Joe Biden on violence against women

[sweettooth]

I found this clip of Biden from a year ago, so it is not in response to the present comment by Akin. It reflects what he has always felt and is why I don't get upset by his gaffes--underneath is his sincere compassion.

"No means no, no matter what"

www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqs5TKH89pE

[IIOY]

Did Biden make a gaffe re: violence against women?

[sweettooth]

I'm saying that people talk about his gaffes and he was drilled last week about the "chains" gaffe and the "20th century" gaffe and there have been comments that he won't be able to debate as well as Paul Ryan. I am just saying there is substance under the gaffes and people shouldn't write him off.

[MrsDL]

Aug 21, 2012 11:24:35 GMT -5 sweettooth said:

I'm saying that people talk about his gaffes and he was drilled last week about the "chains" gaffe and the "20th century" gaffe and there have been comments that he won't be able to debate as well as Paul Ryan. I am just saying there is substance under the gaffes and people shouldn't write him off. [/quote

Because his gaffes when he is speaking unscripted off the prompter says something about his potential debate performance. Compassion toward a cause does not necessarily show "substance" as it relates to the ability to perform in a debate. Being an advocate for violence against women does not guarantee his big tongue won't trip him up. People write him off based on his consistent public falters compared to his opponent, not because they think he is shallow or lacks substance or intellect. Obviously the man is not stupid, quite the opposite, but that doesn't make him a great debater either.

[eliseb0323]

Not women or Akin related -- but I find Joe Biden repugnant because he lied about the accident that killed his first wife and young daughter. He claimed in several speeches that they accident was caused by a drunk driver, which isn't true. The other driver was not drunk, and the crash was likely the fault of Biden's wife. But he knowingly twisted the truth for sympathy and blamed the other driver for something he simply didn't do.

He didn't mis-speak. He didn't make a "gaffe." He knowingly told lies about this guy.

[OscarQ]

Aug 21, 2012 11:58:18 GMT -5 eliseb0323 said:

Not women or Akin related -- but I find Joe Biden repugnant because he lied about the accident that killed his first wife and young daughter. He claimed in several speeches that they accident was caused by a drunk driver, which isn't true. The other driver was not drunk, and the crash was likely the fault of Biden's wife. But he knowingly twisted the truth for sympathy and blamed the other driver for something he simply didn't do.

He didn't mis-speak. He didn't make a "gaffe." He knowingly told lies about this guy.

Source for the accident being the first wife's fault?

[copzgirl1171]

Every time I look at this post I read Joe Biden as Jon Benet

[laurenpetro]

Aug 21, 2012 12:07:18 GMT -5 OscarQ said:

Aug 21, 2012 11:58:18 GMT -5 eliseb0323 said:

Not women or Akin related -- but I find Joe Biden repugnant because he lied about the accident that killed his first wife and young daughter. He claimed in several speeches that they accident was caused by a drunk driver, which isn't true. The other driver was not drunk, and the crash was likely the fault of Biden's wife. But he knowingly twisted the truth for sympathy and blamed the other driver for something he simply didn't do.

He didn't mis-speak. He didn't make a "gaffe." He knowingly told lies about this guy.

Source for the accident being the first wife's fault?

ditto oscar. this is the first tmie i've ever heard this.

[copzgirl1171]

Aug 21, 2012 12:07:18 GMT -5 OscarQ said:

Aug 21, 2012 11:58:18 GMT -5 eliseb0323 said:

Not women or Akin related -- but I find Joe Biden repugnant because he lied about the accident that killed his first wife and young daughter. He claimed in several speeches that they accident was caused by a drunk driver, which isn't true. The other driver was not drunk, and the crash was likely the fault of Biden's wife. But he knowingly twisted the truth for sympathy and blamed the other driver for something he simply didn't do.

He didn't mis-speak. He didn't make a "gaffe." He knowingly told lies about this guy.

Source for the accident being the first wife's fault?

I think there are conflicting reports if I remember correctly. Like maybe Biden said the truck driver was drunk and the then the driver said that he wasn't and then recanted or something like that.

My memory sucks. Let me see what I can find

[laurenpetro]

can't pull up the article but wiki has it cited (for once):

pqasb.pqarchiver.com/delawareonline/access/1743377101.html?FMT=ABS

[Melissa W.]

I just did a quick google and it seems the police reports were lostl

[OscarQ]

Aug 21, 2012 12:14:20 GMT -5 @copzgirl1171 said:

Aug 21, 2012 12:07:18 GMT -5 OscarQ said:

Source for the accident being the first wife's fault?

I think there are conflicting reports if I remember correctly. Like maybe Biden said the truck driver was drunk and the then the driver said that he wasn't and then recanted or something like that.

