I pretty much agree with RoxMonster. I'm not about the martyr life, but of course it gets frustrating when people are all 'la di da, must be nice to have summers off!' LOL YES, it absolutely is. And having that decompression time is the reason I don't throw middle schoolers through a damn window on the daily lol. (or, when I was in the classroom).
There's something interesting to understand about the time off. I agree -- there is a TON of time off. That said, there is NO flexibility. Having a baby was a pain in the ass when I finished the school year. I have to fit pumping into a specific time, I couldn't work it in when I would naturally need to pump. Taking off for doctor's appointments meant I had to take the entire day because you can't leave for a few hours, so that also meant having to deal with sub plans.
There is give and take for sure. I certainly enjoyed many of the benefits of my job, but, just like anyone else, I wanted to be respected as a professional (not directed at anyone here)
I pretty much agree with RoxMonster. I'm not about the martyr life, but of course it gets frustrating when people are all 'la di da, must be nice to have summers off!' LOL YES, it absolutely is. And having that decompression time is the reason I don't throw middle schoolers through a damn window on the daily lol. (or, when I was in the classroom).
There's something interesting to understand about the time off. I agree -- there is a TON of time off. That said, there is NO flexibility. Having a baby was a pain in the ass when I finished the school year. I have to fit pumping into a specific time, I couldn't work it in when I would naturally need to pump. Taking off for doctor's appointments meant I had to take the entire day because you can't leave for a few hours, so that also meant having to deal with sub plans.
There is give and take for sure. I certainly enjoyed many of the benefits of my job, but, just like anyone else, I wanted to be respected as a professional (not directed at anyone here)
I think another thing about that time off to consider is there is so much prep time during the school year/week. I just started full time this year and am putting in roughly 65 hours a week. Granted, I just started and am at a high-priority school, so there's a lot more to do, but if I continue that streak, by the end of the year I'll have worked the equivalent of 50 50-hour work weeks. So that time off is more delayed time off, rather than extra time off.
Where I live (Long Island, NY) teachers make a good salary so I'm suprised when it's mentioned that teachers don't make much in certain locations.
The average for a teacher right out of school is around 60k a yr several of my friends who have been teachers for a while around 10 yrs or so make 90k +
Where I live (Long Island, NY) teachers make a good salary so I'm suprised when it's mentioned that teachers don't make much in certain locations.
The average for a teacher right out of school is around 60k a yr several of my friends who have been teachers for a while around 10 yrs or so make 90k +
I should mention we are a HCOL area
I'm on the island too. Teachers here make bank.
I grew up in West Islip. Schools are a bug deal on LI!
I made $34k out of college in a very HCOL area. Top teacher pay in that district (masters+ with 30 years) was around $100k.
I make in the $60s range, 16 years in, Masters, in a HCOL area but it's private school. I'd make about $80 in public school. No pension (though they match my contributions in a 203b) but I get free tuition for one of my kids which is a sweet benefit.
"Hello babies. Welcome to Earth. It's hot in the summer and cold in the winter. It's round and wet and crowded. On the outside, babies, you've got a hundred years here. There's only one rule that I know of, babies-"God damn it, you've got to be kind.”
Post by Doggy Mommy on Oct 6, 2015 22:04:34 GMT -5
Pay in my district is all screwed up. Starting pay and highest possible pay is determined by your position. I teach elementary so I'm the lowest of the low. The top is special ed teachers and chinese teachers, basically the hard to fill positions. Minimum pay is around 32k. There were many years of pay freezes and now lousy 2% raises. There are teachers with 10 years experience making 40-45k. In a nearby district, teachers with the same experience are making 20k more than that.
Overall, Colorado sucks for teacher pay. I need to move somewhere that pays better.
I looked up my old school district from growing up and there were a handful of long term teachers earning $80k which seems reasonable to me.
Interesting link. Hadn't seen this before. Just looked up my 2nd grader's teacher and she makes 85k. She has been teaching 20 years. I feel like that seems fair. I would say we are MCOL but do have high property taxes.
