Post by basilosaurus on Aug 13, 2012 12:23:50 GMT -5
MrsA, I think you've been spending too much time with the kooks in Estes (who don't flouridate their water). Ingested flouride actually does decrease caries in young children. Also, it's safe. It's been studied for something like 60+ years. I just was reading about this a few months ago, so I'll see if I can find the wealth of evidence showing safety and efficacy.
People have been trying to get rid of flouride for years for a number of oddball reasons (my favorite: it makes us commie), so every so often there's yet another large scale study that once again shows it's safe. I admit the IQ criticism is new to me, so I'm open to changing my mind if you provide sources. Here's one meta study on effects: www.york.ac.uk/inst/crd/fluores.htm
No - FL water is disgusting and might kill you if consumed. I grew up on artisean (spe?) well water. Since my mom moved to the "city" (population 3,000), I don't drink tap water when I visit her either.
Can you give me some links for this? I googled it but I'm getting a lot of contradictory information.
I sort of don't want to make a huge debate about this, but since I was directly addressed, I will point out that both the ADA and AAP (and CDC) recommend fluoride supplementation for kids. That's who I follow for my family's care.
Did you even bother to read the link? the CDC recently lowered the amount of fluoride it considers safe, and specifically warns the public not to use fluoridated water for infant formula because of the risk. There are strong movements within both the ADA and AMA to stop fluoridating water, and even proponents of fluoride concede that it really only works when applied topically (like in toothpaste).
I actually agree with Axilla on this one. I watched a documentary about it that really freaked me out.
Thank you. I want AW to come back in here because I think she's done some research, too.
Sibil - that link is from 2000 and basically says most of the research is crappy and biased one way or another. Even so, it concludes that caries is reduced by about 14%, while fluorosis is increased by 25%. There is some evidence that fluorosis is evidence of fluoride poisoning, so if you're seeing it, there is too much fluoride. I'll repeat again that fluoride works topically. You would see some minor benefit as the water passes over the teeth, but once it's in your system it accumulates in bones and soft tissues. Incidentally, fluoride toothpaste was Introduced about the same time as fluoridated water, so that would account for the reduction in tooth decay as well. Also, most countries are non-fluoridated and they've seen a significant decline on tooth decay, as well, lending support to the notion that topical application is beneficial.
Also, there isn't really a way to control the dosage. Some people drink way more water than others, so a "safe" exposure for some would be excessive for others.
I actually agree with Axilla on this one. I watched a documentary about it that really freaked me out.
Thank you. I want AW to come back in here because I think she's done some research, too.
Sibil - that link is from 2000 and basically says most of the research is crappy and biased one way or another. Even so, it concludes that caries is reduced by about 14%, while fluorosis is increased by 25%. There is some evidence that fluorosis is evidence of fluoride poisoning, so if you're seeing it, there is too much fluoride. I'll repeat again that fluoride works topically. You would see some minor benefit as the water passes over the teeth, but once it's in your system it accumulates in bones and soft tissues. Incidentally, fluoride toothpaste was Introduced about the same time as fluoridated water, so that would account for the reduction in tooth decay as well. Also, most countries are non-fluoridated and they've seen a significant decline on tooth decay, as well, lending support to the notion that topical application is beneficial.
Also, there isn't really a way to control the dosage. Some people drink way more water than others, so a "safe" exposure for some would be excessive for others.
Also, one of the main points that the documentary made was that often the flouride that the municipalities use is bought from China very cheaply, and is very often contaminated with heavy metals and toxins.
Thank you. I want AW to come back in here because I think she's done some research, too.
Sibil - that link is from 2000 and basically says most of the research is crappy and biased one way or another. Even so, it concludes that caries is reduced by about 14%, while fluorosis is increased by 25%. There is some evidence that fluorosis is evidence of fluoride poisoning, so if you're seeing it, there is too much fluoride. I'll repeat again that fluoride works topically. You would see some minor benefit as the water passes over the teeth, but once it's in your system it accumulates in bones and soft tissues. Incidentally, fluoride toothpaste was Introduced about the same time as fluoridated water, so that would account for the reduction in tooth decay as well. Also, most countries are non-fluoridated and they've seen a significant decline on tooth decay, as well, lending support to the notion that topical application is beneficial.
Also, there isn't really a way to control the dosage. Some people drink way more water than others, so a "safe" exposure for some would be excessive for others.
Also, one of the main points that the documentary made was that often the flouride that the municipalities use is bought from China very cheaply, and is very often contaminated with heavy metals and toxins.
I think everyone pretty much covered the effects of fluoride on dental health, but there are other concerns too. Fluoride is absorbed into the digestive tract and can cause problems (this is why I initially stopped ingesting it, because I have Crohn's Disease and try to treat it through diet). It has been shown to effect male fertility and early onset of puberty. Fluoride is listed as a neurotoxin by the EPA and studies have shown that it can effect learning and behavior. There are also theories about Alzheimer's and studies that link fluoride exposure to lower IQ. It collects in bones and is linked to things like arthritis.
My midwives advise me not to ingest it during pregnancy either, because some studies have shown that it effects fetal brain development.
I can dig up sources for this stuff later if anyone is interested.
As far as dental health, we don't even brush with fluoride in my house. The only time we touch the stuff is at dental exams. We've used fluoride-free toothpaste for over five years now and there have been no cavities here. I believe that diet, in particular limiting sugar, is a better way to maintain dental health and actually benefits your body instead of potentially harming it.
ETA - If you fall too far into the rabbit-hole on this topic you find some really startling conspiracy theories out there...
Yes. Our faucet water is good. I can even drink it room temperature just fine. My mom lives about 5 miles west of me and I can't drink her water. It taste different. They Brita filter their water, thankfully.
So what are you supposed to use for infant formula? now I'm going to have to find out for sure if my city uses flouride in the water.
I haven't had to use formula yet - do people use filtered then?
Not all filters remove fluoride. Britas, Purs and things like that do not. You have to use a reverse osmosis system or defluoridation filter. We got ours for about $400. You have to change filters every six months (and oh my goodness, what you see them actually filter in accumulation makes you want to vomit).
There are certain bottled water companies that use reverse osmosis - Aquafina and Dasani, I think. You could always use those for formula.