I'm guessing that this teen's special needs were not always predictable at all times. That is, maybe she is okay with the bag of snacks and not hot foods most times and the mom (and dad! Where is the dad!?) thought all would be okay. But maybe Disney and traveling triggered something in her. The mom tried to mitigate the best she could. I can't see a parent on here doing anything differently when trying to avoid a public meltdown on a plane. If she knew that her child would ONLY eat hot foods at ALL times, don't you think she would have planned better? I do.
I don't blame United for responding the way they did though.
Post by marriedfilingjoint on May 11, 2015 14:15:12 GMT -5
I don't know how she could have planned better than the family having dinner during their layover, which they did. Their special needs child refused food. They do that. If she had brought hot fast food on the plane, it would have been cold by the time their daughter was hungry. Cue meltdown. They were just asking for a little help and the flight attendants were total assholes.
And it's not like this mom was demanding a hot meal because her special snowflake child is so precious and special and just can't eat regular people plane food because no real reason. Likely she was trying to protect the other plane passengers from having to be on a flying metal tube 30k feet in the air with a tantruming 15 year old. We always complain that parents (moms, natch) don't do enough to keep their kids chill on a flight. She was actually trying to do this!
I don't know how she could have planned better than the family having dinner during their layover, which they did. Their special needs child refused food. They do that. If she had brought hot fast food on the plane, it would have been cold by the time their daughter was hungry. Cue meltdown. They were just asking for a little help and the flight attendants were total assholes.
To clarify, I don't think the mom did anything wrong because I don't think her kid was guaranteed to have a meltdown with no hot food so dinging her for not planning better is not legit.
IF she did have a kid with a 100 percent trigger over hot food a good way to plan better is to work work with the airline when booking.
For those of you who are saying the mom should have done something, what is it you would like her to have done? I'm sure she thought she had her bases covered with the hot meal during the layover. When her kid wouldn't eat it, she tried the backup plan (snacks in the backpack). When that didn't work she was looking for some assistance from the flight attendants. She could have avoided the "she'll start scratching" line, but I'm sure she was starting to get worked up herself knowing that a fully preventable meltdown was on the horizon. I feel for her. The thought of the entire scene unfolding makes me anxious.
I don't get all the hate for the mom. Aside from the unpredictability of behavior of a person with autism, the article quotes at least one passenger sitting nearby, and (on Mom's fb post? another article?) says that all the passengers near them backed them up that no one was acting out of line or unreasonably. I say team mom, and the flight attendant was a huge asshole.
I don't know what happened, but the story sounds incomplete. I find it hard to believe they diverted a flight to kick her off for no reason at all.
I also find demanding a first class meal off-putting. If you've flown a lot before, then you should know that most flights don't have hot meals for everyone.
I don't know what happened, but the story sounds incomplete. I find it hard to believe they diverted a flight to kick her off for no reason at all.
I also find demanding a first class meal off-putting. If you've flown a lot before, then you should know that most flights don't have hot meals for everyone.
This is where I'm at. It is 2015, and airlines flying domestically really do not provide hot meals to coach passengers - even for purchase. Their items for purchase generally include a COLD sandwich, like the one she bought.
They probably also have rules about heating up random food in the convection ovens that are used in the galley for the first class meals. I don't think its as simple as popping the sandwich into the microwave to heat it up. I think there are special containers that are met to fit into the ovens with special packaging, etc.
I don't know what happened, but the story sounds incomplete. I find it hard to believe they diverted a flight to kick her off for no reason at all.
I also find demanding a first class meal off-putting. If you've flown a lot before, then you should know that most flights don't have hot meals for everyone.
I'm sure they did know that which is why they tried to get their daughter to eat on the lay over, she wouldn't cooperate and they tried what they had and it wasn't working. Mom was trying her best to deal with her daughter's SN. trying to force a spectrum kid to go against one of their 'rules' (i.e. meals must be hot) is HARD and best done with the help of a specialist because they will freak out. We intentionally sabotage DD all the damn time to try and avoid this kind of situation but when it comes to food it's really hard unless you're willing to force feed or starve the child.
ETA: I mean for DD she created a rule that if DH or I crossed the threshold into the church nursery we had to stay, it took a year and the help of a BCBA to get her to NOT flip her shit if we walked her in the room then left for church. We were just fortunate to have the money for that.
For those of you who are saying the mom should have done something, what is it you would like her to have done? I'm sure she thought she had her bases covered with the hot meal during the layover. When her kid wouldn't eat it, she tried the backup plan (snacks in the backpack). When that didn't work she was looking for some assistance from the flight attendants. She could have avoided the "she'll start scratching" line, but I'm sure she was starting to get worked up herself knowing that a fully preventable meltdown was on the horizon. I feel for her. The thought of the entire scene unfolding makes me anxious.
