My experience is that a mom describes baby noise as minimal and a non mom as horrific screeching. So I'm guessing it was more of a distraction than she describes but maybe not worth of some looks of disdain.
But, really, why bring a baby to a work event? Just because you're a woman at a woman's seminar?
But I also have a lot of sympathy for women who are, or should be, still on leave who still have work requirements and have to bring the baby along
Post by WanderingWinoZ on Oct 14, 2015 15:20:04 GMT -5
I'm confused, like most everybody else.
I tend to be a skeptic when people go on social media or online spaces and write a click-bait type of piece. I tend to imagine there was more to this story or her version of things isn't quite what really happened.
That said, I think professional events/seminars are expected to be baby free, and if somebody had to bring a kid for some reason, they should be very respectful of others experiences. You can still be pro-women & about empowerment without thinking that a woman has the right/freedom to take their kids anywhere & everywhere.
It's work. There shouldn't need to be a no baby disclaimer. When else is it ok to take kids to work?
uhhh...When school decides to close on a random Tuesday for no good reason and you can't get a babysitter in time?
There is usually at least one kid in my office when it snows. This has been true at every job I've worked at. They tend to sit at a drafting desk and color on misprinted plan sheets.
Some jobs this doesn't apply. Nursing obviously you can't bring your kid. Can't take junior to the couthouse. No babies in a backhoe. But random business casual office job where there aren't clients coming in and out all the time? Probably not that big of a deal. My parents used to take me to the office all the time. My dad owned the company so that was a little different, but I even had a tire swing out back. Maybe this is why I'm honestly not getting the hard and fast "omg kids! professionals! never the two shall meet!" responses.
It's work. There shouldn't need to be a no baby disclaimer. When else is it ok to take kids to work?
My baby was at work with me on ocassion because she was a new thing and I was a breastfeeding mom and sometimes, not all the time, those two facts make it harder to separate baby from mom. It's life. Everyone survives. She's hardly here now because she's 3 and that would not be as survivable (haaaaaaaa).
And really if we want women in the workplace, as I'm assuming we all do, then we have to make reasonable accommodations for mothers of babies in the workplace. Bottom line, it didn't seem as if she was being unreasonable. Her baby was sleeping, she had help with her, and she left the room when baby fussed (just twice). If anything the conference people are being unreasonable as they are acting as if the mere presence of a baby will ruin their "empowerment" seminar. (And yes it is slightly ironic that a seminar on female empowerment would involve making a breastfeeding mom and her baby hang in a closet; women have babies. This is a fact. Pretending as if we don't doesn't actually empower women).
I don't disagree that there are sometimes reasons to being a baby to work. Illness, snow, childcare cancellation.
I'm dubious about this case. Only cried twice? No ability to prepare for other arrangements?
And, to me, empowerment is more childcare options and maternity leave, not forcing moms to juggle a baby and work simultaneously.
Basically, it's a NY times example to me
She did have other arrangements, that's the best damn part of this piece of ridiculousness. She had a freaking sitter with her, but chose anyhow to bring the baby with her into the presentations, and then was outraged when her other friend told her to leave the kid with the sitter.
When I was on mat leave, I took my baby to some semi-professional stuff that I continued with. I was volunteering my time and I sure as hell wasn't going to pay to do that, regardless of the fact that someone else might have been wearing a tie.
One year mat leave. I wanted to keep my contacts fresh.
The issue, in her mind, is that "old feminists" don't understand that "new feminists" want the bring their babies everywhere. She's making it about second vs third wave feminism.
lol at 'old feminists'.
I just think it's ridiculous to bring a baby sitter along WITH you, who will sit idly by while you hold, feed and care for the baby, at a seminar where you're expected to perform to the crowd at some point. I don't know where she gets out of this that 'old feminists' never took their children anywhere, either; that's just nonsense.
Oh I agree with you personally. I'm just saying that she did have an issue in mind that is actually kind of interesting (if accurate which I'm not sure it is). She buried it in a lot of extraneous text though.
In the “breastfeeding room,” Angela and I went over what my friend had said. “Maybe in her day feminism was about entering the world of men, hiding your babies away,” said Angela, who is in her early thirties. “And now it’s about doing what we believe in. We don’t have to automatically reject liking cooking or having babies.” She added what I couldn’t stop thinking: “How can this happen in a women’s forum of all places?”
“Older feminists,” she wrote, “carry so many scars from braving the front lines and barely making progress. Older feminists had to disassociate women from children in the public eye in order to make the vision of women in the workplace a reality. Men didn’t bring kids to work, and the feminists had to emulate men to earn respect, so their chillens were invisible, hidden, nowhere.”