It is possible that your hours *could* be good in teaching, if you really don't give a shit. If you have plans in place from previous years you can show up for contracted hours only and get by without getting fired. I see it all the time at my high school.
However, if you are plagued by caring about it and think that your students actually deserve a good education, you are putting in many, many hours outside of school. Summers off are nice (I will get only 5 weeks total) but I don't know who would do this job, for the pay grade in my state, if there was no "break" from it.
Sorry, but however sympathetic I may be about low teacher salaries, that does not extend to undercompensated hours as an assistant coach on the school football team. If Texas can't be bothered to adequately value it's football program, I wouldn't expect the rest of the nation to.
Bottom line is that the societal justification for raising teacher salaries is primarily that we should place a greater premium on our child's education, and should want to attract qualified teachers by paying a competitive wage. There's a secondary argument, I guess, that teachers are undercompensated because it is traditionally a pink collar profession, and obviously, that's also not good. Neither concern exists with respect to the assistant head coach of a football team. Sounds to me like being assistant head coach is sort of an internship one serves on the way to living the dream of being head coach. Good luck to him and all, but society is not gong to fall apart if there is suddenly a shortage of qualified assistant high school football coaches.
Sorry, but however sympathetic I may be about low teacher salaries, that does not extend to undercompensated hours as an assistant coach on the school football team. If Texas can't be bothered to adequately value it's football program, I wouldn't expect the rest of the nation to.
For me, the issue wasn't necessarily being undercompensated for running a club or extracurricular, but it's a total lack of compensation that presents an issue that directly harms the students.
In the past I worked at another Title I school that did not compensate for any extracurricular activities or sports. While teachers would start out in those volunteer positions and not necessarily mind, the lack of compensation contributed to a high turnover for those positions. Eventually, a few clubs/activities ceased to exist at our school, and not for a lack of student interest, putting our students at yet another disadvantage.
At Title I schools, extracurricular activities are a critical component of a college prep education. If a school can't pay advisors or directors or coaches for their time, chances are there won't be as strong of an after-school program, and chances are our kids will have less investment in school.
I legitimately don't know how the coaching thing works.
Are teachers recruited based on being able to coach football, and then a job is found for them?
Or are existing teachers just asked to consider coaching the school's team?
I agree that the coaching stipends seem very low for the hours. The time could be much better spent (or much better compensated, at least) by doing some tutoring.
Do teachers HAVE to coach? Are they doing it because they love it and the money is just a bonus? What would happen if no one stepped up?
For us coaches and teachers are hired separately. If a teacher can coach it is a perk. Our football coach retired last year from teaching PE, but still coaches football. DH was hired as a coach prior to getting a full-time job. There are also non-high school teachers who coach.
Another compensation issue I rarely see mentioned is social security. I am not eligible to collect my husband's social security benefits if he passes away because I am eligible to collect teacher retirement once I reach a certain age. Someone who stays home and never works, therefore also does not pay into social security (and I did pay into SS at my jobs prior to teaching) can collect but I will not be. That's crap.
Sorry, but however sympathetic I may be about low teacher salaries, that does not extend to undercompensated hours as an assistant coach on the school football team. If Texas can't be bothered to adequately value it's football program, I wouldn't expect the rest of the nation to.
For me, the issue wasn't necessarily being undercompensated for running a club or extracurricular, but it's a total lack of compensation that presents an issue that directly harms the students.
In the past I worked at another Title I school that did not compensate for any extracurricular activities or sports. While teachers would start out in those volunteer positions and not necessarily mind, the lack of compensation contributed to a high turnover for those positions. Eventually, a few clubs/activities ceased to exist at our school, and not for a lack of student interest, putting our students at yet another disadvantage.
At Title I schools, extracurricular activities are a critical component of a college prep education. If a school can't pay advisors or directors or coaches for their time, chances are there won't be as strong of an after-school program, and chances are our kids will have less investment in school.
OK, sure, but that concern exists with respect to, like, women's volleyball, not the assistant coach of the boys' football team. Putting aside everything else, the guy is not even the head coach. Nothing ceases to exist if the stipend is so small they can't attract a qualified assistant head coach, the team just won't be as good. I can't even conceive of a hypothetical in which that adversely affects someone's future, let alone, undermines a strong societal interest.
