Can I just divert the thread for a moment (heh heh) and ask about the autism training for flight attendants thing? Is that something that others agree is needed?
#notafrequentflier
No. I think plain old "don't be a jerk" training is needed.
Buuuuuuuuuut that goes to the passengers as well.
I'm going to guess that soon we're not going to see any sort of service for flights. What with price cuts and people being all around jerky anyway.
I became Team Airline the second Mom said "What about when/if my daughter starts scratching people?" or whatever the exact words were. If her daughter actually HAD gotten violent and scratched someone after the mom already warned the FA it could happen, they would have been staring down the barrel of a liability law suit, and the FA would have to say "Yes, Your Honor, this girl's mother DID say her daughter could become violent, and I chose to ignore that, in spite of it being a potential threat to our other passengers."
No, the meltdown never happened. No, nobody got hurt. But I wouldn't be shocked if how they handled it is their standard procedure for handling any perceived threats.
Do they not carry a few extra in case too many people choose one of the options instead of whatever ratio they expected?
Nope. If they're out, they're out. Those extras cost money, both in the meal itself and the weight to carry it, and airlines have cut EVERY possible extra cost.
This. They usually don't even carry enough of the "snack packs" available for purchase in economy for everyone (or, hell, even half the people) to purchase them. They start at the front and when they sell out, they are done. This is one of the many reasons that frequent flyers hate being seated in the back (or know to bring their own damn food).
I have been on planes where grown people have acted like assholes about their seat location, their food, the line up for the bathroom and the way the TV works. And we have never stopped. I wish we had because these people were horrible. Team kid.
All that said, I don't really see why they couldn't have heated up the chicken sandwich for them. It's not that hard to stick it in the oven for a minute or two. I'm fully willing to entertain the possibility that the mom was unreasonable *and* the FA was a jerk.
According to the mom's accounting on Facebook, she didn't ask if they could heat the sandwich for them. She received a cold sandwich, told the FA that her daughter wouldn't eat the cold sandwich, and asked for first class meal to purchase instead.
We had a back pack of snacks but she did not want what we had. The attendant sold me chicken sandwich but it was not hot and Juliette would not eat. The flight attendant said that is all we have. I asked if there was some hot food in First Class. It was a very long flight and I wanted her to get something in her system. The flight attendant went to ask and a male flight attendant in First Class. He came back to tell me that they could not serve the hot food from First Class because we were in economy. I offered to buy the rice they had. He said no. For 40 minutes, I kept trying to think of something that they had that she would eat. He told me no every time. I finally, told him that I am platinum on United thinking he might help. He said No. I again asked if he could make an exception for our daughter who faces autism. He said, no he could not give her the rice from first class. I asked if I could get some chips or something salty for her. He said they had no chips. Juliette was beginning to cry. Frustrated I said, after she has a melt down and tries to scratch in frustration, will you help her then? He said he would see what he could do. He came back scowled at me and gave her a hot meal. I thanked him and offered to pay for it. He did not answer and went back to First Class.
It sounds like she did get the hot meal, but the mom had to threaten the FA of her daughter having a meltdown and scratching people.
I have been on planes where grown people have acted like assholes about their seat location, their food, the line up for the bathroom and the way the TV works. And we have never stopped. I wish we had because these people were horrible. Team kid.
This isn't the point, the mother threatened the FA that the child could potentially have a meltdown and start scratching if she didn't get her way.
I have been on planes where grown people have acted like assholes about their seat location, their food, the line up for the bathroom and the way the TV works. And we have never stopped. I wish we had because these people were horrible. Team kid.
This isn't the point, the mother threatened the FA that the child could potentially have a meltdown and start scratching if she didn't get her way.
I thought she was saying the girl would start scratching herself. Obviously I misunderstood.
All that said, I don't really see why they couldn't have heated up the chicken sandwich for them. It's not that hard to stick it in the oven for a minute or two. I'm fully willing to entertain the possibility that the mom was unreasonable *and* the FA was a jerk.
agreed that would have been the best solution. It's so obvious they should have done this that I wonder if it didn't happen because it was already served cold so it would have been rejected at any temp after that, by the kid. Like she had already decided it was gross so it was too late. Prob a miscommunication because the mom thought she was getting a hot dish so she didn't specify, but they ran out and she got the cold one instead.
I have been on planes where grown people have acted like assholes about their seat location, their food, the line up for the bathroom and the way the TV works. And we have never stopped. I wish we had because these people were horrible. Team kid.
This isn't the point, the mother threatened the FA that the child could potentially have a meltdown and start scratching if she didn't get her way.
This isn't an unruly child having a tantrum because she didn't get what she wants. This is a child who has to find a way in the world where her wants and needs are treated as extreme and unreasonable, through no fault of her own. No matter whose "side" you come down on, there is no case for this being her fault.
This isn't the point, the mother threatened the FA that the child could potentially have a meltdown and start scratching if she didn't get her way.
This isn't an unruly child having a tantrum because she didn't get what she wants. This is a child who has to find a way in the world where her wants and needs are treated as extreme and unreasonable, through no fault of her own. No matter whose "side" you come down on, there is no case for this being her fault.
It wasn't the child who was the problem though, it was the MOTHER'S threat that was the problem.
Post by vanillacourage on May 11, 2015 19:03:44 GMT -5
Also, at 15 she's not exactly a "child" in the eyes of the airplane. If she'd had a meltdown and started scratching, it could be as physically hard to restrain her as a full-grown adult.
