Reign me in (BFing help)

[curbsideprophet]

Where are you trying to nurse him during the day? Does he have blackout curtains in his room? Can you make it as much like night time as possible?

What type of pump are you using? Have you changed your valves or membranes recently? Are you using a hands free pumping bra? Are you sure you have the right flange size?

[Deleted]

How long do you pump? A lot of people don't pump long enough and can get another let down if they wait a few more minutes.

I EP, but my son is a crazy eater with a bottle during the day. I don't think the behavior you described is anything strange.

[barefootcontessa]

my guess is that he is frustrated waiting for the letdown, especially since he is used to a bottle. ditto PP about changing out pump parts.

[Deleted]

Did you eat more or junkies food when you traveled for work? Slept more? Those are both known to help milk.

[teatimefor2]

My O had issues nursing at four months and I figured out it was due to teething. I just couldn't see the tooth yet. When he's teething, nursing is difficult. He cries and seems just unhappy with nursing. Depending on how bad it gets, I either put a little Oral gel on his gums (never had impacted his nursing) or given him some drugs (Motrin, etc) 15 minutes before we plan to nurse. It helps a lot.

He'll have a week of bad nursing and then it's fine. And we continue.

You're doing a great job!

[celiacmom]

I'd have daycare do paced bottle feeding to slow him down. Sounds to me like a bottle preference vs a supply issue. m.youtube.com/watch?v=UH4T70OSzGs

[Deleted]

While pumping, see if pressing the flange to your breast gets any more milk to come out--like hold it for a few minutes. If it does, you may want to consider an option other than the sports bra.

I use simple wishes and sometimes need to tighten it to get max milk.

[tulips]

I don't have much advice above what was already posted, but wanted to tritto the Simple Wishes bra rec. I did have to tighten it from time to time to hold the flanges closer if my breast size had changed a bit.

Have you tried watching videos of your baby or looking at pics while pumping?

Four months is when both of mine started their distracted shenanigans. It still comes and goes a bit with K at almost 10 months. Sometimes the world is just more exciting than me and I can't always go to a quiet spot with a two year old at home, too.

[oswin]

I don't really have any advice beyond what has already been suggested, but I came in to say this sounds like what happened with me and DD, though we didn't have quite as much trouble with actual nursing, just my supply. It really sucked when daycare kept requesting larger bottles and I wasn't pumping enough on a daily basis - I ran through my modest freezer stash (maybe 200oz?) in less than a month. It was hard when we started supplementing with formula, but it immediately made my life so much less stressful since each pumping session I was no longer super stressed out about my output. So I wish you all the luck with pumping enough, but don't beat yourself up about it, it sucks to feel so much pressure about pumping.

[curbsideprophet]

I agree with the SW bra rec.

[Deleted]

4 months was a rough time nursing all 3 of mine. They really become distracted nursers at that point and it's hard to keep them latched. They hear a noise, see something etc and unlatch. It's super frustrating.

With J I could nurse side lying and that usually helped. With the girls I just had to keep trying bevause I tandem nused most of the time. It's also probably why he is waking at night (4 month wakeful). But know that it does get better. I think some people have had success using a nursing necklace to try and keep their attention. I never tried that but it might help.

I have never responded well to the pump. I've used the PISA, Spectra, and Symphony. Honestly, it sucked paying $60 a month for the symphony but that thing worked so much better for me. It saved me with j at 8 mos when my supply dipped. I used it the whole first year with the girls.

Sometimes a warm compress or bath helped my pumping output too. I also used to keep a sweater at work to drape over my shoulders when I was pumping and it seemed to help me relax a little more and improve my pumping there. And I always had to do hands on pumping.

I also couldn't diet or even exercise hard or my supply really suffered. So I sucked it up and waited until after they were a year old to get back into it.

Good luck! I hope the nursing at least gets easier! It's sooooo frustrating.

Eta: the nursing does get better! It was probably just a few weeks or a month where the kids wouldn't stay latched to nurse. Eventually, the constant on and off stopped.

[AmyRI]

IMO, you're in the worst part of BFing/pumping right now. From 4-6 months is when I really struggled. It's a combination of things - 4 month wakeful making baby distracted and losing sleep for you, your body regulating to pumping half the time (so generally speaking lowering production slightly), and a big old growth spurt on top of it. And to top it off, most babies aren't ready for solids yet to help supplement. I wish I could say, "oh it gets so much better soon!" but realistically, I was struggling to keep up pumping and needed to pull from the freezer occasionally to have enough.

All that said - you're still doing great! Try your best to not let your anxiety get to you. Even if you need to pull an entire 5oz bottle from the freezer for him each day (assuming weekdays only) you've got 12 WEEKS of milk. And you're not even to the point of needing any of the freezer stash yet!

I agree with the simple wishes bra rec. It's basically a tube top that's really secure and comfortably hold everything to your chest. The lack of straps really helped me get my hands in there to do compressions. I could press from just below my collar bone straight down to the flange and could see extra milk come out when I did it. Plus I found it easier to put on over my clothes so I didn't have to strip to pump, but I realize you WFH so that is not an issue, lol.

As for the distracted nursing... am I correct to assume your first AM feed is ok and the struggle is the evening hours? Witching hours did not go away for a long time with either of my kids. It wasn't until closer to 9 months when they'd eat a real solid food dinner that we cut one nursing session in the evening and it became calmer.

