. I shouldn't have had to find out after I had been taking it that there were potential concerns. It was presented to me as if it were a matter of course, and nothing to think twice about.

[Deleted]

Aug 7, 2012 13:46:23 GMT -5 @majorwife said:

YYou know, you do hear the "everyone can bf if you try" a lot. It is something that our bodies should do, but i wonder like girls getting their period at 10, if something environmental is increasing the number women who actually cant bf

I always wondered about long term effects of certain drugs. I mean, we know that things like the Pill can hurt your supply if you take it while BFing. But does taking it for 10+ years before BFing cause any damage?

[Deleted]

Aug 7, 2012 12:20:11 GMT -5 emmybean said:

and it was bullshit because it was repeated to me over and over and over again that if I just tried hard enough, kept at it long enough, and took enough pills and supplements (I took reglan, fenugreek and drank several cups of mothers milk tea with my oatmeal every morning.) that I WOULD succeed.

Bingo.

My first LC insisted that if I just offered the breast enough, my supply would go up. It's simple supply and demand! Nurse more! Meanwhile, my son with the crappy latch is nursing 40 minutes of the hour every hour of the day and I'm slowly but surely losing my sanity and hating every last second of his first two weeks of life. But sure. Nurse more. It's worth it.

[wawa]

Aug 7, 2012 13:46:23 GMT -5 @majorwife said:

YYou know, you do hear the "everyone can bf if you try" a lot. It is something that our bodies should do, but i wonder like girls getting their period at 10, if something environmental is increasing the number women who actually cant bf

I wonder this too.
I mean, way way back it was only the upper class that had wet nurses and such, right? If a serf had a baby and the milk never came in...did the kid just die? Drink sheeps milk and grow up with nutritional deficiences? What?

How long as formula existed anyway?
Have BFing issues always been this prevelant and before kids just...didn't get fed...or has something that is causing the problems? Maternal age? Environmental factors?

Do other countries have the same incidence of poor supply or milk just not coming in? Or is it just us? It baffles me...and not because I in anyway blame the mothers or think they aren't trying hard enough (:@ :@ for people who say that), but because I'm sure they did try and I understand that they did what they could. So what's the deal? There has to be something going on here.

(side note: the intro to the wiki page on infant formula is really depressing)

[One Girl In All The World]

I also wonder if other cultures are/were just better*** technique wise, for lack of a better term? I had supply out the wazoo, but G's latch was godawful and my supply surely would have TANKED if I kept trying to follow the 8000 competing sets of instructions that I'd been given to try and continue getting him to. Pumping however worked fine until I couldn't be bothered to do it anymore.

But yea. If people are resorting to ordering drugs from another country (and that advice is given soo often on the bump and elsewhere) to keep up with bf'ing, there's way to much pressure out there to EBF. Way too much. But I am all about the formula feeding, personally.

***better meaning a better way to teach it to mothers as opposed to the spotty support (at best) that we get in this country/era

[wawa]

Aug 7, 2012 14:00:27 GMT -5 @majorwife said:

Im sure wet nurses were common even amoung the poor. Breasts were more communal and there was probably another mother close to nurse. But goat, cow and other milk was given too.

oh, that's true. I forget that it was much more normal to just pop a boob in any hungry baby's mouth.

[Daria Morgandorffer]

In my historical novels, which are clearly 100% accurate, babies of lower/middle class folk either got nursed by a friend or relative, or died. But like MW said, it was extremely common to have babies nursed by multiple people back then.

I just read the Wiki page on formula and I'm surprised that we didn't see more developmental issues back when evaporated milk and such were commonly used.

[meg]

Thanks cookie

the meetings Ive been to have never mentioned drugs to up supply. Just the stuff I mentioned earlier (and mostly nurse nurse nurse). One of the leaders of my group is a family dr too.

They may be perfectly safe, etc but for me, the risk just isnt worth the reward in this case. And like I said, Im a really big fan of BFing - still am doing it in fact, plan to child-led wean, open to tandem, etc blah blah. But at the end of the day like someone said, this is what is the best solution and what works for ME and for my child. Obviously, I think it is a great thing for those who want to and can make it work, and I do think that it is worth some struggling through to get to the happy place. But as long as kids are getting fed, I dont care. I just get upset when moms who want to BF have roadblocks OTHER than their body/baby in the way (clueless Pedi's, poor education on how to make it work, unsupportive family etc, judgment and issues when NIP, etc).

I also know many women who successfully BFd with supplementation for a year plus... whatever works.

[meg]

i think that many women have a really hard time getting tongue and lip ties dx which can cause pain and difficulty. Seems to me there needs to be better edu for health professionals on BFing, like logistics on how to help support a BFing mom and what problems to look for, etc.

[mominatrix]

Aug 7, 2012 14:18:29 GMT -5 meg said:

i think that many women have a really hard time getting tongue and lip ties dx which can cause pain and difficulty. Seems to me there needs to be better edu for health professionals on BFing, like logistics on how to help support a BFing mom and what problems to look for, etc.

Amen.
The problem us the fact that it doesn't neatly fall in one doctor's jurisdiction.

OB's aren't on it, because it's above the waist. Pedi's aren't, because it's mom's issue, not baby's.

We're lucky. There's ONE MD in Seattle who specializes in breastfeeding medicine. But she is busy clipping tongue ties and consulting on super serious cases, she hardly has time to deal with supply issues.

So, we're left with mother to mother groups like LLL, and with LC's.

...and the problem with LC's, is that that term, ” Lactation Consultant” isn't regulated. Literally anybody can call themselves one with no training at all. There's International Board Certified Lactation Consultants (IBCLCs), but who knows to look for them?