1) Not threaten to sue the airline when they did exactly what they should have in the situation. The threat isn't something the airline is making up, the mother is the one saying she said it. She made a statement that included a threat of physical harm--the airline has to take that seriously and the rest of the passengers shouldn't have to worry if it will happen the rest of the flight. United got them home on a different flight/airline. Consequences of her own actions. Her threat made delayed everyone else on the flight--should they all sue her for wasting their time and making them late for bed? If the kid had proceeded to meltdown and started attacking people, then would you be questioning the diversion of the flight? United didn't "discriminate" against them--they followed their policy.
2) I'm ASSuming from the article and the mother's post that this need for HOT food isn't a brand new thing. The mom makes it sound like a normal/common thing. The flight is a 4 hour flight. Even if you PLAN on eating during the layover, the mom knows her kid. If the kid wont eat when she doesn't want to eat as a normal thing, then I'd expect a parent to at least check with the airline about what is available in flight ahead of time--4 hours is a long window to not have any plan for--for any kid, but especially for a SN kid--and that's if the flight isn't delayed/longer. BTW, I've never been on a four hour flight that didn't at least have hot water available--the bag-o-snacks could easily have included one of the multitude of available pre-made/just-add-hot-water meals sold at most grocery stores (again, I know I'm ASSuming there is one the kid would eat). I have been on four hour flights where there was no hot food option available in any class. I really can't imagine this family has flown all over the country/internationally and didn't know how airlines work.
3) She could have not have gotten worked up that people wouldn't break rules for her. I don't believe her behavior, even according to her own rant, was appropriate and frankly, I'd be fine with the airline calling her the passenger with the behavioral issues, not the kid. Yeah, the first class flight attendant probably could have been nicer to her, but she sounds like she started being the snot first when he was enforcing the rules.
And WTF is this shit from her rant? "This was a sheer case of ignorance. Prejudice, ignorance and mistreatment are all too common toward people facing poverty. The parallels between special needs and poverty are striking in that both are causes for judgement, misunderstanding and mistreatment."
I don't get all the hate for the mom. Aside from the unpredictability of behavior of a person with autism, the article quotes at least one passenger sitting nearby, and (on Mom's fb post? another article?) says that all the passengers near them backed them up that no one was acting out of line or unreasonably. I say team mom, and the flight attendant was a huge asshole.
This is actually what makes it kind of hard for me to believe the story she is telling is accurate. According to her EVERYONE backed her, the paramedics, the police and the other passengers. And the passengers didn't just say they weren't bothered by the girl, they stood up and yelled about how the passengers were completely in the right, several of them! I find it a little hard to swallow. I mean they get kicked off because of one terrible flight attendant, but everyone else supported them. I don't generally encounter that kind of unity IRL.
If the story is accurate as presented, then yes, the airline was totally wrong. Even if it is not totally accurate, the flight attendant probably could have handled things better. However, I agree with others that I doubt this is the full story and the rest of the story may influence my opinion.
I can't believe I'm defending United but even if her story is 100% accurate they didn't do anything wrong here. She told them her daughter was unstable and was going to get violent. What did she expect (aside from something United hasn't actually served in a decade)?
I don't get all the hate for the mom. Aside from the unpredictability of behavior of a person with autism, the article quotes at least one passenger sitting nearby, and (on Mom's fb post? another article?) says that all the passengers near them backed them up that no one was acting out of line or unreasonably. I say team mom, and the flight attendant was a huge asshole.
This is actually what makes it kind of hard for me to believe the story she is telling is accurate. According to her EVERYONE backed her, the paramedics, the police and the other passengers. And the passengers didn't just say they weren't bothered by the girl, they stood up and yelled about how the passengers were completely in the right, several of them! I find it a little hard to swallow. I mean they get kicked off because of one terrible flight attendant, but everyone else supported them. I don't generally encounter that kind of unity IRL.
If the story is accurate as presented, then yes, the airline was totally wrong. Even if it is not totally accurate, the flight attendant probably could have handled things better. However, I agree with others that I doubt this is the full story and the rest of the story may influence my opinion.
Except the article posted at ABC news also quoted at least one passenger, verifying this.
This is actually what makes it kind of hard for me to believe the story she is telling is accurate. According to her EVERYONE backed her, the paramedics, the police and the other passengers. And the passengers didn't just say they weren't bothered by the girl, they stood up and yelled about how the passengers were completely in the right, several of them! I find it a little hard to swallow. I mean they get kicked off because of one terrible flight attendant, but everyone else supported them. I don't generally encounter that kind of unity IRL.
If the story is accurate as presented, then yes, the airline was totally wrong. Even if it is not totally accurate, the flight attendant probably could have handled things better. However, I agree with others that I doubt this is the full story and the rest of the story may influence my opinion.
Except the article posted at ABC news also quoted at least one passenger, verifying this.