One last comment is that sleep was very important to both my pumping output and my sanity. I realize with a 4mo there's not much you can do. And I have no idea how you feel about sleep training, but it was what we chose to do (a modified version of Ferber) at 6 months with our pedi's blessing and it made my mood about pumping and life in general SO much better. We weren't even aiming for STTN - but getting down to just 1 MOTN nursing session and eliminating or DH handling other MOTN wake-ups was my lifesaver.

[gibbinator]

I don't have much to add except sympathy. 4 months was a rough time for sleep and distracted nursing for both of my boys.

[lynn07]

Omg, we are dealing with this, to the extent that I could have verbatim wrote your last point. DS3 is 4.5 months, and it is terrible. He thrashes, cries, etc during nursing (except at night, naturally). I don't think it started as a bottle issue because he only got a bottle once a day most days, but it might be one now because I've been pumping instead of nursing at least half the day because I couldn't take how negative feeding time was becoming, and my nips couldn't take the clamping and pulling. I'm getting close to switching to EP/combo feeding. Our nights have been worse, too. I'm no help, just wanted to let you know I understand

[Deleted]

I dont have much to add but just wanting to send you my support. And this will be a rambling from her on out. 4 months is hard. Also he may be still getting used to daycare and the routine. DD used to pull this crap where she got up in the middle of the night just to hang out with me and nurse. She did until almost 11 months when I started sending my husband in and he would take care of her. FInally she figured out its not play time and started STTN again. He is still super small but I think its a combination of a lot of new things. Just keep at it.

Also I know how frustrating things are, especially in the middle of the night. I always tell my friends it was some of my lowest times ever. Its just so hard and was so lonely for me. It does get better. Also you may need a break from pumping. Even taking one session off may put you back in the right mindset to keep on going. I know its counterintuitive because you want more milk but maybe you just mentally need a small break. Listen to your heart and figure out what will get you through it in this moment. Hugs!!! You are doing amazing.

[genet313]

Jul 28, 2015 21:07:32 GMT -5 @pnkybrwstr said:

Jul 28, 2015 21:03:32 GMT -5 curbsideprophet said:

Where are you trying to nurse him during the day? Does he have blackout curtains in his room? Can you make it as much like night time as possible?

What type of pump are you using? Have you changed your valves or membranes recently? Are you using a hands free pumping bra? Are you sure you have the right flange size?

I've tried nursing both in dark rooms (our bathroom is the only room totally dark) and in front of the window (so he has a view) and have had sporadic success with both.  He seems to do a bit better nursing in the carrier with me bouncing up and down (wtf, baby?!!?).

I started w/ the PISA, also bought a Spectra per MMM recommendation and a hand pump... none have seemed to help.  Valves and membranes are fresh and I use a hacked sports bra to be hands free.  I've never been sure about the flange sizes, but haven't had any more success trying different sizes and trying pumpin pals.  I suspect my pumping issues are actually mental.  Weirdly enough, my best pumping days where when I had to travel to San Francisco for work.  I out pumped him by 10ish oz those days - what's up w/ that?

I find this to be very true for me - when I'm actively watching the bottle fill up and willing it to fill u p more, I tend to get about an ounce less.  
So I either try to focus 100% on work (when pumping at my desk) or just surf the internet/GBCN and be relaxed when I pump at night.   And I'm often pleasantly surprised.

Also, I'll just say that DD was a mess when I started pumping (right around 4 months) and was a totally distracted nurser at that time too.  She's now 6 months 1 week and it's gotten considerably easier, both with bottle feeding and nursing.    Hang in there, I think it will get easier.

[genet313]

Jul 29, 2015 8:01:58 GMT -5 @pennypie said:

I feel like I'm just getting over a really frustrating hump with BFing DS (4.5mo). I think a lot of it was reflux, but I also think there was some stuff going on with the increased distraction and one of the Wonder Weeks crappy things. Even during the first week at daycare when he was taking 4oz bottles (so clearly feeling better about getting a 'full' belly and not having reflux symptoms afterwards), he was getting impatient and fussy at the breast. The past week has been a lot better. He's still Mr. Distractible...he does this super-annoying fast flop over and almost rolls off the nursing pillow. Twice I've just barely caught him by his foot! And sometimes in the evening before bed he gets really fussy and won't nurse and I just think it's because he's overtired and kind of adjusting to the new routine.

I've also had the pumping and supply issues too. I'm pumping ~14oz/day at work and he's taking 20oz at daycare...clearly that doesn't add up given I have no freezer stash either. (And I'm using a Symphony pump which I'm responding to better than the PISA.) So, pretty much without other options, I've been topping off bottles with formula or doing half-and-half bottles. I always mark one bottle "LAST BOTTLE" and that's just BM in case they don't get to it in the afternoon before I pick him up.

I think you're doing all the right stuff. I'd just try to hang in there a bit longer and see if it's just a phase. Especially if he's gaining weight, having lots of diapers, etc. It might be just a crappy time that will pass.

Hugs, DD used to do this too - pops off so fast to look at God knows what (with my nipple, what the hell DD) and then tries to pop back on again.  It passes.  Hang in there!