And yet I do confess that some of these videos about the sale of fetal parts, especially one I saw where they were picking through and saying, "oh, that's an eyeball, but hardly usable. Oh here is brain. Here are arms and legs - got both of 'em," do bother me.
Post by decemberwedding07 on Aug 5, 2015 10:55:41 GMT -5
I said yes, but the services I booked were for my sister. When she was in HS she told me she was having unprotected sex with her boyfriend. He told her pulling out was an effective method of birth control. I took her to PP because if I took her to the OB/GYN and used her insurance (she was on my parents' plan), they would have gotten an EOB and obviously wondered why she was going to the doctor without them. So I took her to PP, they did an exam, tested her for STD (for which she was negative), talked to her about safe sex practices, and gave her a prescription for BC. Even though she had insurance through my parents, they gave her a dramatically discounted rate so that she could do all of that and get her BC pills without using her insurance and alerting my parents. Without them, she may have very well wound up pregnant at 17 with the child of a total dumb ass. Her HS boyfriend was the worst.
No. I cannot believe that CEP poster is believing propaganda videos made by an extremist group with ties to abortion clinic violence. I am taking a short blood pressure timeout because this is some Grade-A simpleness. When I come back, expect links and capital letters.
I have not personally used them, but a good friend in HS did when she had some concerning GYN symptoms after having sex with her boyfriend. She did not want to go to her PCP because it was on her parents' insurance. So she went to PP to get checked out (she was fine, thankfully) and also get a script for BCP.
Honestly, the vast majority of people against PP are such hypocrites. They don't want women having easily accessible and affordable options for preventing and/or terminating unwanted pregnancies, but then if women do have children and are unable to afford care for them, they wash their hands of them. Because BOOTSTRAPS and DEAL WITH IT. So fuck all of them.
I agree about most of the videos I saw, including a lady talking about abortion over lunch and how that may seem distasteful so is talking about cancer treatment, etc.
I went off to try to find the video I saw this weekend. It was different from the ones that had been coming into my regular news feed. It was like someone was trying to craft an arrangement that was more than just compensation for the administrative and packaging costs of the fetal material for research. It was a discussion about a "new business venture." Or an expanded business venture with this interested party that went beyond research. And the physician was into it, as opposed to the lady with the fluffy hair video where she was just talking pragmatically about what the process and restrictions are. (ETA couldn't find - I think it is restricted at work).
Now the physician in question in the video I am referencing, who was having the conversation did say that she would have to review it with higher ups and PP has to have a uniform practice and she cannot just go on her own. So there was hope there. I'm curious about what actions took place after that. Did PP say, "Um, no doc - that is a violation of XYZ statute so we aren't going there," vs. "oooh that is a creative way to get around the law and increase our revenue stream!" ETA the propagandists obviously want people to believe the latter.
The first is what I expect and hope happened. (eta - I expect that is what happened because my experience with PP is that they are reputable, ethical in their practice, and I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt). The second is what could get them put on the excluded parties list. I haven't yet read up on the "reasoning" the GOP is trying to use to get them defunded.
Also, how they educated and/or disciplined the physician in question if it was determined the person overstepped policy and authority and pursued the issue outside the bounds of her authority is of interest and speaks to the PP practices.
No. I cannot believe that CEP poster is believing propaganda videos made by an extremist group with ties to abortion clinic violence. I am taking a short blood pressure timeout because this is some Grade-A simpleness. When I come back, expect links and capital letters.
I didn't say I believed them. I said the one I saw bothered me. See my post later about what exactly it was that bothered me.
I am not joining in an effort to defund PP or jump on the bandwagon. I'm allowed to be bothered by explicit intent to violate the law by someone in an organization I support. I would hope we would all be bothered by that, and would expect PP to handle it appropriately.
I work for a very reputable organization. We have people who do bad acts. Doesn't mean the whole organization is bad. But if the bad acts were on video released to the public, I would expect our customers, donors, board of directors to want us to have taken action against the people committing the bad acts. And to be interested in and vested in ensuring we acted on the bad act appropriately.
I agree about most of the videos I saw, including a lady talking about abortion over lunch and how that may seem distasteful so is talking about cancer treatment, etc.
