Look at baby clothing - even back in the 80s, baby clothing was mostly gender neutral, at least for newborns because duh, you didn't know what you were having ahead of time. Plus it was practical, because then you could reuse that clothing for subsequent babies regardless of whether they were boys or girls.
But oh, wait a minute, if people are reusing baby clothes, then they're not buying new ones! How can the clothing industry (and toy industry and baby gear industry...) make it so you have to buy more stuff for your new baby, especially now that people are having fewer babies?
I truly believe that the root of all of this isn't gender-stereotyping so much as it is encouraging consumption and spending and increasing profits.
I never ever thought about this before but I think you're right.
There are so few gender-neutral clothes and I wouldn't be surprised if that was by design. Plus, the gender-neutral stuff kind of disappears after the early stages.
Rocker tees. With jeans for boys and tutus for girls. Obviously.
Post by gibbinator on Sept 14, 2015 8:57:56 GMT -5
I practically went through a moral crisis when all the green carseat of the model that were on sale were sold and only purple remained. I actually texted dh at work asking him for advice on whether our 3 year old would care in 2 years when he's still in this seat. Dh was just like "buy the damn carseat". And I did, and I'm over it now - it's a perfectly good seat. But I'm still annoyed with myself for being so conflicted.
Eta : my mom us always telling me how hundreds of years ago in Italy all the boy babies were dressed in pink because pink was considered a luxurious colour and the little boys always got the best. No idea how true that is.
I grew up in San Francisco in the 70's, with Marlo Thomas's Free to Be You and Me, Williams Wants a Doll, and all that good stuff, plus, San Francisco in the 70's!!! So when the first male child was born, it certainly shouldn't have been a surprise that I planned on buying the creature a doll. The father of my creatures (now my EX), shocked me when he was adamantly opposed. I finally realized that he was afraid the kid was end up gay. #1 a doll isn't going to make the kid gay, and #2 so what?! My best friend is gay and EX never had a problem with that. Stunned, I retorted that a doll wasn't going to make the kid gay, to which EX responded, yelling, that we don't know that. Now had any of my friends known that this conversation took place, they might have talked sense into me about what this man was really like and it might not have taken another 20 years before I left, but that's another story.
So DS didn't get a doll, I dressed my boys "like boys" and I dressed my girl "like a girl", and I'm sad about that.
I really hate how, for a girl/woman to be thought of as smart and strong and progressive, she must reject all things traditionally feminine and adopt a neutral appearance. I equally hate that men can't enjoy more traditionally feminine things without having their masculinity and manhood straight up questioned.
What really bothers me, though, is when I see women trying to push their girls away from liking the color pink, or feminine styles of dress, or even traditionally feminine toys and interests because they want their girls to be "smart and strong", as if liking any of those things automatically disqualifies them from being anything but a homemaker or stripper. Why not instead teach girls that they can like anything they want and still be smart and strong? Use pink tools while they build things, if they want. Wear pretty dresses with their combat boots. And both boys and girls can dig in the dirt for worms with their painted fingernails.
Makes me miss the '90's, man, when I'd paint my guy friends nails and some of them wore skirts to school and clubbing and I'd wear steel-toed boots with my pink dresses, and some of my girl friends shaved their heads and most of my guy friends had hair longer than mine, and we didn't give a damn.
I think I do this sometimes, although I try not to. I was a tomboy and not into girly things. My mom is forever asking me "What if DD wants to..." dance? play with dolls? wear a lot of make up? I'm ok with that. I want DD to do what she wants to do. What I DON'T want, or didn't want when she was younger (she's 3) is an endless supply of princesses and barbies and tutus and pink ruffles, because that's what girls are supposed to like. If she likes princesses, I will get her princess stuff, take her to see Disney princess movies, etc. But I want it to be something she decides that she likes. Not something that was pushed on her by well meaning relatives.
One thing that is keeping me away from dance is the attitude of her daycare. They offer dance lessons during daycare to 3 and 4 year old GIRLS ONLY. This annoys me. I realize it is mostly little girls who dance, but to offer it only to girls is part of a bigger problem. In my mind anyway, DH thinks I'm more annoyed than I should be. DD hasn't asked about it though, so I haven't had to make a decision.
Post by marriedfilingjoint on Sept 14, 2015 10:30:25 GMT -5
Since moving to the UK, I've noticed Europeans are less weird about this. I've seen men wearing colorful socks that look like women's socks. I've seen men with what many people would consider to be girly tattoos (stars, paw prints, etc.). They don't care. I'm kind of kicking myself for even noticing. It's way easier to find gender neutral baby and children's items. In fact, I never see big ticket items (strollers and carseats, for example) in colors that aren't gender neutral.
Re: Legos, I agree with everything said here, but Lego claims their sales went up 40% as a result of the Lego Friends push. It's all about making that sale.
Here's the bottom line on all the messaging: A girl being girly is bad. A boy being girly is bad.
Being a girl is bad.
Right?!?!
H and I were just talking about C should be for her 2nd Halloween, and I said, "What about Goofy?" because she loves Goofy and talks about him all the time. Then H was like, "What about Anna? She'll be so excited about that, too." And I was like, "But..that's just so gendered and princessy. Are we ready to start that?"
And he was like, "She loves it, it's not wrong to be female or feminine, and Anna is the hero of that story. It's a story of a young woman saving her sister, women doing things for themselves, and the Anna dress is adorable."
He's 100% right. She'll be stoked.
Anna is the hero? I really need to rent that movie. I thought Elsa was the hero.
Post by eponinepontmercy on Sept 14, 2015 10:51:23 GMT -5
This makes me feel all progressive that I didn't pick an alternate craft for the 2 boys at DD's party and had everyone decorate their own faux leather wristbands. I was really just lazy and knew their parents weren't the type to get mad at their sons for wearing sparkly things.
Post by CrazyLucky on Sept 14, 2015 11:09:11 GMT -5
LOL. My kids won't sit through a whole movie yet. Besides Frozen, I've only seen part of Despicable Me, none of the two sequels. Who knows what else I'm missing out on?
I really hate how, for a girl/woman to be thought of as smart and strong and progressive, she must reject all things traditionally feminine and adopt a neutral appearance. I equally hate that men can't enjoy more traditionally feminine things without having their masculinity and manhood straight up questioned.
What really bothers me, though, is when I see women trying to push their girls away from liking the color pink, or feminine styles of dress, or even traditionally feminine toys and interests because they want their girls to be "smart and strong", as if liking any of those things automatically disqualifies them from being anything but a homemaker or stripper. Why not instead teach girls that they can like anything they want and still be smart and strong? Use pink tools while they build things, if they want. Wear pretty dresses with their combat boots. And both boys and girls can dig in the dirt for worms with their painted fingernails.
Yes, totally agree. Some of the smartest women I know and work with, love pink and dresses and "girly" shoes and jewelry. That's fine. I grew up more of a tomboy and most days prefer pants to skirts and dresses, but I like fixing my hair and wearing some make-up. That's fine too. I hope I'm not pushing my boys one way or the other, but just letting them "be." But they live IN the world, not just of the world, and I am not their only influence. I remember when my oldest was in preschool the teacher in his room asked me if it was ok if he wore the dresses that were in the pretend play closet. I said yes, of course. She then went on to explain that they had to ask now because some of the parents were not ok with this. They were 3 years old. I mean, I know I shouldn't be surprised, but really? I should have asked if these same parents have a problem with the girls wearing anything but the princess and fairies and other costumes that were dresses. I mean, if you're going to be an asshat, at least be an equal opportunity one.