For me, the issue wasn't necessarily being undercompensated for running a club or extracurricular, but it's a total lack of compensation that presents an issue that directly harms the students.
In the past I worked at another Title I school that did not compensate for any extracurricular activities or sports. While teachers would start out in those volunteer positions and not necessarily mind, the lack of compensation contributed to a high turnover for those positions. Eventually, a few clubs/activities ceased to exist at our school, and not for a lack of student interest, putting our students at yet another disadvantage.
At Title I schools, extracurricular activities are a critical component of a college prep education. If a school can't pay advisors or directors or coaches for their time, chances are there won't be as strong of an after-school program, and chances are our kids will have less investment in school.
OK, sure, but that concern exists with respect to, like, women's volleyball, not the assistant coach of the boys' football team. Putting aside everything else, the guy is not even the head coach. Nothing ceases to exist if the stipend is so small they can't attract a qualified assistant head coach, the team just won't be as good. I can't even conceive of a hypothetical in which that adversely affects someone's future, let alone, undermines a strong societal interest.
I see what you're saying. I was thinking of it more generally (all extracurriculars, etc.), but you're talking specifically about the assistant head coach of a football team. And you're right.
OK, sure, but that concern exists with respect to, like, women's volleyball, not the assistant coach of the boys' football team. Putting aside everything else, the guy is not even the head coach. Nothing ceases to exist if the stipend is so small they can't attract a qualified assistant head coach, the team just won't be as good. I can't even conceive of a hypothetical in which that adversely affects someone's future, let alone, undermines a strong societal interest.
I see what you're saying. I was thinking of it more generally (all extracurriculars, etc.), but you're talking specifically about the assistant head coach of a football team. And you're right.
I think the post was in direct reference to Tami's posts
I teach in the Boston suburbs, not BPS. We start around the low 40s and top out at a PhD around 90, and that's with 15+ years in the system. My district pays lower than the neighboring towns but we are surrounded by some very wealthy areas.
What she says about union rules are probably close to true. Firing a teacher because they stink is hard, if not impossible BUT you can fire a teacher for actual improper behavior and/or actions. While I recognize that many people find this troubling, the new evaluation system does not let teachers phone it in anymore. If they preform poorly on the new eval then their job will be in danger, union or not.
Also, it's important to remember that those union rules were put in place to protect old, expensive teachers who could be easily fired because they are costly. While I'm sure there are some teachers who suck, it isn't everyone.
And yes, we are required to put a lot of money into our pension. We have no say in the matter, the MTA controls our pension. It's a substantial contribution.
We may be coworkers, as I teach in a similar town in MA.
I would argue that union rules provide a measure of job security for teachers so that school committees don't just fire more expensive teachers and replace them with cheaper ones. They also provide due process-- at least in my district, it's hard to fire teachers because more often than not, an administrator dropped the ball on following that process. It bugs me when people tar teachers' unions with such a broad brush, as they are also a reason that MA salaries compare favorably to those in right-to-work states.
My two cents-- I'll complain about working conditions all day long because I like to complain, and I work damn hard. That said, I'm paid decently well (in the 80s with a masters and 15 years of experience). I will never get rich, but I probably won't go hungry. kevin arnold is right that the retirement benefit is hugely helpful and balances out the salary, though others have noted that it's largely teacher-funded (at least in MA). But I deserve it. Not more than many of you, but I won't apologize for asking for a living wage. As elle mentioned, for a long time it was assumed that teachers' salaries didn't matter because teachers were women who were not the family breadwinners.
And not to nitpick, but it's the MTRB, not the MTA, who controls pensions in MA. I think the MTRB is an elected board, but it's not the union (the MTA) as far as I know.
MIL gets paid around $60k, middle school, public, rural NJ, and she's been a teacher for over 20 years.
The school district I grew up in was ridiculous. Average salary is $111,821. No wonder my parents' property taxes were insanely high.
There is a huge range in NJ but if they have their masters and teach for a decent amount of time, most northern NJ teachers are making well over $100K. They will complain about it all day long too. I know 2 teachers that are making over $130K (they have been working for more than 20 years).