I went off to try to find the video I saw this weekend. It was different from the ones that had been coming into my regular news feed. It was like someone was trying to craft an arrangement that was more than just compensation for the administrative and packaging costs of the fetal material for research. It was a discussion about a "new business venture." Or an expanded business venture with this interested party that went beyond research. And the physician was into it, as opposed to the lady with the fluffy hair video where she was just talking pragmatically about what the process and restrictions are. (ETA couldn't find - I think it is restricted at work).
Now the physician in question in the video I am referencing, who was having the conversation did say that she would have to review it with higher ups and PP has to have a uniform practice and she cannot just go on her own. So there was hope there. I'm curious about what actions took place after that. Did PP say, "Um, no doc - that is a violation of XYZ statute so we aren't going there," vs. "oooh that is a creative way to get around the law and increase our revenue stream!" ETA the propagandists obviously want people to believe the latter.
The first is what I expect and hope happened. (eta - I expect that is what happened because my experience with PP is that they are reputable, ethical in their practice, and I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt). The second is what could get them put on the excluded parties list. I haven't yet read up on the "reasoning" the GOP is trying to use to get them defunded.
Also, how they educated and/or disciplined the physician in question if it was determined the person overstepped policy and authority and pursued the issue outside the bounds of her authority is of interest and speaks to the PP practices.
1. All these videos have been highly edited to present a narrative.
2. It is illegal to sell body parts.
3. There is no evidence, not even from these highly edited videos, that PP is breaking any laws.
4. Fetal tissue research is a valuable and lawful field of science for which CONGRESS, including some of these same GOP blowhards, have sanctioned.
5. Part of the law ALLOWS institutions that donate, WITH THE WOMAN'S PERMISSION, to receive compensation in the amount of lost revenue for storing, handling, and shipping the tissue to the resersch lab.
6. THERE IS NO EVIDENCE THAT PP HAS DONE ANYTHING WRONG. NONE. NADA. ZILCH.
This all comes down to "I don't like the way they talked about fetuses for research."
Do you think heart surgeons speak any differently? If you heard them talk about a heart transplant? Or any transplant team of surgeons for that matter?
When my cousin had double lung, heart and kidney transplant, there was a macabre sense in all her familiy's posts about it. I'm sure her team of doctors were even more morbid when they discussed plans. Does that mean we should halt transplants? Or think about transplants differently?
I went to PP in college for birth control so my parents wouldn't find out about it. During the physical exam, the NP identified a non-GYN problem that my regular doctor (who I had coincidentally seen the week before) had missed. This problem turned out to be chronic and would have become worse if it hadn't been diagnosed and treated, so I was grateful to PP for more than birth control. I think their services are valuable to a lot of people for a lot of reasons.
heyjude I want to hug you. Thank you for saying everything so perfectly.
I used PP for BCP in HS because it was cheaper than going through my insurance. In college and after (especially when I no longer had health insurance for a couple of years), I went for my general care.
In HS my sister worked their as a peer educator on safe sex. She continued with that job all through college.
Annual exams and BC in college. I could have found a private practice GYN but it was faster to get an appointment at PP and they would fill a year's prescription at one time. The doctor I saw was amazing. My college's med school staffed it almost exclusively.
I've never needed to, I was on my parent's health insurance through college + was able to get Plan B at my college's student health clinic, then got a nursing job right out of school with immediate benefits. I've been a fan and supporter since high school though, and I did use their website as an information source at that age. Having never used their services, I still donate to them and very much support their existence and ability to receive government funding.
I was on a girls camping trip this weekend playing a card game called I Never (you have to clap if you've done the thing on the card). A card came up that said I've never used the services of Planned Parenthood and every single woman there clapped and started talking about how great PP is. It was awesome!
I agree about most of the videos I saw, including a lady talking about abortion over lunch and how that may seem distasteful so is talking about cancer treatment, etc.
I went off to try to find the video I saw this weekend. It was different from the ones that had been coming into my regular news feed. It was like someone was trying to craft an arrangement that was more than just compensation for the administrative and packaging costs of the fetal material for research. It was a discussion about a "new business venture." Or an expanded business venture with this interested party that went beyond research. And the physician was into it, as opposed to the lady with the fluffy hair video where she was just talking pragmatically about what the process and restrictions are. (ETA couldn't find - I think it is restricted at work).