I have been on planes where grown people have acted like assholes about their seat location, their food, the line up for the bathroom and the way the TV works. And we have never stopped. I wish we had because these people were horrible. Team kid.
Did they threaten the safety of other passengers? Actually say words in the form of a threat? And was this post 9/11?
I think everyone here is Team kid. Nobody here is suggesting the kid did anything wrong or bad. The mom handled it badly. The FA handled it badly. The mom made a threat. The airline followed their policy and diverted and put them on another plane. No one here was "discriminated" against. The mom continues to be an ass. We all feel bad for her kid.
I have been on planes where grown people have acted like assholes about their seat location, their food, the line up for the bathroom and the way the TV works. And we have never stopped. I wish we had because these people were horrible. Team kid.
Did they threaten the safety of other passengers? Actually say words in the form of a threat? And was this post 9/11?
I think everyone here is Team kid. Nobody here is suggesting the kid did anything wrong or bad. The mom handled it badly. The FA handled it badly. The mom made a threat. The airline followed their policy and diverted and put them on another plane. No one here was "discriminated" against. The mom continues to be an ass. We all feel bad for her kid.
Exactly. I have nothing but sympathy for the kid and her needs.
I still don't think the airline was wrong to do what they did after the mom said that a violent meltdown could happen.
All that said, I don't really see why they couldn't have heated up the chicken sandwich for them. It's not that hard to stick it in the oven for a minute or two. I'm fully willing to entertain the possibility that the mom was unreasonable *and* the FA was a jerk.
This is where I think the FA was a jerk. They told her they had a hot chicken sandwich. It came cold. It sounds to me like the mom knew the flight carried meals for purchase so she thought in the case of an extreme meltdown she would have the "hot food" issue covered. Except then the sandwich was cold so THAT was when she asked for the first class meal.
The mom should not have used the daughters behavior as a threat but I'm sure she did not expect the flight to be diverted. She just thought it would get her a hot meal.
Where does it say that the airline told her they had a hot chicken sandwich?
Post by heliocentric on May 11, 2015 20:05:34 GMT -5
I understand the airline's position. I also understand the mom's frustration and it's quite likely the FA was a jerk. Still, I imagine FAs deal with people trying to get special treatment all the time and it might be difficult to tell the people who truly need something extra (like this case) from those who are asking for special treatment they don't really need.
The FA could possible be the biggest asshole ever created. But Mom made a huge mistake threatening that there could be physical harm if the needs were not met. I really don't see how the airline could make a different choice in today's sue happy world.
Post by UMaineTeach on May 11, 2015 20:56:14 GMT -5
I don't understand if there was a "threat of violence" (that I think was over-reacted to), why they were suddenly safe to go on another flight? Either you are un-safe and your demands can't be met and you get to fly nowhere ever again better rent a car and get driving, or you stay on your flight. Why would the passengers on the new plane want someone on who has been known to have made threats?
I'm pretty burned out on these "airline does something horrible but we're only getting one side of the story so there's a lot of doubt if it's as ZOMG that's-so-awful as we think" stories, tbh.
All that said, I don't really see why they couldn't have heated up the chicken sandwich for them. It's not that hard to stick it in the oven for a minute or two. I'm fully willing to entertain the possibility that the mom was unreasonable *and* the FA was a jerk.
This is where I think the FA was a jerk. They told her they had a hot chicken sandwich. It came cold. It sounds to me like the mom knew the flight carried meals for purchase so she thought in the case of an extreme meltdown she would have the "hot food" issue covered. Except then the sandwich was cold so THAT was when she asked for the first class meal.
The mom should not have used the daughters behavior as a threat but I'm sure she did not expect the flight to be diverted. She just thought it would get her a hot meal.
Yes the article did say it was supposed to be a hot sandwich.
"The attendant told her they had a hot sandwich, but the sandwich arrived cold, Beegle said, and Juliette refused to eat it. "
mom's, United's and the truth plus plenty of blame to go around.
In the interest of public safety, once the mom warned of a violent meltdown, diversion was the obvious consequence. This is an adult-sized person not some 40 lb toddler. I get that mom wanted to avoid a scene, but it seems like she may have been the catalyst for what followed.
I would also wonder what sort of therapy they have done to prepare her for situations outside her control. The mom is quick to point out her IQ which is sort of pointless in this situation- did they opt out of a robust ABA program because she's "high functioning"? Is she doing CBT to become more flexible when things are beyond her control? Did they do a Social Story to prepare her for what to expect on the plane? Did they do one of the flight rehearsal programs offered around the country?
I don't understand if there was a "threat of violence" (that I think was over-reacted to), why they were suddenly safe to go on another flight? Either you are un-safe and your demands can't be met and you get to fly nowhere ever again better rent a car and get driving, or you stay on your flight. Why would the passengers on the new plane want someone on who has been known to have made threats?
My assumption is that once they were taken off the flight, the situation was reviewed, etc etc etc, it was determined that they were fine to go on another flight. I DO hope that the authorities had at least the sense to realize that the mom spoke out of frustration and that her DD was actually doing fine.
(Claim about steaming hot food) "I asked the flight attendant if they had anything hot, because Juliette is very particular about her food," Beegle told KPTV. "If it's warm she won't eat it, if it's cold she won't eat it, it has to have steam rolling off of it.""
I think the flight attendant came over at least 4 times and tried to help them - and at one point, they just decided enough is enough and this family wasn't ready to fly at this particular time - nothing they were doing was appeasing the girl.
I also read where one passenger did say the girl was howling and the flight attendant tried to work with them for over an hour.