So...my faith is...in a tough place right now. I don't need a religious debate, I need some input from those who consider themselves current believers. I'm so not trying to play post police. It's just I don't really know how to talk to anyone about this, so I'm bringing it here.
I keep having people tell me how God knows what it is to lose a child because he gave his only son. But that is not resonating with me at all--instead it just makes me angrier. God knew he would be separated from his son for a whole 33 years. And then they would get back to spending eternity together. So a whole 33 years, which is probably like a millisecond to people like us. And not only that, but he could see and talk to him during that time. So big deal.
I don't even really know what I'm looking for. Maybe some words of wisdom that will give me new perspective?
I think that statement is strongly overused and taken out of context. Yes, he knows what it is like to lose a son. A man that had great potential on earth and that wouldn't be able to grow old and experience things. But, he gave that son willingly, just as Abraham was willing to sacrifice his son.
child loss can't equate because God is omniscient. In our humanity we can't give our children willingly or see the whole plan and picture.
I am am so sorry for your loss and your pain. I think at times people say things like that to comfort themselves. Because they don't know what else to say they cling to these inspirational quotes they've been told over and over again. Because you know saying it makes it true.
Personally, I think God can understand a bit in different terms. He creates all of us and sends us into the world with free will. Not all of us will make it and not all of us will be good people.
Grief and pain are real and it's okay to feel them. I had two surprise special needs kids. They're pretty severely disabled. Then I found out I was a carrier for their disorder. I want angry, depressed, sad, bargaining, etc. grief is a swampy path that you slowly trudge through. But I took comfort in the fact that even Jesus cried out on the cross "eli, eli why hast thou forsaken me?" It's okay to question. Its okay to feel distance. The journey back to him is what strengthens our faith. Sometimes the journey has lots of stops or turn offs, but it doesn't make your faith less significant.
No real words of wisdom. I like nursecramer's idea above. I just know you aren't alone in fee lining anger, confusion, distance, whatever. It took me almost 2 years to really go back. And how I hate getting "surprised" In what I feel should be my safe place, church, with reminders. Like two weeks ago instead of praying to end abortion, the prayer of the faithful was for those who had suffered miscarriage or loss of a child. Out of nowhere. So first I teared up. Then I started thinking that maybe, just maybe, God was finding ways like that to point something out to me. Not sure what, but I don't think its in the literal words said, but where it sends my thinking. In the case of that prayer, to other women who must be around me in that church possibly hurting the same way, am I aware of their need for compassion or commiseration? Not saying those people saying things like God giving up his Jesus are the same at all. That one just makes no sense at all.
I question my faith to this day due to my son's stillbirth, and I don't know if the questioning will go away. Before Bryce died, I was a faithful person who believed that G-d was something that humans couldn't comprehend, which is why we have so many religions/ways to G-d. But then he was gone, and I was so, so scared that I would never be with him again. I was/am scared that he no longer exists anywhere but my memory. That fear still consumes me when I think about it, and my faith has suffered.
My cousin told me something that comforted me immensely, and it has helped me go on. Energy is never lost. When a human being dies, energy leaves his or her body. The soul is that spark of life, the energy we all possess. So even if we are never "with" our loved ones again, their energy has not been lost. They exist, they existed, and they continue to exist. They will always be with us, and we will always be with them. It is one of the laws of the universe; it is science, physics, truth.
As to the assholes that try to define your grief for you, if you can, tell them they are being unhelpful and that you would appreciate if they allowed you to grieve the way you need to. That usually shuts people up for me. When it doesn't, I try to go Sue Sue on the asshole and pull out the "Why would you say that?" "I understand you feel that way." "I am no longer going to discuss this with you." Then I drink a bottle of wine and bitch about them to my husband and best friend. It isn't a perfect coping mechanism, but it is what I've got. I think it is very important to protect yourself when you are suffering. Who cares if you make someone uncomfortable when they are hurting you? Your pain is your pain, and you have the right to take ownership of it when other people try to co-opt it for their own comfort or purposes.
This. This has always resonated with me. I came across some quotes and writings that helped me a lot during the early grieving period.
“Nothing really dies,” I told him. “It just turns into something else. Everything is always changing form. Do you remember the pumpkin that rotted into the earth in your garden? Tomatoes sprouted where it used to be. This bird will go back to the earth and turn into lavendar flowers and butterflies.”
– Anne Cushman
Death is one of two things. Either it is annihilation, and the dead have no consciousness of anything; or, as we are told, it is really a change: a migration of the soul from one place to another.
– Socrates
KateAggie (and anyone else), I'm sharing a particular thread on a support board I was active on after I lost my first son. That particular board isn't as active now, but maybe the responses will help. They address the things you brought up. Struggling with religion after loss. (((hugs)))
I don't know where I am on the spectrum of belief right now and haven't for along time, but what I have come to realize very recently is that my issues had more to do with what people were telling me about this unfathomable force we call God, then possibly what God is or means to be. I don't know if that makes sense.