Now the physician in question in the video I am referencing, who was having the conversation did say that she would have to review it with higher ups and PP has to have a uniform practice and she cannot just go on her own. So there was hope there. I'm curious about what actions took place after that. Did PP say, "Um, no doc - that is a violation of XYZ statute so we aren't going there," vs. "oooh that is a creative way to get around the law and increase our revenue stream!" ETA the propagandists obviously want people to believe the latter.
The first is what I expect and hope happened. (eta - I expect that is what happened because my experience with PP is that they are reputable, ethical in their practice, and I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt). The second is what could get them put on the excluded parties list. I haven't yet read up on the "reasoning" the GOP is trying to use to get them defunded.
Also, how they educated and/or disciplined the physician in question if it was determined the person overstepped policy and authority and pursued the issue outside the bounds of her authority is of interest and speaks to the PP practices.
1. All these videos have been highly edited to present a narrative.
2. It is illegal to sell body parts.
3. There is no evidence, not even from these highly edited videos, that PP is breaking any laws.
4. Fetal tissue research is a valuable and lawful field of science for which CONGRESS, including some of these same GOP blowhards, have sanctioned.
5. Part of the law ALLOWS institutions that donate, WITH THE WOMAN'S PERMISSION, to receive compensation in the amount of lost revenue for storing, handling, and shipping the tissue to the resersch lab.
6. THERE IS NO EVIDENCE THAT PP HAS DONE ANYTHING WRONG. NONE. NADA. ZILCH.
I get all that.
and I'm telling you this video was different. And of course I recognize there could be editing.
I cannot access it from work, but will try to find it from home and post so you can see for yourself.
1. All these videos have been highly edited to present a narrative. yes of course
2. It is illegal to sell body parts. It is also illegal to bribe a judge. People do it, and judges take them.
3. There is no evidence, not even from these highly edited videos, that PP is breaking any laws. there is evidence in this particular video that a physician was interested in entering into an agreement that would have violated the laws to sell body parts. However as already written, the person said she'd have to escalate it because all the PPs have to have the same practice. But she also said if it could be worked out some way with the attorneys, and she was sure it probably could, she was interested.
4. Fetal tissue research is a valuable and lawful field of science for which CONGRESS, including some of these same GOP blowhards, have sanctioned. yep, known already.
5. Part of the law ALLOWS institutions that donate, WITH THE WOMAN'S PERMISSION, to receive compensation in the amount of lost revenue for storing, handling, and shipping the tissue to the resersch lab. yep - know that already, think I acknowledged that above. This was exploring greater compensation than that or "we can pay you a certain amount that you could, you know, classify like that, right? to make it look like that." And the physician was agreeable.
6. THERE IS NO EVIDENCE THAT PP HAS DONE ANYTHING WRONG. NONE. NADA. ZILCH. Correct. As I already stated, I expect that if the physician escalated it the response was, "um ah yeah - no stupid doctor, that is illegal." and then the issue probably dropped at that point.
But I'm still bothered that a physician that should know better didn't just shut down the conversation and say, "you know, it seems like you are trying to skirt an issue here with your proposed business venture, and PP is not about that. We aren't looking to profit from the sale of fetal tissue. There are costs associated with it, but we only get reimbursed to cover the costs and are not looking to profit. Your proposal is making me uncomfortable. Get the hell out."
You should be bothered by it too. PP should be bothered by it and their leaders and employees probably are. and they are probably doing inhouse training right now. The physician I saw was flirting with the idea of something that was unethical and borderline illegal. Doesn't mean PP as a whole did something wrong. But I'm bothered by it. I'm not going to apologize for that or be made to feel ridiculous for that.
Post by mrsdewinter on Aug 5, 2015 11:54:44 GMT -5
When my husband and I wanted to TTC our second child, my insurance wouldn't cover my Implanon removal. I called a few local gyn offices, and they wanted to charge hundreds of dollars, and I would have to go in for two appointments. Finally I called PP. They got me in quickly, and charged me only $70. I got pregnant pretty soon after and now I have a wonderful little boy.
1. All these videos have been highly edited to present a narrative.
2. It is illegal to sell body parts.
3. There is no evidence, not even from these highly edited videos, that PP is breaking any laws.
4. Fetal tissue research is a valuable and lawful field of science for which CONGRESS, including some of these same GOP blowhards, have sanctioned.
5. Part of the law ALLOWS institutions that donate, WITH THE WOMAN'S PERMISSION, to receive compensation in the amount of lost revenue for storing, handling, and shipping the tissue to the resersch lab.