::shrugs::
The news story quotes one other passenger as saying it was wrong and claiming she stood up and said so. Not quite the level of support the mom claimed on FB.
Post by aussiecrush on May 11, 2015 17:02:10 GMT -5
In terms of the meal being too much of an accommodation, United's own in flight meal page indicates that the food available for purchase is able to be heated on select flights. Seeing as they were eventually able to serve this child a warm meal it sounds like the parents asked for something that was reasonable.
As said upthread, it doesn't matter that the girl didn't melt down. What matters is that the mom used her behavior as a threat, and it was perceived as a threat. As soon as she said it, the attendant went to the cockpit and they started the diversion procedures.
As said upthread, it doesn't matter that the girl didn't melt down. What matters is that the mom used her behavior as a threat, and it was perceived as a threat. As soon as she said it, the attendant went to the cockpit and they started the diversion procedures.
I don't disagree at all. I think that's partly why I can't describe how I feel about this clusterfuck.
Post by shopgirl07 on May 11, 2015 17:09:01 GMT -5
I'm really surprised at these responses.
How pissed would you be if your flight made an emergency landing due to this? It screwed up everyone's day I'm sure. The Mom might have said something annoying and bitchy but in the end, the girl was fine. I think this was a major overreaction on the airlines' part.
I feel like I need to know more. We're really only hearing the mom's side. Was the FA an asshole? Maybe. Or maybe not. We're only hearing HER version.
I sense her frustration. But as said - she KNOWS all the stuff that can possibly go wrong w/ her DD while traveling. She knows. I do question why she didn't contact the airline about her options as far as food goes. Hot meals are NOT a given anymore. And there may be rules around warming food up.
For those of you who are saying the mom should have done something, what is it you would like her to have done? I'm sure she thought she had her bases covered with the hot meal during the layover. When her kid wouldn't eat it, she tried the backup plan (snacks in the backpack). When that didn't work she was looking for some assistance from the flight attendants. She could have avoided the "she'll start scratching" line, but I'm sure she was starting to get worked up herself knowing that a fully preventable meltdown was on the horizon. I feel for her. The thought of the entire scene unfolding makes me anxious.
1) Not threaten to sue the airline when they did exactly what they should have in the situation. The threat isn't something the airline is making up, the mother is the one saying she said it. She made a statement that included a threat of physical harm--the airline has to take that seriously and the rest of the passengers shouldn't have to worry if it will happen the rest of the flight. United got them home on a different flight/airline. Consequences of her own actions. Her threat made delayed everyone else on the flight--should they all sue her for wasting their time and making them late for bed? If the kid had proceeded to meltdown and started attacking people, then would you be questioning the diversion of the flight? United didn't "discriminate" against them--they followed their policy.
2) I'm ASSuming from the article and the mother's post that this need for HOT food isn't a brand new thing. The mom makes it sound like a normal/common thing. The flight is a 4 hour flight. Even if you PLAN on eating during the layover, the mom knows her kid. If the kid wont eat when she doesn't want to eat as a normal thing, then I'd expect a parent to at least check with the airline about what is available in flight ahead of time--4 hours is a long window to not have any plan for--for any kid, but especially for a SN kid--and that's if the flight isn't delayed/longer. BTW, I've never been on a four hour flight that didn't at least have hot water available--the bag-o-snacks could easily have included one of the multitude of available pre-made/just-add-hot-water meals sold at most grocery stores (again, I know I'm ASSuming there is one the kid would eat). I have been on four hour flights where there was no hot food option available in any class. I really can't imagine this family has flown all over the country/internationally and didn't know how airlines work.
3) She could have not have gotten worked up that people wouldn't break rules for her. I don't believe her behavior, even according to her own rant, was appropriate and frankly, I'd be fine with the airline calling her the passenger with the behavioral issues, not the kid. Yeah, the first class flight attendant probably could have been nicer to her, but she sounds like she started being the snot first when he was enforcing the rules.
And WTF is this shit from her rant? "This was a sheer case of ignorance. Prejudice, ignorance and mistreatment are all too common toward people facing poverty. The parallels between special needs and poverty are striking in that both are causes for judgement, misunderstanding and mistreatment."
Her quote is a bit ridiculous, yes. I agree she should have called the airline as a backup, but jeez. How hard is it for first class, which had hot food that she offered to pay for, to show some good customer service and get the kid a meal?
I agree we don't know the whole story here, but is it really so hard to show a little grace and understanding to a SN parent when one of their plans or backup plans goes awry?
The mom needs to chill and the flight attendants screwed up. Fail all around.
I really can't believe they diverted a flight because of the "threat" they faced by an autistic girl who scratches when melting down. did they think she was going to run all over coach gouging out people's eyes? And secondly, I can't believe they diverted a flight even though the girl got food and ate it. The risk of a meltdown was seemingly over at that point so they should have reassessed and continued with the flight.