If I won't bring a six-month-old baby to a movie theater where people are paying $15-ish for their tickets to watch a movie without distractions, I'm for sure not bringing a six-month-old baby to a conference where people are likely paying $50+ to absorb the material.
Neither may have signs saying "stop bringing your baby here," but I feel it's a no-brainer.
If I won't bring a six-month-old baby to a movie theater where people are paying $15-ish for their tickets to watch a movie without distractions, I'm for sure not bringing a six-month-old baby to a conference where people are likely paying $50+ to absorb the material.
Neither may have signs saying "stop bringing your baby here," but I feel it's a no-brainer.
If I won't bring a six-month-old baby to a movie theater where people are paying $15-ish for their tickets to watch a movie without distractions, I'm for sure not bringing a six-month-old baby to a conference where people are likely paying $50+ to absorb the material.
Neither may have signs saying "stop bringing your baby here," but I feel it's a no-brainer.
Babies go to movies all the time.
I said "I won't."
ETA: Look, daycare is expensive. Too expensive. But I know I hate dropping my limited dollars on a movie only to have an unpredictable baby do what babies do, so I refused to try it.
You do you, but since I hate having babies in the same movie theater as me, I'm going to opt to not subject other people to the same thing I hate.
Post by earlgreyhot on Oct 14, 2015 18:37:53 GMT -5
I am team author. Ramble-y article aside, I think I agree with her point.
It's now the norm for women to have professional careers, and increasingly the line between being "on the clock" and and "off" are blurring. To accommodate the needs of working families, I think more concessions can be made allowing for more flexibility with respect to brand new moms. Lactation rooms are a great start, certainly, but I would love to see a conference for where women feel comfortable with their newborns (babies who are nursing often, sleeping lots, non-mobile) in wraps. Maybe even a special lounge where they can escape when the baby cries, but still network.
It's true that old feminists were expected to conform to the male-dominated workplace norm. But that norm doesn't fit anymore, and it's time young feminists push to continue to push the envelope.
ETA: Look, daycare is expensive. Too expensive. But I know I hate dropping my limited dollars on a movie only to have an unpredictable baby do what babies do, so I refused to try it.
You do you, but since I hate having babies in the same movie theater as me, I'm going to opt to not subject other people to the same thing I hate.
Oh I don't take babies to movies. But you or I choosing not to take a baby to movie does not mean she shouldn't take a baby to a conference.
ETA: Look, daycare is expensive. Too expensive. But I know I hate dropping my limited dollars on a movie only to have an unpredictable baby do what babies do, so I refused to try it.
You do you, but since I hate having babies in the same movie theater as me, I'm going to opt to not subject other people to the same thing I hate.
I took my 6-10w newborn to movies on maternity leave. Went to the first showing of the day on a weekday. It was often just us. Was lovely.
There is a great local theater chain here that specifically has "Baby Day". When I was on maternity leave with DD, I went to the movies every week with her. It was awesome.
Shorti has been to the movies. But not with me. Dcp took her when she had a day with just her own kids and at the time wee baby shorti. She slept through it.
Post by theoriginalbean on Oct 14, 2015 20:56:35 GMT -5
I took my 4 month old with me to an out of town conference, where I was a scheduled presenter. I wore her in the ergo both while i stood in the back of the room listening to other sessions and while I gave my own presentation. No one had anything negative to say (to my face), and she slept the whole time. In fact, I received supportive comments from quite a few other attendees. I don't think health/geographic research/technology development is a particularly women-centric field, but it was fine. I don't really know what else I could have done, other than leave the baby with a complete stranger or just not attend and present.
I took my 4 month old with me to an out of town conference, where I was a scheduled presenter. I wore her in the ergo both while i stood in the back of the room listening to other sessions and while I gave my own presentation. No one had anything negative to say (to my face), and she slept the whole time. In fact, I received supportive comments from quite a few other attendees. I don't think health/geographic research/technology development is a particularly women-centric field, but it was fine. I don't really know what else I could have done, other than leave the baby with a complete stranger or just not attend and present.
Assuming the friend who asked her to present knew the age of the baby, I can see why mom I'd miffed. I'm participating on a panel for you, shortly after giving birth, and you're gonna freak out over my baby, who needs to eat every couple of hours? What did the lady think she was gonna do with her baby?
I have seen newborn babies at conferences occasionally. I am barred in a state that has bi-yearly mandatory CLES. If you dont have the credits you can't have an active license.
So sometimes new moms come with babies. I have never seen one more than 12 weeks old or so. Moms are always quick to leave if they peep and people taking constant phone calls are much more distracting than the babies. No big deal imo.