Such a mess.

...via mobile.

[heyjude]

The article makes it sound as if these women are engaging in risky hoo-doo voodoo in order to breastfeed their babies.

(a) Pumping, fenugreek, prescription meds, frequent nursing, etc. is not hoodoo voodoo. It's common stuff.
(b) The goal of breasfeeding is not a terrible one to have.

That said, I skipped the reglan because of the side effects AND I supplemented with formula in the beginning. Also I refused to pump 8 times a day (like the LC recommended). I found adding 1 or 2 pump sessions and taking fenugreek and other herbs increased my supply in those early weeks. These were all personal decisions that I felt comfortable making.

I feel like this article is painting both the goal of breastfeeding and the mitigating measures one must sometimes take in order to successfully breastfeed with a broad a negative brush. Like, "Oh you are having trouble breastfeeding? Well you are a stupid woman if you try to take steps to fix it because you could just use formula, der." It makes me think the author has never breastfed or been married to someone trying to breastfeed.

[ringstrue]

I honestly think that new moms are stretched waaaaay too thin and the body just draws the line at producing milk. This is something I found for myself especially during the first 3 months. For me, ideally, I need to be carrying for ME, and have a helper with that, then someone carrying for the baby, then someone carrying for the house and cooking. Each one of those is a FT job. My role would be to nurse and then straight back to caring just for myself - eating enough, sleeping, vitamins, resting while awake, light exercise, etc. But no, all of a sudden new mom has 4 FT jobs to do, plus a normal life of phone calls and outings, and then we wonder why she isn't getting enough sleep or making enough milk and needing this that and the other to get through? Its ridiculous. Ofcourse your body is going to say uncle at some point.

[MrsAxilla]

What the hell are we eating/drinking/breathing that's causing so many women to have such low milk production? Women have BF'd for thousands of years; there was no other choice. All women theoretically CAN BF. Is it the fluoride? The aluminum? The HFC?

:::adjusts tin foil hat:::

[meg]

yeah momin... I know around here LCs are such a mixed bag too. Some great some terrible... I have learned a ton from mtgs myself, but of course not everyone will click wtih their local leaders etc (and for me, finding a group that isnt too far away and meets at night was almost impossible). My group is great but Ive heard that some are much pushier, etc. In general I think other moms can be an amazing resource to help solve parenting issues in general - BFing or otherwise.

Plus really, I like that BFing isnt overly medicalized... I dont think in most cases it needs to be. But, it would be good for there to be a more clear path for moms who need some more help to make it work.
I know I was lucky that everything mostly went smoothly for me with henry but who knows that #2 will present. But I also have read books, have boards like this one and my local which are both full of moms who have faced every possible hurdle, have OBs and pedis who support it (was not pushed to supplement when H dropped % for example), etc.

I like seeing the conversation out there more, and would love more articles for those not on message boards about this stuff to help moms KNOW where to look for help.

[heyjude]

Also, neither Reglan nor Domperidone are blackmarket or illegal. Using these loaded terms is just as harmful as calling formula poison.

[emmybean]

Aug 7, 2012 14:35:54 GMT -5 heyjude said:

The article makes it sound as if these women are engaging in risky hoo-doo voodoo in order to breastfeed their babies.

(a) Pumping, fenugreek, prescription meds, frequent nursing, etc. is not hoodoo voodoo. It's common stuff.
(b) The goal of breasfeeding is not a terrible one to have.

That said, I skipped the reglan because of the side effects AND I supplemented with formula in the beginning. Also I refused to pump 8 times a day (like the LC recommended). I found adding 1 or 2 pump sessions and taking fenugreek and other herbs increased my supply in those early weeks. These were all personal decisions that I felt comfortable making.

I feel like this article is painting both the goal of breastfeeding and the mitigating measures one must sometimes take in order to successfully breastfeed with a broad a negative brush. Like, "Oh you are having trouble breastfeeding? Well you are a stupid woman if you try to take steps to fix it because you could just use formula, der." It makes me think the author has never breastfed or been married to someone trying to breastfeed.

The article isnt poo-pooing taking steps to make it work, the article is stating that women push themselves too far to try and make it work, when it isn't necessary, is could be dangerous.

I was told, on this board, that I wasnt motivated enough to succeed in breast feeding because I mentioned that I took a four hour nap while my then MIL was watching then MPI. THAT is insanity. And it's exactly what this article is addressing. Not the supplements to help a low supply, not pumping a couple times a day because you aren't quite getting enough. This is about the larger than accounted for number of women who do no and cannot produce enough BM to make BFing happen at all, and the frutile lengths they go to try and make something out of nothing.

[ringstrue]

Aug 7, 2012 14:50:55 GMT -5 heyjude said:

Also, neither Reglan nor Domperidone are blackmarket or illegal. Using these loaded terms is just as harmful as calling formula poison.

ITA with this. Many areas of medicine have drugs that've been adopted from other areas because of beneficial side effects. So long as the doctors are aware of all the effects of a drug its not wrong to use it for multiple issues.

[heyjude]

Aug 7, 2012 14:48:45 GMT -5 MrsAxilla said:

What the hell are we eating/drinking/breathing that's causing so many women to have such low milk production? Women have BF'd for thousands of years; there was no other choice. All women theoretically CAN BF. Is it the fluoride? The aluminum? The HFC?

:::adjusts tin foil hat:::

I think doctors have become hyper aware of infant weight gain and if they see slow weight gain they immediately point to mom's supply.