I get the mom's desperation. She tried to get her to eat and it didn't work. What else could she do but try to get hot food on board? It's not like she came on board after doing nothing and then demanded beef bourguignon from first class.
1) Not threaten to sue the airline when they did exactly what they should have in the situation. The threat isn't something the airline is making up, the mother is the one saying she said it. She made a statement that included a threat of physical harm--the airline has to take that seriously and the rest of the passengers shouldn't have to worry if it will happen the rest of the flight. United got them home on a different flight/airline. Consequences of her own actions. Her threat made delayed everyone else on the flight--should they all sue her for wasting their time and making them late for bed? If the kid had proceeded to meltdown and started attacking people, then would you be questioning the diversion of the flight? United didn't "discriminate" against them--they followed their policy.
2) I'm ASSuming from the article and the mother's post that this need for HOT food isn't a brand new thing. The mom makes it sound like a normal/common thing. The flight is a 4 hour flight. Even if you PLAN on eating during the layover, the mom knows her kid. If the kid wont eat when she doesn't want to eat as a normal thing, then I'd expect a parent to at least check with the airline about what is available in flight ahead of time--4 hours is a long window to not have any plan for--for any kid, but especially for a SN kid--and that's if the flight isn't delayed/longer. BTW, I've never been on a four hour flight that didn't at least have hot water available--the bag-o-snacks could easily have included one of the multitude of available pre-made/just-add-hot-water meals sold at most grocery stores (again, I know I'm ASSuming there is one the kid would eat). I have been on four hour flights where there was no hot food option available in any class. I really can't imagine this family has flown all over the country/internationally and didn't know how airlines work.
3) She could have not have gotten worked up that people wouldn't break rules for her. I don't believe her behavior, even according to her own rant, was appropriate and frankly, I'd be fine with the airline calling her the passenger with the behavioral issues, not the kid. Yeah, the first class flight attendant probably could have been nicer to her, but she sounds like she started being the snot first when he was enforcing the rules.
And WTF is this shit from her rant? "This was a sheer case of ignorance. Prejudice, ignorance and mistreatment are all too common toward people facing poverty. The parallels between special needs and poverty are striking in that both are causes for judgement, misunderstanding and mistreatment."
Her quote is a bit ridiculous, yes. I agree she should have called the airline as a backup, but jeez. How hard is it for first class, which had hot food that she offered to pay for, to show some good customer service and get the kid a meal?
I agree we don't know the whole story here, but is it really so hard to show a little grace and understanding to a SN parent when one of their plans or backup plans goes awry?
The mom needs to chill and the flight attendants screwed up. Fail all around.
meal?
They don't have extra first class meals. Giving her a hot meal meant taking one away from a first class passenger.
I don't have children with autism or other special needs. I don't care who's wrong or who's right. The whole situation sucked for that family and the other passengers. I'm sorry they went through all of that. The mom sounds like any mom who would have been at her wit's end and running up against a potential epic meltdown. I don't blame her for describing the potential actions of her daughter should things go awry. I don't blame United for following their procedures.
How pissed would you be if your flight made an emergency landing due to this? It screwed up everyone's day I'm sure. The Mom might have said something annoying and bitchy but in the end, the girl was fine. I think this was a major overreaction on the airlines' part.
How pissed would you be if a passenger threatened violence. And the flight crew ignored them. And then you were harmed by the passenger? Or hell, how pissed would you be if you were the person sitting in front of the kid and the kid had proceeded to meltdown and try to scratch you for the next three hours of the flight? And the flight crew just told you to suck it up, don't make everyone else be late.
Yes, it sucks, but the airline did exactly what they should have done in this situation. The mother should not have made the threat. As a passenger on this flight, I'd be pissed at her for the delay, not the airline for following policy.
They don't have extra first class meals. Giving her a hot meal meant taking one away from a first class passenger.
Do they not carry a few extra in case too many people choose one of the options instead of whatever ratio they expected?
Nope. If they're out, they're out. Those extras cost money, both in the meal itself and the weight to carry it, and airlines have cut EVERY possible extra cost.
All that said, I don't really see why they couldn't have heated up the chicken sandwich for them. It's not that hard to stick it in the oven for a minute or two. I'm fully willing to entertain the possibility that the mom was unreasonable *and* the FA was a jerk.
Can I just divert the thread for a moment (heh heh) and ask about the autism training for flight attendants thing? Is that something that others agree is needed?
I know this was mentioned upthread, but I totally get having a policy where people who threaten violence are kicked off the airplane.
The second the mom told them she was going to become violent they were put on notice. Had she in fact done so and hurt someone the airline is now negligent in regards to that injury. The injured passenger then (rightly) sues the airline.
It's a sucky situation all around, but I really can't fault them for this.