6. THERE IS NO EVIDENCE THAT PP HAS DONE ANYTHING WRONG. NONE. NADA. ZILCH.
I get all that.
and I'm telling you this video was different. And of course I recognize there could be editing.
I cannot access it from work, but will try to find it from home and post so you can see for yourself.
1. All these videos have been highly edited to present a narrative. yes of course
2. It is illegal to sell body parts. It is also illegal to bribe a judge. People do it, and judges take them.
3. There is no evidence, not even from these highly edited videos, that PP is breaking any laws. there is evidence in this particular video that a physician was interested in entering into an agreement that would have violated the laws to sell body parts. However as already written, the person said she'd have to escalate it because all the PPs have to have the same practice. But she also said if it could be worked out some way with the attorneys, and she was sure it probably could, she was interested.
4. Fetal tissue research is a valuable and lawful field of science for which CONGRESS, including some of these same GOP blowhards, have sanctioned. yep, known already.
5. Part of the law ALLOWS institutions that donate, WITH THE WOMAN'S PERMISSION, to receive compensation in the amount of lost revenue for storing, handling, and shipping the tissue to the resersch lab. yep - know that already, think I acknowledged that above. This was exploring greater compensation than that or "we can pay you a certain amount that you could, you know, classify like that, right? to make it look like that." And the physician was agreeable.
6. THERE IS NO EVIDENCE THAT PP HAS DONE ANYTHING WRONG. NONE. NADA. ZILCH. Correct. As I already stated, I expect that if the physician escalated it the response was, "um ah yeah - no stupid doctor, that is illegal." and then the issue probably dropped at that point.
But I'm still bothered that a physician that should know better didn't just shut down the conversation and say, "you know, it seems like you are trying to skirt an issue here with your proposed business venture, and PP is not about that. We aren't looking to profit from the sale of fetal tissue. There are costs associated with it, but we only get reimbursed to cover the costs and are not looking to profit. Your proposal is making me uncomfortable. Get the hell out."
You should be bothered by it too. PP should be bothered by it and their leaders and employees probably are. and they are probably doing inhouse training right now. The physician I saw was flirting with the idea of something that was unethical and borderline illegal. Doesn't mean PP as a whole did something wrong. But I'm bothered by it. I'm not going to apologize for that or be made to feel ridiculous for that.
Nothing is borderline illegal. Either THIS ONE EMPLOYEE was doing something illegal or not. And an entity that supports bombing PPs is in NO position to direct your feelings, and they certainly will NOT direct mine, on PP with their highly edited videos intended to inflame.
michelle, can you link to this video you're talking about?
Yeah I tried to but my company blocked it.
I will try to pull it from home.
I will say that I get where heyjude is coming from - don't imply that I'm endorsing the CMP group or let them make me feel a particular way about PP because they are anti-women terrorists. I am on board with you there heyjude.
I just get so fucking ranty about this. It is inherently more expensive to be a women from a medical perspective. We are expected, just to stay healthy, to have two physicians (a GP and a GYN)...
Arggghhh! This part about two physicians is so true and so frustrating. In my twenties I already had an OB, but I had a vague sense that I was supposed to have a GP too. I made an appointment with one. He told me if I was having my annual exams with my OB I didn't need a GP too although he did give me some vaccine boosters I want aware I needed and my OB hadn't mentioned.
Just having an OB worked out well for years until I slipped on some ice and broke my foot. My OB wouldn't see me because it wasn't related to her specialty. I didn't have a GP, so I ended up having to go to urgent care. Later, I moved shortly after having a baby and when I was looking for a doc I decided to go with a GP so I wouldn't have that problem again. GP told me she didn't do post partum care and referred me to an OB. So here I am again with just an OB and no GP.
Not only do we need to keep funding PP, but we also need to make place in the system for women to have one primary care provider, whether that be GPs with expanded OB care or OBs that can take care of other general health care needs of women.
In undergrad and grad school for BCPs and annual exams, and for a little while after I got my first post grad school job (until I realized that being too lazy to switch to an OB/GYN practice wasn't worth the drive down to campus after work to pick up my BCPs). I love that place.
Does this terrorist org (thanks michelle!) also oppose those red dots many of us place on our drivers' licenses signifying we happily turn over our organs in case we die? Do they not realize there is some cost associated with that voluntary transaction too?