When I experienced doubt or anger or loss, when people would say the things you mentioned it always felt like they were trying to stop my grief or anger somehow, or telling me to set it down, or putting a time limit on how long I could feel what, or how I should express it. I know they didn't mean it that way but that is how it felt. But years later when I let that go and gave myself permission to be angry and doubt and grieve, for however long I needed to, without having to define what it was or who I was, I've come to a kind of peace. I feel like as mortals we give each other these definitions and put timelines on faith, but this God, this Force is infinite, it is something beyond anything we can imagine, and it's okay to need time to come to terms with our place in all of it. Feeling anger or doubt doesn't mean I have done something wrong or have "lost my way" forever, or any of those things that people tell me. It just means that on that particular day or particular year, or time period, or lifetime even, I was confused, or questioning, or doubtful, and that that's okay because life is big and messy and awesome and tragic, and any feelings I have about it or the force that created it will reflect that.
I'm sorry if that is rambling, I have a hard time making my thoughts on this coherent. Hugs to you.
Grief has no timeline. You will always hold your baby girl in your heart, and it will always hurt. People don't want to admit that there is a pain that stays with you until you die. It's unfathomable, and it tends to make people uncomfortable, which makes them say stupid, insensitive things.
God doesn't exist to make our troubles disappear. He never said that there would be life without sorrow or hardship. On the contrary, actually. But He did promise to be with those who mourn, who hurt, who weep. He promised to walk beside them. He promised to carry those who can no longer walk.
Ultimately, I think that God understands when we falter in times of immense sorrow. I can't believe in a God who would hold that against someone. You lost a part of you, a part that you can't get back until you leave this world. Give yourself time to learn your new normal. Do what feels right for you. If praying feels right, pray. If taking a break feels right, take a break. There is no right or wrong when you are grieving such an immense loss.
Most of all, please know that so many people are thinking of you and praying for you and remembering your baby girl, myself included.
So many great thoughts posted already. I'm so sorry for what you're going through.
I think US Christian culture confuses faith with certainty, and makes an idol of certainty and having all the answers. Like, people panic a bit if they see something they can't fix, and they end up saying something ridiculous and hurtful out of their own need for certainty, all the while patting themselves on the back as if their platitudes are building you up.
I hope this makes sense, it's fueled by some Chardonnay. Do whatever you need to do to protect yourself from random slings and arrows right now, even if they come from people who seem well-intended.
Post by cookiemdough on Apr 1, 2015 8:11:39 GMT -5
I would echo origami and kelbrian that being faithful doesn't shield us from the trials that may come. I guess the analogy that was told to me recently is that there will be storms but God's role is not to prevent the storm but he will give you what you need to survive it. I think about some of your posts about how amazing your husband has been for you and the support system of those that love you and think that God placed those blessings in your life to get you through this grief. However It doesn't make the day-to-day easier. I don't think anything does. In the meantime I think it is okay to express your anger and your doubt to God. This is something I still struggle with because I have always learned to profess my gratitude not the negative stuff. It feels weird honestly but where I am in my life currently I have a lot of anger and it is either express it or go silent. But really he sees you and he knows you are feeling doubt and anger so I am learning it is okay to take those things to him.
As for people they often say crazy things because grief is uncomfortable and it usually makes them feel better for you to just move forward. Well they are not your problem. It is a process and some days will be better than others. But on top of everything you can't be worried about making others feel better about your grief. It is okay not to force a smile when they talk craziness. It is okay to grieve and grief is not pretty but it is a necessary process to get to the other side. Sending you lots of hugs
I'm an infrequent poster here, but I'm very sorry for your loss.
I consider myself a current believer, and with that said, a lot of people use sound bites because they don't know what to say. While their intent might be nice, it often just comes off as trite, insensitive, and condescending instead of comforting and helpful.
You are allowed to feel however you need to feel, no matter what anyone says.
I'm deeply sorry for your loss, and I'm sorry people are saying unhelpful things, especially as your pain is so raw right now. I'm agnostic but was raised in the Anglican church and have befriended the local vicar. She has helped me immensely following our loss just by sitting and talking with me. For the most part we leave God out of it. She did advise me to try and avoid people who thought they had all the answers (religious or otherwise), and I personally found some comfort in the fact that she said she didn't have any answers either. It helped me feel like I wasn't crazy for not understanding a single thing about what happened. I don't know. Grief is so personal, even if someone knows what it is to lose a child, no one knows what it is like to be you losing your child.
As pps mentioned, you are allowed to feel however you feel about this. So many hugs.