Post by wildfloweragain on Oct 7, 2015 19:55:56 GMT -5
I make $60,000. MCOL 17 years, masters, mentor and national board certification.
Started at $28,000.
I think starting now is $35,000.
I spend a good chunk of all breaks on school stuff. We also don't get "vacation" days at all. We have to fit any trips into school breaks. I'd say the days I get off and don't have to spend setting up a classroom, writing papers to keep my job (APPR) or lesson planning are about equivalent to other jobs that have "vacation" days. I don't consider my job 81% of a year.
MIL gets paid around $60k, middle school, public, rural NJ, and she's been a teacher for over 20 years.
The school district I grew up in was ridiculous. Average salary is $111,821. No wonder my parents' property taxes were insanely high.
There is a huge range in NJ but if they have their masters and teach for a decent amount of time, most northern NJ teachers are making well over $100K. They will complain about it all day long too. I know 2 teachers that are making over $130K (they have been working for more than 20 years).
To answer the original question, I'm in the most affluent county in NJ and make almost $60K, with over ten years and my Masters. As PP said, I earn every penny.
Sorry, but however sympathetic I may be about low teacher salaries, that does not extend to undercompensated hours as an assistant coach on the school football team. If Texas can't be bothered to adequately value it's football program, I wouldn't expect the rest of the nation to.
Bottom line is that the societal justification for raising teacher salaries is primarily that we should place a greater premium on our child's education, and should want to attract qualified teachers by paying a competitive wage. There's a secondary argument, I guess, that teachers are undercompensated because it is traditionally a pink collar profession, and obviously, that's also not good. Neither concern exists with respect to the assistant head coach of a football team. Sounds to me like being assistant head coach is sort of an internship one serves on the way to living the dream of being head coach. Good luck to him and all, but society is not gong to fall apart if there is suddenly a shortage of qualified assistant high school football coaches.
I'm guessing this is directed at me. Lol. Honestly it's not the lack of pay for the a coaching position that's insulting. It's the lack of pay overall for his teaching position. He teaches government/economics. He has a degree in history. He is not just some dumb jock teaching so he can coach. You HAVE to be a certified teacher in the state of TX to even be allowed to coach.
Honestly, your post is a little strange to me. If you worked hard and were away from your family and didn't see your child for the months of July-December, would you not to be compensated fairly for that?
My ex was a teacher and he coached for a little bit. Honestly, I didn't even calculate that pay into his paycheck because it was such a minimal amount. He did it mostly for the enjoyment. I don't think high school coaches should expect the same pay as say a college coach as the responsibilities are very different.
But do they do things different in TX than other places? As in, to get the history job do you also have to coach football? If so, then I think that's pretty fucked up since that pretty much eliminates women from the job because I highly doubt they're hiring female football coach on the regular. I think that holds true for most boy's sports.
My ex was a teacher and he coached for a little bit. Honestly, I didn't even calculate that pay into his paycheck because it was such a minimal amount. He did it mostly for the enjoyment. I don't think high school coaches should expect the same pay as say a college coach as the responsibilities are very different.
But do they do things different in TX than other places? As in, to get the history job do you also have to coach football? If so, then I think that's pretty fucked up since that pretty much eliminates women from the job because I highly doubt they're hiring female football coach on the regular. I think that holds true for most boy's sports.
Most DI college assistant coaches make at least 6 figures. I don't think anyone expects that for a HS coach. We know the HC at a major university here in TX and he makes $$$$$. The coaching is tied to the teaching position. However it is the same way for girls coaches.
That's really interesting. It's never been like that in any of the school districts I've lived in or my ex or mom worked in.
I wonder how many well-qualified teachers they pass up because they can't coach. And just out of curiosity, how do they determine which subject and which sport are matched up? As in, is there a reason that a math teacher must be a track coach for example? It must be even more stressful to find a teaching job in that area. You not only have to worry about being on top of teaching, but being qualified in a sport to get a teaching position. Since it's a requirement to coach, I honestly think that would be a reason for me to move. Sorry you're in that position.