My memory sucks. Let me see what I can find

Not disputing the drunk part - really seems like he wasn't and Joe conceded that and then was caught on tape saying he probably was - bad Joe.

I just have never heard it was possibly his wife's fault. That is a terrible intersection - or at least it was until recently. Valley Road was this little road that crossed Limestone Road - Limestone is heavily trafficked by tractor trailers moving at high speeds.

[heightsyankee]

A debate about it (with links) on SNopes.com

message.snopes.com/showthread.php?t=35939

[msmerymac]

Aug 21, 2012 11:58:18 GMT -5 eliseb0323 said:

Not women or Akin related -- but I find Joe Biden repugnant because he lied about the accident that killed his first wife and young daughter. He claimed in several speeches that they accident was caused by a drunk driver, which isn't true. The other driver was not drunk, and the crash was likely the fault of Biden's wife. But he knowingly twisted the truth for sympathy and blamed the other driver for something he simply didn't do.

He didn't mis-speak. He didn't make a "gaffe." He knowingly told lies about this guy.

The man's wife and infant daughter died tragically in a car accident, which also landed both of his sons in the hospital for quite a while. It's one reason he used to commute to Washington by train from Delaware everyday - originally he did it to spend time with his sons who were in body casts and motherless.

I find it repugnant to judge him for anything related to that, frankly.

[heightsyankee]

Aug 21, 2012 12:24:32 GMT -5 msmerymac said:

I find it repugnant to judge him for anything related to that, frankly.

+1

From that Snopes forum, one poster says this:

Part of me wonders if he really believes what he is saying. Shortly before Christmas his wife and infant daughter are killed in a tragic auto accident; his sons injured. I can comprehend someone might form an opinion that their beloved wife could not possibly have been at fault and that therefore the trucker must have been drunk/speeding/faulty brakes and during the ensuing weeks never actually bring themselves to reviewing what really happened because it is so emotionally wrenching.

Years pass and those original thoughts take on the guise of reality in his mind.

I can totally see that. I have seen people do that for much less tragic events, where they convince themselves of the truth and stick to it as a way of comforting. I've seen my own mother do this with some of her memories of my grandmother.

[OscarQ]

Aug 21, 2012 12:23:36 GMT -5 heightsyankee said:

A debate about it (with links) on SNopes.com

message.snopes.com/showthread.php?t=35939

So sounds like it was just a terrible accident.

Quote of the Evening Journal from that link:

"As the chief deputy attorney general, Jerome Herlihy was assigned to the incident. Two days later, he issued his report, clearing Dunn.

A story headlined, “No Charges Due for Trucker in Biden Deaths,” in the Evening Journal read: “[Herlihy] said there was no evidence that [Dunn] was speeding, drinking or driving a truck with faulty brakes. In addition, Herlihy said, witnesses to the crash near Hockessin provided no basis for a prosecution.”"

[y4m]

Aug 21, 2012 12:24:32 GMT -5 msmerymac said:

I find it repugnant to judge him for anything related to that, frankly.

I don't know. Saying someone killed your family drunk driving when they didn't is pretty repugnant, actually. I hadn't heard about this.

[eliseb0323]

Aug 21, 2012 13:05:41 GMT -5 y4m said:

Aug 21, 2012 12:24:32 GMT -5 msmerymac said:

I find it repugnant to judge him for anything related to that, frankly.

I don't know. Saying someone killed your family drunk driving when they didn't is pretty repugnant, actually. I hadn't heard about this.

He knows damn well the driver wasn't drunk and he used the death of his wife and child to gain public sympathy and political support. Disgusting. Plus he trashed the reputation of the other driver who was found not to be at fault.

[dev22]

Aug 21, 2012 13:30:16 GMT -5 eliseb0323 said:

Aug 21, 2012 13:05:41 GMT -5 y4m said:

I don't know. Saying someone killed your family drunk driving when they didn't is pretty repugnant, actually. I hadn't heard about this.

He knows damn well the driver wasn't drunk and he used the death of his wife and child to gain public sympathy and political support. Disgusting. Plus he trashed the reputation of the other driver who was found not to be at fault.

This is ludacris to me. He would have gained plenty of sympathy for having lost his wife and daughter in accident, no matter the cause (if that was his sole intent). Dude ACTUALLY has to live with the fact that his wife and daughter died - this is not a political ploy. Maybe he is convinced to this day that the truck driver was drunk. Maybe he tells himself that so he does not blame his wife. WHo the fuck cares? The end result is that he lost his wife and daughter, and that is horrific. I DO NOT understand the judgment.